Neon Genesis Evangelion Mafia (Game Over)

[Pomegranate]

Clarification on the point on Kast: I have no problem with the people wagonning him as I think he is mildly scummy - I am not however going to vote for him.

K, cool story bro. Why do you find him mildy scummy?

[Pomegranate]

Actually, VOTE: Stevie. I hate the way he came in to make another short, meaningless post, gets criticized by GW for not having reads, and then right away comes in with a post voting GI (as well as the rest of his previously mentioned scummy behavior, of course). Additionally, although I don't like GI's play right now or anything, I can say that I don't want to be on a wagon with Stevie.

[Nocmen]

As for Amrun, what he did is a scumtell. I'm quite sick of this debate but I believe its a scum tell, and worth a vote at that stage of the game. Not everyone in this game agrees with this, and frankly its been debated to death so I'm going to try and move past it. His recent posts have been good.

Why is it a scumtell? Because of an offhand cult mention, that may or may not refer to a previous game? At the same time, you've switch to grey for his mention of masons, which is attributable to almost the same thing Amrun did?

Doesn't help that you vote right after you get criticized for it too.

No I voted GreyIce because yesterday I posted that if he did not answer my questions I would vote for him. He did not answer my questions. I am voting for him.

If you want to see why I think the cult mention is a scum tell, then read my posts. That cult post has derailed a lot of our day one discussion. Its a scumtell and I'm not the only one who thinks that. If you disagree with that it's fine but to attack me over that is ridiculous.

I'm much more satisfied with you moving it off of him, but I was hoping it would be due to his position with the Kast wagon.

[Kast]

@Noc-
To be clear, you are ignoring my post rather than responding to the point. You are also abandoning your previous position and simply saying I am scum for not placing a vote; despite having reads on multiple players which you admit to reading. You are also taking the position that a null-read/declaration is equivalent to a non-existent read/declaration.

I'll let you know who is scum and who you should be voting for when I am ready.

Your continued insistence that I hate GreyIce remains as wrong now as it was before. It sounds like you are grasping to that as a false justification for your vote.

@GreyIce-
If you are finished hyping yourself up and deliver a reasonable point on Noc, then I'll re-evaluate whether you are contributing anything to this game. At the moment, you still have done nothing but distract people from scum hunting.

@Surye-
Welcome to the game. Do you have anything more to add and/or thoughts about anything else?

Also, excusing yourself from your position by claiming to not read old grudges allows you to mischaracterize my position. I was one of the few players who defended GreyIce and was willing to engage in discussion with him despite his behavior. He was just as unhelpful and intentionally hostile in that game as this one, but I got a strong VI-town read from it. If you're going to bother using the linked game as an excuse, get it right.

@Stevie Votes/Criticisms-
I'm not really buying the case on him. He's coming across pretty genuinely as a n00b player. I'm slightly disappointed though since I'd expect scum to quickly and readily jump on Stevie-n00b-town; but Vollkan and Ghostwriter both read plausibly as legit town avoiding the obviously crap leading wagons.

@Noc-
Pot, meet kettle.

FYI, I'm not liking your evasion, inconsistency, or repeated misrepresentations despite clarifications/corrections. I'm also not liking your eagerness to appease others (ie. Grey switch/Kast switch), nor your attempts to egg on myself and Grey to waste more time.

@Spyrex-
I'd like more posts from you. A bit more sanity in this game would be great. If you're sane town, that would be even better.

P-Edit-
Pom- I'm saddened to see more votes on someone who is so easily a mislynch magnet.

@Mod-

Can we have prods on Kawaii, C-Worl, and kanyeknowsbest? Thanks

[Kast]

Hmm, screwed up the tag, but it should be clear from context.

[Pomegranate]

P-Edit-
Pom- I'm saddened to see more votes on someone who is so easily a mislynch magnet.

I dunno; although I still don't like GI or anything, I'm pretty sure the vibes I'm getting are anti-town rather than scum. And Stevie is just scummy for enough reasons listed to switch at this point.

