Panzerjager wrote:Ah, gotcha.
Yeah that doesn't help Hiplop's case at all. I'm all for a Hiplop lynch at this point.
![Rolling Eyes :roll:](./images/smilies/icon_rolleyes.gif)
Hoppster wrote:xvart wrote:Finally,what do you mean by "for town."That sounds pretty definitively that you know I am town.
Is English your first language? I was going to make a derogatory remark here, but realised that would be rash of me considering you may very well speak Albanian as your first language.
If English is your first language, you're reaaaally stretching here and I assume that native English speakers on this site (probably at least of average intelligence if not above-average) will see this.
The gist is,by saying "for town" I am probably (indeed I am in this context) accusing you of being scum or stupid-town.(You'd have to be stupid-town to attack me without reading my posts, paticularly when I have commented that you need to start reading my posts.)
Hoppster wrote:Hoppster (relevant to [1], slightly relevant to [2]) wrote:Toro wrote:I'm going to be watching Empking more and more from here on out, I'm not going to place a vote down on him to start a bandwagon asthere is a chance still he actually is Miller. I won't make a final decision on what Empking is until I've read him better down the road. As of now I'm going to re-read back through the thread and look at all of the different conflicts going on.
... Come again?
Of coursethere's a chance he's town (and therefore a Miller), that's the situation WITH EVERYBODY.
Please... with this logic, you should never ever make a vote apart from a select few scenarios when somebody is confirmed scum.
Toro wrote:Hoppster
- First post of his (which includes a CC vote) appears serious, kind of appears as if he's jumping the gun here. (Scum)
- #26: Calls out Sleepy for over-eagerly rushing onto a wagon. Contradiction. Hopp overeagerly started a wagon and pushed for it in RVS. (Scum)
JUDGMENT: Lack of posts doesn't set anything in stone for me yet, but he's leaning scum.
What? How is a serious vote in RVS scummy?
I am also not contradicting myself inany shape or form.
Even if I was overeagerly starting a wagon (and I firmly believe I was not), my overeagerness in starting a wagon and Sleepy rushing overeagerly onto a wagon are not mutually exclusive.
I'm not even being hypocritical, if that's what you're driving at. Starting a wagon and rushing onto a wagon arevery different things.
My wagon was justified, anyhow. Or are you saying this is not the case?
Toro wrote:Thomith
- Posting thoughts on game so far. Thru #50. Not really contributing though. (Null)
- Still hasn't contributed anything. #62. (Null-Scum)
JUDGMENT: Is just coasting along echoing others thoughts and hasn't contributed, I think we might have scum here trying to lay low.
---------------------------------
Vote: Thomith
This is actually ridiculous.
Going to refer you back to your logic from avoiding Empking: "I'm not going to place a vote down on him to start a bandwagon as there is a chance still he actually isMillertown".
In fact, here's another lovely quote illustrating this:Toro wrote:Because here's the thing, it's not certain that Empking is a miller or not. I don't want to keep my vote on him throughout the whole day phase and potentially mislynch a townie.
Are you saying that there is no chance that Thomith is town? Pray, tell us how you know this.
You have 2 points on Thomith - Null and Null-Scum.
You have 2 Scum points on myself. You have 3 on SleepyKrew.
And yet you vote for Thomith?!
Toro wrote:Empking
- Claims miller right off the bat, you all know how I feel about this. (Null)
Yep, that's right, I know you think it's... null? That's not how it looked earlier...
Toro wrote:IGMEOY: Empking
^ Ie. MILLER CLAIM TOTALLY NOT NULL
xvart wrote:Hoppster, 502 wrote:Hoppster wrote:xvart wrote:Hoppster, 357 wrote:Mafia One-Shot Vigilante is a normal role. I think it's safer if we tie Toro to a certain specific target, whether that be himself or a lurker. (I'd prefer it to be himself, seeing as lurkers can be replaced.)
I think I've seen one mafia vig and it was a large them (I think). I highly doubt there is a mafia one shot vig in a mini normal all things considered. And the directing a vig kill to a single person is highly scummy due to the influence scum have in the night actions.
The only thing that could even be construed as justified suspicion here would beif you believe that I am scum and my faction has a Redirector or Bus Driver, with both being explicity non-Normal.
Or perhaps if I have full setup knowledge and know every single person's role.
A hypothetical scum roleblocker DOES NOT mean directing the vig shot is scummy,AS THEY CAN ROLEBLOCK REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THE SHOT IS DIRECTED OR NOT
AND THEN I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT ELSE YOU COULD POSSIBLY THINK IS SCUMMY
You accuse me of not reading because you have a different interpretation of what you said than what you actually said? Where did you say anything about a roleblocker in your first response? This is another example of you justifying something after the fact with evidence that was not originally stated. What you said originally is completely different than your annotations in blue. The whole point is if there is a RBer they know if the single individual set to be killed is on their team or not. When it is not directed, they do not know if the target is going to be their team or not. Even if they don't have a RBer they can influence the kill during the day to someone who is town and say "welp, at least we got rid of a town lurker." Giving scum advanced knowledge of specific night actions only helps scum and not town because they have more information about night actions to begin with.
Panzerjager, 527 wrote:That was convoluted.
Hoppster, 360 wrote:I'm fine with a lurker vig provided we tie down Toro to a specific shot.
xvart wrote:Hoppster, 360 wrote:I'm fine with a lurker vig provided we tie down Toro to a specific shot.
This goes back to the directing vig kill argument. You are fine with a vig shootingany lurkerbut you want it tied down to a specific lurker for what purpose? Why does it matter which lurker he shoots if you are fine with generalized lurker kill?
