Mini 1159 - Powerrox93's Mini Normal I (Game Over)

[Zdenek]

This is very difficult without Ranger or Redtail making any posts.

What's the case against red all about?

For me the main point against him was how he voted C-Worl while also saying that he'd be happy to unvote and vote Ocelot instead.

[Jase]

Bluh. The Point is to avoid having everyone post "Yeah guys let's ignore c-worls WIFOM". Yes we are going to do that. No I don't want to hear that everyone agrees that "Yeah let's do that". I know it's a bad idea to look into, and so does everyone else. I was hoping that my first post on the matter would have been the end of the c-wifom discussion but that kinda got kicked in the head when TO took that post and ran with it. Hopefully This Post will be the end of that discussion.

I've gotta wonder if TOs willingness to pursue a trivial sidecase, and place a vote until I stop being a dick (being a dick is my natural state thank you very much) speaks to her alignment at all. Specifically spending the time to "analyze" my post and having it culminating with a vote that is essentially "Stop that" and not one that is "You're scum".

[tarsonisocelot]

Bluh. The Point is to avoid having everyone post "Yeah guys let's ignore c-worls WIFOM". Yes we are going to do that. No I don't want to hear that everyone agrees that "Yeah let's do that". I know it's a bad idea to look into, and so does everyone else. I was hoping that my first post on the matter would have been the end of the c-wifom discussion but that kinda got kicked in the head when TO took that post and ran with it. Hopefully This Post will be the end of that discussion.

I've gotta wonder if TOs willingness to pursue a trivial sidecase, and place a vote until I stop being a dick (being a dick is my natural state thank you very much) speaks to her alignment at all. Specifically spending the time to "analyze" my post and having it culminating with a vote that is essentially "Stop that" and not one that is "You're scum".

You do realize that the only reason I posted was to say to someone who apparently at the time did not see attempting to analyse C-WIFOM as pure folly that it was, and that no-one was likely to comment further? Nope, not willing to put the past page from you away until I've reread you or you've posted something actually useful.
You were scummy at the start of the game, then began to play townie and I'm not just going to overlook the past few posts of yours which have been "wtf?" derailing.

I'm not voting you because you're being annoying, I'm voting you because you're being weird in a way which disrupts discussion - and is therefore anti-town.

The second half of your post appears to attempt to non-confrontationally suggest you think I'm scum. If so then why? Make a case. If not then why post that?

[Me=Weird]

Looking at andrews iso, the only living players he doesn't mention are me, zdenek, rotn(s slot), and redtails slot. As someone said, he seems like a kind of person who'll ignore his partners, so assuming that, it narrows down to us four.
c-worls iso's 12-13 could be scum talking to a partner, but it's a weaker tell. The people he mentions least are me, zdenek, and rotn. As I know I'm town, that leaves rotn, zde, and red. Connections point strongest to rotn and zde, but as zde has actually made contributions, I say rotn goes first.

[Jase]

Bluh. The Point is to avoid having everyone post "Yeah guys let's ignore c-worls WIFOM". Yes we are going to do that. No I don't want to hear that everyone agrees that "Yeah let's do that". I know it's a bad idea to look into, and so does everyone else. I was hoping that my first post on the matter would have been the end of the c-wifom discussion but that kinda got kicked in the head when TO took that post and ran with it. Hopefully This Post will be the end of that discussion.

I've gotta wonder if TOs willingness to pursue a trivial sidecase, and place a vote until I stop being a dick (being a dick is my natural state thank you very much) speaks to her alignment at all. Specifically spending the time to "analyze" my post and having it culminating with a vote that is essentially "Stop that" and not one that is "You're scum".

You do realize that the only reason I posted was to say to someone who apparently at the time did not see attempting to analyse C-WIFOM as pure folly that it was, and that no-one was likely to comment further? Nope, not willing to put the past page from you away until I've reread you or you've posted something actually useful.
You were scummy at the start of the game, then began to play townie and I'm not just going to overlook the past few posts of yours which have been "wtf?" derailing.

I'm not voting you because you're being annoying, I'm voting you because you're being weird in a way which disrupts discussion - and is therefore anti-town.

The second half of your post appears to attempt to non-confrontationally suggest you think I'm scum. If so then why? Make a case. If not then why post that?

What I realize is that we had three posts (the first three) talking about c-wifom before I posted, and now we're still talking about it because you couldn't leave well enough alone. Also I really think you're overstating the WTF-ness of my recent posts.

I want this to be perfectly clear. Based on my recent posting Do you think I'm scummy or not?

In what way is it weird to make a post to the effect of "We aren't talking about this and nobody should ever mention it again" about the c-wifom?

The second half of my post is an attempt to get you to answer a point that makes me suspicious of you.

Me=w: Let's not line up lynches yeah?

