NY136: The Death of ReaperCharlie (GAME OVER, Town win!)

[Hydra]

HEY, PARAMA!!!

NEIGHBOR GUY!

WEIGH IN ON MERAN AND DON'T DUCK OUT AND AVOID IT!

[Meransiel]

And since people are barely noticing this whole case form, and I'll have a decent chance of death via murder - this would make at least one neighbor scum as well.
Thank you.

Why would anybody want to kill you? You are a decent player, but you don't have a lot of suspicions, and I believe your actions pretty much obviously come from a [REDACTED].

[Parama]

*yawn*

I'd rather see MoIscum lynched. I'm too lazy to attack multiple people at once, anywho.

[Meransiel]

*yawn*

I'd rather see MoIscum lynched. I'm too lazy to attack multiple people at once, anywho.

Then vote for him. I'll back up.

[Parama]

...I already did?

[Parama]

There's even been a votecount since I voted for him. Do you read this thread?

[Meransiel]

Oh, sorry. Still had the impression all neighbors were on me.

[Hydra]

@Parama - then maybe you should be explaining why this pile of people on Meran is wrong and we should all be lynching MoI? Because that weaksauce wagon isn't going anywhere quick, and YOU'RE IGNORING MERAN ADMITTING TO BEING SCUM BECAUSE YOU CAN'T ATTACK MULTIPLE PEOPLE!?!

::insert lengthy rage post here which in basic tl:dr format equates to, I am awesome, everyone else is an idiot, and people should do what I say. Also, Parama's mother/girlfriend/wife/favorite pet and I have had improper relations and I have video to prove it.::

@Meran - yeah, scum never kill people who seem to be focused and clear in their suspicions.

[DemonHybrid]

V/LA from now until Monday, June 27th.

[Meransiel]

No, because people with only 2 or 3 scumreads are usually dead wrong, no matter how good their scumhunting. They'll let them live and make mistakes.

[Hydra]

V/LA from now until Monday, June 27th.

If kondi comes in and goes V/LA without commenting on Meran I may just replace out of this game and take up fishing.

[Iecerint]

@ Merans -- Looking back, it came from the back-and-forth on page 8. May just be that you quoted him a little liberally idk.

There's not really a deeper point...

[kondi2424]

Actually, I think I get where Parama is going with this. UNVOTE: VOTE: MagnaofIllusion

[MrBuddyLee]

unvote, vote: SensFan

@Meransiel

, at the time you rolefished the neighbors, how many scum did you suspect were in the neighborhood, and if any, who did you think were the most likely scum? Has your opinion changed since then?

@Iecerint

, please make your Meransiel-town case more clearly.

@kondi

, why did you choose to follow one of your neighbors and not the other one?

@DH and Parama

, what's this all about, and was it prior to D1 or prior to receiving alignments?

Me and DH had already agreed to push this (kondi) lynch prior to the game.

Meransiel is 2nd on my scumlist

Who was first and why?

vote: MoI he's scum. Lots of misrep and he's happy to dodge any question thrown his way.

Please clarify.

@PJ

, what are your thoughts on each of the neighbors?

@Yos

, what do you think of DH and Parama?

[Iecerint]

I don't think the rolefishing is a scumtell given the context. That's the gist of it. There may be other legitimately sketchy things (e.g. Hydra's claim that Meransiel just kind of pretended to understand Kondi's towntell), but all the focus on the rolefishing is bad.

Why I think the rolefishing is not a scumtell in this context:

1. In the course of reading the thread, I had the same "I bet their PR status would modulate the likelihood that there is 1 scum" idea that Meransiel expressed immediately subsequent to it occurring to me. I would never have requested CLAIMS at that point, but I think the scenario was set-up such that that being on one's mind was at least consistent with a town PoV.

2. Actually, that is the main reason. I also already had a town feel on Meransiel before that because I thought the Hydra pressure was really dumb, and he was the first one to point out that it was dumb AFAICR.