Panzerjager wrote:vollkan wrote:PJ wrote:
1) Pointing that Emp did it was a way of saying why I'm the only one answering for it. Also, If he doesn't do it, we lynch him for being scum, if he's town he should do it because he obviously played poorly enough and anti-town enough to be a detriment thus should martyr himself for the town. Also, it prevents him from mis-vigging anyone. On a more mafia theory related note, I generally think vig's are a detriment to the town due to them generally hitting town.
But you're forgetting that one-shot scum would be bizarre. Thus, if we let him make a free choice tonight, there is still a prospect that he will hit scum and, moreover, his claim is easily tested if he is faking it.
SK could easily just make 1 kill and let it go. Scum could just claim he was blocked. How else would you test it?
Hoppster wrote:
A hypothetical scum roleblocker DOES NOT mean directing the vig shot is scummy, AS THEY CAN ROLEBLOCK REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THE SHOT IS DIRECTED OR NOT
AND THEN I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT ELSE YOU COULD POSSIBLY THINK IS SCUMMY
Xvart wrote:
Hoppster admits this is true, although claims it is only coincidence;
xvart wrote:
I agree that town does this, but not to the degree you've done it. The saying "fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me." The fact that you have done it repeatedly says something about your alignment. Multiple examples will be provided later.
xvart wrote:
This has been detailed to great extent, but I'm really less concerned with the original argument of him knowing my alignment and more concerned with the fact that he came back and claimed that when he said "for someone who is town" (or even "for someone whose likely town" if that were the case) he meant "for someone who is scum or idiot town." This is a blaring contridiction and as good of a backpedal as I've ever seen.
SleepyKrew wrote:But you would be willing to hammer Hop?
Vollkan wrote: First off, to get my standard "How I Play" PSA out of the way: I rank my suspects from 0 (absolutely town) - 100 (absolutely scum). Everybody starts at 50. Because I don't believe in towntells and am skeptical about most scumtells, it is common for people to stay at 50. 50 does not mean "no opinion" - it means "I don't see scumtells" from this person. Absent claims,need for deadline compromises, etc. I will always vote the person with the highest score.
vollkan wrote:SleepyKrew wrote:But you would be willing to hammer Hop?
As a deadline compromise instead of Hiplop, yeah.
Vollkan wrote: First off, to get my standard "How I Play" PSA out of the way: I rank my suspects from 0 (absolutely town) - 100 (absolutely scum). Everybody starts at 50. Because I don't believe in towntells and am skeptical about most scumtells, it is common for people to stay at 50. 50 does not mean "no opinion" - it means "I don't see scumtells" from this person. Absent claims,need for deadline compromises, etc. I will always vote the person with the highest score.
Sundy wrote:vollkan wrote:SleepyKrew wrote:But you would be willing to hammer Hop?
As a deadline compromise instead of Hiplop, yeah.
Vollkan wrote: First off, to get my standard "How I Play" PSA out of the way: I rank my suspects from 0 (absolutely town) - 100 (absolutely scum). Everybody starts at 50. Because I don't believe in towntells and am skeptical about most scumtells, it is common for people to stay at 50. 50 does not mean "no opinion" - it means "I don't see scumtells" from this person. Absent claims,need for deadline compromises, etc. I will always vote the person with the highest score.
I hope you will revise all of your scum-points and future town-tells in light of new information (especially after lynches and the night) or this manner of playing will start to seemawfullyrigid.
Sundy wrote:Sundy wrote:vollkan wrote:SleepyKrew wrote:But you would be willing to hammer Hop?
As a deadline compromise instead of Hiplop, yeah.
Vollkan wrote: First off, to get my standard "How I Play" PSA out of the way: I rank my suspects from 0 (absolutely town) - 100 (absolutely scum). Everybody starts at 50. Because I don't believe in towntells and am skeptical about most scumtells, it is common for people to stay at 50. 50 does not mean "no opinion" - it means "I don't see scumtells" from this person. Absent claims,need for deadline compromises, etc. I will always vote the person with the highest score.
I hope you will revise all of your scum-points and future town-tells in light of new information (especially after lynches and the night) or this manner of playing will start to seemawfullyrigid.
EBWOP: I also cannot help but notice that you have null-tells on fully half the players in the game. Don't like it.
Sundy wrote:vollkan wrote:SleepyKrew wrote:But you would be willing to hammer Hop?
As a deadline compromise instead of Hiplop, yeah.
Vollkan wrote: First off, to get my standard "How I Play" PSA out of the way: I rank my suspects from 0 (absolutely town) - 100 (absolutely scum). Everybody starts at 50. Because I don't believe in towntells and am skeptical about most scumtells, it is common for people to stay at 50. 50 does not mean "no opinion" - it means "I don't see scumtells" from this person. Absent claims,need for deadline compromises, etc. I will always vote the person with the highest score.
I hope you will revise all of your scum-points and future town-tells in light of new information (especially after lynches and the night) or this manner of playing will start to seemawfullyrigid.
vollkan wrote:Sundy wrote:vollkan wrote:SleepyKrew wrote:But you would be willing to hammer Hop?
As a deadline compromise instead of Hiplop, yeah.
Vollkan wrote: First off, to get my standard "How I Play" PSA out of the way: I rank my suspects from 0 (absolutely town) - 100 (absolutely scum). Everybody starts at 50. Because I don't believe in towntells and am skeptical about most scumtells, it is common for people to stay at 50. 50 does not mean "no opinion" - it means "I don't see scumtells" from this person. Absent claims,need for deadline compromises, etc. I will always vote the person with the highest score.
I hope you will revise all of your scum-points and future town-tells in light of new information (especially after lynches and the night) or this manner of playing will start to seemawfullyrigid.
I do revise my scumpoints if new information comes to light. But it will be a cold day in hell before I'm seen giving out townpoints(see previous post)