[Pomegranate]

(I forgot how much I missed/enjoyed mafia... <3)

[Kdub]

Day 1 - Vote Count #5

Amrun (1)

- animorpherv1

Kawaii (0)

-

GreyICE (3)

- Candle Jack, malthusis, StevieT92

Antifinity (0)

-

Candle Jack (1)

- Antifinity

C-Worl (0)

-

kanyeknowsbest (0)

-

Nocmen (1)

- Amrun

Surye (0)

-

Celebloki (0)

-

malthusis (0)

-

Starbuck (0)

-

ace5993 (0)

-

drewoftherushes (0)

-

ZeL1nK (0)

-

StevieT92 (3)

- vollkan, GhostWriter, Pomegranate

GhostWriter (0)

-

SpyreX (0)

-

Kast (4)

- GreyICE, ace5993, Surye, Nocmen

vollkan (0)

-

Pomegranate (2)

- LobsterCatapult, ZeL1nK

LobsterCatapult (0)

-

animorpherv1 (2)

- Starbuck, Celebloki

No Lynch (0)

-

Not Voting (6)

- Kawaii, C-Worl, kanyeknowsbest, SpyreX, Kast, drewoftherushes

23 votes available, 12 votes needed to lynch

Deadline is July 18, ~ 10 am PDT

Kawaii and kanyeknowsbest have been prodded.

@Mod-

Can we have prods on Kawaii, C-Worl, and kanyeknowsbest? Thanks

C-Worl has not picked up his role PM and will be replaced if he doesn't show up in 24 hours. Kawaii and kanye have been prodded.

[Amrun]

Kast, how do you know Stevie would be a mislynch? What makes you think he's town?

[GhostWriter]

As for Amrun, what he did is a scumtell. I'm quite sick of this debate but I believe its a scum tell, and worth a vote at that stage of the game. Not everyone in this game agrees with this, and frankly its been debated to death so I'm going to try and move past it. His recent posts have been good.

Why is it a scumtell? Because of an offhand cult mention, that may or may not refer to a previous game? At the same time, you've switch to grey for his mention of masons, which is attributable to almost the same thing Amrun did?

Doesn't help that you vote right after you get criticized for it too.

No I voted GreyIce because yesterday I posted that if he did not answer my questions I would vote for him. He did not answer my questions. I am voting for him.

I'm pretty sure he answered you, actually.

[vollkan]

GI's posts suck, considering he isn't answering valid questions, and he's criticizing Kast, who is making sense and stuff. GI continuously avoids/brushes off legitimate questions.

VOTE: GreyICE.

And a strong FoS goes out to Stevie , mainly for his acutely wishy-washy sentence regarding Kast. If you don't find Kast scummy then you don't think the wagon has a base; if you the wagon has a base then Kast is scummy. Also, if it's not 'completely unfounded', then what, in your opinion is it founded on? To top it off, the 'I wouldn't like it to see it get out of hand' seems to come to remedy the lack of sense made in the sentence, yet it does simply the opposite. No idea what's going on with this.

Pom+5

Aside from the fact that GI is playing exactly like how I've seen GI play in the past, there's a deeper problem with the above in that your reasons for Voting GI (avoiding questions and criticising Kast) are weaker than your reasons for FoSing Stevie (his inconsistent attitude on Kast)

---
All the votes on GI for the obvjoke mason claim are stupid over-reaction (null, but stupid nonetheless)
---

vollkan: Pom's #41 was like, "Well, what Amrun did was scummy, but it could have been a mistake, so maybe it's townie. Also, I'm going to extend RVS and not contribute. Bye." Her more recent post was better, though.

Is your problem with the first part of that (not having a strong position on Amrun) or the second (extending RVS and not contributing)?

Clarification on the point on Kast: I have no problem with the people wagonning him as I think he is mildly scummy - I am not however going to vote for him.

You clearly don't think Kast is scummy enough to merit your own vote, so why then do you think other people are justified in voting for him. You've yet to actually explain what it is about Kast that makes him "mildly" scummy.

[Amrun]

Both, but more the former rather than the latter.