[Me=Weird]

Me=w: Let's not line up lynches yeah?

Or maybe I was listing my suspects? Because who wouldn't want their current suspects lynched?

[Jase]

Looking at andrews iso, the only living players he doesn't mention are me, zdenek, rotn(s slot), and redtails slot. As someone said, he seems like a kind of person who'll ignore his partners, so assuming that, it narrows down to us four.
c-worls iso's 12-13 could be scum talking to a partner, but it's a weaker tell. The people he mentions least are me, zdenek, and rotn. As I know I'm town, that leaves rotn, zde, and red. Connections point strongest to rotn and zde, but as zde has actually made contributions,

I say rotn goes first.

The bold part implies that somebody from the list goes second.

[crazypianist1116]

I'm not analysing the wifom. You are the only person who has attempted to do that. Was that a mistake yesterday?

I am analysing Jase's response.

No I meant you two were arguing over something that came as a result of c-worl's bullshit. Jase's opinion was correct in that we shouldn't over analyze it now. Yesterday I was gambiting to get a scum tell out of him but that didn't work as he didn't really reveal much.
Jase, if you haven't noticed, I wasn't serious yesterday.

I'll reread tomorrow, I've just had a busy week...

[Powerrox93]

RangeroftheNorth is being replaced for failing to post anything at all, but a I may already have a replacement for him, I just need to double-check one thing with a person first

redtail896 has been prodded

[Powerrox93]

imaginality has been prodded

[Uncle Pain]

Hmm, I’ve been wondering… I know this is highly vague but ever since Powerrox93 decided to give RangeroftheNorth an extended deadline to participate, I had this tiny hunch he could have some important role in this game. Now with #483 my hunch becomes greater. Due to the nature of the posts that this slot has given us so far, I find it not far-fetched to assume that he could be an anti-town PR… maybe a serial killer that failed to kill anyone due to the inactivity of the players? It probably isn’t the scum goon sending the night kill choices, otherwise Night 2 probably would have had no kill. The way Powerrox93 worded it, it’s also possible that it’s a linked role. I don’t know, I’m just guessing… but since all our major questions are directed towards the player behind the slot, I think we could spend our “free” time thinking about things like these.

[crazypianist1116]

Blah I have some bias towards those thoughts as well but I'd like to think that Powerrox would have extended the night deadline regardless of who was being replaced. Trying to outguess the mod though will not lead to good results. If it works it unbalances the game and makes it less fun, and if it doesn't then you're just making uninformed decisions.

[Powerrox93]

Setael replaces RangeroftheNorth

[Powerrox93]

Hmm, I’ve been wondering… I know this is highly vague but ever since Powerrox93 decided to give RangeroftheNorth an extended deadline to participate, I had this tiny hunch he could have some important role in this game. Now with #483 my hunch becomes greater. Due to the nature of the posts that this slot has given us so far, I find it not far-fetched to assume that he could be an anti-town PR… maybe a serial killer that failed to kill anyone due to the inactivity of the players? It probably isn’t the scum goon sending the night kill choices, otherwise Night 2 probably would have had no kill. The way Powerrox93 worded it, it’s also possible that it’s a linked role. I don’t know, I’m just guessing… but since all our major questions are directed towards the player behind the slot, I think we could spend our “free” time thinking about things like these.

Blah I have some bias towards those thoughts as well but I'd like to think that Powerrox would have extended the night deadline regardless of who was being replaced. Trying to outguess the mod though will not lead to good results. If it works it unbalances the game and makes it less fun, and if it doesn't then you're just making uninformed decisions.

The only reason why I decided to extend the deadline and give RangeroftheNorth another chance was that the game had already suffered from replacement, not for any role-related reason

[imaginality]

I reread Me=Weird, Zdenek and Rangerofthenorth in iso. My write-up's on my home computer and I'm away at the moment (home Monday) but in short, I think all three are plausible as scumbuddies due to D1 (lack of) interactions and in the case of Me=Weird and Rangerofthenorth reasonable possibility they bussed C-Worl D2. However Me=Weird is looking better than Rangerofthenorth otherwise, so.

Vote: Rangerofthenorth

One thing nagging me about the NK, I don't think bvoigt was obvtown so I want to look more at why he might have been picked - did scum think he was a PR, were they worried by his reads, or did they think he's obvtown?

I agree with Jase about that other stuff.

[Powerrox93]

Vote: Rangerofthenorth

.

In the future, please vote for the latest player in a spot that has been replaced.

Votecount 3.4

Updated as of post #489

Setael (3) - Me=Weird, crazypianist1116, imaginality
redtail896 (1) - Zdenek
Jase (1) - tarsonisocelot

Not voting (4) - Uncle Pain, Setael, redtail896, Jase

If there's a mistake let me know.
9 Alive == 5 to Lynch && 5 to No-Lynch

Setael

will be lynched at deadline if votes doesn't change

V/LA

tarsonisocelot: Until May 27-30
Uncle Pain: June 3-5 + June 11-12

Deadline

June 7 17:00 CEST

[Me=Weird]

The bold part implies that somebody from the list goes second.

