Mini 1107: Just a Game (Game Over)

[Riceballtail]

I'm not explaining the primary reason for my vote yet.

Cecily, however, is a highly likely target if I decide to move it though.

[Neruz]

I'm not explaining the primary reason for my vote yet.

VOTE: Riceballtail

[Withnail]

@ sordros and Cecily: your posts made me look again at the Neruz's interactions with his attackers. I had remembered Neruz overreacting

after

he was put under a lot of pressure and insulted. But in fact the first insults are thrown by Neruz, and very early, in posts 36 and 38.

Later on, Neruz's frustration seemed much more understandable and justified. But the early over-reaction is more interesting. I don't think it's very strong evidence of guilt, and the case that got built on top of that still looks poor to me. But I'm glad you made me look again at this. It's an example of why I think it's good for townfolk to be transparent about their thoughts. By comparing different perceptions, we can help each other to work out who's town and who's not.

[Tasky]

VOTECOUNT 2.1

Neruz (2/6): Riceballtail, Hiraki
Riceballtail (2/6): Cecily, Neruz


Not Voting: Hiraki, Riceballtail, werewolf555, Neruz, Withnail, Nobody Special, mockingjaye, Vigilante Ventriloquist, sordros, Cecily

Deadline is Thursday, 03.02, 06:00 CET

also

@Mod:

thread name seems to think it's still Day 1, as does the first post. Might want to fix that.

fixed, thank you.

[Neruz]

@ sordros and Cecily: your posts made me look again at the Neruz's interactions with his attackers. I had remembered Neruz overreacting

after

he was put under a lot of pressure and insulted. But in fact the first insults are thrown by Neruz, and very early, in posts 36 and 38. .

I dislike stupidity, in light of the fact that i believed (and was later proven to be correct) that Hiraki had just put a serious vote on me in response to a joke i made during RVS i don't think i overreacted at all. I'd say my reaction was entirely justified. Hiraki was being an idiot, i called it like i saw it.

[Hiraki]

Riceballtail was about as townie as Parama was. He will not be lynched.

Hiraki however, i know you're capable of reasoning and talking because you did it on D1, like to explain your vote a bit, or are you cool with just leaving it hanging like that?

I'm cool with leaving it hanging, depends on if there's more information needed.

I will take back about what I said about Cecily being an idiot for the Riceball, and take another look at Riceball. He was one of my town reads, but perhaps I'm just missing something.

Of the still-living players, he's the one who has disagreed most with VV.

The point being?

I didn't like his "unvote" after Parama reached the lynch point. That looks doubly bad given that he wasn't even voting for Parama.

Someone on the Parama wagon needed to die more than Parama, that's what the unvote was for.

Also somewhat suspicious is his often aggressive tone, occasionally stepping over the line into insults. I think both are anti-town, because they distract town players from effective mafia-hunting. But some people just behave that way online, so it's not a very clear indicator of guilt.

Nah. It's more how I play on here. Insults shouldn't distract people. I bring out reasoning. For example, with Cecily, I called her an idiot, and then proceeded to say why. I don't just insult without reason. Well, maybe sometimes, but it'd have to be pretty obvious. You should get the gist of what I mean.

EBWOP: I also find the ICE kill rather interesting, he would not have been my first choice for scum kill. I shall have to go back and take another look at his interactions on d1 to try and work out what made him a target, but i have a sneaking suspicion that he might have been killed to try and incriminate me. I'm tired though, so that could be the paranoia speaking.

Did the paranoia in you also tell you to care about the kill?

Hey guys. You know what's even the second bad part? Neruz assumes that this is a scumkill. It's pretty clear that

everyone

here thought he was scum. Not only was this post not needed, but hindsight, this post is so not needed.

I had remembered Neruz overreacting after he was put under a lot of pressure and insulted.

To note, this is why I kept the vote on until the end.

Btw. because ICE turned up villager, Withnail looks erkgle.

[Neruz]

Did the paranoia in you also tell you to care about the kill?

