Newbie 940 - Game over

[Haylen]

i do NOT support an Equinox lynch today. I would be just about willing to switch to a Nacho lynch though.

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Official Vote Count

Equinox - 2 (Nachomamma8, Nobody Special)
Nobody Special - 2 (Equinox, Haylen)

Not Voting - 1 (Thor665)

3 to Lynch.

Deadline

is the end of Tuesday, June 22.

[Thor665]

Well, that's interesting. Equinox is now checked out and I think Haylen is comfortably set. I'm sticking with what I know - I'd like to see what Equinox/Nacho scum opt to do for the night kill.

No whammy, no whammy...

Vote: Nobody Special

(and dude, seriously, 'I always act scummy when town' as a defense? Somebody needs to modify their meta. )

I suppose my last will and testament will be - If I am noghtkilled make sure to go back and look for possible connections (or lack thereof) between Nobody and the remaining suspects.

[Thor665]

Do the above if I'm nightkilled too, though noghtkilling sounds less pleasant.

[Nobody Special]

BAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Equinox]

I call Nobody Special (Mafia Goon) and Nachomamma8 (Mafia Roleblocker) scum team. I thought of this while reading a post sometime back when Nobody Special first claimed doctor. It'll be funny if it's actually the other way, though.

Equinox is now checked out

I only intended to stay checked out for the duration of the game day. Either I was going to get lynched out of the game or Nobody Special was going to get lynched out. I would return to the game if the latter occurred, as I still have stake in this game despite being rather angry at one player.

On the other hand, if a Nachomamma8 lynch occurred and not a Nobody Special lynch, I would probably have placed a vote early on Day 4 and then checked out.

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Final Day 3 Vote Count

Equinox - 2 (Nachomamma8, Nobody Special)

Nobody Special - 3 (Equinox, Haylen, Thor665)

Not Voting - 0 ()

3 to Lynch.

Deadline

is the end of Tuesday, June 22.

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Nobody's claim of being the town Doctor is nothing Special and far less than believable. It doesn't take you long to turn him over to the mob for a good old-fashioned hanging, where his true allegiances are revealed.

Nobody Special,

Mafia Goon

, lynched Day 3

Night has begun. Those of you with night actions must submit your choices by Monday, June 7 (click for exact time).

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

The latest victim is found, and the paranoia reaches a fever pitch. Who will come out on top in this deadly little game?

Haylen,

Townie

, killed Night 3

Day 4 has begun. With 3 alive, it takes 2 to lynch. Deadline is the end of Monday, June 28.

[Equinox]

Vote: Nachomamma8

Die, scum.

[Thor665]

Haylen,

Townie

, killed Night 3

Aww, you jerks. I was hoping to be NKed so I could later claim I'd figured it all out while dead (ever notice how perfectly everyone who has been NKed is able to figure out the scum? I get the same effect.)

Okay, I intend to look over the Nobody slot and see what connections I can draw. If either of you feel you have a knockout piece of evidence against the other feel free to toss it out for consideration and the other one may, of course, feel free to dispute it (dance, dance for my entertainment!)

In the end I'll probably just take a shot of tequila and pick randomly, but I like to pretend I'll have a good system going into it.

[Equinox]

There was a reason Nachomamma8 killed Haylen.

That's all I've got. Everything else is in the sea of walls and uber rage.

[Nachomamma8]

Vote: Equinox

There was a reason Nachomamma8 killed Haylen.

There's plenty of reasons for you to have killed Haylen, the first of which is so you could say things like this...

@Thor:
I've done some reading back, and I've noticed a few little things...

First of all, it seemed like Sauron and Nobody were trying to get you lynched solely on the WIFOM of you being alive. There's Sauron's comment here:

Oh, one other thought I had right after I hit submit. Perhaps I am projecting a bit much, but I seemed to get the feeling that a nontrivial fraction of the players of the game believed Thor to be rather townie, and he seems to be playing fairly well so far. With that in mind, why would he have not been the NK? Was AV closer on some trail than Thor? Is Thor really scum? Does the scum want to WIFOM me into thinking Thor is scum? Am I misperceiving how others looked at Thor?

While Nobody Special posts this:

That said, Thor is playing very very town, and while that's usually a good thing, I think he's going a bit far with it.

There's also Equinox's behavior before the hohum lynch, and then after he was hammered, and then the beginning of the next day. Before, we had "hohum is definitely scum". Then, after the hammer, we had "Hohum might flip town; if so, I'm gonna look at SB." Then, once Day 3 started, we had "Nobody Special is definitely scum."



Quotes to back that up:
Before the hammer:

I really do not like how it spiraled so quickly. Haylen has outlined reasons for why she believed hohum to be scum, yet hohum has done no such thing in response; instead, he continued to throw accusations with no backing, make defaming and very offensive remarks, and essentially tunnel Haylen. Of course Haylen was going to react emotionally to such personal attacks. I don't know what hohum was planning to get out of this.

