Mini 1061: Mafia in Someplace - Game Over!

[el simo]

Also I'm pretty sure I did reply to that, let me check through my posts.

[el simo]

Eh will do it later gtg.

[Retrospective]

he is just trying to discredit and argue theory blah blah unfounded all he is doing is saying I'm wrong blah blah

[Retrospective]

I don't know Retro, do you hate me that much?

Yeah.

[Retrospective]

On a more serious note:

el simo; post 307 is where you start talking about Elleran vs Diddin for scum. Post 325 is where you where you say "idk about elleran so ima vote jace 'cause his post number is low" [Please note this is also the part of the game where you weren't even reading Elleran's posts and you just looked at post count.] Elleran defends on 377. You voted Jace 52 posts before Elleran even attempted to defend himself. Saying I made up these numbers is ridiculousness. You were extemlely hypocritical especially because you were voting for lurking. You stopped pressureing Elleran the second he posted even though he said next to nothing of value, however when Jace posts you're still confident he's scum. Yeah, you're right! I'm not sure where anyone is getting this double standard argument from. And I just realized this now but between diddin and elleran you voted diddin. Once Elleran was getting a huge amount of heat and people stopped learning on diddin, you picked Jace out of nowhere. Everytime you were at a cross road between Elleran and another player, you always picked the latter.

Can someone tell me how Sweep is so goddamn town? I really cannot fathom why you're not all up in arms with me. Take a minute and ISO him. I'm tired of hearing neutral. Freaking analyze his play. If you think he's town, prove it. Otherwise vote Sweep.

Time to make an example out of this.
Now that I've talked about el simo and and sweep being scum. I'm gonna vote hmmm....DH1

Unvote; Vote: DH

This is perfectly justified!

[Retrospective]

Guys, I know there are scumtells flying but until someone gets to L-1 and I will hammer, have no fear. But until then I'm gonna pressure DH. DH, how are you going to respond to this pressure vote that I'm pressuring you with because its a pressure vote?

[Retrospective]

btw guys this isn't a pressure vote

[Benmage]

So I jumped back to about pg 18 for this post/read through.

Sweep I had an answer t your question but I realized i caught me with my own logic. So instead of arguing a losing battle I'll admit the pressure aspect of must vote. How ever, unlike Ben implies, the pressure was not the reason for my vote and was only a by product of my suspicion. This is why I claim it isn't a pressure vote.

There is not much else I can argue. I can argue technicalities with you all day (such as the incorrect use of the term wishy washy) but at the end of the day I was

non committal

.

Which isn't good....

So what it comes down to is Bens word over mine.

Not so black and white..because one of my points against you is you being non committal.

Firstly, there was the Retro case. That had some decent steam, and some really good points. Retro refutes some points, but is simply incapable of answering to others. The case pointed Retro at having a good likelihood of flipping scum, and still does. Nothing changed between then and now, and yet simo seems to have completely forgotten the case. He unvoted Retro simply because Retro AtE'd and complained his vote off of him. I unvoted Retro because I found another player who I felt was scummier. Simo hasn't had a single case against anyone since he unvoted Retro.

I unvoted Retro to focus my attention else where, my views have not changed about him and he is still my favourite lynch today.

Whhh Whhh What??? You unvote your favorite lynch target to put attention elsewhere?? Why would you ever want to detract attention from you favorite lynch target? Moreover for what purpose/ why did you/ who did you feel the need to focus on(yes this may be repetitive, please answer).

I'm going to bold this statement because I don't want Ben, Sweep or the rest of the town to miss it.

The pressure is a by product of my suspicion. It is not the reason why my vote is placed on him. This is why I was arguing the fact that it wasn't a pressure vote.

Yeah, you're suspicions are based on his lack of participation. Thus your vote is parked there until he adequately participates. So yeah...this is a pressure vote which you s.p.e.l.t out the get out of jail free card, or how he can easily alleviate any suspicion you have........ Posting. Look out, god forbid he didn't simo probably wouldn't do anything anyways. One, side, wasted vote causing so much pressure Jase's way. (sarcasm in those last two lines for those who didn't realize it)

Either or, there has

not been a word of truth

from this post, and it alone is enough to warrant my vote.

Now this seems like a misstatement to make your counter sound a bit stronger.

