Mini Normal 1187: Game Over

[Scumhunter]

At what point are our votes not about the "reaction" we get and more about our votes being with the intent to lynch?

If a player is not contributing to the game we should be willing to lynch them particularly d1 since it either menas

a)they are lurkering scum
b)losing a townie unwilling to help isn't the end of the world on d1

[nintendoaddict1]

I'mma have to break this down...

Soooooooo after the last hour or so of reading a few people stand out to me.

Okay, if a few people stand out to you, why don't you post your analysis on them as well?

1) Nintendoaddict1:

Struck me as odd in the very beginning. I wouldn't have taken an RVS accusation remotely seriously no matter how intent the accuser seemed to be with it. However, Nintendo64 took the time to calmly and rationally answer archaebob's questions. In general that seems pro-town, but he it much to serious about it. He is responding as though there was a threat, rather than responding to generate discussion. Scum tend to do that, not town.

I didn't take it seriously, cause I knew it was RVS. And wait, you're saying you would not have taken it seriously either? So how does that make you town, but make me scum?

No, I like to make it clear when I am using an RVS vote, because some people do not make it known, thus it makes it very confusing as to whether or not it is actually random, so unless I say RVS I am making a serious vote.

Now it's painfully fucking obvious that it was an RVS vote without him saying anything. This is clearly redundant and the result of nervous energy.

Actually, it was a response to someone asking why I labeled it RVS. Should I ignore questions asked of me?

Aren't all votes early in the game RVS anyway? Labeling a few of them does not make every other vote a serious one.

Yes, yes they are. Labeling them is strange especially if you already accept the idea that all early votes will be RVS votes. I believe I saw earlier archaebob explain the idea that scum will explain how their play is townie without being prompted. This labeling of your RVS vote is an example of that. "Don't vote me, I'm just random voting."

Exactly. I know all votes are RVS at first. Why is saying 'RVS' in front of my vote strange? Oh, and nice buddying on bob, there. Where did I say anything

remotely

like that paraphrase?

My vote is dead serious.

Instead of speculating about what I'm doing, why don't you do something productive.

Okay, I'll do that right away.

Vote: archaebob

This is cute.

Fluff.

Okay, I'll do that right away.

Vote: archaebob

Good boy.

archaebob is agreeing with my vote on him...

inb4jester

This has departed from cute and is now stupid.

I literally have no response to this.

i dont really have a meta tbh. I play differently depending on how im feeling. I think one thing that reigns supreme throughout all m games, is that i'm a terrible day one-r. Almost every game i attract some sort of attention on me day one. I am at least putting content forward, i apologize for the bad typing, im not feeling that great and not paying much attention.

Does anyone else notice how Demon is pretty much worshipping bob? no one finds that even a little suspicious? i think it warrants a wagon at least

Oh, I've noticed, but to whom do you think it is deserving a wagon of? bob, or Demon?

This is a little more interesting. I don't usually go after people for buddying, but that is very much what it looks like here. He saw someone else who agrees with his pseudo suspicion of archaebob and jumped on it. He has made no previous mention of suspecting DemonHybrid, but now he's on to him! Can't you see him smiling while he writes that?

Oh, and the burden of proof for your vote is on you. You should be justifying it, not waiting for it to be unjustified. Be an active player.

Just because I may not have mentioned DH, does not mean I never found him suspicious.

@ nintendo -

I'm not sure he suspects me at all. That's the whole point.

And you didn't answer my question from before. What are you accomplishing with your vote?

Right now, it's not doing much of anything, it seems.

UNVOTE:

Your vote isn't accomplishing anything so you just get rid of it? You don't vote somewhere else maybe? You do, but not until a few posts later. That means you weren't reading anybody except archaebob at that point. If you had been, you would have been able to switch your vote more efficiently to another significant read rather than going back to find out who else has been suspicious. This is VERY indicative of scum play. You watch one player and argue with/vote them to appear to be active. Interesting.

Yeah, I am usually multi-tasking on the computer and not always able to do one thing exclusively. But for this post, I make an exception.

Nintendo, please think about why you want to vote me. Is it solely because I have been lurking? Does that make me scum? Normally lurking is actually somewhat of a scumtell from me, but if you check my other games on here I have been similarly inactive the last few days. Ignoring my lurking up until this point...why would you want to vote me?

