town needs to find scum to lynch, and they need information for that... I like to get (a little bit of) this informations by character profiles... I'm not saying everyone should do the same... I don't carexvart wrote:The town needs character profiles in order to make lynch decisions?Tasky wrote:the "that's what I'm saying" point is that generally information doesn't hurt town since the need it to make lynch decisions
Mini 1005: Mafiaphobes! (Game over)
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Tasky Mafia Scum
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howyou find scum, as long as you find it-
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KageLord Goon
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- Location: Illinois
Here you say that 2-3 aren't rolefishing, but go on to say that they could be used later for analysis and that quoted part from you says we might be able to later use those "personality profiles" to determine who has what role based on their play. While this method doesn't seem reliable at all to me, if you believe in it, how could you say that's not like rolefishing? If a cop or doc is somehow discovered through your method, that would, in fact, hurt town. So, either the questions do nothing as some people say (and I personally believe), or they are actually hurtful to town. Either way, the benefit to scum would outweigh the benefit to town (this method, even if it works, is unlikely to find scum unless they are pretty dumb about it). If Tasky is town, all these questions have done so far is make town suspect him, drawing attention away from the real scum. If Tasky is scum... well, these questions might have done some good after all.Tasky wrote:
question 2/3 are not role-fishing... I honestly want to know from you which role you prefer to play and which roles you don't like to play against (or with)...Super Smash Bros. Fan wrote:
Pointless rolefishing question.Tasky wrote:2) What's the role you prefer to play (nothing to uncommon please), which role do you prefer between townie and scum?
See above.Tasky wrote:3) What role you hate having in the setup/play against (nothing uncommon please)?
this can beused later in the game for analysis of posts...
_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_Tasky wrote:e.g. I think that someone is more likely to be passive if they are playing a role they dislike...
knowing ones favorite role can turn useful later on... see it as a kind of investment, everybody invests 10 seconds of their time to tell us their favorite role and maybe we get to use that information later in the game... it's probable that it won't serve any purpose, but it could be helpful later, so it's definitely an investment that's somehow favorable-
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Tasky Mafia Scum
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look... those questions were just made to start the game... you all keep overrating them... I like those questions to scumhunt, you don't, that's it... everybody uses their method...
I never said those questions (2/3) would give me all the scums in one shot, I just said theycould, maybehelp...
the others are even more useful... e.g. if I someone tells me his playing style, it's more difficult later to cover up scummy behavior...
as I said, 2/3 are more like a personal style of play, the others are definitely in towns interest to be answered from everybody...-
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vezokpiraka Jack of All Trades
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Friend Mafia Scum
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quadz08 Jack of All Trades
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xvart, while I can see where diddin might be seen as scummy for that comment, I don't fully agree. Also, the underlined sentence? That is an enormous logical fallacy. What he was saying was "look, what I was trying to do was accomplished, even if it wasn't by my hand." That, by no means, equates to "look, what I was trying to do was accomplished BECAUSE I SCREWED UP."xvart wrote:
But you are claiming some responsibility; so show me where the conversation occurred about bandwagoning or the person you bandwagoned occurred.diddin wrote: I'm not claiming sole responsibility for ending RVS, I'm just saying that my usual plan for getting out of RVS worked, regardless of because what I did or not.AND, you then say your plan for getting out of RVS worked, whether you did it or not; so logically, you are saying because what I did failed, we still got out of RVS.The fact that you are trying to take credit for something to gain town points is highly suspicious. Care to link to games where you enacted your usual plan?
Plus, your vote on Tasky was extremely opportunistic.
Don't try to push suspicion on people for pretty much nonexistent reasons. I will not stand for it.Current Avatar: Kronk. Duh.-
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Friend Mafia Scum
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Oso Goon
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@ Friend. My opinion on diddin is pretty much neutral at the moment. Mostly because, while you pointed out that vote could be seen as opportunistic, I need more than a single instance of opportunistic behavior to consider that it is opportunistic AND because he used the contradiction to vote. I voted for that same reason myself so trying to find him scummy/null/town off that isn't going to work for me. Same goes for SSBF.
