Newbie 1070 - Game Over

[Quaroath]

@T-bone aside from the theory of activity trolling, you haven’t said what you think of me. I really can’t believe you don’t have some idea where I fall. So what is it? You seem to want to not give an opinion on me.

I'll go ahead and

Unvote

for now.
Barefoot was pretty scared when she had 3 votes on her. This seems suspicious to me. She also placed an OMGUS on me. Also suspicious. I personally don't like giving out these instead of votes, but

FOS Barefoot-fighter

To the people saying we should no lynch, its a bad idea. Don't ask it just is, we know by experience.

I hadn’t realized how little Muh has addressed anything not Jack/no-lynch related. The above post is the only post of substance from Muh that wasn’t related to the no-lynch issue. And even it touches on the no-lynch drama.

@Muh - Why did you unvote Barefoot just to FoS her, when she was still L-2? OMGUS votes happen, and from new players I don’t find then particularly suspicious. Barefoot wasn’t in any real danger of getting lynched and L-2, but you had to relieve pressure on her nonetheless? You even feel like you have to explain the FoS with I don’t like doing this, but I will anyways” justification. I agree with Split that’s kinda fishy.

In your last post Muh, you talk about finding and looking at flaws in posts. Have you found any you'd care to share?

Vote Count

muh316 (1) - splitfarvle
barefootfighter (1) - Ellyssa
Rain (1) - Quaroath
Jack Forman (1) - Stels
Stels (1) - T-Bone
Quaroath (1) - Rain
No Lynch (1) - Jack Forman

Not Voting (2) - muh316, barefoot-fighter

With 9 alive it is 5 to lynch.

[Quaroath]

In the future I'll focus on not double/triple posting as much, I do realize it can be annoying and makes people less likely to read em. I'm just leery of posting one massive post over a couple smaller ones.

[T-Bone]

Debatable, on multiple points. Split didn't catch me in a contradiction.

I don't really have a good feel for you on pro-town or anti-town.

I still maintain a lynch on you is far better than a policy lynch on jack. I haven't waffled on this. That's not saying I think you *should* be lynched. I just think a policy lynch is the worst possible solution today.

As far an contributions go, sure I'm rather vocal about how I feel on people. I can post less if you'd like? If I see something I want to respond too, I respond to it.

At this point I would be quite surprised if split, ellyssa, or Jack turned up scum. Everyone else, not so much. I'm 80% sure that either rain or barefoot is scum. T-bone and muh316 are middle of the road, and wouldn't shock me either way.

Then I'm playing the way I want to play.

I'm not saying post less. I'm not saying "let's lynch this guy because he wants to lynch me".

My problem is, and I don't mean to pick on you, is that I've seen a lot of "T-Bone isn't contributing/T-Bone is lurking" etc. Which I don't get. It looks like to me "Damn, I need to put the heat on someone else. Hey, what about that T-Bone guy?"

It would be one thing if people were lurking. But all of us except the Mod and Barefoot have posted at least once in the last 12 hours. We're all pretty much posting pretty often. I don't get why people are throwing out "hey PLAYER is lurking. Look at him!"

6 pages in, with everyone posting...

NO ONE

is lurking. That's something I think should be made

clear

. People go offline. It happens.

[T-Bone]

Ah a new post. What's that, Quad posting lol?

What do I think Quar? It's not like we have more than two factions. I have a vote, and it's at where it is at for a reason.

[barefoot-fighter]

Oh, my, do you post.

Trying to make it fit in one post.

No policy lynch. And for Jack? What the hell? Sorry for saying you were n00b, Jack, I just meant to say, he wasn't suggesting no-lynch thinking of how it would benefit the scum, because he didn't know it would. It didn't come off great. Anyways, stop trying to convince him to lynch, it's annoying. And I support Jack in his standing for his decision of no lynch. For me he is obviously a townie. So lynching him would be more than useless, since I think most of us don't suspect him anymore. If we are going to do a policy lynch, lynch troublesome players. But for reals, don't.

T-Bone: I am a girl. Must resist the urge to add smilies.

Everyone is targetting everyone, it really adds to the discussion but confusionnn...

In the future I'll focus on not double/triple posting as much, I do realize it can be annoying and makes people less likely to read em. I'm just leery of posting one massive post over a couple smaller ones.

And thank you for making one more post for that?

I don't think idleness is a reliable scum-tell. Actually, these scum-tells are driving me crazy. But still, I'm with T-Bone on this one, Quaroath really wants a reason to vote for him. And posts a lot. Man, those number quotes...

