Cold War Mafia - GAME OVER!!

[Amrun]

Gonnano: I considered lying and giving a different flavorname, but what if someone else had that flavorname and counterclaimed? Also, silencing as a town role is a stretch anyway without it fitting as flavor with McCarthy. Very likely I would have been lynched anyway and then gained a meta as a liar. I'd rather tell the truth.

You might see it as a dangerous claim, and I knew some would, but I read the situation on me, and the ThAd wagon was losing ground, the moth/jmj wagon wasn't even close, and the wagon on ME was gaining speed. I didn't want to wait until the hammer was about to happen. I thought it would be a lot less fruitful that way. That relies on everyone being online etc.

I also meant to add that BoS makes a great point... WHO is EGL? Lurker much? Wow.

[Furcolow]

Do you blame me, BotS? What do I have besides my mind and my vote? an extra life?

I dislike Feysal's silly wrathful pushing, and his wanting me silenced. I have freedom of speech. If my vote is taken away, it will only make me louder.

[Amrun]

I won't silence you, Furc, because as much as your play has annoyed me this game, I actually believe your claim.

[mothrax]

The problem with "I would have made up another name" is this. We are in a Large game, about a relatively obscure subject. How many people do you know off the top of your head? Most of the publicly known people are bound to be in the set-up which means there is little room to slip up in a claim.

I believe you are indeed McCarthy, and the ability makes sense with the flavor, but the role is scummy. Even before your claim you were scummy, and I still believe that point, post claim.

[Amrun]

As I said, I considered it. However, silencing would be a strange ability on a random obscure townie, imho, and I would come under just as much heat for that... And in the end, I'd rather not lie as town even if lying might be the smarter move in this way. I'm still pretty new and I could see it backfiring. Idk. Lying isn't my strong suit.

Believe or not that I am town. I doubt there's anything I could do to convince you otherwise at this point.

[Furcolow]

there is no way we can be burning fahrenheit 451, gui montag.

[InflatablePie]

Why make such a dangerous claim when there are still other viable wagons?

Exactly. It doesn't make sense to do this as scum. Gonna mention Occam's Razor before someone pulls the gambit card.

Then Amrun came along and basically claimed Hitler

Different time period, bro.

I have had it up to here with everyone voting for people who are not their top suspects or most likely scum reads. It is batshit crazy. And we wonder why there are 11 different "wagons." It's pretty obvious that one vote wonder wagons are not achieving anything... AT ALL. Let me suggest something crazy: vote for scum.

I wanted to vote for one of the top 3 wagons, and he was my user of choice. I'm trying to stop the "11 different wagons" thing. If any of my scumreads had a chance at gaining support, I'd lay down a vote on them. Otherwise, I'm putting my vote to actual use. How many times do I have to repeat myself? My ISO's 10, 17, 19...

Also, regarding the last comment in the quote: what do you think of EGL?

...good question, er, I honestly didn't know he was even in this game.... He hasn't posted much lately, but he's at least posted content. I'll look more into posts later.

Unvote

I don't mind furc being silenced because his play in the last game we were both in caused a town loss. >:|

[Stephoscope]

Why has Furcolow not fullclaimed? Since he claimed bulletproof, is there ANY good reason he shouldn't fullclaim?

There is *no way* a "Cold War" game wouldn't have Joseph McCarthy in it. But "General McArthur"...ugh...but, if there are no other McCarthy claims, I believe it.

[Amrun]

That's a good point. I forgot Furc hadn't full claimed.

[Artem]

I just caught up on reading, but it took me over an hour and I'm too beat to post details, so here's a quick summary of my thoughts (with details hopefully tomorrow if I have time during my lunch break):

- Out of the people that voted for Amrun after her claim, DP is most likely town, Scott and Gonnano are most likely scum, Moth is kinda null. (I think there were others, but I'll check tomorrow)
- Furc is most likely a third-party joker role (suicide bomber? did those exist during the Cold War?) and should be silenced each and every day from now on.
- Smarg is likely scum
- Feysal and Bvo are awesome

Unvote

until I post next.

[Amrun]

I forgot that Furc didn't full claim, so my top two choices for silencing are Furc and smarg. Smarg's blatant misrep of me on an earlier page was a major scumtell for me.

However, if there is some sort of consensus between enough people that they can't all be mafia about whom I should silence, I will do that.

[Furcolow]

Heydar Aliyev, Soviet Bulletproof

[Furcolow]

I don't really know a lot about my character, can someone inform me?

