Open 241: Emotional Breakdown! (Over)

[Mysterio]

Crap, my browser screwed up there.

[Xite91]

A)This thread sure blew up since I claimed. Everyone altogether now say, "Thank you, Mysterio!"

B) Sidebar: A lot of these points were completely unnecessary. Fracturing someone's post and trying to pick out random crap makes you look very,

very

scummy.

2), 3), 4) - It's arguably more important in the beginning of the game when everyone is equal. Later in the game, there's a possibility of building a reputation that might allow scum to take more risks. Just how the game evolves. Also,

I'm

the one that said it was fake. That's not misrepresenting you, that's accusing you. There's a difference. Finally, 4) is a huge stretch. Have you never heard that figure of speech before? Please don't waste my time with weak points like these.

5), 6), 7) - These points should not have been fractured like that. They are all referring to the same main point, which is that your reasoning behind a town fake claim doesn't make sense. Point 5) was the setup, while points 6) and 7) were the explanation. Breaking up my post into nonsensical parts tells me that you're forcing the issue. If you are indeed town, then my advice to you is to stop trying so hard. If you're scum, well, just one more point against you. Also, your response to 7) is strange. Did you forget that you're the one who mentioned the possibility of me fake claiming as town? I'll even quote it:
If you did forget, then please try to keep up.

What if I'm really a Mason? I'm interested to know how you'd read my claim then.

A) Please, people, I need gratification! What, were you trying to get townie points or something?
B) Discredit without any actual information... Interesting
I broke it up to make it easier on the readers of it, and to me (answering it) It's a pain in the ass trying to remember where you were in a paragraph that jumped around so much
2+3) But the accusation was pointed out as definite truth. This is why I called it a misrep
4) No, I'd like you to point out exactly where the slip is, because if you can't point it out, then it's not there. That's not just a figure of speech, there's usually evidence involved with those.
5) It's really hard to tell when your points jump around so much.
6) Waitwaitwait... did you just say that if i'm town, to stop trying so hard? What the hell? Have you EVER played this game before?
7) Sorry, misunderstanding I saw "Fake claiming as town" and thought, he's "fake -claiming as town-" AKA your town claim was fake. It is really cute, though, how you're trying to make me look dumb to the rest of the group in order to discredit me. I kind of want to pat you on the head.

Then you eat rainbows and shit gold? For some reason I'm just convinced you're not an actual mason, so there's no scenario I can come up with.

[Xite91]

The statement that "scum knows that I [Mysterio] am town," is inherently false. Scum knows he is not their scumteam, and that is all.

Can you expand on this a bit? The fact is scum know I'm not on their team, whether or not they know if I'm on the other scum team is irrelevant. This would only be worth pointing out if the scum teams had some kind of win condition that forced them to collaborate. Otherwise, if I'm not on their team, then me being on the other team or town makes no difference to them. You're going to have to explain this a bit.

Because you being town and you being scum teams are two completely different things to the town? Therefore it's important to differentiate. Do you really need it explained any further?

[Mysterio]

@mysteriou why did u claim so early?

Mostly to try and catch a scum slip, which I mentioned to Xite. However, another reason was for the fun of it. This game was literally dead, so claiming seemed like a good way to also satisfy my boredom. If claiming gets me NK, meh. It was still worth it.

A) Please, people, I need gratification! What, were you trying to get townie points or something?
B) Discredit without any actual information... Interesting
I broke it up to make it easier on the readers of it, and to me (answering it) It's a pain in the ass trying to remember where you were in a paragraph that jumped around so much
2+3) But the accusation was pointed out as definite truth. This is why I called it a misrep
4) No, I'd like you to point out exactly where the slip is, because if you can't point it out, then it's not there. That's not just a figure of speech, there's usually evidence involved with those.
5) It's really hard to tell when your points jump around so much.
6) Waitwaitwait... did you just say that if i'm town, to stop trying so hard? What the hell? Have you EVER played this game before?
7) Sorry, misunderstanding I saw "Fake claiming as town" and thought, he's "fake -claiming as town-" AKA your town claim was fake. It is really cute, though, how you're trying to make me look dumb to the rest of the group in order to discredit me. I kind of want to pat you on the head.

Then you eat rainbows and shit gold? For some reason I'm just convinced you're not an actual mason, so there's no scenario I can come up with.

Why do you assume it was for townie points? And if you're unable to respond to a post without breaking things up, then wow. Not sure how to even respond to that.