Like I said, the vote on you was to ensure you would actually post something. Seeing as you have, I'll UNVOTE: .

Oh, but wait, something stood out to me in that wall:

I suppose it's possible that he is a very good scum player trying to take charge from the beginning of the game... How anyone reads bob as scum is beyond me.

What's this? Saying bob could be scum, and in the same post, showing disbelief that anyone could see bob as scum?

What is this I don't even...

wtf? ................

I don't know what it is that you don't get. Be more specific.

IF YOU HAVE SKIPPED EVERYTHING UP TO THIS POINT, PLEASE READ THIS NEXT PART.

If you need to move on... then move on. Yes, I am bothered by his lack of content, he is usually more active. But in another completed game I played with Pine, (Mini 1156) he turned out to be scum, so his lack of activity here is a towntell for him.

As for me not liking your play, I'll have to get into that later as I am going out the door.

I saved this for last, because it is BY FAR the most interesting tid bit in Nintendo's play.

Most importantly, you make a meta argument. This meta argument is based on exactly one game. Pine posted lots as scum, and little now. Therefore he is playing differently than he did as scum, and therefore he is most likely town.

That's exactly what I am trying to say. So what if it was only from one game? It is a

drastic

change in his style.

archaebob (who you are still voting at this point in the thread) posted a town meta game a long fucking time ago in which he plays almost

exactly

as he is playing now. Clearly you accept the value of meta, yet you ignore archaebob's cited meta for your own purposes. That my friend is fabricated reasoning, and that is scum play.

Honestly I haven't found the time, I've been rather busy with a few things.

vote: Nintendoaddict1

The other people who seem scummy to me are hiplop (gut read mostly, haven't read him in iso yet), Pine, and Maaayyyyybeeee ace.

Archaebob, heliman, and to a lesser extent Barry Allen are town.

Any reasons on why you think those others are scummy? Or do I get special treatment for some reason?

[Scumhunter]

nintendo, what foilist is getting at was the tone in your posts. Your agenda doesn't seem like that of a paranoid townie, but rather of a scheming mafia whose sole agenda is to make themselves look good and spread suspicion on townies.

Your last post was defensive but you really didn't help alleviate any of the concerns.

What you can do if you are town to help let us know that is to start sharing more of your reads.

If you suspect DH, can you explain why? Why didn't you explain it earlier if you suspected him?

[Scumhunter]

I don't mean to be accusatory there nintendo, but yea can you explain your reads on everyone with your thought process behind them. thanks

[ace5993]

DH is town, we are not voting him. I am 95% sure that DH-scum would have loved to tunnel a policy vote on me today for our disagreements from last game.

I want to see your case on him Bob. Also, yea Pine is V/LA, we don't want to vig him or even consider voting him til he gets back and can contribute. That is reckless play.

I have to agree with DH with regards to jilynne. If the point of voting someone for pressure is to actually elicit a response you don't just GIVE UP when they aren't responding. You continue to pressure them until they either respond or lynched as bad town/scum.

I'm more than willing to vote jilynne if she doesn't want to contribute.

vote jilynne1991

Wait a second. You're saying to back off Pine because he's on V/LA yet at the same time voting Jilynne, who's getting replaced?

I'll look at the nintendo case later, however I still say we lynch Pine today unless someone literally claims scum.

[pappums rat]

Vote Count 1.7

DemonHybrid - 3 (ace5993, archaebob, hiplop)
archaebob- 2 (Pine, Heliman)
jilynne1991 - 2 (DemonHybrid, Scumhunter)
Heliman - 1 (Spadille)
hiplop - 1 (Barry Allen)
nintendoaddict1- 1 (foilist13)

Not Voting - jilynne1991, nintendoaddict1, Giitah

With 13 alive it takes 7 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 1 is 12 A.M. on June 26, 2011.

jilynne is V/LA until Monday.
Pine is V/LA until Monday.
Heliman is V/LA until Wednesday.

Still searching for a replacement for Spadille.

[Scumhunter]

ace, good point, I forgot jilynne was on V/LA. I don't believe she is being replaced but ya.