So the overall theme is that I've identified with his thought process so much that I don't think he's very likely scum. Which is kind of specific to my own personal experience BUT that's the basis of my belief.

[Parama]

@Parama - then maybe you should be explaining why this pile of people on Meran is wrong and we should all be lynching MoI? Because that weaksauce wagon isn't going anywhere quick, and YOU'RE IGNORING MERAN ADMITTING TO BEING SCUM BECAUSE YOU CAN'T ATTACK MULTIPLE PEOPLE!?!

Show me where Meran claimed scum?

vote: MoI he's scum. Lots of misrep and he's happy to dodge any question thrown his way.

Please clarify.

@DH and Parama

, what's this all about, and was it prior to D1 or prior to receiving alignments?

Me and DH had already agreed to push this (kondi) lynch prior to the game.

The conversation has already been paraphrased at least once <_<
Hey look, you took my quote out of context (sorta) and then asked me to clarify.
Funnily enough, I clarified plenty in that post and in previous posts made, but when you take things out of context you lose all that, don't you?

[Parama]

Gah, I messed up the order of stuff in that post didn't I.
Fixed version:

vote: MoI he's scum. Lots of misrep and he's happy to dodge any question thrown his way.

Please clarify.

The conversation has already been paraphrased at least once <_<

@DH and Parama

, what's this all about, and was it prior to D1 or prior to receiving alignments?

Me and DH had already agreed to push this (kondi) lynch prior to the game.

Hey look, you took my quote out of context (sorta) and then asked me to clarify.
Funnily enough, I clarified plenty in that post and in previous posts made, but when you take things out of context you lose all that, don't you?[/quote]

[MrBuddyLee]

You said "lots of misrep" and I only found one weak example of you accusing MoI of misrepresenting you.

The conversation has already been paraphrased at least once <_<

was it prior to D1 or prior to receiving alignments?

[Parama]

Prior to D1, seeing as I received my alignment with my role PM, and that same role PM contained to Neighbor QT link.

[Hydra]

Actually, I think I get where Parama is going with this. UNVOTE: VOTE: MagnaofIllusion

RAZZLEBERRY CUPCAKES!!!

Asks lots of questions to lots of people and AVOIDS MY MERAN CASE LIKE A PLAGUE!

There may be other legitimately sketchy things (e.g. Hydra's claim that Meransiel just kind of pretended to understand Kondi's towntell), but all the focus on the rolefishing is bad.

HEY, I AM DEFENDING MERAN WHILE ADMITING THERE IS A CASE OUT THERE WITH POSSIBLE MERIT, BUT I WILL AVOID DEBATING/DISCUSSING IT LIKE THE PLAGUE!

@Parama - then maybe you should be explaining why this pile of people on Meran is wrong and we should all be lynching MoI? Because that weaksauce wagon isn't going anywhere quick, and YOU'RE IGNORING MERAN ADMITTING TO BEING SCUM BECAUSE YOU CAN'T ATTACK MULTIPLE PEOPLE!?!

Show me where Meran claimed scum?

The conversation has already been paraphrased at least once <_<
Hey look, you

took my quote out of context (sorta)

SIDESTEPPED EVEN ADMITTING IT EXISTS, AS THOUGH IT WERE A PLAGUE and then asked me to clarify.
Funnily enough, I clarified plenty in

that

MANY postS and in previous posts made, but

when you take things out of context you lose all that,

NEED TO AVOID IT LIKE A PLAGUE don't you?

HERE;

Here's the basic gist;

Parama: Townslip, ho!
Meran: Yes, total and obvious townslip!
Thor: Buh? What townslip - explain pl0x.
Parama: Because of what he said in the QT paired with this it makes sense as a townslip.
Thor: Meran, what townslip did you see?
Meran: Oh...that post, um...just that post, totally a town tell.
Thor: I think you're using inside knowledge and are changing your story.
Meran: That wouldn't work unless scum have Daytalk.
Thor:

I can link relevant posts if you really want, but I think that should explain the flow pretty well. Meran leapt at the townslip as obvious, but now is having to basically say that the townslip was a...post that looked town to him...which seems nothing remotely like a townslip to me so...wtf?