Anyway, this is the second time where your responses do not follow at all. Point 5) of your previous post bolded the "Unfortunately" word that I used, and asked how it was unfortunate if you're not scum. That is what I was responding to. Asking me to point out your "slip" makes no sense, because the post you were responding to did exactly that! So, either you didn't understand it, or you're deliberately muddling things up. As such, I will quote my post that explains your slip:

A scum sees my claim, and knows that I am town. At this point in the game, it is in the best interest of scum to blend in. Making overtly scummy moves would obviously be bad play. What is the best way to blend in for scum who knows that I'm town? Make a fake attempt at stopping a counterclaim. At the same time, the scum would be thinking to themselves, "Easy N1 target." Unfortunately, that kind of thought can slip into the post without the person realizing it. You see, my goal in claiming was to try and catch someone slipping. I believe I have.

In other words, your initial reaction to my claim is the "slip" I'm referring to.

Moving on...

Because you being town and you being scum teams are two completely different things to the town? Therefore it's important to differentiate.

There's an underlying assumption to your response here. You seem to be under the assumption that I'm simply trying to get town to accept my claim. That was clearly not my intention, given the fact that I made that point as an argument

against you.

Whether or not town accepts my claim is secondary at this point.

[AGar]

The statement that "scum knows that I [Mysterio] am town," is inherently false. Scum knows he is not their scumteam, and that is all.

Can you expand on this a bit? The fact is scum know I'm not on their team, whether or not they know if I'm on the other scum team is irrelevant. This would only be worth pointing out if the scum teams had some kind of win condition that forced them to collaborate. Otherwise, if I'm not on their team, then me being on the other team or town makes no difference to them. You're going to have to explain this a bit.

Townies are always more dangerous to scum than other scum groups. You say scum know you are town and must get rid of you. They do not though. They can let you sit around and make a believable case from an honest point of view that they believe that you are scum. That's the benefit given to scum groups in a 2 scum party game - they have an added way by which they can fly under the radar, so to speak.

Until you are either confirmed our counter-claimed, you are no more of a threat to either scumgroup than anyone else, and just a nuisance to the town at this point. Open claims on Day 1 simply pull the focus of the town onto one player and encourage tunneling. If it weren't a 2:2:8 game right now, I'd easily believe that you could be scum gambitting to draw attention to yourself in order to give your buddies a day without scrutiny and out of the limelight. Since that isn't the case, I'm going to say that you're either really bold scum or a really dumb townie and leave you at that.

The mason claim discussion at this point is indirectly getting us somewhere, but further discussion about whether Mysterio is telling the truth or not is getting us nowhere. Instead, the focus should be on reactions to his claim and where we can find scum there. Discussion on the veracity of Mysterio's mason status should be minimalized, if not completely eliminated.

That said, I do have two points about it before I wrap up discussing the claim itself.

1) Mysterio, you said it is not your point to get us to believe your claim. Then, I must ask, what is? Please tell me you didn't do this solely for discussion's sake. I've read what you wrote, but I'm not 100% convinced that that is the whole reason? Was this pre-discussed or a seat-of-your-pants decision to claim like this?
2) I'm inclined to believe it because of the way he worded his initial claim about "talking behind our backs." It's a nice hint at the masons' passive ability. I don't think many scum would be keen enough to pick up on that. Just my piece.

[Kaiveran]

Okay, I'm all caught up and ready to play. Unfortunately, I am a little...shall we say...out of sorts, so this post may be unorganized. But enough of my personal matters; let me address things.

@Andrew73

: I didn't have a particular suspicion because nobody registered as truly scummy, and the argument between Mysterio and Xite, my main candidates for scum hadn't progressed to the point that it has. I had very limited access and hadn't able to keep up with the game until recently.

On that point, I am getting less suspicious of Mysterio, and more so of Xite. It makes more sense for Mysterio to be a Mason (or at least a Townie) than scum, and yet Xite keeps fighting him and seems to be intentionally muddling things in order to gain an artificial edge.

Mysterio said that "scum knows I'm town," in an attempt to give proof as to why he is confirmed town and this claim is valid.

The statement that "scum knows that I [Mysterio] am town," is inherently false. Scum knows he is not their scumteam, and that is all.

I'm not sure that particular point matters now. Whether Mysterio is Town or Scum, it would not be reasonable for scum to counterclaim. In fact, it might not make sense for Mysterio to be scum at all. As pointed out before, if the 3 real masons all counterclaim, that means that we've got Mysterio pinned as scum. No scum team would have the manpower to pull off that fakeclaim (please remember that we're dealing with two

opposing

scum teams; Mysterio's response to your post seems obtuse until you realize that in the eyes of

any

scumteam, he is a potential enemy.) Many possibilities of scum counterclaiming have been explored, and IIRC all of them at

least

result in a 50% chance of the offending scum being offed. Since scum are apt to stay away from risky moves this early in game, I'll have to award the townie prize to Mysterio for the time being.