[Furcolow]

I forgot that Furc didn't full claim, so my top two choices for silencing are Furc and smarg. Smarg's blatant misrep of me on an earlier page was a major scumtell for me.

However, if there is some sort of consensus between enough people that they can't all be mafia about whom I should silence, I will do that.

i don't see why you would silence someone who has not been counterclaimed whatsoever

[Stephoscope]

this is good info.

[smargaret]

Amrun's claim is still scummy. McCarthy is hardly a peaceful role, and silencer is much more likely to be scum than town. Just because LMP stopped the lynch doesn't mean we have a confirmed townie - even if Amrun silences me and I can't vote tomorrow, that still won't confirm her as town, just confirm her as silencer.

Furc's rolename is likely town.

Since we're not going to be lynching Amrun today,
UNVOTE:
VOTE: ThAd

[ThAdmiral]

Thoughts on the claim:
- The macarthur/mccarthy thing was weird. The fact that amrum seemed to get off with only a few questions about it, and for some people came out looking

even more town

because of it is even weirder. As mentioned not only were the name's mixed up Amrum specifically called him a general and a "warmonger".
- Amrum: saying "there was no scum motivation for this, so why would I have done it if I was scum" is the very DEFINITION of wifom. The fact that you attacked people for saying you were using wifom after acting this way is really bad on your behalf. Do you understand why what you said was wifom?
- Amrum was never hammered. Bvoigt was already voting him. We should really test llama's governer claim by pushing amrum to a proper lynch.
- If mccarthy is town I would say the game is bastard. He is clearly not pro-peace so he really shouldn't be town.

One of the reasons I decided to do it was because ThAd jumped on my wagon -- OMGUS, self-preservation, or scumvote? You decide.

So there's no possibility that I am town voting you?
I don't really know what you want me/expect me to do in my situation. I was voting mothrax but don't feel he is scum any more. I would obviously rather vote someone like ghostwriter but that would be a waste.

I was already voting Amrun...maybe she realized that it was an actual hammer, but the reaction feels sincere to me.

I wouldn't be so sure. We had a vote count very recently, and if amrum was paying attention to the votes (as she clearly was since she said she claimed because people started voting for her) it would not have been hard to act shocked at being hammered. When I'm scum I always hope someone gambit-fake-hammers me so I can act all outraged.

[Nachomamma8]

- If mccarthy is town I would say the game is bastard. He is clearly not pro-peace so he really shouldn't be town.

More tomorrow.

[RedCoyote]

It's debatable, guys. First of all, we're really still playing outguess the Mod when we say that "war is necessary" roles are scum and "peace at all costs" roles are town. Someone made a good point about JFK. Sen. McCarthy is not particularly known for his foreign policy positions. As I recall, he was extremely critical of the Truman administration, and President Eisenhower didn't much care for him either. I'd have to check my facts, but I don't even really remember him being a vocal proponent of the Korean War.

Eh, sorry to miss out on all the fireworks anyways.

Unvote

;

vote: mothrax

[DavidParker]

Guys, it's not too late for a last minute gonnano wagon. This guy has scum written all over him. And yeah, I'm starting to think we are wrong about the Amrun wagon.

Unvote

Furcs role/nameclaim look town at this point. Moth is still a good lynch imo, but gonnano seems to be even better now with some weak justifications of his vote. Then as soon as amrun wagons fizzles pops his vote back to Moth who is also is voting with bad reasons. He also seems overly worried about how other people see him (http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 2#p2794902)

So llama and co. Gonnano wagon is A GOOOOOO

Vote: Gonnano

[Furcolow]

unvote

ThAdmiral - 9 -

Nachomamma8, EGL, LynchMePls, LlamaFluff, GhostWriter, Amrun, Feysal, Bvoigt, Smargaret

Amrun - 8 -

XScorpion, Beasts of the Sea, Stephoscope, ThAdmiral, smargaret, mothrax, Scott Brosius, Lowell

I'm pretty sure this is where we're at.
I am not happy with EITHER of these wagons, honestly.

Seeking new wagon...
Loading...
...Loading Completed.

Let's lynch EGL
He is not contributing
In the last two weeks, he has posted twice. They are just senseless pushes on TheAd
One consists entirely of "Why is TheAd still alive?"
If this is what the town has, we don't need it. Policy lynch can be achieved. Let's lynch a lurker. Of his 18 posts, literally like 80% came in a two hour period on JANUARY TWENTY-THIRD. No joke.