Unvote:Tasky
Why? Look at the discussion. Many people have pointed out how scum could possibly use his method against him and against town. Again, I don't want to get into a huge MD dissertation here but he has a theory of Mafia that he is trying to refine. Whether it works or not is moot. I think the contradiction I caught him in was a direct result of the fact that his trying to make his method work and he didn't think about what he was saying for that reason. Not because he was trying to lay some sort of trap.
Friend hit on the head here:
Based on the way Tasky has posted so far, if his questions are some sort of scum gambit, I am not seeing it.Friend wrote:I see what you're getting at, I suppose. While I don't think not answering the questions is scummy, I think I can see why he does.My Uncle always use'ta say, 'You can't get no blood from a turnip.' .... He'd say the same thing about gettin' it from a stone, too.
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I never said nothin' back to him. You don't want mess with no freak that's searchin' around that hard for blood.-
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quadz08 Jack of All Trades
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QFT.Oso wrote: Based on the way Tasky has posted so far, if his questions are some sort of scum gambit, I am not seeing it.
Yes, if you look at it like a math problem, you're right. The thing is, this isn't a math problem. Words rarely obey the commutative property.Friend wrote: @quadz - he wasn't saying diddin said that specifically. He said that:
"My plan for getting out of the RVS worked, whether my bandwagon succeeded or not" is equivalent to "My bandwagon didn't succeed, so we got out of RVS" logically, like a math problem. Correct me if I'm wrong, xvart.Current Avatar: Kronk. Duh.-
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Friend Mafia Scum
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xvart Mafia Scum
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diddin is claiming some level of responsibility for the town now being out of the RVS stage.quadz08 wrote:xvart, while I can see where diddin might be seen as scummy for that comment, I don't fully agree. Also, the underlined sentence? That is an enormous logical fallacy. What he was saying was "look, what I was trying to do was accomplished, even if it wasn't by my hand." That, by no means, equates to "look, what I was trying to do was accomplished BECAUSE I SCREWED UP."
diddin also said that [his] usual plan for getting out of RVS worked, regardless of because what [he] did or not [do].
Maybe my phrasing was a little off the first time so I'll try again:
Essentially, what diddin said was:Even if my typical plan had nothing to do with getting us out of RVS, my plan still worked, because we are now out of RVS.Check the logical fallacy on that one. He's claiming responsibility for something he had nothing to do with.
lol? It is hardly non-existent (as I hope I have clarified); but your jumping to his defense is duly noted. I also like how you tried to butter me up by saying you can see where diddin might be scummy for his comment and then go right ahead and blast my logic as a fallacy and how you won't stand for it. If everything about what I said was nonexistent and a fallacy, how pray tell do you see where he could be scummy?quadz08 wrote:Don't try to push suspicion on people for pretty much nonexistent reasons. I will not stand for it.
FoS: quadz08
xvart.I only read quote walls.
"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"-
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Oso Goon
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- Location: Northern California
I quote part of my last postFriend wrote:@Oso: Why the change of heart? You were the one who brought up the contradiction in the first place.
Your comment that you thought not answering the questions wasn't scummy, but you could see how Tasky would think it was clarified it for me. He didn't contradict himself because he is scum but rather because he is trying to get his theory to work. Same contradiction still exists but my thoughts on his motivation for making it in the first place has changed.Oso wrote: - snip -
I think the contradiction I caught him in was a direct result of the fact that his trying to make his method work and he didn't think about what he was saying for that reason. Not because he was trying to lay some sort of trap.
- snip -My Uncle always use'ta say, 'You can't get no blood from a turnip.' .... He'd say the same thing about gettin' it from a stone, too.
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I never said nothin' back to him. You don't want mess with no freak that's searchin' around that hard for blood.-
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quadz08 Jack of All Trades
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What I said was that I could see how he might be seen as scummy, not that I saw him as scummy. I understand your opinion, I simply do not share it.
And yes, I agree that what Diddin said is contradictory. However, I believe it to be a result of poor word choice, not of an attempt to look more townie. It's far too blatant (and too illogical) for that to fly.Current Avatar: Kronk. Duh.-
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Friend Mafia Scum
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vezokpiraka Jack of All Trades
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Oso wrote:@ Friend. My opinion on diddin is pretty much neutral at the moment. Mostly because, while you pointed out that vote could be seen as opportunistic, I need more than a single instance of opportunistic behavior to consider that it is opportunistic AND because he used the contradiction to vote. I voted for that same reason myself so trying to find him scummy/null/town off that isn't going to work for me. Same goes for SSBF.