I do not agree with your plans, Agar. For starters, what exactly is this "added way to fly under the radar" that scum have this game? Are you suggesting that the scum are just hanging back, banking on Mysterio to appear scummy and warrant a lynch? Because that is something that can NEVER be counted on.

I kinda see the logic in your plan to delay a mason counterclaim till next day, especially if Myst flips Mason when killed, but said logic seems flawed to me. If you're expecting a dream play in which both scum teams counterclaim the masons and we have 2/3 or better chance of nailing a red with each lynch, don't count on it. You're asking both scums teams to effectively commit suicide, and in the best-case scenario, only one will. If one scum team counterclaims and sets up a 1-vs.-1 with the real masons (or vice versa) the other will just hang back and watch the fireworks (unless we are the luckiest bastards alive and they do so simultaneously. Then again, scum (or even masons) might abstain from claiming, leaving two standouts ripe for the town's picking (i.e two lone claimers have a 1/3 chance of being masons, but 2/3 chance of being scum). That's assuming that Mysterio

is

killed and

does

flip mason. What if Myst

isn't

killed? What if he flips Town or Scum? We can pretty much throw your plan out the window then.

About your beef with me: as stated before, I was V/LA up until my post, I only forgot to send advance notice. I didn't contribute much because I hadn't had time to form significant contributions. There's a difference between V/LA and lurking...right? You might have thought I was taking pot shots at an easy target, but it seems you might well have been doing the same thing.

No OMGUS for you though, since this looks more like townie error and I'm sure there's something I've overlooked that you will point out to me (I'm a tiny bit smashed...).Not too keen on voting Xite due to lack of votecount, aaand nopointinactingup still hasn't shown his face.

Prod on nopoint

, please?

FoS: Xite

[andrew94]

@mysteriou why did u claim so early?

Mostly to try and catch a scum slip, which I mentioned to Xite. However, another reason was for the fun of it. This game was literally dead, so claiming seemed like a good way to also satisfy my boredom. If claiming gets me NK, meh. It was still worth it.

so far the only slip i see you saw is about xite

also kaiveran my name is andrew94!!!!

[andrew94]

A)This thread sure blew up since I claimed. Everyone altogether now say, "Thank you, Mysterio!"

B) Sidebar: A lot of these points were completely unnecessary. Fracturing someone's post and trying to pick out random crap makes you look very,

very

scummy.

2), 3), 4) - It's arguably more important in the beginning of the game when everyone is equal. Later in the game, there's a possibility of building a reputation that might allow scum to take more risks. Just how the game evolves. Also,

I'm

the one that said it was fake. That's not misrepresenting you, that's accusing you. There's a difference. Finally, 4) is a huge stretch. Have you never heard that figure of speech before? Please don't waste my time with weak points like these.

5), 6), 7) - These points should not have been fractured like that. They are all referring to the same main point, which is that your reasoning behind a town fake claim doesn't make sense. Point 5) was the setup, while points 6) and 7) were the explanation. Breaking up my post into nonsensical parts tells me that you're forcing the issue. If you are indeed town, then my advice to you is to stop trying so hard. If you're scum, well, just one more point against you. Also, your response to 7) is strange. Did you forget that you're the one who mentioned the possibility of me fake claiming as town? I'll even quote it:
If you did forget, then please try to keep up.

What if I'm really a Mason? I'm interested to know how you'd read my claim then.

A) Please, people, I need gratification! What, were you trying to get townie points or something?
B) Discredit without any actual information... Interesting
I broke it up to make it easier on the readers of it, and to me (answering it) It's a pain in the ass trying to remember where you were in a paragraph that jumped around so much
2+3) But the accusation was pointed out as definite truth. This is why I called it a misrep
4) No, I'd like you to point out exactly where the slip is, because if you can't point it out, then it's not there. That's not just a figure of speech, there's usually evidence involved with those.
5) It's really hard to tell when your points jump around so much.
6) Waitwaitwait... did you just say that if i'm town, to stop trying so hard? What the hell? Have you EVER played this game before?
7) Sorry, misunderstanding I saw "Fake claiming as town" and thought, he's "fake -claiming as town-" AKA your town claim was fake. It is really cute, though, how you're trying to make me look dumb to the rest of the group in order to discredit me. I kind of want to pat you on the head.