Also we are name-troubled. Muh, T-Bone, Stels. Three different players. Possibly different roles.

And I'm confused on my suspicions. Will wait.

[Quaroath]

Debatable, on multiple points. Split didn't catch me in a contradiction.

I don't really have a good feel for you on pro-town or anti-town.

I still maintain a lynch on you is far better than a policy lynch on jack. I haven't waffled on this. That's not saying I think you *should* be lynched. I just think a policy lynch is the worst possible solution today.

As far an contributions go, sure I'm rather vocal about how I feel on people. I can post less if you'd like? If I see something I want to respond too, I respond to it.

At this point I would be quite surprised if split, ellyssa, or Jack turned up scum. Everyone else, not so much. I'm 80% sure that either rain or barefoot is scum. T-bone and muh316 are middle of the road, and wouldn't shock me either way.

Then I'm playing the way I want to play.

I'm not saying post less. I'm not saying "let's lynch this guy because he wants to lynch me".

My problem is, and I don't mean to pick on you, is that I've seen a lot of "T-Bone isn't contributing/T-Bone is lurking" etc. Which I don't get. It looks like to me "Damn, I need to put the heat on someone else. Hey, what about that T-Bone guy?"

It would be one thing if people were lurking. But all of us except the Mod and Barefoot have posted at least once in the last 12 hours. We're all pretty much posting pretty often. I don't get why people are throwing out "hey PLAYER is lurking. Look at him!"

6 pages in, with everyone posting...

NO ONE

is lurking. That's something I think should be made

clear

. People go offline. It happens.

Fair enough. Rain brought up your "Active lurking" and I latched on it. It definitely hasn't been the truth in the last couple days.

Ah a new post. What's that, Quad posting lol?

What do I think Quar? It's not like we have more than two factions. I have a vote, and it's at where it is at for a reason.

Stepping it up a notch to quads!

I actually just discovered I can still pull new quotes in preview. Awesome. That'll help.

[Jack Forman]

Jack. I never said I wanted to lynch you. I never placed my vote on you. All I did was mention that you were being anti-town.
I agree with stels. If you are going for a no lynch, you won't scum hunt. Its going to hurt the town more. For now, let all this no lynch stuff go and try to look at flaws in posts, ask questions do something productive to help the town.

I find it odd how quick you take back a PL after I point out that it is worse than a NL, just seems odd.

Can you explain to me Quaroth how you're contributing? Posting the same wall of information post after post is not "contributing". That is just posting for the sake of posting.

I feel the same way T-Bone, in most of Quaroth earlier post he was making the same points other people had already made. So both Quaroth and Muh give me an odd feeling at this time. I am not sure how I feel about the rest of the people at this time. I will try to make an assessment on everyone for you guys before I go to bed tonight.

Just as an FYI, I work 8am to 4pm so don't look for me to post then, and every wed night I go to school. I will try to post more and again after I get home tonight.

[muh316]

I find it odd how quick you take back a PL after I point out that it is worse than a NL, just seems odd.

I didn't vote for you, therefore there was no policy lynch in the first place. There was just the idea of it though your not someone we should lynch today.

@Muh - Why did you unvote Barefoot just to FoS her, when she was still L-2? OMGUS votes happen, and from new players I don’t find then particularly suspicious. Barefoot wasn’t in any real danger of getting lynched and L-2, but you had to relieve pressure on her nonetheless? You even feel like you have to explain the FoS with I don’t like doing this, but I will anyways” justification. I agree with Split that’s kinda fishy.

My reasons for voting her were not the same as others. Mine was just a RVS.

As for T-bone, he reminds me of my style of playing. I don't find it fishy since I do it all the time.

[Ellyssa]

@barefoot #129 Welcome back.
a) Are you indicating you are going to vote no-lynch, or that you support Jack in his stance but are going to vote something else? Not sure how to read your paragraph otherwise, as depending what you mean, the "But for reals, don't." part could be read as you also want to vote no-lynch (ie, don't want to vote someone on D1), or you are simply against lynching him (and the policy lynch idea earlier) but don't mind lynching someone else.

b) Half the rest of your post is about Quaroath's multi posting that Toad already mentioned. Assuming you aren't Mafia and not still mostly away from game either, could you please share who your top suspects are at the moment and why?