Yes, because I want all my suspects lynched, but the one I want dead most is rotn/setael. I don't see why you're making such a big deal of it. Does it ever actually happen?
imaginality, I didn't mention andrew much because he was a null read, and c-worl because I had a hard time telling whether he was noob or scum.

[Jase]

The bold part implies that somebody from the list goes second.

Yes, because I want all my suspects lynched, but the one I want dead most is rotn/setael. I don't see why you're making such a big deal of it. Does it ever actually happen?
imaginality, I didn't mention andrew much because he was a null read, and c-worl because I had a hard time telling whether he was noob or scum.

Does what ever actually happen? Lined up lynches? Do you think the associative tell with andrew/c-worl is strong enough for a lynch?

Imaginality: I'd just focus on looking at bvoigts reads. Weather or not scum thought he was a PR is pretty much irrelevant. It's also possible scum thought everyone thought he was obvtown, but if so I don't think it'd be very informative.

[Jase]

Mod: Considering two primary suspects have not posted/been replaced could we get the deadline extended? Perhaps two weeks from the date red responds to his prod/is replaced. Though that might be a bit much...dunno.

Let me think more about this.

[Zdenek]

Me=weird, what was the strong connection between RotN and C-Worl?

[Setael]

Hello everyone. I'm reading up and should be able to post tonight. (Tomorrow at the latest if I get distracted by Skype mafia.)

[Me=Weird]

Does what ever actually happen? Lined up lynches? Do you think the associative tell with andrew/c-worl is strong enough for a lynch?

Yeah. I've never really seen people successfully line up lynches. Associative tells by themselves maybe not, but I also find it scummy that none of the slot members have contributed.

Me=weird, what was the strong connection between RotN and C-Worl?

Not a connection, lack of one. C-worl and andrew ignored that slot.

[Setael]

Uncle Pain and Zdenek are scum.

HOLLA.

Zdenek blatantly avoided commenting on c-worl or his wagon, but once asked point blank about it, he provided all kinds of reasons to think c-worl was scum.

Uncle Pain has avoided interaction with Zdenek, and based on his “scum hunting” regarding everyone else, if he were town, he’d have called Zden out for this. His play on the c-worl wagon was definitely bussing.


zdenek post 23 sheeps imaginality

Andrew post 60 could be scum with pain

61 crazypianist prob not scum with Andrew

Surprise 74 town

p125 Uncle Pain defends Andrew. “imaginality: A beautiful case you’ve built here. Can you point out where you found andrew94 particularly scummy?”

p 128 Odd for zdenek to not even comment on Uncle Pain, the leading wagon. If zdenek is scum, it makes sense for him to vote L at this point. If he’s partners with Uncle Pain, he wouldn’t want to be backing the wagon on stefan so much. He even gives a few reasons to be suspicious of Stefan, but then says his read on him is null. Could definitely see him scum with uncle pain because otherwise he’d have at least commented on the uncle pain wagon which was at 3 votes here. Answers Uncle Pain’s question about Stefan but doesn’t comment on Pain at all.

P7-8 uncle pain zdenek lurkingish, have they mentioned Andrew at all?
Or each other?? (I need to look back at this, but I think minimally if at all).

Post 279 imaginality townish when he calls out Andrew

P304 redtail townish when he calls out hammer

Uncle pain 321 c-worl vote is almost definitely bussing

Zdenek post 330 tries to derail cworl wagon and start one on redtail. Then in 360 he’s agreeing with uncle pain that Redtail is scummy for supposedly preparing an escape from the c-worl wagon. If this is the case, and Zdenek thinks c-worl is scum, why isn’t he voting c-worl? Or mentioning him at all? Then when the redtail wagon doesn’t take, in post 424 when c-worl is at L-1 he tries to get momentum moved to crazypianist.

The interaction between zdenek and uncle pain while c-worl was about to be lynched is fishy. It’s like Uncle Pain was seeing that the townies were letting zdenek fly under the radar, so he made sure to ask him lots of questions, just not about c-worl.

Bvoigt was NK'd for uncle pain suspicion in posts 393 and 432.

P399 Uncle Pain says: "bvoigt: How can you explain that everyone else sees me town but you see me scummy?" Sounds like something scum would say - upset they're losing their free pass.

Zdenek's 402 without details is scummy

Actually, I found it a bit relieving to see that someone may finally have found something scummy about me because – since I don’t feel like an expert at this game¹ – a pure town read from all of you just puts me in a position of pressure where I feel I have to keep being the towniest of all. No one plays perfectly, everyone makes mistakes now and then and I’m no exception.

