Open 279 - Rusty Guillotine Mafia - Game Over!

[Fate]

HHEAHEHAEHHAEHAH

HEHAEHAHEHAHEAHAHAEHAHHA

DANCE

DANCE

DANCE

[AlmasterGM]

Your mom says "stay."

my mom died 2 years ago, fucktwat.

but i guess you like that sort of thing?

[GreyICE]

I kinda feel bad.

BUT THIS IS NOT GETTING OBVSCUM LYNCHED

And I have no human emotions except rage.

[Equinox]

@crypto - what is your opinion about this setup and what do you think is the optimal strategy?

When crypto responded to this question, how much did you look into his response?

---

LuckayLuck's and VP Baltar's responses are going to determine which wagon I join, so have fun with that. I'm saving Fate reading for tomorrow, since there's a lot of material to cover there and I'd really like to crack open my books now.

By the way, VP Baltar, I think Ythill getting killed because he was a power role is pretty likely. His behavior here is similar to sottyrulez's behavior in Open 250.5.

[Equinox]

EBWOP:

my mom died 2 years ago, fucktwat.

Sorry to hear, AlmasterGM.

[RedCoyote]

Damnit, Equinox.

LL, why are you lazing about? You realize you're about to be strung up?

[VP Baltar]

This post by Luckay is hilarious in its desperation to prevent his own scummy lynch

I will not address any further inquiries about my play nor any flip floppery I have taken. What I have done stands as is. Sue me.

This is clearly him saying 'I know I'm being scummy and I'm going to try to stem the backdraft on my shit post by preempting you'.

argument falls apart as vp baltar has revealed that he expected sd to go eventually, hence if he ever voted or attacked sd, then it was purely to his benefit.

Doesn't make sense if our role PMs are different. You can make whatever conjectures about what you want. All I am saying is that I highly doubt SD would have made it long after that. True or False? I'd like to see you claim it otherwise.

When crypto responded to this question, how much did you look into his response?

Not a lot to be honest. I took his word at face value because he seemed earnest in his answers to me. I definitely could have pressed harder at that time, but I suppose I was kind of giving him a bit more of a pass than I should have simply because he was one of the players I had a decent amount of experience with.

By the way, VP Baltar, I think Ythill getting killed because he was a power role is pretty likely. His behavior here is similar to sottyrulez's behavior in Open 250.5.

I totally disagree. He was too out in the open and burning banners to get lynches. I would have believed him to be a VT with how aggressive he was being. Definitely wouldn't have thought tracker. He also didn't have any obvious breadcrumbs that I noticed or anything. I think the most logical conclusion is that an LL-scum and SD-scum wanted him dead because they were recurring names on his scum list. What about his play reminds you of SR in that game?

Damnit, Equinox.

LL, why are you lazing about? You realize you're about to be strung up?

I'll give you one guess.


Also, just as a side note, I hope people look at vote counts in ISO don't get confused about where LL was at on the Shadow Dancer wagon. He was very late to that game and there was just a lot of wagon movement in the final two days of that wagon. It was messing with me at first two until I checked out the votecounts more closely.

[GreyICE]

CHESSKID

GET IN HERE AND START BUSSING FOR JUSTICE

HE'S TOO OBVIOUS FOR WORDS

[chesskid3]

I DONT BUS

[chesskid3]

I read 11-20
not much changed in my reads

[GreyICE]

I DONT BUS

Well you had an entire case on why your buddy was town, and almost nothing to say about your LuckayLuck vote, so I was guessing that.

[VP Baltar]

Considering he's read more of the game than you, it actually makes sense he'd have good reads Grey. Disagree? Care to read the game yet? Thought nooooooooooooot.

[GreyICE]

Considering he's read more of the game than you, it actually makes sense he'd have good reads Grey. Disagree? Care to read the game yet? Thought nooooooooooooot.

It's funny VP.

Have actually read the game by now.

It's strange how things like that change over time.

But scumplane till your death, I don't really care.

[Equinox]

Damnit, Equinox.

Patience, sir. The cases on Fate-town and Fate-scum are many in number, quite large, and very involved. Besides, LuckayLuck and VP Baltar look worse at the moment.

Not a lot to be honest. I took his word at face value because he seemed earnest in his answers to me. I definitely could have pressed harder at that time, but I suppose I was kind of giving him a bit more of a pass than I should have simply because he was one of the players I had a decent amount of experience with.

So you asked to see if someone did thinking about the setup without even seeing whether he actually did? I'm all for tone hunting, but ignoring the content of crypto's post gives the impression that your initial question was insincere. It was very obvious, even with a very cursory glance, that crypto completely misunderstood the setup; for someone who expected town to think about the setup, you sure didn't dwell on it too much. As for giving crypto a pass... not what I'd have expected of you, VP Baltar.