@T-Bone #127 I think Rain's original comment about some people active lurking was not that they didn't post within a certain timeframe, but that when they did post, they posted short blurbs that toed the "safe" party line, so people would tend to gloss over their participation and they can stay under the radar, which Mafia would more likely to want to do than an innocent townie (even though obviously it's not a sure thing).

I don't agree with Quaroath's views on Rain or Rain's views on Quar, yet, there's a bit too much WIFOM there for me, but at least I can see their views and then judge them on that later when more info is out. If person X is a townie and if they eventually get lynched/killed, it can help us greatly if we know their suspects and reads and reasons, and can view all that in a proven-townie light.


@muh I noted that unvote was just after I asked you about whether your vote was still valid now that we were out of RVS, so I guess I at least can buy that line of reasoning for now. Just weird that the vote was removed and then followed with the FOS.. but you've already tried to answer that point anyway.

I still don't really like that besides answering questions asked your way (playing defence, so to speak), that barefoot issue you agreed with (#79, #3 in your ISO) was the only bit of offence/questioning you've done at all, and conveniently happened to be the same person that you originally RVSed too to cause this little issue, so it seems like she's the only person that's gotten any attention from you the whole game besides Jack/the policy lynch issue. Though you aren't voting for anyone else. You saw what the pressure votes did to her. Who do you think is second most suspicious at the moment? Or do you have thoughts on anyone else you'd like to share? Oh, and you're my 2nd most likely suspect at the moment.

[Jack Forman]

@Muh- What did you mean to imply in post #84?... Here let me make it easy for you, I will quote it.

Guess we have our policy lynch...

This post number is 84 two post after mine (aimed most likely at my post, but tell me if I am wrong), so help me understand how you were not ready to PL me.

[Stels]

Sort of skimmed through this and the last page due to lack of time. Have to catch up on reading tomorrow.
BTW, tomorrow is the last day of my V/LA! No more HSPA's, but I do have a project that is due the next day :'(

[Jack Forman]

Ok here we go...

Ellyssa- You post a lot and ask questions and reply to everyone, and you look like you are doing a good job of scum hunting. You were also very much against the NL idea witch in 99% of the time most would be. I think you are town and doing some good scumhunting.

Quaroath- You flip flop more than a fish out of water with your votes. Lets see, i am pretty sure this is in order- Your votes- 1 stels, 2 rain, 3 jack, 4 bear, 5 rain, and 6 bear. You are all over the board and don't tell me it is to get info out when you have not voted t-bone (even though you have suspicions he is scum), but Splitfavle and Muh you talk about but are posting enough info for you to not vote them for info??

Guess we have our policy lynch...

This post really

really

bothers me for a reason I can't get my head around. It is purely a gut feeling, it just feels wrong. I'll try to figure out why while rereading.

What Muh says here bothers you but you never come back to it... kind of lets say Mafia chat "Muh, mafia friend don't do that". So why did you not come back to this and don't say you "forgot", you post and quote so much that you should have not miss this.

Barefoot- I don't have a very good feel on you right now but if anything I don't think it is a scummy feel. In fact Quaroath wanting to vote you so much makes me think that he maybe scummier than I first thought.

Splitfavle- He just seems to be hung up on the mario thing and has not had very much input at this point.

Muh- Every time you vote or think about voting for someone and it goes south you just back out, like you dont want to make any mad. That is all I have to say about you for now.

Rain- I understand that your job is IC and you are supposed to be helping people with the game, but I wish you would stop putting out so many facts and definitions of the game and tell me something that is useful in the game that we are playing.

Stels- You have not posted very much since RVS and I know that you are on V/LA, so I will come back to you at a later time.

T-Bone- I get a lurking feeling from you and your vote for stels cus you think he is jumping on the bandwagon is a weak vote to me, other than that there is not a lot to say about you cus you really have not said much.

[Quaroath]

Quaroath- You flip flop more than a fish out of water with your votes. Lets see, i am pretty sure this is in order- Your votes- 1 stels, 2 rain, 3 jack, 4 bear, 5 rain, and 6 bear. You are all over the board and don't tell me it is to get info out when you have not voted t-bone (even though you have suspicions he is scum), but Splitfavle and Muh you talk about but are posting enough info for you to not vote them for info??