"
This combined with 398 is weird. Either he thinks it’s odd that bvoigt suspects him when no one does, or he’s relieved by it. The 2 posts don’t work together for me.

Zdenek 424 against CP - still doesn't mention cworl. Trying to swing momentum anywhere else

Zdenek 434 finally addresses cworl after being specifically asked and look how much he has to say!

Overall, his play is definitely anti-town, and the only thing that makes me think that he could be town is that don't think that scum would hammer after being told not to.

This doesn’t even make sense. And seriously, if THAT is the only thing that makes Zden think c-worl might be town, again, why has he not mentioned him until now?

c-worl: "Not enough for you? Hammered myself to keep suspicion of Uncle Pain from building up." So you can say what you want about c-worl’s WIFOM, but this one makes sense, and I think it is true.

@Uncle Pain - any reason not to post your longish post anyhow, if you still have it?

And then post 444 UP posts it...and it’s questions for most the players. Why not post it when he supposedly wrote it? And if he decided not to post it then, why save it for later when the questions would be totally obsolete? Makes no sense.

457 Uncle Pain brings up bvoigt NK wifom before anyone else can. He clearly NK’d the person who was suspicious of him and planned to wifom the town.

At this point, Uncle Pain not being suspicious of Zdenek after he totally avoided commenting on c-worl makes it pretty obv they’re buddies.

Hmm, I’ve been wondering… I know this is highly vague but ever since Powerrox93 decided to give RangeroftheNorth an extended deadline to participate, I had this tiny hunch he could have some important role in this game. Now with #483 my hunch becomes greater. Due to the nature of the posts that this slot has given us so far, I find it not far-fetched to assume that he could be an anti-town PR… maybe a serial killer that failed to kill anyone due to the inactivity of the players? It probably isn’t the scum goon sending the night kill choices, otherwise Night 2 probably would have had no kill. The way Powerrox93 worded it, it’s also possible that it’s a linked role. I don’t know, I’m just guessing… but since all our major questions are directed towards the player behind the slot, I think we could spend our “free” time thinking about things like these.

Why would you assume scum PR instead of town PR? This is just thinly veiled role fishing combined with an attempt to cast suspicion on my slot with crap mod-outguess reasoning.

Happy with a lynch of Uncle Pain or Zdenek.

vote: Uncle Pain

[Powerrox93]

Votecount 3.5

Updated as of post #497

Setael (3) - Me=Weird, crazypianist1116, imaginality
redtail896 (1) - Zdenek
Jase (1) - tarsonisocelot
Uncle Pain (1) - Setael

Not voting (3) - Uncle Pain, redtail896, Jase

If there's a mistake let me know.
9 Alive == 5 to Lynch && 5 to No-Lynch

Setael

will be lynched at deadline if votes doesn't change

V/LA

tarsonisocelot: Until May 27-30
Uncle Pain: June 3-5 + June 11-12
Powerrox93: June 17-19. I should be able to do VC and such, but in worse case scenario Empking will look over the game then

Deadline

June 7 17:00 CEST, but depending on the situation with replacements this might be extended

[Zdenek]

zdenek post 23 sheeps imaginality

This is a pathetic accusation considering this happened in RVS and has no bearing on alignment. Besides, just because two people have the same idea, does not automatically imply that one is sheeping the other.

p 128 Odd for zdenek to not even comment on Uncle Pain, the leading wagon.

He was at three votes, one of which could have been an RVS vote (at least it didn't seem serious at all), it was early in the game and there was no need to comment.

Zdenek post 330 tries to derail cworl wagon and start one on redtail. Then in 360 he’s agreeing with uncle pain that Redtail is scummy for supposedly preparing an escape from the c-worl wagon. If this is the case, and Zdenek thinks c-worl is scum, why isn’t he voting c-worl? Or mentioning him at all? Then when the redtail wagon doesn’t take, in post 424 when c-worl is at L-1 he tries to get momentum moved to crazypianist.

First of all, I'm the one who brought up the prepared escape vote. I was trying to use the time to scum hunt. There really wasn't anything to say about C-Worl. I thought his hammer was bad, but I'm surprised it came from scum.

The interaction between zdenek and uncle pain while c-worl was about to be lynched is fishy. It’s like Uncle Pain was seeing that the townies were letting zdenek fly under the radar, so he made sure to ask him lots of questions, just not about c-worl.

What is the scum motivation in not letting a buddy fly under the radar?

Zdenek's 402 without details is scummy

This game has been moving very slowly, they were completely obvious and could have only referred to a few posts on the previous page.

Anyway, I think Uncle Pain is town because he's remained active when he could just lurk, and has tried to keep other people active too. I see no scum motivation in this. I think this argument trying to link the two of us is a bad exercise in hunting for connections between players.