No Hiraki, logic told me to care about the kill. ICE died for a reason, his death does not seem to line up with what i would expect in this game based on my view of it. That makes ICE's death an abnormality, and abnormalities are clues to finding scum.

Hey guys. You know what's even the second bad part? Neruz assumes that this is a scumkill. It's pretty clear that

everyone

here thought he was scum. Not only was this post not needed, but hindsight, this post is so not needed.

It was even numbers and there was only one kill. If it

wasn't

the scumkill then the town PR responsible for that kill has a

lot

of explaining to do.

[Neruz]

@Mod:

Also, on that last votecount you've got Me, Riceball, Hiraki and Cecily down as not voting

[Hiraki]

No Hiraki, logic told me to care about the kill. ICE died for a reason, his death does not seem to line up with what i would expect in this game based on my view of it. That makes ICE's death an abnormality, and abnormalities are clues to finding scum.

I don't find any reason that scum would want to kill a villager(which btw, if they had a role-cop, they still wouldn't be able to find it out), especially one that was second in line to be killed. And also the scummiest in the game. I've had one game where I was compromised as scum(offsite, mind you) by a watcher who the scum team didn't dare touch because he was scummy. Of course, he saw me Roleblock a Tracker one night and boom I was gone.

This really doesn't make any sense from a scum point of view. The only other plausible solution would be a NK and a Visit Kill Ability, but that's bagging on a lot right there. That'd also confirm 2 PRs that were on ICE.

[Neruz]

Um. I'm not certain but i'm pretty sure you just agreed with me.

[Hiraki]

It seemed like you were leaning toward the reasoning that there was some sort of reasoning that the scum killed ICE.

Am I incorrect?

[Vigilante Ventriloquist]

Sorry for not getting around to posting. Sleep reared its ugly head earlier than I expected last night and I was busy yesterday (I'm in GMT-5). If I don't get a post in by the end of today....I don't know, insert some horrifying action here and imagine me following it if I don't post. I should be able to post though.

[Neruz]

It seemed like you were leaning toward the reasoning that there was some sort of reasoning that the scum killed ICE.

Am I incorrect?

I was pointing out that the ICE kill seemed like an abnormality based on my current view of the game, which means it merits some attention as to working out the reasons behind it.

I'm not going to just chalk it up to a town PR though; we had a night, one townie died, unless someone wants to claim that kill (and they shouldn't want to just yet) then i will assume it was the scum kill. I'm certainly not going to just ignore it.

[Neruz]

Decided to do the ISO of Ice just now, since it's only a few posts.
ICE didn't seem to really be an obvious threat to anyone, he poked Hiraki for his 'i'm town amirite' thing, but then pretty easily switched to me and didn't really pay attention to Hiraki again. He greatly disagreed with Vigilante, pointed out a light suspicion on Cecily and then lynched Parama for his scum claim.


Looking at that, i don't think Hiraki had any reason to fear ICE being alive, Cecily

might

, but it's pretty light. The only people ICE had any really strong opinions on were me and Parama, so there's a reasonable chance he was the kill because he's safe, with the added bonus of making me look bad.
With that said, Cecily was quite timid with her vote earlier. I think riceball is a better lynch at this point, but i've got my eye on you Cecily.

[Tasky]

Prodding Nobody Special and werewolf555

[werewolf555]

Ok, I'm back
So far, I'm thinking that Rice seems scummy and is trying to push a counter-bandwagon so that she doesn't get lynched.

[Hiraki]

Apparently voting first means that it's plausible to push a counter-wagon.

You learn something new everyday.

[Nobody Special]

Hiraki & Neruz -- can the two of you stop spouting nonsense for a bit? Thanks, ever so.

RBT, do you agree with Hiraki that the ICE kill was suspect?

Actually, everyone (except Hiraki obv) can answer that.

werewolf, who do you think is scummiest right now?

@Mod:

See sig, no access tomorrow. Back Tuesday.

[Riceballtail]

@NS: Yeah, I have no idea why they killed ICE. Best thought is to WIFOM us out of looking at the others in the list for partners though.