Then you eat rainbows and shit gold? For some reason I'm just convinced you're not an actual mason, so there's no scenario I can come up with.

the point is
he claimed
no1 cc'ed
so...
why are you arguing against him
are you mason or what shit

[nopointinactingup]

Though Mysterio's mason claiming was bad, he did fish out a good reaction from Xite. I can see Xite's reaction as what scum would do.

Unvote.Vote:Xite

[dramonic]

Votecount 3: It feels the same!

Xite (2): Mysterio, nopointinactingup
drmyshottyizsik (2): a2rudeboy, andrew94
andrew94 (1): bv310
ConfidAnon (2): Xite, drmyshottyizsik
Kaiveran (1): AGar
bv310 (1): SotSSS
nopointinactingup (1): Kaiveran

Not voting (2): don_johnson, ConfidAnon

With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch!

a2rudeboy prodded

Deadline is the 27th

[a2rudeboy]

unvote

Picking up prod. Will be back soon, need a reread on some things.

[AGar]

Kaiveran's response was satisfactory for the time being.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Xite

The more I read his posts, the more I just want to make like a Norwegian and club Tiger Woods in the head. Because he deserves it more than baby seals do.

Xite, start producing content that is helpful and not asinine.

[Xite91]

Responding to each person one at a time.

@mysteriou why did u claim so early?

Mostly to try and catch a scum slip, which I mentioned to Xite. However, another reason was for the fun of it. This game was literally dead, so claiming seemed like a good way to also satisfy my boredom. If claiming gets me NK, meh. It was still worth it.

Really? The game was dead? Would you like me to link you to a

real

dead game? Trust me, this one was quite alive.

Why do you assume it was for townie points? And if you're unable to respond to a post without breaking things up, then wow. Not sure how to even respond to that.

Because it takes less time and space than doing this, and like I said, it's easier to follow than a huge paragraph that jumps everywhere answered by a huge paragraph that jumps everywhere else. It's my style of posting, are you really using it as a pseudo-valid argument against me? Wow. Not sure how to even respond to

that.

Anyway, this is the second time where your responses do not follow at all. Point 5) of your previous post bolded the "Unfortunately" word that I used, and asked how it was unfortunate if you're not scum. That is what I was responding to. Asking me to point out your "slip" makes no sense, because the post you were responding to did exactly that! So, either you didn't understand it, or you're deliberately muddling things up. As such, I will quote my post that explains your slip:

A scum sees my claim, and knows that I am town. At this point in the game, it is in the best interest of scum to blend in. Making overtly scummy moves would obviously be bad play. What is the best way to blend in for scum who knows that I'm town? Make a fake attempt at stopping a counterclaim. At the same time, the scum would be thinking to themselves, "Easy N1 target." Unfortunately, that kind of thought can slip into the post without the person realizing it. You see, my goal in claiming was to try and catch someone slipping. I believe I have.

In other words, your initial reaction to my claim is the "slip" I'm referring to.

Lets start with discrediting the person I'm attacking

again

. Next, read the damn post

4) At the same time, the scum would be thinking to themselves, "Easy N1 target."

Unfortunately

, that kind of thought can slip into the post without the person realizing it.

You see, my goal in claiming was to try and catch someone slipping. I believe I have.

4) Bolded. How's that unfortunate unless you're scum? Also, I'd like you to point out that "slip"

It was in regards to the whole sentence, which I've even underlined for you. It meant how is that unfortunate for the town??
Okay, then can you point out how it was a scum slip and not a cautious townie tell?

Moving on...

Because you being town and you being scum teams are two completely different things to the town? Therefore it's important to differentiate.

There's an underlying assumption to your response here. You seem to be under the assumption that I'm simply trying to get town to accept my claim. That was clearly not my intention, given the fact that I made that point as an argument

against you.

Whether or not town accepts my claim is secondary at this point.

Orly?

And there will be no counterclaims, for I am indeed a Mason.

What if I'm really a Mason? I'm interested to know how you'd read my claim then.

[Xite91]

Anyway, this is the second time where your responses do not follow at all. Point 5) of your previous post bolded the "Unfortunately" word that I used, and asked how it was unfortunate if you're not scum. That is what I was responding to. Asking me to point out your "slip" makes no sense, because the post you were responding to did exactly that! So, either you didn't understand it, or you're

deliberately muddling things up

.

@Andrew73

: I didn't have a particular suspicion because nobody registered as truly scummy, and the argument between Mysterio and Xite, my main candidates for scum hadn't progressed to the point that it has. I had very limited access and hadn't able to keep up with the game until recently.