The two wagons I don't want to support at this time are DH (for sure) and archaebob (mostly)

V/LA really ruins the continuity of a game -___-

But I suppose you are right that was hypocritical. I didn't notice jilynne was V/LA. I am skeptical that she will ever produce content where as Pine I'm sure will at least be active once he's back. For the record, I'm not diametrically opposed to the idea of a Pine lynch but I want to wait for him to come back from V/LA to defend himself.

@Everyone voting DH, can you unvote please? He is town, thanks.

unvote

[Giitah]

Okay, I've finally finished my analysis. Before I say anything I'd like to question Scumhunter.
What makes you so certain DH is town? Do you think there is a merit to defending him so much? If you think DH isn't scum, why don't you make a logical and coherent argument against the attack of the supporters rather than telling people 'HEY GUYS STOP TRYING TO KILL HIM!'? I'm interested in what you have to say on him.

[foilist13]

Okay, if a few people stand out to you, why don't you post your analysis on them as well?

My post was already a bleeding wall mate. I didn't have the patience to make it any bigger, and I would be just about guaranteeing that nobody would read it. I'll get to everyone else when I'm done with you.

I didn't take it seriously, cause I knew it was RVS. And wait, you're saying you would not have taken it seriously either? So how does that make you town, but make me scum?

You put some amount of thought into how best to respond to diffuse the issue. That is taking it seriously.

Actually, it was a response to someone asking why I labeled it RVS. Should I ignore questions asked of me?

I'm intentionally taking this out of context. I simply wanted to expose your view. When, where, and why you said that are not relevant.

Exactly. I know all votes are RVS at first. Why is saying 'RVS' in front of my vote strange? Oh, and nice buddying on bob, there. Where did I say anything remotely like that paraphrase?

You're trying to deflect this onto me buddying archaebob. Stop that. It's unbecoming.

It's strange in that it serves a purpose that only one alignment could reasonably be interested it. Is it the end of the world? No. Does it make you automatically scum? No, but it sure helps towards that.

If it makes you feel better, I don't plan to lynch you on the basis of you labeling your RVS vote.

I'm not going to do quote walls because they make me angry, but the "cute" and "stupid" bits should be self explanatory. I'm fairly confident everyone else will pick up on my meaning.

Just because I may not have mentioned DH, does not mean I never found him suspicious.

So?

Yeah, I am usually multi-tasking on the computer and not always able to do one thing exclusively. But for this post, I make an exception.

I fail to see how this is an adequate response to my post.

I don't know what it is that you don't get. Be more specific.

*sigh* Why would you unvote him right when you found something suspicious? By structuring your post that way you're guaranteeing that he won't take your new concern seriously since he is under no pressure at all to answer it. That means you're less concerned with his reaction, which in turn means you're more concerned with how your post will cause you to be perceived.

That's exactly what I am trying to say. So what if it was only from one game? It is a drastic change in his style.

Good, so we've further established your faith in meta.

Honestly I haven't found the time, I've been rather busy with a few things.

Bullshit. Archaebob said exactly why he linked that game and what it would say. You knew without even having to read it

Any reasons on why you think those others are scummy? Or do I get special treatment for some reason?

Like I said earlier, I'll get to them when I'm done with you.

[ace5993]

Oops yeah I thought Jil was getting replaced for some reason, I'm not really sure why O_o

[nintendoaddict1]

Like I said earlier, I'll get to them when I'm done with you.

Any reason I come first?

[Giitah]

@Nintendo
Obviously, because he thinks your suspicious.

[Giitah]

Don't ask meaningless questions. It's like Hiplop asking 'Did you actually read my posts'? No shit, everyone says YES OF COURSE because otherwise our argument is basically invalidated.

[foilist13]

@ foilist13 -

What's your impression of DemonHybrid? Please look carefully before you answer.

Before I read him in ISO I'm going to say my gut read is town. It has been that throughout my reading, however, I'll read him again and give a reasoned opinion.

Also, Unvote, Vote: hiplop. archaebob is not new and he's certainly not taking anything TOO seriously. The point of RVS is to leave RVS, and so far, you have the sketchiest vote of everyone.

I don't know if this holds true for everyone, but I read Hiplop's vote as a joke right off. I could accept that you took it seriously, but that's a bit of a stretch for me.

Other than that his early game doesn't seem very interesting.

LOL, yes, that was pretty much what I was going to say.