What about his play reminds you of SR in that game?

I could argue sottyrulez were pretty blatant, too. Both sottyrulez and Ythill were more fixated than the average townie on power role claims. sottyrulez's case against me was based on lynching vanilla claims to protect the power roles; it became obvious as time when on they meant them. Ythill was somewhat the same way with his power role strategy and whatnot.

Also, just as a side note, I hope people look at vote counts in ISO don't get confused about where LL was at on the Shadow Dancer wagon. He was very late to that game and there was just a lot of wagon movement in the final two days of that wagon. It was messing with me at first two until I checked out the votecounts more closely.

What do you make of LuckayLuck sticking to the Shadow Dancer wagon when momentum was shifting to AlmasterGM?

[VP Baltar]

@Grey - Ok, let's hear some analysis then. Also, I haven't obtained my aviation license yet. Someday.

So you asked to see if someone did thinking about the setup without even seeing whether he actually did? I'm all for tone hunting, but ignoring the content of crypto's post gives the impression that your initial question was insincere. It was very obvious, even with a very cursory glance, that crypto completely misunderstood the setup; for someone who expected town to think about the setup, you sure didn't dwell on it too much. As for giving crypto a pass... not what I'd have expected of you, VP Baltar.

I'm not denying it was lazy. It was and I've said that since way back when. I had RL/other ongoing games happening at that time which were chewing my time. Could have been played better, but I just went with my gut feeling on it. It is what it is I guess.

I could argue sottyrulez were pretty blatant, too. Both sottyrulez and Ythill were more fixated than the average townie on power role claims. sottyrulez's case against me was based on lynching vanilla claims to protect the power roles; it became obvious as time when on they meant them. Ythill was somewhat the same way with his power role strategy and whatnot.

Wasn't his strategy to out the PRs pretty quickly though? IIRC, he wanted most of them outted by like Day 2 or 3 just to get the info out there. Doesn't seem like a protect the PRs strategy. Maybe your memory is fresher on it because you just read it, but that's what I recall.

What do you make of LuckayLuck sticking to the Shadow Dancer wagon when momentum was shifting to AlmasterGM?

His posting was pretty sparse during this time considering, so that is the first thing of note. Second, the momentum was shifting pretty quick and he may have thought he could get off by staying on the bus wagon while the mislynch happened. I don't think it was necessarily out of conviction that SD was scum that he stayed there. A lot of his posts from this time blatantly say 'not much I can do here'. And he's calling zoraster and Jarti scummy more than SD, imo. In fact, I don't even know how he names those three as scum when his vote for SD says:

I will throw caution to the winds and trust in crypto & fate. I begrudgingly give Jarti credit on having a 'note to self' on Shadow Dancer's shady activities.

Post #1048 of Shadow Dancer's actually simply makes no sense. It has no townie flow to it.

It's just out of left field that he calls SD scum (giving Jarti credit for finding the scum), then pages later he's convinced the scum team is SD (confirmed scum he barely mentioned previously), Zoraster (confirmed town), Jarti (person he gave credit to for convincing him on SD scum?). It's all very bizarre to me.

I also don't like the quotes here he adds in one liners about 'its pointless for me to say this, but I oppose the AGM lynch'. That just sounds very weak-willed...like he wants to look good after a possible town flip, but he doesn't actually want to derail the wagon.

What is your interpretation of his posts between March 10-12, Equi?

Idk, maybe I'm not giving him enough benefit of the doubt here. I'm reading over it some more and I

[GreyICE]

Analysis:

AGM is town. Duh. Needs to get his head out of his ass and run your wagon up. Fate being weird while drunk is business as usual.
Fate is town. Explained why.
LuckayLuck is town. Explained why.
VV is town because they have reasoning and make sense from a town perspective.
Red Coyote is town. Will not explain why.

You are scum. Explained why.
Crypto is scum. Chesskid lolzing about his replacement being obvtown when he replaced into a slot which was pretty far from it confirms this to me.

You can see where my plans are going.

[VP Baltar]

So you read 80 pages and your reads did not have any variance from skimming my iso. That makes sense. I contest that you didn't actually read the game.

[GreyICE]

I contest that nothing about your interactions this game make me think 'town.' At all.

Yep, nothing changed. If you think there's something in there that covers up the fact that you're scum... there isn't.

[VP Baltar]

My point is that you haven't attempted to have any kind of real thought process or discussion about why you think I'm scum. You've come with a preconceived notion and tried to use rhetoric to make your horrible case seem better. I know for a fact that you're wrong, so I'm trying to get you to use your brain for a bit and actually consider the game. You have failed to do so. That's cool. If this were earlier in the game and we had mislynches to spare, I probably wouldn't even care because I pretty much despise how lazy the town has been this entire game. I would gladly die. However, that's not the case so I'm stuck arguing with you.