While I'm at it, I already had suspicions against hohum's slot due to Die Prediger's tunneling and wagon hopping. I can't hold hohum responsible for Die Prediger's actions, but hohum's recent posts have left a very bitter taste in my mouth.

Vote: hohum

I'm not washing my hands, either. I've made my case against hohum. I am not changing my vote. I'm assuming everyone else is happy with their votes; therefore, the hammer's out of my hands.

Since you asked for a restatement of the hohum case, though, perhaps I still have some control of the lynch.

- Die Prediger was jumpy with the vote counts. He admitted to keeping track of them to prevent mislynches.

- Die Prediger seemed to take on easy bandwagons (e.g., [no], silverbullet999) and neither considered other possibilities nor brought any new evidence/cases.

- hohum used ad hominem attacks against Haylen. Either he did not have an actual case and therefore needed to resort to personal issues, or it was a reaction test. Considering the length, I doubt it was the latter.

- hohum did not consider any other scum possibilities (with exception of Thor665).

- hohum did not build a convincing case against Haylen following attempt to "press buttons." (I will acknowledge that this might be related to his V/LA, though it's not enough to overcome the others.)

After the hammer:

There's still the possibility that hohum is town. Considering silverbullet999 had the hammer, if hohum flips town, it wouldn't look very good. I did state before that I'd make a decision after hohum flipped, but I posted about my feelings toward SB before the flip -- I gather that's what Thor665 was referring to.

Next day:

Did scum really just do that? That just made my job easier.

I'm calling Nobody Special for scum. Process of elimination.

[Equinox]

Bringing up my predecessor again, scum?

First of all, it seemed like Sauron and Nobody were trying to get you lynched solely on the WIFOM of you being alive. There's Sauron's comment here:

That sounds just like idle speculation. Did Sauron ever push for an actual lynch? Did Sauron ever vote Thor665? Did Sauron ever formally FoS Thor665? If he did, I probably would have remembered because that's one fairly big contradiction in his and my reads if he truly believed Thor665 to be scum, and our reads were pretty close.

There's also Equinox's behavior before the hohum lynch, and then after he was hammered, and then the beginning of the next day. Before, we had "hohum is definitely scum". Then, after the hammer, we had "Hohum might flip town; if so, I'm gonna look at SB." Then, once Day 3 started, we had "Nobody Special is definitely scum."

1. I was sure hohum was scum.
2. I always consider the possibility of a town flip in twilight. I may be damn sure someone is scum, but I will almost never fail to speculate about the possibility. Day 3 was an exception because there was no point to speculating about that -- if Nobody Special really was doctor, we were screwed.
3. Nobody Special was the only one left, and I didn't bother considering the Nachomamma8 + Haylen pair until Thor665 brought it up. Thanks for playing.

[Nachomamma8]

Bringing up my predecessor again, scum?

Your predecessor is where my suspicion stemmed from, so of course I'm going to bring him up.

That sounds just like idle speculation. Did Sauron ever push for an actual lynch? Did Sauron ever vote Thor665? Did Sauron ever formally FoS Thor665? If he did, I probably would have remembered because that's one fairly big contradiction in his and my reads if he truly believed Thor665 to be scum, and our reads were pretty close.

No, and for two reasons. First of all, all-out pushing for a Thor lynch would've been suicide at that point. Secondly, he didn't have a chance to push the angle anymore because he replaced out.

2. I always consider the possibility of a town flip in twilight. I may be damn sure someone is scum, but I will almost never fail to speculate about the possibility. Day 3 was an exception because there was no point to speculating about that -- if Nobody Special really was doctor, we were screwed.

Can you bring up evidence of this? Also, if you were so sure that hohum was scum before, then why did it take you until after he was hammered to see the possibility of him being town?

3. Nobody Special was the only one left, and I didn't bother considering the Nachomamma8 + Haylen pair until Thor665 brought it up. Thanks for playing.

There was no reason (as I recall... fuzzily) for Hayscum and Nachoscum8 to clear each other at that point in the game, so I thought it would just be one town and one scum clearing each other.

Yeah, but your reasons for not suspecting it were shoddy at best. You were definitely reaching at this point.

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Official Vote Count

Nachomamma8 - 1 (Equinox)
Equinox - 1 (Nachomamma8)

Not Voting - 1 (Thor665)

2 to Lynch.

Deadline

is the end of Monday, June 28.

[Thor665]

Greetings,

I'm going to do a bit of rereading today, and I'm expecting to manage my coin flip no later then tomorrow as I figure anything past that will just have me starting to think myself in circles.

