Mini 1061: Mafia in Someplace - Game Over!

[Slaxx]

I'm more than happy to give that up DH, but Retro and I are the only ones around here making cases. If someone else wants to make a case and help me, I am fine, but so far everyone has been sheeping me. If you think my leading is scummy, I can defend myself only with this: Would I really, as scum, led and disintergated two bandwagons and called them town after they were under pressure? Its WIFOM, but thats the best I got. If you think my reads are town then just let it go, if you think where I am coming from is scummy say something. But someone has to perpetuate the game forward and I'll take that role.

Preview Edit: TL just assumed Sweep was town. Interesting.

[Smitster]

TL is like that in all my games DH, I think he is having access problems. Idk about Diddin.

What do you mean falling hard? Why does my attitude factor into your town read of me? Especially with good reads? I asked for one thing before anyone hammered and actually had to unvote because he made it to L-1 again, then someone else but him at L-1, then numbnuts over there had to hammer. I have every right to be pissed off right now.

What did you ask?

[DemonHybrid]

I didn't say it was "scummy", I said it was concerning/unnerving.

That being said, I will try to focus on this game and pick up the cases, since I can see where you're coming from with that.

[Slaxx]

If you read the thread, you'd notice I was waiting for Benmage to give his opinion on the Sweep wagon, and then he said he would ISO seep later and give his opinions on stuff. Thats what we were waiting on. Good to know you didnt even read the events prior to your hammer.

[Slaxx]

I know you didnt say that DH, I was saying if you started to think it was, don't wait to call me out on it. I was encouraging you to speak your opinion.

Also DH you're still my favorite ^^ that last post sounded kind of harsh >> didn't mean it that way.

[DemonHybrid]

By the way, everything that I said aside, I still find you and Retro town, but you have gone from "I mostly trust you" to "Hm...they're probably town, but their play Day 2 has been ultra-persuasive-manipulative....so...." and that's quite the fall from what I've been feeling before.

Preview edit: Understood. It wasn't harsh, at least I didn't think so. It's all legit concerns.

[Smitster]

If you read the thread, you'd notice I was waiting for Benmage to give his opinion on the Sweep wagon, and then he said he would ISO seep later and give his opinions on stuff. Thats what we were waiting on. Good to know you didnt even read the events prior to your hammer.

Ben still has time to do this, sorry man I missed that, I thought you were waiting for the claim, which sweep did.

[Slaxx]

Well I hope he does.

And its okay.

[DemonHybrid]

Even so, why would you FoS both Slaxx and Sweep, given their interactions?

[Smitster]

Even so, why would you FoS both Slaxx and Sweep, given their interactions?

Play play interactions.

[Retrospective]

I didn't know DH thought I was town yesterday. :O

I figured people still suspected me.

[el simo]

You have had a much better day 2 save a few points. You'll have to do some uber scummy for me to push your lynch tomorrow.

[Slaxx]

Smit, you'll have to elaborate. Because Sweep and I are probably the farthest from scumbuddies there are, except maybe for Retro and Sweep.

[Retrospective]

No this is classic bussing, Slaxx.

[Retrospective]

Shit i said that outloud

[ICEninja]

I'm willing to believe more townVI now than bad scum. I suppose the possibility is still there, but he's not a wise lynch.

You definitely seemed extremely confident in his towniness. I'll try to follow the transition you went through on him. Originally at the beginning of day 2, your opinion could be summarized here:

I'm probably will Slaxx on the Smit lynch, but I am worried about Murder in the Desert pt 2 as well.

You feel like he's scum, but you're hesitant.
Then you make this statement, which has been reinforced by things you're still saying:

As far as the VI argument goes, he has enough logic to prove that he's not quite a VI...but it's terrible and misguided logic. Most VIs just don't even have logic.

I don't exactly agree with this, but you're being consistent with yourself. You've voted for him at this point, and for reasons presented by diddin.

Then this is what comes as the biggest surprise to me:

As far as Smit goes, he's ultra scummy, but he's now been reduced to absolutely no logic...and I guess he's starting to shape up like that VI that I mentioned earlier. I'm going to keep an eye on him still.

Then you transition in to this:

Smitster is nothing but ultra-VI town, like TL said. Like I said, bad scum at least have some logic. He's been degraded to none.

I noticed Smit changed very minimally between these 2 posts. He was presenting a lot of VI behavior around he time of you saying he was ultra scummy, and dissapeared after that for the most part. The next time you refer to him, he's ultra town. How did he go from ultra scummy to ultra VI town? It is interesting to note that the ONLY thing Smit posted between ultra scummy and ultra VI town was this:

I've had no further info to change any of my FOS's and I'll vote them as such until I do.

And now you've transitioned to somewhere nicely between?

I'm willing to believe more townVI now than bad scum. I suppose the possibility is still there, but he's not a wise lynch.

So ultra scummy to ultra VI town to probably VI town.

[Slaxx]

ICE, nice misrep.

"As far as Smit goes, he's ultra scummy, but he's now been reduced to absolutely no logic...and I guess he's starting to shape up like that VI that I mentioned earlier. I'm going to keep an eye on him still."

You took the first part of that but not the second part. He

did

say that he was ultra scumym but

didn't just say that

. He said he was probably VI in that very same post.