[StevieT92]

Actually, VOTE: Stevie. I hate the way he came in to make another short, meaningless post, gets criticized by GW for not having reads, and then right away comes in with a post voting GI (as well as the rest of his previously mentioned scummy behavior, of course). Additionally, although I don't like GI's play right now or anything, I can say that I don't want to be on a wagon with Stevie.

I think you guys see me being scummy about a playstyle thing I do. When I write posts I like to keep different topics separate and try to post multiple posts in a flurry. After I finished reading the thread and before GW posted I had already planned to vote for GreyIce. When I posted that first one sentence post I immediately started typing my post voting for GreyIce, the fact that GW posted a criticism of my voting at the same time was purely coincidental. You will see plenty of times in this game (assuming you dont all lynch me :p) that i post two or more times in a row. And of course I had never planned on posting one sentence and then leaving.

Look at what happens when I try and cram multiple thoughts into one post: I frankly admit that the sentence I wrote about Kast sucks ass and isn't vaguely good town behavior. That is why I tried to clarify what I meant.

Steve

[Pomegranate]

GI's posts suck, considering he isn't answering valid questions, and he's criticizing Kast, who is making sense and stuff. GI continuously avoids/brushes off legitimate questions.

VOTE: GreyICE.

And a strong FoS goes out to Stevie , mainly for his acutely wishy-washy sentence regarding Kast. If you don't find Kast scummy then you don't think the wagon has a base; if you the wagon has a base then Kast is scummy. Also, if it's not 'completely unfounded', then what, in your opinion is it founded on? To top it off, the 'I wouldn't like it to see it get out of hand' seems to come to remedy the lack of sense made in the sentence, yet it does simply the opposite. No idea what's going on with this.

Pom+5

Aside from the fact that GI is playing exactly like how I've seen GI play in the past, there's a deeper problem with the above in that your reasons for Voting GI (avoiding questions and criticising Kast) are weaker than your reasons for FoSing Stevie (his inconsistent attitude on Kast)

Yeah, note the fact that my vote has already changed to Stevie, basically for that reason.

[StevieT92]

@GhostWriter I didn't like his response, here it was:

Also, how many games have you played before Stevie? Legit question, because I'm curious as to you knowing what you do to people who are tracked or watched targeting a night kill. Watched really makes it a 'throw in the towel' on me trying to just play super town and get night killed fast as I can be town enough not to get copped/tracked but I can't dodge a watcher.

Firstly, the entire post is trying to answer a question with a question. That is scummy behavior, I'm not going to answer the question for you.

Secondly, he again ignores my second question asking why he didn't reveal his flavor name. This is a legitimate question, and if more people jump on the wagon then we should force him to reveal this - that's really up to you guys though. This is also scummy - even if he doesn't want to reveal his flavor name (there are valid reasons for feeling this way, i just wanted to hear what he had to say) there is no reason he should be ducking the question.

I also think that if this wagon for GreyIce grows we should eventually demand to hear this flavor name.

.

Lastly, the noob comments are cracking me up. It's not my fault all my games on this website were lost in the abyss that is the internet - and considering I was playing mafia on the internet for year or so before I even came to this website I have plenty of experience. I also was a regular on ScumChat back in the good old days.
Steve

[GreyICE]

Fair enough, scumclaims come from scum.

Vote: Stevie

[Amrun]

I thought Nocmen claimed scum according to you. Are you ever going to explain that or show conviction in your reads, Grey?

[LobsterCatapult]

sorry, shit happened in rl, worked a double at work then went out. i skimmed the thread, i will post tomorrow.

so far, very inclined to think that kast and GI are town, along with volkan

need to read stevie, and pom more closely.

[SpyreX]

@Spyrex-
I'd like more posts from you. A bit more sanity in this game would be great. If you're sane town, that would be even better.

I ended up gone waaay longer than I thought today.

You'll get real input from me tomorrow night but for now: CJ is town fo sho, you're probably town and, I know this is going to sting you, GI is probably town. Don't let a clash of styles turn into a boxing match that lets sliders slide along.

On that note don't let me forget a.) that post I posted about because it STILL bugs me and b.) a parse of the actives versus the non. Even at this point there should be some tidbits.