Hmm...
I cannot see a town motivation to stop putting pressure on someone that you think is the most scummy.

QFT

Oh really, how funny, because you were the one insisting that I do it, claiming I was too tunnelled. Besides, this statement is no longer true. I favour ICE for todays lynch,..

Did Jase ever satisfy

his lack of contribution

your "suspicions"?

Why is ice scummy for making the case? It looks like only a dressed up OMGUS to me.

^QFT, and yes Retro summarized it nicely in 452.

And saying that I'm manufacturing the lie is bullshit. I can't make it up, he blatantly said things that weren't true and is now covering them up by saying opps you're right, oh well you're still scummy, probably even more so because you didn't vote! Woolah!

It was pretty obvious when I read his and yours post before rereading his response that it was a simple misstatement. Why would anyone make such a blatant lie, and then attempt to push it when anyone could clearly do a fast iso of yourself or of the votecounts and see that you didn't vote Elleran. This was obviously a misstatement and for you to be suggesting otherwise is a massive grasping at straws and scummy as shit. I can't believe at this point I am going to have to still read 5 more pages and you aren't dead.

Regardless, I focused on Ell. Found him scummy at first

See.. this is where the misstatement stems from. This idea, and anyone could get your original words if you like and show you what Ice said in context was truth. You stamping around on your feet going LIAR LIAR isn't persuading anyone. You were torn between diddin and El, and voted diddin. What Ice said in regards to you and Ell was true.

. I stated intent to hammer because I did - at that time - but there was no need for me to move my vote off Jase, so I didn't.

Because your vote on Jase was so effective (more sarcasm)

I'm pretty suspicious of Ben but I want to stay quiet on that for now, I don't want him to adapt his game according to my read on him.

In previous skimming I saw this....I'm sure I'll get to it later as I believe others have commented on it.

19 pages of pretty much wild accusations and nothing concrete. Random voting will probably get a townie voted off and prefer to start in the night phase. Can't really see any useful info coming from today so:

Vote: No lynch

w.t.f.(missed this post in my skims)

In your experience, how many games (or % wise) that you (or anyone) played, that started in day phase, had a scum voted off in day one?

I have no math % but I have seen both town and scum lynched D1. You lynch D1 otherwise you end up in D2 as an extended D1 down a townie because NK speculation turns into too much wifom. All the information gained D1(which i can break down some specifics if need be) is virtually nullified or not achieved without a D1 lynch.

I doubt any one will have enough "evidence" for me to confidently vote today.

What do the others think?

Okay…pausing on top of pg 20…to breakup this post before it becomes too massive, and I need to go to the gym.

[Benmage]

I fell so far behind guys so bare with me if I mention things already taken care of.

[el simo]

It was pretty obvious when I read his and yours post before rereading his response that it was a simple misstatement. Why would anyone make such a blatant lie, and then attempt to push it when anyone could clearly do a fast iso of yourself or of the votecounts and see that you didn't vote Elleran. This was obviously a misstatement and for you to be suggesting otherwise is a massive grasping at straws and scummy as shit. I can't believe at this point I am going to have to still read 5 more pages and you aren't dead.

A simple misstatement 9 times in three posts all accusing me of doing things I haven't done? Benmage your response is outdated. I have a guest over so I can't respond in full just yet.

[Elleran]

I just ISO'd Sweep and I'm leaning toward town. His last post seemed to try to get the town away from theory arguments and get players back into the game. Although it was a short post, it gave me a strong town read; short and sweet. However, before the last post, I had a weak scum read on Sweep due to his seemingly contentless posts.

[DemonHybrid]

Guys, I know there are scumtells flying but until someone gets to L-1 and I will hammer, have no fear. But until then I'm gonna pressure DH. DH, how are you going to respond to this pressure vote that I'm pressuring you with because its a pressure vote?

With a witty response that's totally solid and logical with absolutely no scumtells whatsoever, no siree, not one bit. The most townish reply ever.

[Retrospective]

Guys, I know there are scumtells flying but until someone gets to L-1 and I will hammer, have no fear. But until then I'm gonna pressure DH. DH, how are you going to respond to this pressure vote that I'm pressuring you with because its a pressure vote?