@Nacho - I see the biggest point in favor of Equinoxtown being her assault on Nobody Special right out of the gate yesterday. Why do you think she decided to bus at that time and in that manner?

@Equinox - I see the biggest point in favor of Nachocop as a combination of the risk the cop claim entailed if he was scum considering Nobody was the more busted scum paired with his legitimate shift of acting favorably towards Haylen at the start of Day 2 - what do you see as the logic in this being Nachoscum actions as opposed to Nachocop?

[Equinox]

@Equinox - I see the biggest point in favor of Nachocop as a combination of the risk the cop claim entailed if he was scum considering Nobody was the more busted scum paired with his legitimate shift of acting favorably towards Haylen at the start of Day 2 - what do you see as the logic in this being Nachoscum actions as opposed to Nachocop?

1. Risk acknowledged in both Nachocop8 and Nachoscum8 scenarios. If it's Nachocop8, well, it's not really a risk but more of a difficult obligation he has to fulfill. If it's Nachoscum8, the great risk he took makes his claim more believable.
2. Breadcrumbing. As an IC, Nachomamma8 would be familiar with the technique, both as cop and as scum.

Unfortunately, I've got nothing else to say here, as this was a brilliantly laid-out plan. All I have left to say is, "Listen to Haylen."

Cheers.

[Nachomamma8]

@Nacho - I see the biggest point in favor of Equinoxtown being her assault on Nobody Special right out of the gate yesterday. Why do you think she decided to bus at that time and in that manner?

I think she really didn't have any other choice at that time, really. Her scumpartner had already tried to push a case on silver the previous day (which ended up implicating him), so there was no way that was going through. I had a strong town read on Haylen and a strong scum read on her, and you didn't seem too convinced that she was scum, so there was no way that was going to work. Haylen was the only person who so much as entertained the thought of you being scum to that point, so that wasn't going to work. And the only time anyone had been suspicious of me up until that point was Haylen, from her misunderstandings, so a push on me wasn't going to work. So, Equinox needed to gain a little towncred by bussing her buddy NS before she was going to try to get the ICs to view each other as scum.

[Thor665]

I'm working through my re-read (and as promised I do intend to manage a vote sometime tomorrow). My current pickle is looking at Jerako (aka Nobody) and his early interactions with [no] (aka Equinox).

@Nacho - I'm guessing you're calling this action bussing/distancing from his partner, yes? My issue is that it basically went on from post one by Jerako up until his eventual replacement. It feels a little heavy to be simple distancing which means it had to be a bus attempt.

Seems a little odd for a bus at that stage of the game, what are your thoughts?

[Nachomamma8]

Yeah... That confused me a bit myself.

The best I can come up with is that it was his reaction to [no]'s mistake. Newbiescum sees his partner make a mistake, his paranoid mind makes it seem 10x more severe than it is, so he goes on the attack.

[Thor665]

Okay, I am full of suck and admit it, I haven't finished the re-read yet (only on page 10 - though I'm only reading up through the hohum lynch) and am not comfortable voting till then, so I'm taking a pass till sometime tomorrow (Thursday) where I'll vote no matter what since I'm starting to feel all my reading is just digging me more into WIFOM holes.

Nacho's answer to the Jerako on [no] violence is weak. Of course he's sitting back with his assuredness of being cop and having a result - so it's not like he needs to justify his suspicions much.

I had a gut suspicion on Sauron as there was always something there that rubs me the wrong way and it's hard to ignore a cop claim.

Conversely, without a cop claim I'd almost certainly be lynching Nacho right now as that's where I feel the evidence seems to be pointing since the pressure on Nobody and the [no] pressure from Jerako both feel a little different then simple distancing to me.

I wish you'd left Haylen alive and NKed me...

[Equinox]

I thought this game was over already. Bah.

I wish you'd left Haylen alive and NKed me...

I'll say only this in response and let you think this out however you wish:

Ockham's Razor.

It does not have 100% reliability, but it's a favorite tool for students during exam season.

[Equinox]

I just remembered something.

Nobody Special's Day 3 posts assume a roleblocker. Interpret those posts as you wish, but I saw them as scum slips, which was why I did that setup analysis with Haylen.

I am not doctor. If you are not doctor, Nachomamma8 is not cop.

I'll be out for most of the day, so if you have any questions left over, I'll answer them when I get back. If not, good luck with your hammer, and GO TOWN.

[Thor665]

Nobody's role blocker concepts Day 3 included him being the doctor, so by definition he needed to discuss the roleblocker. So that's a thought but hardly groundbreaking.

I'm breaking out for lunch shortly, after lunch I'll finish my re-read and so should be voting sometime prior to 3pm. I just also ended up losing another game that was in Mylo so am full of sad and shalt be even sadder if I pick wrong here - consequently I just won't pick wrong.