I'm REALLY trying not to neglect this game because early D1 in a large is normally a headache for me so keep on the the straight and narrow.

[ace5993]

@Kast - I still do not see where you explicitly contrasted Grey joking vs Grey being serious. You've done two things related: firstly you asked if he was joking, which is not contrasting anything, just asking a question. The other time was when you made an actual contrast:

Flailing around randomly D1 like an idiot is just going to waste time and peg you for a useless VI. If you're scum, then keep it up, but if you're town, you're just going to hurt your credibility when you try to play seriously later. In either case, you're just setting yourself up as lynch bait (either as a mislynch or a sacrificial bus) and that's clearly not playing to your win con.

Yet still managed to avoid saying anything except that Grey was playing like an idiot. You don't even appear to consider grey scummy, so why are you wasting your time with this crap about him in the first place? You're distracting the town from scumhunting by... what, VI hunting? You are also not scumhunting proactively AT ALL right now, just sitting back and letting others do the work for you while you formulate reads, which is also scummy.

I also think that if this wagon for GreyIce grows we should eventually demand to hear this flavor.

This is blatant scum comment number two by Stevie. Whether he's a noob or not is irrelevant, this is just scum. Kast is a priority right now though since Stevie's actually posting useful stuff at the moment.

[ZeL1nK]

Nocmen's #118 looks scummy. The jump onto GI was terrible, and the jump back onto Kast looks insincere. Even apart from the fact GI's claim was a fairly obvious joke, why would you vote for someone who claimed mason? Like, you voted him for 'outing' himself... Really? And come on, you'll give GI the 'benefit of the doubt' that he was joking?

This looks like distancing by Pom. Also explains why Stevie only takes the time to respond to Pom in #137 without even mentioning any of the other people voting for him.

Unvote

VOTE: Stevie

Kast is a priority right now though since Stevie's actually posting useful stuff at the moment.

Wait, what? How is Stevie posting useful stuff? He's not actually scum hunting, he's just saying "X is a scum tell" and defending himself.

[vollkan]

Both, but more the former rather than the latter.

Which doesn't make any sense to me. "Well, what Amrun did was scummy, but it could have been a mistake, so maybe it's townie" is a perfectly legitimate way of explaining that, whilst something is on its face scummy, the prospect of it being simply a mistake is not sufficiently small to make the action a scumtell.

The only alternatives are either ignoring the prospect of it being a mistake (which is daft) or simply stating that it is a nulltell (which is fine, but I don't see why Pom is scummy simply for expressing it in a less succinct way)

Actually, VOTE: Stevie. I hate the way he came in to make another short, meaningless post, gets criticized by GW for not having reads, and then right away comes in with a post voting GI (as well as the rest of his previously mentioned scummy behavior, of course). Additionally, although I don't like GI's play right now or anything, I can say that I don't want to be on a wagon with Stevie.

I think you guys see me being scummy about a playstyle thing I do. When I write posts I like to keep different topics separate and try to post multiple posts in a flurry. After I finished reading the thread and before GW posted I had already planned to vote for GreyIce. When I posted that first one sentence post I immediately started typing my post voting for GreyIce, the fact that GW posted a criticism of my voting at the same time was purely coincidental. You will see plenty of times in this game (assuming you dont all lynch me :p) that i post two or more times in a row. And of course I had never planned on posting one sentence and then leaving.

Look at what happens when I try and cram multiple thoughts into one post: I frankly admit that the sentence I wrote about Kast sucks ass and isn't vaguely good town behavior. That is why I tried to clarify what I meant.

Steve

Unless you're just making some kind of generic "I'm a bad player" defence, the above doesn't respond to the specific points I raised against you.

To put them in a simple numbered format:
1) Assuming that Amrun's cult reference was scum-motivated, when he'd already given a plausible null explanation (ie. meta reference)
2) Attacking Amrun for non-contribution
3) Your stance on Kast (which is now becoming the most important issue here).

On the Kast point specifically, the fact that you post quickly is irrelevant. You gave two posts lending tacit support to Kast's wagon without actually committing yourself to any particular view of Kast, coupled with the get-out-of-jail card of "don't let it get out hand".