With a witty response that's totally solid and logical with absolutely no scumtells whatsoever, no siree, not one bit. The most townish reply ever.

Obvious scum is obvious.

[Slaxx]

unvote

Vote: Demonhybrid

Elleran got a lot more townie with that vote

This is just a guesstimate btw.

[Slaxx]

-with that post, sorry.

[ICEninja]

A simple misstatement 9 times in three posts all accusing me of doing things I haven't done?

9 misstatements? 3 posts? I do believe you're making these numbers up. I believe you found 7, and almost all of them (maybe all of them?) were in 1 post. 2 of them were definitely stretches.

Elleran's one post giving Sweep a town tell clears him? Slaxx you're going soft. Granted, it is indeed much improved from what he's been giving us. I'm feeling more solid about a simo lynch at the moment.

Slaxx, care to explain the DH vote?

One thing that simo is right about is that he's addressed Jace's question. More than once, in fact. I don't like the response much, but he's given it.

[Jase]

Ok, wow, he really did drop of the face of the earth, and of course all it takes to summon him is a bit of attention. If we don't lynch him today (and it's looking much more like we should) everyone be sure to tack something to the effect of "Sup elleran" on the end of each and every post. For now I'm backing off from Simo. My ultimate read of him depends quite a bit on the outcome of his and Ices current back and forth.

Elleran: I don't care if you don't think there's anything new to say. Every time you're able to make a post comment on the new attacks that have been made take sides. Do it. Do it or you're as good as lynched. (Though you might be anyways it looks a lot like your intentionally lurking) Also you say nothing has changed since you last gave us your read on Simo. I call bullshit. You say you've been reading the thread, so how is it you missed the attacks on simo? Do you REALLY have nothing to say about it?

Hey. Hey Elleran. Hey. I made this post just for you. Do you like it. You must not have found it. I put it somewhere I thought you'd see it.

[Slaxx]

Haha it was a joke vote ICE, I was parodying how Stim voted me.

ICE, do me a favor and ISO stim. Tell me all the things wrong with his play.

Ive pointed some of them out already...Also

unvote

Vote Elleran

Because he still isnt giving any scum reads. You can town read people all you want as scum but thats called appealling to town and its a scum move.

[Jase]

One thing that simo is right about is that he's addressed Jace's question. More than once, in fact. I don't like the response much, but he's given it.

Don't tell me that "I wanted to put my vote on Jase" was his explanation. That's the closest I think I've seen to him addressing it.

Slaxx: Um what? I mean...I don't know...It usually takes more than simply saying a thing to reduce suspicion.

[Slaxx]

Here is a good one for starters, ICE. He says

B) You clearly read my votes. You are selectively quoting, not? i.e. " 95% is random guessing and people voting for others that are "disagreeable" (for lack of a better word). Of the 5% remaining, 95% is composed of people blowing the slightest little tiny hint of a "tell" out of proportion. That leaves 0.25% of real tells which I will never see in a 100 million years, with the little experience I have. " and I did mention guesstimate.

Tell me whats wrong with this?

Making up statistics, for one.
Not taking responsibility for a vote, for another.
Voting someone without any case, for another.
Clinging on to the RVS with 20 pages of material, for another.
Deflecting my question by reverting back to statistics he made up from inside his noggin, for another.

Shall I go on or can we agree that Ell is scum and Smit is chainsaw attacking me?

[DemonHybrid]

Guys, I know there are scumtells flying but until someone gets to L-1 and I will hammer, have no fear. But until then I'm gonna pressure DH. DH, how are you going to respond to this pressure vote that I'm pressuring you with because its a pressure vote?

With a witty response that's totally solid and logical with absolutely no scumtells whatsoever, no siree, not one bit. The most townish reply ever.

Obvious scum is obvious.

Oh noes! The evidence is absolutely overwhelming!

[Jase]

Oh...nevermind.

[Slaxx]

I freakin love DH.

He gets my next sig shoutout.

BUDDYING.

[Jase]

That sounds like an admission of guilt DH. Lynching time?

[DemonHybrid]

I freakin love DH.

He gets my next sig shoutout.

BUDDYING.

<3

Preview Edit for Jase: Why so srs?

If you guys want to pick my brain, it's all for the pickin'. I haven't read EVERY wall but I have my opinions.