NY135: Sexy Sedilla Semi-Open - Town Wins

[Magister Ludi]

Also, feel free to ask me any questions.

And though it goes without saying, if someone hammers me rapidly me today, they are a STRONG candidate for vigging, because it is still possible for town to lynch scum and lose tomorrow if the scum bookie themselves, which they will probably do if the quicklynch to end this day.

[kanyeknowsbest]

1. well shes still alive. if prevailing opinion among the scum was idher vig then i see no reason she would not have been shot last night.
2. i think zepher is scum. i dont think that both you and mastin are scum.
3. i think they killed yos because he was pretty much universally agreed as obvtown. maybe they thought he was vig? maybe they didnt care?
4. i dont know how many shots the bookie has. im not experienced enough with setups to guess at what would make it balanced. i dont think you are bookied.

p-edit i originally thought it was a fairly scum free wagon. chair flip and the events of today have lead me to believe thats not the case. i still maintain it could have coasted in without too much scum interference

yes, my current lambda read is town.

[kanyeknowsbest]

what is your read on spyrex? also do you believe kunkstar's stump claim?

[MrZepher]

Catching up on the last couple of pages. Content possibly after.

[Magister Ludi]

Yeah, I believe kunkstars stump claim, and furthermore, he should probably never use it. I think SpyreX is town because he is trying to diffuse me and mastin as town on town, when there is no reason to do that as scum (note, no other player in the game did this), because if we were both town the game is essentially won for scum. It seemed a very towney thing to do.

1. KKB, do you think Yosarian was killed for his reads more than because of how townie he looked, because I think I am and was the only one who expressed suspicion of Idher at all since day one (?)
2. If I flip town, do you agree that it is very likely that there is a MrZepher and Mastin2 scum team in play?
3. What are the events of today that flipped your mind?

[Magister Ludi]

KKB, tell me if this makes sense to you (Or tell me why I am scum completely spinning nonsence)

Actually, with Idher as vig and no shot coming last night, I'm going to assume that the mafia have a rolecop in their possesion. A hidden three man mason group is very powerful, and combining that with a vig would about balance out a rolecop and a booker. There is clearly no cop, so there probably is no tailor.

Continuing, the mafia probably rolecop Idher as vig some point during the game, which is how they knew she was a vig (obviously), but also why they didn't kill her last night, I am going to speculate she is in fact a one shot vigilante. So with two people of known quantities being called town, they killed the person with the more accurate reads.

At the end of day yesterday, Idher was set on me, LLD/saporo being scum, and Yosarian was on Mr. Zepher and I think that may be it.
Thus, the killed Yosarian, but also why no one else picked up on suspecting Idher with me, they knew for sure that when she claimed Vig everyone suspecting her would be seen as scum.

hmmmm...

[Magister Ludi]

Reads currently.

Idher (town)
Kunk (town)
SpyreX (town, based on diffusing mastin me as town v. town)
LLD (town. The wagon on her wasn't very good. I could go into it more because I don't want her wagoned up)
KKB (I have a definite read here, and it is town. He and oversoul were a tossup for the last scum spot.)
Mastin2 (scum.)
Mr.Zepher (scum)
Oversoul (scum. Well, I originally had him as town, but assuming four scum, this guy is the only one left.)

If we're going for scum roles, I'll hit Mr.Zepher as the rolecop and oversoul as the bookie, not that it matters.

[kanyeknowsbest]

KKB, tell me if this makes sense to you (Or tell me why I am scum completely spinning nonsence)

Actually, with Idher as vig and no shot coming last night, I'm going to assume that the mafia have a rolecop in their possesion. A hidden three man mason group is very powerful, and combining that with a vig would about balance out a rolecop and a booker. There is clearly no cop, so there probably is no tailor.

Continuing, the mafia probably rolecop Idher as vig some point during the game, which is how they knew she was a vig (obviously), but also why they didn't kill her last night, I am going to speculate she is in fact a one shot vigilante. So with two people of known quantities being called town, they killed the person with the more accurate reads.

At the end of day yesterday, Idher was set on me, LLD/saporo being scum, and Yosarian was on Mr. Zepher and I think that may be it.
Thus, the killed Yosarian, but also why no one else picked up on suspecting Idher with me, they knew for sure that when she claimed Vig everyone suspecting her would be seen as scum.

hmmmm...

this is something i didnt consider.

unvote

i admit that there is the possibility that you are town and mastin in scum, so what might actually be a better choice is this:

i also believe kunkstars claim. further, i went into today thinking one of kunkstar and zepher is scum. there is no reason to force ourselves down the mastin gambit road.

vote misterzepher

[SpyreX]

One sec:

Why was it obvious Idher was the vig? (I actually thought it was you KKB until you claimed).

If I remember correctly Idher was the one that said Hiraki was a terrible vig shot out the gates.

If it weren't for her being the last one there's no way I'd have bought that being vig.

[kanyeknowsbest]

One sec:

Why was it obvious Idher was the vig? (I actually thought it was you KKB until you claimed).

If I remember correctly Idher was the one that said Hiraki was a terrible vig shot out the gates.