Yeah, note the fact that my vote has already changed to Stevie, basically for that reason.

I am aware of that, but it doesn't change the inconsistency of your position at the time.

Firstly, the entire post is trying to answer a question with a question. That is scummy behavior, I'm not going to answer the question for you.

Le fail:

Come on, wagon scum to lynch by page 4.

Do it. DO IT

Town gains nothing by rushing for a quick lynch. Also you really haven't offered any significant criticisms of Kast, besides your sarcastic responses and posting about how much you want him lynched.

Come on, wagon scum to lynch by page 4.

Do it. DO IT

Town gains nothing by rushing for a quick lynch. Also you really haven't offered any significant criticisms of Kast, besides your sarcastic responses and posting about how much you want him lynched.

Town gains a lot from scum knowing that we don't have to sit around dragging our feet all day because it's really town to foot drag on lynching scum.

I love fast wagons, I love scum wagons, I love the uncertainty. Two of my favorite wagons both occurred in under six hours on day 1.

Kast posts suck. This is a good reason to lynch.

Also, how many games have you played before Stevie? Legit question, because I'm curious as to you knowing what you do to people who are tracked or watched targeting a night kill. Watched really makes it a 'throw in the towel' on me trying to just play super town and get night killed fast as I can be town enough not to get copped/tracked but I can't dodge a watcher.

[GreyICE]

I thought Nocmen claimed scum according to you. Are you ever going to explain that or show conviction in your reads, Grey?

Sure, soon as there stops being MULTIPLE SCUM I'll be happy to pick one and stick to him.

I mean unless you have a "Lone Scumman" theory you'd like to share.

[drewoftherushes]

I also think that if this wagon for GreyIce grows we should eventually demand to hear this flavor name.

This is not good. Second reference, I think, to GI's flavor name. Eliminating possibilities for a fakeclaim?

VOTE: Stevie

P-Edit-
Pom- I'm saddened to see more votes on someone who is so easily a mislynch magnet.

First, why is he more easily a "mislynch magnet" than, say, GI? But the votes on GI don't sadden you? And I'd like to know who you're suspicious of, since you don't have a vote down on anyone.

[LobsterCatapult]

I thought that was a pretty obvious joke. Why would GI-scum lie about it when Candle Jack could easily confirm it's a lie?

This is null for me. Although the responses and vote shifts because of it have got my interest.

I'm fairly confident GreyIce is doing this just for that. i think GreyIce is town, though i think his playstyle is really getting under peoples skin, like Kast.

@greyice...pom bussing stevie?

Im seeing Kast as likely town as well, i like his response to CandleJacks points about Amrun's cult "speculation". i think kast and GreyIce are town, but just mixing as well as oil and water. i think kast is exaggerating GreyIce's posts as antitown, and misinterpretting them as such, especially the one where he pointed out a very valid point against pom. that inlies what i said about kast earlier discrediting GI, kast since the first exhange between him and GreyIce as come across as rather town, i like that he has pulled away to address other points, but i think their incredibly different playstyles have led to misinterpretations that instead of me originally thinking as discrediting, have been simply misinterpretations.

pom's 41 was pretty garbage indeed, and she ended up reversing her vote like that. which.....in turn, i find a bit scummy. i find her 41 a bit scummy, and i feel after she got called out on it, she switched her vote to stevie at the soonest point she found acceptable. However, since i dont like stevie's posts about kast wagon, either, i think this is rather poor bussing/distancing. whatever.

still not liking how ace voted kast simply because there was a wagon...i mean, c'mon look how early the day is, the point is to try to build cases here, not sheep them at this point. also...stevie is not doing anything useful, except finding a good tree and getting strong rope.

i like Zel1nks and volkans posts thus far.

nocmen seems to be reacting extremely strongly to greyice's stupid fake mason claim, and i dont understand his kast vote.
however, i really don't like malthusis' vote right after it.

thus, taking my own advice, im going to vote malthusis.

unvote
vote:malthusis

why are you more inclined to believe candlejack than greyice?

this seems to me like scum trying to find an easy wagon, for a stupid reason.