Also, VV can join Cecily.

[Hiraki]

Hiraki & Neruz -- can the two of you stop spouting nonsense for a bit? Thanks, ever so.

That's impossible, and you know it.

[Neruz]

For once i agree with Hiraki.

Let us ensure this never happens again.

[werewolf555]

I think that the highest scum suspect is Riceball for his not explaining, I believe I outlined my reasoning in the above post.

[Hiraki]

I think that the highest scum suspect is Riceball for his not explaining, I believe I outlined my reasoning in the above post.

Apparently voting first means that it's plausible to push a counter-wagon.

You learn something new everyday.

Also, no. You said it was due to him doing the counter-wagon.

No one is going with Neruz today, so I'll abandon that for today because everyone has their brains stuck on Rice being scummy enough to lynch.

Unvote, Vote: Werewolf

You're not town.

[Vigilante Ventriloquist]

Yeah, I know. I'm "a little" late, but I'm here now.

I'll start with the two obvious things:

1. Parama, I hate you, you're a bad person, you deserve to be locked up, etc etc.
2. That was just about the least likely scum kill humanly possible. Unless scum thought ICEninja was a cop or something, they lost an easy mislynch by killing him. (Of course, it might not have actually been a scum kill, but that's not worth discussing at the moment.)

Now moving on to what's happened today.

Nobody Special asking werewolf about his breadcrumb in post #180 is just awful. Considering breadcrumbs are usually used to point out one's role, this is blatant rolefishing.

FoS Nobody Special

Then again, I don't get werewolf's explanation of his crumb at all.

in other words, I was pretty sure of ice-scum
Want to know why everybody is voting neruz though

Why did you want to crumb that? Sounds like the kind of thing you would just come out and say in a post.

Obligatory "I still don't see the case on Neruz" statement. I would like it if one of his attackers (preferablly Riceballtail, since his initial vote came with no reasoning) would

succinctly

describe why Neruz is scum.

I'm kind of getting reservations about Withnail. I tend not to be suspicious enough of people who agree with me and this could just be my paranoia kicking in now. Either way, not something I care to look into so much now. There are bigger scum to fry.

VOTE:Neruz

It's the right thing to do.

Can you provide a little more detail? Cecily's case on you sounds good to me in light of your contributions.

Not particularly liking this. The post really doesn't do much but say "hey, im thinking of voting you, plz defend urself." Not sure if that's more likely a scum-scum interaction or a scum-town interaction (if sordros is scum, that is), but this could be an interesting link to look back at after either sordros or Riceballtail flips.

Riceballtail was about as townie as Parama was. He will not be lynched.

This could definitely use some elaboration.

Hey guys. You know what's even the second bad part? Neruz assumes that this is a scumkill. It's pretty clear that everyone here thought he was scum. Not only was this post not needed, but hindsight, this post is so not needed.

The frustrating part about reading things like this is that I still think you're town. Night kill speculation is more common where Neruz normally plays and the fact that he assumed the kill was a scumkill is only bad if you also assume it was a scum kill.

As for where my vote should go...
My first instinct is to put it on Riceballtail. His day 1 play consisted entirely of jumping on big wagons with little or no reasoning and he stuck with that trend with his day 2 vote on Neruz. He's basically contributed nothing to this game.
After ICEninja's flip, I'm kind of tempted to look elsewhere though. If my main day 1 suspect is town, I'm a bit hesitant to immediately go back to someone else I suspected day 1. Actually, forget that.

Vote: Riceballtail

I might look into doing some wagon analysis. Even with only 2 flips, the rather hectic nature of the day 1 wagons could allow us to draw some interesting information out of day 1 votes.

[Hiraki]

This could definitely use some elaboration.

They are both town in motive, but not in action. Therefore, neither will die today.

The frustrating part about reading things like this is that I still think you're town. Night kill speculation is more common where Neruz normally plays and the fact that he assumed the kill was a scumkill is only bad if you also assume it was a scum kill.

I'm not sure what you're getting at here.