On that point, I am getting less suspicious of Mysterio, and more so of Xite.

It makes more sense for Mysterio to be a Mason (or at least a Townie) than scum, and yet Xite keeps fighting him

and seems to be

intentionally muddling things

in order to gain an artificial edge.

Hmm... Seems to be a strange similarity there.

Next

a) I think you're town, just not a mason, trying to pull something I've actually done a few times before

1) Assuming you're town, which I am atm.

-----

Anyways, since you're slipping away from looking townie to me, I'll give you what I thought you were doing if you were town, hence the "youre a genius" in my reaction
You claim mason
Theres a bit of discussion, a lot of which gives some good info during the day
If no one else claims, you get NK'd, giving town less of a chance of losing a PR
If others claim, there's still a chance of you getting NK'd, which is still less a chance of town losing a PR
Therefore, a successful gambit

^With that said, I'd like to point out that he's the one attacking me. I'm only responding to the case.

Mysterio said that "scum knows I'm town," in an attempt to give proof as to why he is confirmed town and this claim is valid.

The statement that "scum knows that I [Mysterio] am town," is inherently false. Scum knows he is not their scumteam, and that is all.

I'm not sure that particular point matters now. Whether Mysterio is Town or Scum, it would not be reasonable for scum to counterclaim. In fact, it might not make sense for Mysterio to be scum at all. As pointed out before, if the 3 real masons all counterclaim, that means that we've got Mysterio pinned as scum. No scum team would have the manpower to pull off that fakeclaim (please remember that we're dealing with two

opposing

scum teams; Mysterio's response to your post seems obtuse until you realize that in the eyes of

any

scumteam, he is a potential enemy.) Many possibilities of scum counterclaiming have been explored, and IIRC all of them at

least

result in a 50% chance of the offending scum being offed. Since scum are apt to stay away from risky moves this early in game, I'll have to award the townie prize to Mysterio for the time being.

Oooooooh, so you're basing your idea off of WIFOM... interesting

I do not agree with your plans, Agar. For starters, what exactly is this "added way to fly under the radar" that scum have this game? Are you suggesting that the scum are just hanging back, banking on Mysterio to appear scummy and warrant a lynch? Because that is something that can NEVER be counted on.

I'm pretty sure it was the point that scum can actively scumhunt, because they don't know who town actually is, which makes their cases look more real/less scummy. Use your head plox

I kinda see the logic in your plan to delay a mason counterclaim till next day, especially if Myst flips Mason when killed, but said logic seems flawed to me. If you're expecting a dream play in which both scum teams counterclaim the masons and we have 2/3 or better chance of nailing a red with each lynch, don't count on it. You're asking both scums teams to effectively commit suicide, and in the best-case scenario, only one will. If one scum team counterclaims and sets up a 1-vs.-1 with the real masons (or vice versa) the other will just hang back and watch the fireworks (unless we are the luckiest bastards alive and they do so simultaneously. Then again, scum (or even masons) might abstain from claiming, leaving two standouts ripe for the town's picking (i.e two lone claimers have a 1/3 chance of being masons, but 2/3 chance of being scum). That's assuming that Mysterio

is

killed and

does

flip mason. What if Myst

isn't

killed? What if he flips Town or Scum? We can pretty much throw your plan out the window then.

So are you suggesting we lynch Mysterio?
Where do you get your numbers?
Didn't you say you looked at the other ideas for outcomes of CCs?

No OMGUS for you though, since this looks more like townie error and I'm sure there's something I've overlooked that you will point out to me (I'm a tiny bit smashed...).Not too keen on voting Xite due to lack of votecount, aaand nopointinactingup still hasn't shown his face.

Prod on nopoint

, please?

FoS: Xite

Placeholder, placeholder.

By the way, there was only one vote on me at this point. Just sayin. Looks a lot like fence-sitting to me.

Anyways,

Unvote, Vote Kai

[Xite91]

Though Mysterio's mason claiming was bad, he did fish out a good reaction from Xite. I can see Xite's reaction as what scum would do.

Unvote.Vote:Xite

How so mister lurker?

Kaiveran's response was satisfactory for the time being.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Xite

The more I read his posts, the more I just want to make like a Norwegian and club Tiger Woods in the head. Because he deserves it more than baby seals do.

Xite, start producing content that is helpful and not asinine.

How was it satisfactory? Or did you just mean the reason for being gone?
Uhm... you are aware that I was responding to a case against me, right?