Read what I type more carefully, I have never said I think T-bone is scum, I have said that a lynch on T-bone would be more informative and thus better for the town, than a policy lynch. My scum group has been preety static all game. Pretty sure that's not flip-flopping. What's more..
your vote list for me is simply full of holes. Untrue even. You have 6 votes listed for me, I've voted 4 times (though technically it's only three as I screwed up the bolding on one. The following are the votes I've made:

RVS:
Stels (This is the one i botched the bold on), Rain (voted this because of the bolding issue on my first vote)

Real Votes:
First "real vote"
Jack over the no lynch issue

Second and only other post-RVS vote:
Rain for the misrepresentations.

I've also said I think split is town, along with ellyssa and you. Why would I vote split if I think he's town?
I have a better use for my vote right now than Muh, so... not moving my vote. I really have no desire to lynch Muh at this point.

At least I'm voting. *Poke*

Guess we have our policy lynch...

This post really

really

bothers me for a reason I can't get my head around. It is purely a gut feeling, it just feels wrong. I'll try to figure out why while rereading.

What Muh says here bothers you but you never come back to it... kind of lets say Mafia chat "Muh, mafia friend don't do that". So why did you not come back to this and don't say you "forgot", you post and quote so much that you should have not miss this.

Didn't feel I had too get too in depth on this. Still bothers me because policy lynches are almost universally poor. I have gone back to it though, saying that is bothers me because I think a policy lynch is the worst possible outcome for town D1, outside of a no lynch.

[Alduskkel]

Vote Count

muh316 (1) - splitfarvle
barefootfighter (1) - Ellyssa
Rain (1) - Quaroath
Jack Forman (1) - Stels
Stels (1) - T-Bone
Quaroath (1) - Rain
No Lynch (1) - Jack Forman

Not Voting (2) - muh316, barefoot-fighter

With 9 alive it is 5 to lynch.

[splitfarvle]

Splitfavle- He just seems to be hung up on the mario thing and has not had very much input at this point.

I think I've been clear about why I think muh316 is scum.

To summarize: he doesn't seem to be scum hunting. The only time he's expressed any suspicion was for a player he unvoted. He just drops in to support what others have said.

As for T-bone, he reminds me of my style of playing. I don't find it fishy since I do it all the time.

T-Bone has a vote on Stels and explained why. Also, T-Bone actually seems to be playing the game while having posted in the thread about the same amount as muh316.

[T-Bone]

Jack I have been posting a hell of a lot more than you. I've been playing a hell of a lot more than you, and MOST importantly, I've been contributing to the scum hunting more than you. It's your fault that you're not good enough to "read" me.

I keep seeing people bring up the point which is hilarious, because at this point the only people who have posted more than me are Quaroth, Ellyssa, and maybe Rain but I think I passed him. Like I said in another post of mine, NO ONE is lurking, and claiming that someone is lurking is a lazy way of saying "I'm not good enough to read that player."

So Jack you've admitted that you are not good enough to 'read' barefoot, splitfavle, Stels, and myself, because we've all been posting plenty.

Calling someone a lurker is the lazy way of saying "I'm not good at this". Which is fine, not knowing things is part of the game. But I'm starting to get tired of the same people using that as an excuse to not play the game.

Jack I don't mean to attack you personally, you're just the most recent example of this. I gather to think that despite this being a newbie game, most of us have at least played elsewhere first before coming here, so if anyone really is playing mafia for the first time, my apologies for assuming otherwise.

[Rain]

@Quaroarth
I still don't understand why a T-Bone flip would have any impact on my appeared alignment. You seem to think he and I are are scummy because you assume us to be scums. In fact, your position towards T-Bone is odd. Many times, have you said you don't really think he's scummy. Care you explain this?

I think that there is a decent chance that [Rain is] trying to tie me to t-bone, with him being [Rain's] partner.

I only think T-Bone is scummy because he has had an interesting relation with my prime suspect at the moment. It wouldn't make sense to go after him when I can go after you.

@Jack
A policy lynch is not worse than no lynch, it is in fact better, for the same reason that a lynch is better than no lynch. Also, even if no one suspects you, that does not mean you aren't scum.

I think my contribution to the game has been fair so far. I voted for a number of people, posted reasons why. Some people had the false notion that a NL would help town, and I had to explain why it isn't (even though I used theory to back up my claims, it was specific to this game). Quaroath's voting for me, and now I'm trying to explain why his case is bogus.

Remember that I'm in the same situation as you; I don't know anyone's alignment. I don't have more information (currently, only scums know who's town and who's not) than any typical townie. I'd have to examine what people have posted so far, and actively look for scummy behaviors. I then vote for the person whom I think is the scummiest person alive in this town. I suggest you do the same.