Also, you make that case, but don't take a stance on it. What does that make you think of DH?
Surely you had a thesis in mind for that post. Honestly it looks a bit timid to me, like you're not for sure whether you want to go there or not.

[ICEninja]

I made that post in haste because I realized there was a hammer and I wanted to get that in before twilight. Hopefully it doesn't have any errors in it. I didn't get to finish it fully, and submitted in a panic of impending thread locking.

I lost my town read on DH because of how he keeps saying Smit is scummy but probably town. I don't think he's a good lynch for tomorrow, but I'm not so positive he's town at this point either.

I'm really irritated by Smit, and I simply just don't feel like we can let him live tomorrow unless we're really sure of another lynch. At this point I'm too confused by him to know if he's scum or if he's town, but I'm positive that if we don't lynch him he will survive all the way to lylo. So our options are to either try to win before lylo despite Smit, which I suggest we take a crack at assuming Sweep flips scum, or we lynch Smit tomorrow and play it safe, and do our best to win during lylo.

I definitely suggest the policy lynch if Sweep flips town, especially considering how sketchy that hammer was.

[DemonHybrid]

Ultra-VI town, not Ultra VI-town.



He went from posting SOME logic to fluff....to even more fluff. He's starting to regress though. I HATE the fact that he's saying that Sweep and Slaxx's interactions make them likely scum. Such a dumb statement.

[DemonHybrid]

Regressing as in now he's back to posting terrible logic. I'll keep you updated.

[ICEninja]

You took the first part of that but not the second part. He did say that he was ultra scumym but didn't just say that . He said he was probably VI in that very same post.

Yes he said that, but he's still stated that Smit was "ultra scummy", even if he is a VI. Smit didn't say anything worthwhile at all whatsoever before DH called him "ultra VI town". It is the inconsistency of his wording that gives me pause, not his actual stance on Smit.

Preview edit:

I see your point DH. I suppose I misinterpreted your "ultra VI town" statement. I also agree that Smit's most recent actions, along with his statement about suspecting both Sweep and Slaxx (which is blatant alignment neutral idiocy) force us to reconsider our positions on him. I'll also have to decide for myself tomorrow.

[DemonHybrid]

I'm willing to believe more townVI now than bad scum. I suppose the possibility is still there, but he's not a wise lynch.

You definitely seemed extremely confident in his towniness. I'll try to follow the transition you went through on him. Originally at the beginning of day 2, your opinion could be summarized here:

I'm probably will Slaxx on the Smit lynch, but I am worried about Murder in the Desert pt 2 as well.

I think he's scum here.

You feel like he's scum, but you're hesitant.
Then you make this statement, which has been reinforced by things you're still saying:

As far as the VI argument goes, he has enough logic to prove that he's not quite a VI...but it's terrible and misguided logic. Most VIs just don't even have logic.

Still think he's scum

I don't exactly agree with this, but you're being consistent with yourself. You've voted for him at this point, and for reasons presented by diddin.

Then this is what comes as the biggest surprise to me:

As far as Smit goes, he's ultra scummy, but he's now been reduced to absolutely no logic...and I guess he's starting to shape up like that VI that I mentioned earlier. I'm going to keep an eye on him still.

Not so sure of him. He stopped posting awful logic and started focusing on distractions without logic.

Then you transition in to this:

Smitster is nothing but ultra-VI town, like TL said. Like I said, bad scum at least have some logic. He's been degraded to none.

Changed my mind, he's now been so VIish that I can see the town VI in him.

I noticed Smit changed very minimally between these 2 posts. He was presenting a lot of VI behavior around he time of you saying he was ultra scummy, and dissapeared after that for the most part. The next time you refer to him, he's ultra town. How did he go from ultra scummy to ultra VI town? It is interesting to note that the ONLY thing Smit posted between ultra scummy and ultra VI town was this:

I've had no further info to change any of my FOS's and I'll vote them as such until I do.

And now you've transitioned to somewhere nicely between?

I'm willing to believe more townVI now than bad scum. I suppose the possibility is still there, but he's not a wise lynch.

Nothing has changed from my last post about him

So ultra scummy to ultra VI town to probably VI town.

Right, and now he's going back to "Slaxx is scum, and this is why". His "this is why" is fucking terrible.

[Slaxx]

Actually that makes sense ICE, sorry. I forgot we were even in twilight >>

We'll see about smit tomorrow. If Sweep is scum I'm gonna lol if smit is mafia. But I highly doubt it. If Sweep flips mafia its more or less Ben or El Simo, maybe TL.

[Retrospective]

I was feeling a bit uneasy when Smit came and hammered but all of the discussion after the hammer has just reinforced my towntells on everyone. Except maybe diddin, but that's just because he hasn't posted.

[Retrospective]

Actually that makes sense ICE, sorry. I forgot we were even in twilight >>

We'll see about smit tomorrow. If Sweep is scum I'm gonna lol if smit is mafia. But I highly doubt it. If Sweep flips mafia its more or less Ben or El Simo, maybe TL.

There's no way there is a Sweep/smit team. There's so much pointing away from it. Just look at how confident Sweep was in a smit lynch.