[AGar]

I do not agree with your plans, Agar. For starters, what exactly is this "added way to fly under the radar" that scum have this game? Are you suggesting that the scum are just hanging back, banking on Mysterio to appear scummy and warrant a lynch? Because that is something that can NEVER be counted on.

I didn't say that at all.

I was saying scum have less slips to worry about in a two scum-party game as they can honestly scumhunt.

I kinda see the logic in your plan to delay a mason counterclaim till next day, especially if Myst flips Mason when killed, but said logic seems flawed to me. If you're expecting a dream play in which both scum teams counterclaim the masons and we have 2/3 or better chance of nailing a red with each lynch, don't count on it. You're asking both scums teams to effectively commit suicide, and in the best-case scenario, only one will. If one scum team counterclaims and sets up a 1-vs.-1 with the real masons (or vice versa) the other will just hang back and watch the fireworks (unless we are the luckiest bastards alive and they do so simultaneously. Then again, scum (or even masons) might abstain from claiming, leaving two standouts ripe for the town's picking (i.e two lone claimers have a 1/3 chance of being masons, but 2/3 chance of being scum). That's assuming that Mysterio is killed and does flip mason. What if Myst isn't killed? What if he flips Town or Scum? We can pretty much throw your plan out the window then.

There was no plan here. It was just saying let Mysterio be and talk about other things. If he flips tonight mason, we know he was telling the truth. If scum opt to kill him and he's another scum, we get a cross-kill. If scum leave him be, we have another day to worry about him, but we can also maybe bring forth his mason buddies and have 3 confirmed townies at that point. Narrows the pool down. If he flips non-mason when he gets killed, he is an idiot.

You're really just not capable of reading it seems. :/

How was it satisfactory? Or did you just mean the reason for being gone?

It explained why he or she voted Nopoint. It explained the V/LA. The reaction was ok.

Uhm... you are aware that I was responding to a case against me, right?

You've decided to discuss the mason claim until you were blue in the face and you're fighting with flawed logic about your case on Mysterio. You're tunneling hardcore and looking for anything to make Mysterio look scummy at this point.

[Xite91]

You've decided to discuss the mason claim until you were blue in the face and you're fighting with flawed logic about your case on Mysterio. You're tunneling hardcore and looking for anything to make Mysterio look scummy at this point.

Really? Is that what I'm doing? I really just thought I was arguing against a case that was made against me. Way to blow that one out of proportion. And, no I'm not tunneling. Actually, I have suspicions on a good amount of people, and am doing what I can to investigate them, if I was tunneling, I would have a vote on mysterio and I would be ignoring everyone else in the thread.

[AGar]

Oh I'm sorry. You removed your vote and turned around and voted someone who accused you.

And your entire reason you need to defend yourself so vehemently is because you overaggressively tried to make a mason claim something it wasn't, and now you're scumminess has been revealed.

[Xite91]

1) Oh I'm sorry. You removed your vote and turned around and voted someone who accused you.

And your entire reason you need to defend yourself so vehemently is because you overaggressively tried to make a mason claim something it wasn't, and now you're scumminess has been revealed.

I really hope you're not talking about Mysterio, because I never voted him, I voted Kai for obvscum behavior.

No, I was pointing out all the reasons for a mason claim, and just warning the masons (in case they're noobs/ don't think too well) not to counterclaim. I'm pretty sure Mysterio was the one making it something it wasn't. Not quite sure how I made myself look so scummy by defending what seemed to me to be complete bullcrap that needed correcting. But eh, what do I know?

[andrew94]

xite why were u arguing against an un cc'ed mason.
nopoint pls stop lurking

Anyway, this is the second time where your responses do not follow at all. Point 5) of your previous post bolded the "Unfortunately" word that I used, and asked how it was unfortunate if you're not scum. That is what I was responding to. Asking me to point out your "slip" makes no sense, because the post you were responding to did exactly that! So, either you didn't understand it, or you're

deliberately muddling things up

.

@Andrew73

: I didn't have a particular suspicion because nobody registered as truly scummy, and the argument between Mysterio and Xite, my main candidates for scum hadn't progressed to the point that it has. I had very limited access and hadn't able to keep up with the game until recently.

On that point, I am getting less suspicious of Mysterio, and more so of Xite.

It makes more sense for Mysterio to be a Mason (or at least a Townie) than scum, and yet Xite keeps fighting him

and seems to be

intentionally muddling things

in order to gain an artificial edge.

Hmm... Seems to be a strange similarity there.

yes i agree with the similarly. it seems as if kai is trying to do something there or just BANDWAGONING

unvote

[nopointinactingup]

I just began school so it's kinda hectic. But I'm not lurking because I would post when I see the new content.
@Xite: Reading you just reminds me of scum. And I don't see how a town could react like this:

Mysterio is either a genious or scum. Masons,

don't

counter-claim plox, if he's scum thats what he's trying to get you to do.