If you're accusing me of active lurking, please be more assertive.

[splitfarvle]

Because the thread has slowed down a bit, and I've had a nice relaxing day after my last mid-term exam, I'm going to write a nice

Lynch muh316 on D1

post:

Vote Barefoot-fighter

For confirming last. Scum confirm last to buy themselves time.

From #29, an RVS vote, then this third post:

I'll go ahead and

Unvote

for now.

Barefoot was pretty scared when she had 3 votes on her. This seems suspicious to me. She also placed an OMGUS on me. Also suspicious. I personally don't like giving out these instead of votes, but

FOS Barefoot-fighter

To the people saying we should no lynch, its a bad idea. Don't ask it just is, we know by experience.

From #79, this is the post that got me thinking. Ellyssa was correct in noting that we had just started to come out of RVS stage, and that he seemed to be responding to her question. The problem for me, however, lies in the fact that he was barefoot's first vote and all of a sudden she was in the lead. muh316 expresses suspicion but seems hesitant to use his vote to put pressure on barefoot. Two possibilities:
A. barefoot is town, and muh316 doesn't want to be the first vote on her when she flips
B. barefoot is scum, and muh316 wants to keep her around while still weakly bussing her

For your further edification, the rest of muh316's posts (minus posts he quoted) now in convenient one-post size!

I was actually in a situation like that once. 10 minutes to deadline and 3 people were only active. I was at l-1 and nobody else was there to vote me. I came at the last minute and self-voted, I figured it was better to get a lynch day 1.

One more thing, remember, the IC can be scum. He can give out all this good info and there might be an evil mastermind behind him. So just keep that in mind. Its not that I'm accusing Rain of anything

A vote is a much more bolder statement than an FOS. A vote sends out the message " I want you dead" an FOS just declares your suspicion.

Guess we have our policy lynch...

I'm not scum. I'm just stating that the Mafia is pretty much laughing at this guy. A policy lynch is better than a no lynch.

Jack. I never said I wanted to lynch you. I never placed my vote on you. All I did was mention that you were being anti-town.
I agree with stels. If you are going for a no lynch, you won't scum hunt. Its going to hurt the town more. For now, let all this no lynch stuff go and try to look at flaws in posts, ask questions do something productive to help the town.

I didn't vote for you, therefore there was no policy lynch in the first place. There was just the idea of it though your not someone we should lynch today.

As for T-bone, he reminds me of my style of playing. I don't find it fishy since I do it all the time.

My analysis: posts helpful tips for us, especially Jack (while flippantly suggesting a policy lynch), weakly defends his unvote on barefoot (while she's the only player he's claimed to find suspicious), and tries to link his play to T-Bone's style despite not really playing much like T-Bone at all.

Finally, and I'd be inclined to dismiss this if I didn't suspect him from his subsequent playing:

Vote: muh316

because the Mario avatar caught my eye and I want to test my sick voting skillz before things get serious.

That Mario avatar was there because of a Mario themed game

The weakest part, I admit, since this was during RVS, but because it was RVS I didn't expect any sort of response. My main goal was to test the forum mechanics of voting and I literally picked the avatar that caught my eye. (If you just focus on this last part Jack again, look up please!) muh316's response seems defensive in a way, but like I said this part of my argument is easily the weakest.

[splitfarvle]

Jack. I never said I wanted to lynch you. I never placed my vote on you. All I did was mention that you were being anti-town.
I agree with stels. If you are going for a no lynch, you won't scum hunt. Its going to hurt the town more.

For now, let all this no lynch stuff go and try to look at flaws in posts, ask questions do something productive to help the town.

EBWOP Rereading my very first wall post, I wanted to bold the above.

muh316: "Do as I say, not as I do."

And I'm out /drops mic

[T-Bone]

Well guys, here's my post lest I be called a lurker again. Since SOOO MANY PEOPLE posted in the last 24 hours since my previous post.

Come on guys... 3 people have posted a total of 5 posts in the last 36 hours? Are you all who are not Rain/Split suddenly have nothing to say? I understand we all have lives, but 36 hours is a long period of time. No one has ANY more thoughts?

[Ellyssa]

Yeah it has died down a bit in the last day, hasn't it? My suspect list us still topped by barefoot/muh, but neither of them has posted back so I have nothing new in that regard to go on yet.