ALSO, there is a pretty good case on him
He tries to INITIATE momentum on the PI wagon, while FoS on DavidParker (fishy)
Also, then, JUMPS on theAd wagon. Guy criticizes TheAd for votehopping d1, when he has been on the biggest wagons.
pot...kettle

vote: EGL

[Furcolow]

VOTE: Vote: RedCoyote for being Red... as in Communist.

***Mod: Fixed them tags ***

scumslip?
I'm soviet, here, and I know my alignment.

What was wrong with my tags?

*** Mod: You opened a vote: tag but closed a bold tag. ***

scum messing up tags? lawl

My pm from mod stating my role also made it rather clear, as it was a town pm, that there is probably town-aligned players of different nationalities (ie: people of other nationalities who only want peace, which makes sense thematically)

I find it interesting you explicitly state the PM you got was a town PM. It seems like subliminal messaging or something.

Anyway, my role PM didn't explicitly state that there are town aligned players of different nationalities. Town role PMs could be different in that some might explicitly state this and some might not.

I do find you have a point though on PoisonIvy thinking that it's America vs. Soviets due to the town win condition saying to eliminate threats against peace.

I'm going to maintain differing levels of skepticism that either of you have received pro-town roles, with a higher level of skepticism toward PoisinIvy than you. I would, however, like to point out I didn't like your three short posts in response to RedCoyote voting for you. They seemed defensive.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: PoisonIvy

FoS: DavidParker

Really bad case scum could have made looking at a sample PM
Jumps on the PI wagon
FoS on DP when DP is probably town... even if not, senseless FoS from january 23rd when it's february 15th and he hasn't contributed anything except a one liner in the past week... further than that, really, but whatever.

NO MORE ANSWERING THE QUESTIONS

I am completely serious about that, I have no idea how many times I have to reitterate it.

You don't get to dictate these things, you know.

What do people make of this? LF + EGL buddying?

@GhostWriter, LlamaFluff will get it when he sees it.

I think he makes a good argument about question three though and I do believe that speculation of the setup so early on D1 benefits anti-town roles the most by far. The first two questions though, to get things going, I don't see anything wrong if people want to answer them.

Furthered here with the smilie, and the "he makes a good argument"

For me, PoisonIvy hasn't adequately accounted for the fact she thought the game was Americans vs. Soviets as opposed to a town who wants to eliminate all threats to peace which is in the pro-town win condition.

This after
this:

VOTE: Vote: RedCoyote for being Red... as in Communist.

***Mod: Fixed them tags ***

makes no sense.
So, he thinks both Americans and Soviets are communist?
hmmm

Are you sure there couldn't be an all Soviet mafia? Game Specifics number 4 is listed as a POSSIBLE mafia win condition.

Also contradicts this!

3.) Having played a cold war game on golivewire, im going to guess that a) its USA vs. Soviets/Russians. And there is a miller in our midts. FYI its not me.

@PoisonIvy, I clearly read your post. You did say Americans(USA) vs. Soviets/Russians.

Anyway I'm going to

unvote

for now and

vote: ThaDmiral

. Apologies if the casing is wrong there. I didn't really like his reasoning on the Furc daytalking scum situation. I think it was a stretch since the information was apparently available to everybody per a post by the mod.

Jumps on TheAd after PI wagon dies for absolutely no reasoning. Has had vote there since January 23rd, making 0 case, only saying "why is thead not dead"

-end of case, even if this guy is town, he needs to die

[Furcolow]

P.S. SUP FEYSAL?

[ThAdmiral]

We really should test the governor claim by getting 12 votes on amrum before anything else.

But I fully support looking at alternative wagons. David parker has suggested gonnano and Furculow has suggested egl and I don't think either of these are bad ideas. Quite a few people have expressed suspicion of gonnano but he has somehow escaped real scrutiny, and egl looks pretty bad from what furc brought up - especially the apparent hypocrisy in regards to why he jumped on the PI wagon.

But as I said -

before anything else we need to test the governer claim by getting 12 votes on amrum

I don't think scum would ever have a governer ability; third party maybe at a stretch. But confirming the ability pretty much confirms llama isn't scum.

[Amrun]

@Furc: I said that to prompt a full claim. You're off the silencing list for now.

Also, your EGL idea is not bad, not bad at all...

@TheAd: I understand your points against me, which are basically "Amrun could be lying!". I could. What else could I say to show that I am not? Nothing I can think of.

Also, I didn't come out and say, "there's no scum motivation for this" off the bat. People called it scummy, I asked why... No one could answer.

I feel an air of desperation about your recent posts.