Unvote:Tasky
Why? Look at the discussion. Many people have pointed out how scum could possibly use his method against him and against town. Again, I don't want to get into a huge MD dissertation here but he has a theory of Mafia that he is trying to refine. Whether it works or not is moot. I think the contradiction I caught him in was a direct result of the fact that his trying to make his method work and he didn't think about what he was saying for that reason. Not because he was trying to lay some sort of trap.
Friend hit on the head here:
Based on the way Tasky has posted so far, if his questions are some sort of scum gambit, I am not seeing it.Friend wrote:I see what you're getting at, I suppose. While I don't think not answering the questions is scummy, I think I can see why he does.
I have to agree with you.
UnvoteWindows hasn't detected any keyboard. Press Enter.-
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Friend Mafia Scum
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Super Smash Bros. Fan Mafia Scum
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I'm starting to become suspicious of Friend. I'll explain:
ISO: 11: Okay, he said that he didn't understand Oso's contradiction accustion against Tasky. Goes on to say that he doesn't want to continue to defend Tasky because he found Tasky pretty scummy anyways. Okay, fair enough.
However, the problem is that despite him saying he doesn't want to defending Tasky, he does exactly that. First sign of Tasky defense is ISO: 12, where he asks me to provide a case against Tasky in my own words, which I did. Continues with ISO: 13 where he continues to say he has trouble seeing the contradiction and that Tasky didn't refuse to answer any questions, just say that it would help him scum hunt.
ISO: 17 is the one that I despise the most. I don't like how he's trying to give Tasky a n00b pass in this game.
I also want people to refer back to ISO: 11 again. There, he said that Tasky was pretty scummy anyways. If that is that case, why defend a person you believe to be scummy?
If Tasky flips scum, this will sound like that Friend was defending his scum buddy. ISO: 12 is possible chainsaaw defense as well.
IGMEOY: Friend
I am not going to give him a pass based on his join date and posting style. If he expected mercy from me, he would get it at the Newbie games. Any other sections of Mafia and he deals with the best of my ability and nothing but the best.Friend wrote:Guys, take a look at Tasky's join date, posting style, etc. Now tell me, do you really think he's good enough to subtly rolefish like that as scum? Cause I really don't.-
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vezokpiraka Jack of All Trades
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vezokpiraka Jack of All Trades
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Friend Mafia Scum
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SSBF. Think about it, now. I'm not defending Tasky on anything else except the rolefishing accusations, because I do NOT think Taskyscum is capable of thinking "hm I'll try and out some PRs with these RQs" in a million years.
I asked you to give me a Tasky case because I wanted to see if you were sheeping on a case you didn't really understand (which I think vezo is doing now). I decided you weren't after your post. Just wanted to explain my reasoning behind it.
And I'm not trying to give Tasky a "n00b pass." If I find him scummy for other things besides the rolefishing deal, I'll call him out on them. But I just cannot see Tasky being smart enough to try and subtly fish out PRs like you're claiming he did.-
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Friend Mafia Scum
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quadz08 Jack of All Trades
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Friend Mafia Scum
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Friend Mafia Scum
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diddin Mafia Scum
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- Location: Belvidere, IL
Ok, let me try to explain my wording. From my experience of playing mafia, a bandwagon in RVS helps generate discussion to end RVS. I am trying to imply a CORRELATION between my wagon and RVS ending so quickly, not necessarily a CAUSATION. The comment was meant to be halfway sarcastic and you guys took it way too seriously.
Also, FoS:Vezopiraka for that backpedal.
I'm not sure I should be voting Task, as some other people said, he's pretty new, and I doubt noobscum would have such an elaborate plan. From my experiences, noobtown tend to want to be as helpful as possible and end up looking scummy because of it. That, and noobscum often will freak out and start flailing with only a few votes on them and start fiailing, while Tasky has kept his composure pretty well.
unvoteShowTown 8/4
Mafia 2/3
3rd Party 0/0
Everyone loves Diddin-Slaxx
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