I like the list that Jack built; good to see his list so far (though for quite a few people nearer the end he has kind of a neutral/not much of a read on yet). I've tried reading his post as being written from a Mafia point of view, and it doesn't seem quite right. I'm still leaning fairly decently on him being town, and that post didn't hurt it (earned a few additional townie points).

Neither Quaroath nor Rain are on my scumdar, though I'm kind of worried I have no real negative spin to say on Rain's posts at all yet. Not going to invoke the too townie or appeal to authority fallacies (yet) though. A little bit of a methodical feel to a couple of the posts but mainly due to the IC-ness of pointing out fallacies and scum tells, which is the role he signed up for anyway, but the posts otherwise that I've seen seem to make sense. Quaroath seems passionate and doesn't seem to be slipping under pressure (that I've seen yet).

I was thinking of hopping onto muh's bandwagon to see if we can elicit a response, since our votes are all split 7 ways, and he is one of my top two suspects, but I don't know how much info we'd get on a potential partner regardless of whatever he flipped (town or scum). Mainly because that does seem to be his playstyle overall, looking back on a few past posts. Not sure how useful he'd be in endgame though. I do agree with split's reasons (besides the RVS avatar one) and did raise some of them already in previous posts, I think. (Do you prefer to be referred to as a he or she, split? Or just 'split' works?)

@T-bone I know other people have mentioned general lurking and you in the same sentence. Outside of that, Rain earlier specified in #96 about active lurking, ie posting but with little content to be the 'face in the crowd', rather than lurking as in not posting at all. Do you think muh is active lurking? Also I called you Toad earlier, sorry, didn't notice that until now.

Actually, @everyone except muh, Jack and split, what are your opinions on muh?

@muh, There's still an earlier question from me to you in #133.

[T-Bone]

@ Elly. No I don't think anyone is actively lurking. I stated my opinion of lurking and calling other people lurkers in post #146

I think now we've gotten what we're going to get out of the day phase. People keep throwing out a suspect list, so lets grab some common ground and get a lynch going.

Unvote

Vote: Muh316

I said I'd be okay with this vote. He and Stels were my picks for votes, at this point, I think Stels has redeemed himself enough for now. At least until the next phase.

[T-Bone]

EBWOP

Dunno why I typed 146. I meant #140.

[Rain]

I don't know about muh316. He hasn't posted much to get a good read on him.

Splitfarvle's case on him doesn't seem to convincing. I do see an earnest attempt at scumhunting though, so at least I see obvtown points to him.

[muh316]

My apologies for the absence. Here we go
These quotes are from Split

The problem for me, however, lies in the fact that he was barefoot's first vote and all of a sudden she was in the lead. muh316 expresses suspicion but seems hesitant to use his vote to put pressure on barefoot. Two possibilities:
A. barefoot is town, and muh316 doesn't want to be the first vote on her when she flips
B. barefoot is scum, and muh316 wants to keep her around while still weakly bussing her

So here I explained a vote I placed at RVS. It wasn't placed for reasons that others had stated. It was purely a random vote. I don't like how your calling my statements weak

My analysis: posts helpful tips for us, especially Jack (while flippantly suggesting a policy lynch), weakly defends his unvote on barefoot (while she's the only player he's claimed to find suspicious), and tries to link his play to T-Bone's style despite not really playing much like T-Bone at all.

I posted helpful tips. I defended my unvote but it was not weak. Barefoot was not the only one I suspected. I was just trying to give the impression that lurking is fine. I have a rep for it and I thought it was T-Bones style but that has changed over time.

The weakest part, I admit, since this was during RVS, but because it was RVS I didn't expect any sort of response. My main goal was to test the forum mechanics of voting and I literally picked the avatar that caught my eye. (If you just focus on this last part Jack again, look up please!) muh316's response seems defensive in a way, but like I said this part of my argument is easily the weakest.

It wasn't defensive. It was just a friendly gesture to you.

"Do as I say, not as I do."

Call me a hypocrite but thats just what I do. I'm more of a skimmer. I don't analyze posts. My main goals are to find something large. Aiming for the bigger picture. Not a post by post analysis.
This is from Elyssa

Who do you think is second most suspicious at the moment? Or do you have thoughts on anyone else you'd like to share? Oh, and you're my 2nd most likely suspect at the moment.

Here's how I do it. I list everyone who I think is town. The rest are not clear enough to be considered town.
Town: Jack, split, T-bone, Rain
The other 4 I'm not very sure of what to think about them.