@Hydra: About the dialogue reenactment thingie...you're straight on. That's why I'm currently hitting my head with my fists.

When I catch up (doing so now) if Meran isn't gaining any other votes than I am going to want to know why.

@Meran - please explain how you did this as "town" and why we shouldn't be speed lynching you, and why I shouldn't be screaming at everyone to lynch you na0w.

AND THEN HE BASICALLY KEPT SAYING 'CAN'T DEFEND IT, WON'T TRY, YOU SHOULD LYNCH ME'
So - he's town who decides to say someone townslipped off of information he had ABSOLUTELY NO WAY OF KNOWING.
or
He's scum who either has access to the QT or a quick breakdown of it courtesy of a scummy buddy - or he's agreeing with the townslip because he's scum who already knows kondi's alignment and wanted to look good.

Now we are lynching him!

[Iecerint]

There may be other legitimately sketchy things (e.g. Hydra's claim that Meransiel just kind of pretended to understand Kondi's towntell), but all the focus on the rolefishing is bad.

HEY, I AM DEFENDING MERAN WHILE ADMITTING THERE IS A CASE OUT THERE WITH POSSIBLE MERIT, BUT I WILL AVOID DEBATING/DISCUSSING IT LIKE THE PLAGUE!

I don't really know much about your case apart from what I just summarized above (which I guess is basically accurate?). I don't think you're communicating it very clearly if there's more to it.

There are some people attacking Meransiel for bad reasons and some people doing it for OK reasons (that I didn't personally notice the latter reasons or voices very much as I read through the thread on my own, which is when I developed my reads).

I do not personally think he is scum because his posts matched my own impressions so precisely. I don't think my own introspection is very likely to convince anyone on this point, though, since it's inherently subjective.

I am aware that that results in kind of unfortunate implications regardless of how Meransiel flips, but it's the truth. <_<

[Meransiel]

@Meransiel, at the time you rolefished the neighbors, how many scum did you suspect were in the neighborhood, and if any, who did you think were the most likely scum? Has your opinion changed since then?

Exactly 1 scum. If there were 2 revealing the neighborhood would've been plain suicide. At the time I suggested that, I was not sure who would be scum there, but as the thread progressed I narrowed it down to Parama and DH. And now, because I think MoI is scum, I am leaning less on Parama. Still not willing to lynch any of them.

Show me where Meran claimed scum?

It's where he brought up that thing with the towntell and I admitted I have no defense against it. I don't see why it's a scumclaim tho.

THOR, WHERE THE FUCK DID I ASK TO BE LYNCHED.

Fuck this, Thor is confirmed town from his behavior but DAMN if I don't feel the urge to crack his skull open.

[Iecerint]

It's scummy because blindly accepting players as nigh-conf town is an action that is odd, especially from someone with enough independence to repudiate the anti-Hydra nonsense early on. So there's a dissonance.

Scum motives are murkier. You can explain it away as a desire to be seen as cooperative, though.

[Meransiel]

Look, I think kondi's first post is a towntell in itself. Hard?

[Hydra]

It's where he brought up that thing with the towntell and I admitted I have no defense against it. I don't see why it's a scumclaim tho.

THOR, WHERE THE SMURF DID I ASK TO BE LYNCHED.

Smurf this, Thor is confirmed town from his behavior but SMURF if I don't feel the urge to crack his skull open.

@Meran - please explain how you did this as "town" and why we shouldn't be speed lynching you, and why I shouldn't be screaming at everyone to lynch you na0w.

You should. I have no excuse for that.

This is asking to be lynched.

Also, for both Iec and Meran - here is why it's a scumtell;

So - he's town who decides to say someone townslipped off of information he had ABSOLUTELY NO WAY OF KNOWING.
or
He's scum who either has access to the QT or a quick breakdown of it courtesy of a scummy buddy - or he's agreeing with the townslip because he's scum who already knows kondi's alignment and wanted to look good.