And one more reason is that you wanted me modkilled ..
So that's all ..
basically ..

[Kaiveran]

Yeah, I guess I

really

misread Agar's post. I could have also sworn that there were more votes on Xite (drugs are bad, kiddies.) I think the little clear reasoning that was there was understood though. Mysterio is very likely to be an actual mason, and if he's not, the real Masons can nail his ass to the wall with a counterclaim, which wouldn't be a good move if he was anything other that what he says he is. Nice one, Myst.

So now I have

Xite

to deal with:

Anyway, this is the second time where your responses do not follow at all. Point 5) of your previous post bolded the "Unfortunately" word that I used, and asked how it was unfortunate if you're not scum. That is what I was responding to. Asking me to point out your "slip" makes no sense, because the post you were responding to did exactly that! So, either you didn't understand it, or you're

deliberately muddling things up

.

@Andrew73

: I didn't have a particular suspicion because nobody registered as truly scummy, and the argument between Mysterio and Xite, my main candidates for scum hadn't progressed to the point that it has. I had very limited access and hadn't able to keep up with the game until recently.

On that point, I am getting less suspicious of Mysterio, and more so of Xite.

It makes more sense for Mysterio to be a Mason (or at least a Townie) than scum, and yet Xite keeps fighting him

and seems to be

intentionally muddling things

in order to gain an artificial edge.

Hmm... Seems to be a strange similarity there.

OMG, they used a similar phrase, they must be scumbuddies! Protip: Being pegged as scummy for tunneling on someone doesn't mean you can shift your attention to someone else to get out of it. You're just exhibiting the same behaviors against me, which is not doing anything to avert suspicion. Digging up petty shit like this is only getting you dirtier.

Mysterio said that "scum knows I'm town," in an attempt to give proof as to why he is confirmed town and this claim is valid.

The statement that "scum knows that I [Mysterio] am town," is inherently false. Scum knows he is not their scumteam, and that is all.

I'm not sure that particular point matters now. Whether Mysterio is Town or Scum, it would not be reasonable for scum to counterclaim. In fact, it might not make sense for Mysterio to be scum at all. As pointed out before, if the 3 real masons all counterclaim, that means that we've got Mysterio pinned as scum. No scum team would have the manpower to pull off that fakeclaim (please remember that we're dealing with two

opposing

scum teams; Mysterio's response to your post seems obtuse until you realize that in the eyes of

any

scumteam, he is a potential enemy.) Many possibilities of scum counterclaiming have been explored, and IIRC all of them at

least

result in a 50% chance of the offending scum being offed. Since scum are apt to stay away from risky moves this early in game, I'll have to award the townie prize to Mysterio for the time being.

Oooooooh, so you're basing your idea off of WIFOM... interesting

How is

any

of this "based on" WIFOM? I was simply saying that a scum counterclaim was not a wise move as it narrows down the possible culprits

very fast

, which is something that

no

scum wants to do. Notice how I used the phrase "at

least

50%". That means in the

best-case scenario, a scum counterclaim will result in half of the lynch targets being bona fide scum

. Hence my viewpoint. I fail to see how WIFOM factors into any of this. Looks like I'm not the only one who could brush up on my reading comprehension.

I'm pretty sure it was the point that scum can actively scumhunt, because they don't know who town actually is, which makes their cases look more real/less scummy. Use your head plox

I already addressed this point. I wasn't thinking about the principle of devalued scumhunting because the hubbub was mainly about Myst, who I've already established is non-suspect. I wasn't thinking straight. Forgive me for being a member of the gaffe-prone human race.

[quote="Xite]

I kinda see the logic in your plan to delay a mason counterclaim till next day, especially if Myst flips Mason when killed, but said logic seems flawed to me. If you're expecting a dream play in which both scum teams counterclaim the masons and we have 2/3 or better chance of nailing a red with each lynch, don't count on it. You're asking both scums teams to effectively commit suicide, and in the best-case scenario, only one will. If one scum team counterclaims and sets up a 1-vs.-1 with the real masons (or vice versa) the other will just hang back and watch the fireworks (unless we are the luckiest bastards alive and they do so simultaneously. Then again, scum (or even masons) might abstain from claiming, leaving two standouts ripe for the town's picking (i.e two lone claimers have a 1/3 chance of being masons, but 2/3 chance of being scum). That's assuming that Mysterio

is

killed and

does

flip mason. What if Myst

isn't

killed? What if he flips Town or Scum? We can pretty much throw your plan out the window then.