I can see you reason, but you can't FoS or Vote someone with no case.

Sure he can.

Again, he's pressuring someone. It's me, but it's still good townie behavior.

This feels very town to me. Scum are generally concerned with getting votes off of themselves. It would take a very cool headed scum to try and do that by defending the guy voting them.

2. I'm trusting bob's reads and actions because he has ABSOLUTELY NO SCUM MOTIVATION to do anything that he's done so far. Every FoS without a reason, vote without a reason, page 1 seriousness, etc. has absolutely no scum motivation and he's obviously putting pressure on people instead of sitting there with his thumb up his ass.

This also tells my gut town.

His case on jillynne is fairly whatever. Scum could make that case fairly easily, though town would have just as much motivation to do so.

Then we get to him refusing to move his vote. That is CLEARLY anti-town. He isn't generating a wagon or pushing for a lynch, therefore he is not doing anything to accomplish his goal of getting her lynched. That means his vote is essentially on principal of voting the person you would most like to see lynched at the end of the day. I would say that's fine, except he was perfectly happy pressure voting and defending pressure votes earlier in the day. This gives me a logical reason to suspect him, but my gut still says he's town.

His writing makes him feel townish. HIs Jil vote irritates me, but I don't see a real scum motivation for absolutely refusing to move one's vote, especially if suspicion is being drawn to them for it.

[foilist13]

Any reason I come first?

Any reason you chose to respond only to the single most inconsequential part of that entire post?

I chose you because you are the most scummy to me right now. I though that reasoning was obvious after I voted you. If I wanted to vote one of the others I probably would have made a case against them and put them first.

[nintendoaddict1]

Any reason I come first?

Any reason you chose to respond only to the single most inconsequential part of that entire post?

Because in your post you only quoted back one layer, thus just showing my comments without the previous quotes. To properly respond I will need to go back and read my post and then check yours to see the subject your talking on for that part. I don't have the time for that right now.

[nintendoaddict1]

Like I said earlier, I'll get to them when I'm done with you.

Really? You can't keep up with multiple reads and cases at once? Or are you just tunneling me now?

[Scumhunter]

unvote, vote nintendoaddict1

[Giitah]

Vote: Scumhunter

Don't avoid my questions.
Post #382.

[Giitah]

on an aside, can someone quickly link me to a definition/define tunneling?

[foilist13]

Really? You can't keep up with multiple reads and cases at once? Or are you just tunneling me now?

You've got nothing better to say? Come on man, get with it. You're getting shitted on and trying to wait for it to go away.

[nintendoaddict1]

Really? You can't keep up with multiple reads and cases at once? Or are you just tunneling me now?

You've got nothing better to say? Come on man, get with it. You're getting shitted on and trying to wait for it to go away.

Way to dodge the questions, foil. At this time, no. I don't at all believe it will go away simply because I ignore it.

[hiplop]

DH is town, we are not voting him. I am 95% sure that DH-scum would have loved to tunnel a policy vote on me today for our disagreements from last game.

I want to see your case on him Bob. Also, yea Pine is V/LA, we don't want to vig him or even consider voting him til he gets back and can contribute. That is reckless play.

I have to agree with DH with regards to jilynne. If the point of voting someone for pressure is to actually elicit a response you don't just GIVE UP when they aren't responding. You continue to pressure them until they either respond or lynched as bad town/scum.

I'm more than willing to vote jilynne if she doesn't want to contribute.

vote jilynne1991

so because hes going after someone else, that makes him town?

I think we've found our scum team guys.. (dh and scumhunter)

[foilist13]

Doesn't the 1/4 rule mean that there are 3 scum?

@Nintendo: Oooh right. I'm sorry, I didn't realize I was the one dodging questions since there's that big post sitting there about me that I haven't responded to.

Just to make you happy, I can easily keep up with multiple reads. However, if I were to interrogate all of them at once I would clog the thread and become anti-town. Secondly, you have not yet posted as much content in this entire game as I have

today.

Get your ass moving and don't try and high road me. You'll fail.

[ace5993]

on an aside, can someone quickly link me to a definition/define tunneling?

Tunneling is when you focus all your posts on one person for extended periods of time, mostly ignoring the rest of the game. It's like tunnel vision on a specific player, hence the name.