Now, once again I suggest you try to actually look at context and read closely instead of making snap judgments. This is pretty much my final appeal. If you are just going to reply with more derpy 'scumplaining' throwaway comments, just save it.

@Fate - I suggest you read over LuckayLuck between Mar. 10-12 and stop being lazy. You're pissing me off because you can play better than this.

[hitogoroshi]

Vote Count #71

LuckayLuck: VP Baltar, chesskid3, AlmasterGM,

Fate

(L-2)
VP Baltar: GreyICE,

Fate

, LuckayLuck, Fate (L-2)
Fate: Vigilante Ventriloquist, RedCoyote

Not voting:

Equinox

On guillotine:

Equinox

Deadline is on April 19th, 2011, at 2PM Central Time.

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to end the day immediately.

With no new votes until deadline, LuckayLuck will be placed on guillotine.

[GreyICE]

I'll discuss it with any townie. I don't really see how discussing it with you is a productive use of my time. What are you going to do? Eventually go "Well, yeah, you convinced me, so I guess I'm scum after all. That red PM and the quicktopic were pretty good hints, but without your logic I just wouldn't have known!"

The only thing you've been interested in discussing with me so far is:
- How stupid I am
- How I have no idea what I'm talking about
- How I haven't read the game

So yeah, you're an unproductive waste of my time to discuss things with. You spent the AGM/Shadow Dancer wagon steadfastly ignoring shadow dancer and pushing AGM. Even when you tossed softballs to Shadow Dancer he botched them. You proceeded to not follow up at all, in any way. By the end, you were pleading with the town to lynch AGM over shadow dancer even though "Shadow is really scummy too!"

At any time you had a chance to explain why Shadow's answers in any way satisfied you. At any time you had a chance to say why you were using such WIFOMY arguments to push the AGM wagon (things like 'the number of times he's been at L-1 disturb me' - yet shadow's wagon did the same).

Yesterday your vote swung around between:

AGM
VV
RedCoyote

Pretty much at random depending on how you felt life was going.

Today, you have a different plan on how to win the game. RC and AGM are near-confirmed, so what's the plan on how to win? VV+LL/Me.

My absolute favorite:

Well, yeah, we shouldn't lynch until the replacements get in here and catch up. But we can't put it all on them or this is going to go too much down to the wire.

I'm not really sure how I feel about Maemuki...though I've been back and forth on that slot so many times this game it's ridiculous. You guys really don't see VV as trying to distance from SD late yesterday?

I'd say scumz are LL and one of GREYice/VV

When did I say I thought you were scum?

It must be killing you that you spent the first three days buddying fate so hard it FUCKING HURTS and now you can't vote for him without basically claiming scum in the thread.

Oh and does any townie want me to list the endless history of fate buddying? Because every few pages there was a post by VP Baltar telling Fate HOW COOL he is and how he should totally be voting with VP's 'scumreads.'

Now get off LuckayLuck.

Get on VP Baltar.

THIS IS TO ALL THE TOWN.

VP, your best bet is to self-vote and pray your buddy is less obvious.

[VP Baltar]

Don't blame me because fate decided to quit in the past ten pages.

Also, end of game will vindicate every single thing I've said about you playing like shit. So, let's just end that discussion, as it's a pointless ego battle I don't have the patience for.

[GreyICE]

My point is that you haven't attempted to have any kind of real thought process or discussion about why you think I'm scum.

You've come with a preconceived notion and tried to use rhetoric to make your horrible case seem better. I know for a fact that you're wrong, so I'm trying to get you to use your brain for a bit and actually consider the game. You have failed to do so. That's cool. If this were earlier in the game and we had mislynches to spare, I probably wouldn't even care because I pretty much despise how lazy the town has been this entire game. I would gladly die. However, that's not the case so I'm stuck arguing with you.

Now, once again I suggest you try to actually look at context and read closely instead of making snap judgments. This is pretty much my final appeal. If you are just going to reply with more derpy 'scumplaining' throwaway comments, just save it.

@Fate - I suggest you read over LuckayLuck between Mar. 10-12 and stop being lazy. You're pissing me off because you can play better than this.

Don't blame me because fate decided to quit in the past ten pages.

Also, end of game will vindicate every single thing I've said about you playing like shit.

So, let's just end that discussion,

as it's a pointless ego battle I don't have the patience for.

'kay, discussion over. Didn't quite go so well, did it?

We now enter the 'voting VP Baltar' stage of this event.

[VP Baltar]

It didn't go well because you are pig-headed. Like I said, end of game will vindicate me so you may as well start tucking your tail between your legs for post game.

[Fate]

I don't get it VP, so Grey is town and wrong?

Why isn't he scum?