So are you suggesting we lynch Mysterio?
Where do you get your numbers?
Didn't you say you looked at the other ideas for outcomes of CCs?[/quote]

What. The. Fuck.
Again, do you comprehend what you read? Number one, I've already reconciled my misunderstandings with Agar, and number two, I thought the point would have been pretty damn obvious;

it is a bad idea for Masons to claim on the next day, regardless of what happens.

If Mysterio were scum, he would have been run over by the real masons already. I also did look at the other outcomes for counterclaims, and if you were actually ppaying attention you would have grasped that by now.

Placeholder, placeholder.

By the way, there was only one vote on me at this point. Just sayin. Looks a lot like fence-sitting to me.

Anyways,

Unvote, Vote Kai

This is one of the few times where I can employ the term "OMGUS" literally.

Unvote, Vote:Xite

[Kaiveran]

AND SUDDENLY, EPIC FORMATTING FAIL

[Xite91]

1) Yeah, I guess I

really

misread Agar's post. I could have also sworn that there were more votes on Xite (drugs are bad, kiddies.) I think the little clear reasoning that was there was understood though. Mysterio is very likely to be an actual mason, and if he's not, the real Masons can nail his ass to the wall with a counterclaim, which wouldn't be a good move if he was anything other that what he says he is. Nice one, Myst.

So now I have

Xite

to deal with:

2) OMG, they used a similar phrase, they must be scumbuddies! Protip: Being pegged as scummy for tunneling on someone doesn't mean you can shift your attention to someone else to get out of it. You're just exhibiting the same behaviors against me, which is not doing anything to avert suspicion. Digging up petty shit like this is only getting you dirtier.


3) How is

any

of this "based on" WIFOM? I was simply saying that a scum counterclaim was not a wise move as it narrows down the possible culprits

very fast

, which is something that

no

scum wants to do. Notice how I used the phrase "at

least

50%". That means in the

best-case scenario, a scum counterclaim will result in half of the lynch targets being bona fide scum

. Hence my viewpoint. I fail to see how WIFOM factors into any of this. Looks like I'm not the only one who could brush up on my reading comprehension.

4) I already addressed this point. I wasn't thinking about the principle of devalued scumhunting because the hubbub was mainly about Myst, who I've already established is non-suspect. I wasn't thinking straight. Forgive me for being a member of the gaffe-prone human race.

5) What. The. Fuck.
Again, do you comprehend what you read? Number one, I've already reconciled my misunderstandings with Agar, and number two, I thought the point would have been pretty damn obvious;

it is a bad idea for Masons to claim on the next day, regardless of what happens.

If Mysterio were scum, he would have been run over by the real masons already. I also did look at the other outcomes for counterclaims, and if you were actually ppaying attention you would have grasped that by now.

6) This is one of the few times where I can employ the term "OMGUS" literally.

1) Or masons could be doing the smart thing and waiting to CC. Just sayin
2) Funny. I do recall changing my vote before he said anything about tunneling. But if I'm wrong, you can always let me know. Also, yeah, it was scummy because you used the same terms, made the same basic reasons for eventually voting, and then voted for the same person.
3) That whole thing is a steaming pile of WIFOM.
4) Uhm... ok?
5) Starting with that first actual sentence, the answer is yes thank you, very well. But I think you have your idea of time screwed, because again you are going crazy about something that happened later in the game. In this case the post I'm responding to right now. Look at point one my quoting of your post. Interesting, isn't it?
6) Ironically, very little of my case on you had anything to do with you voting me. It was partly buddying up and partly blowing out of proportion and now even misreping things (although you could have done that before, I'd have to go check) I just don't like how you seem to be trying to ride on the tail of someone else's case.
So yeah, i'm pretty sure my vote is in a good spot right now

[Xite91]

oops EBWOP, meant to have this on my other post

I just began school so it's kinda hectic. But I'm not lurking because I would post when I see the new content.
@Xite: Reading you just reminds me of scum. And I don't see how a town could react like this:

Mysterio is either a genious or scum. Masons,

don't

counter-claim plox, if he's scum thats what he's trying to get you to do.

And one more reason is that you wanted me modkilled ..
So that's all ..
basically ..

Ok, first point has no real reason, just an easy to jump on a wagon.
Second, wow. Just wow. Lets just forget for a second that that was a joke and think... If I was really pushing for a modkill there, what would be my reasoning? Did you break any rules that would result in a MK? Did you break any rules in general?