If it weren't for her being the last one there's no way I'd have bought that being vig.

idher was as adamant about hiraki scum as i was on d1. d2 i pulled back from hirakiscum while she remained strong on him and there is no way i would have let empking lynch go through if i had a bullet in the chamber for him. the fact that it was obvious (to me) that she was vig was why i was trying to get the two of you to stop arguing about vigs yesterday.

[kanyeknowsbest]

spyrex, what are you thoughts on zepher.

[MrZepher]

Don't see anything resembling a question I feel I need to answer at this place and time.
If you want to wagon me and then argue about whether or not Mastin can be scum independently of my flip then by all means, go ahead.

PREDIT:
With a treestump in the setup, I'd see it as more likely to have a 2-shot bookie, 2 goons and a mafia traitor on the scum side; 3 masons, a 2-shot vig and a stump and however many VTs make up the rest of the count. 3-shot bookie if there's no traitor.
I don't see how with with the the currently claimed roles you can derive that there's a rolecop. Wouldn't balance well IMO unless there was another town PR.
Tailor wouldn't exist unless there's a cop, and I have yet to find a reason to believe that there's a cop in this game.

That all being said, I don't understand why you assume that there IS a rolecop, yet none of the nightkills have flipped a PR, or some other telling reason to think that there is a PR. I'd like to know more on why you think there is one.
At the same time, I'm speculating setup which I will avoid basing an argument off of.

PREDIT PREDIT:
@SpyreX
Maybe that's what Idher wanted scum to think >.>

Remember, Vig isn't a role one of the heads isn't familiar with....

[kanyeknowsbest]

actually, spyrex, who do you think is scum at this point?

[MrZepher]

Also, voting off the Mastin gambit is probably muy bueno.
Ludi is still likely scum though.

[SpyreX]

But if you're a one shot vig and that wagon looks obviously bookied why not claim and shoot?

If you're more than one shot why hold until claimtime? Two shot and I'll kind of understand but thats about it.

-----

Unless I'm wrong somewhere Zeph is pretty much scum by PoE. The thing is we need to get this under wraps if it goes that way because if I'm not wrong that means kunk was ballsy mcscum with a stump claim.

The only thing is I still think LLD-scum makes sense from yesterday so I'm gonna need ludi to eludicate. Especially with oversoul NOT being a scum mastermind and probably town.

[kanyeknowsbest]

yeah, oversoul is definitely town.

[SpyreX]

So here's how it sits:

Idher: Town as per vig
Kunk: Ballsy scum probably via PoE
Ludi: Town
LLD: Scum per yesterday and PoE
KKB: Town
Mastin2: Town as per Ythan
Mr.Zepher: Scum per PoE
Oversoul: Town via being town.

-----

So if I'm NOT wrong scum is Kunk, LLD, Zepher. If I had to order those it'd be LLD Zeph/Kunk - I need to really think about balance with 3 masons + stump + vig versus even a bookie.

If I'm wrong somewhere it'd be mastin by a margin. Especially with the one shot bookie = one shot vig argument when that if kunk is town is so redonk I dont even know.

[kanyeknowsbest]

spy, do you think that empking stacked all his scum buddies into the middle of his reads? (see: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 8#p3299028)

[mastin2]

...The heck happened here? I was gone for only a couple hours working on a wall, and then there's a new page to read? :/

/Reading.

[Îdher]

Let me clear a coupole of things up.

I am not one shot. How many shots am I? You don't get to know that.

We also definitely have a rolecop in this set-up. Reck screwed up Empking's flip twice, once as bookie, and once as rolecop. It's not rocket science.

We can also infer that therefore, I was rolecopped at the earliest last night. It is a possibility that this happened for the reasons KKB noted.

Ludi is fucking wifoming me with his one-shot bullshit.

Suspecting oversoul is claiming scum as far as I am concerned.

Also yesterday does not make LLD town holy shit what are you smoking.

Zephyr... I'm starting to doubt my town read on him, but it still remains.

I don't see kunk claiming treestump as a fakeclaim. I've been scum with him and he claimed VT with an obv track result, so I just don't see him going to treestump with no pressure at all. Plus LLD is scum and he's voting for her.

LLD being the lynch is okay, if we decide to go that direction. 100% she was not bookied, at the very least.

I'm going to re-read some things.

-Amrun

[Îdher]

Quilford/Empking's ISO actually looks quite bad for Zephyr, LLD, SpyreX, and Ludi. Quilford seemed overly concerned about how people perceived Swag, and once, Mask; both of them largely ignored all of the listed slots besides that.

Kunkstar definitely town. I hate that Chair was lynched; he was so painfully town. But I wasn't around to prevent that lynch. :/

-Amrun

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Quilford/Empking's ISO actually looks quite bad for Zephyr, LLD, SpyreX, and Ludi. Quilford seemed overly concerned about how people perceived Swag, and once, Mask; both of them largely ignored all of the listed slots besides that.

Kunkstar definitely town. I hate that Chair was lynched; he was so painfully town.

But I wasn't around to prevent that lynch

. :/

-Amrun

This is frustrating. FRUSTRATING.

I WAS SHOUTING THAT CHAIR WAS TOWN AT THE TOP OF MY FUCKING LUNGS YESTERDAY.

I WAS BASICALLY ASKING FOR ANY LYNCH OUTSIDE OF CHAIR AND MYSELF, AS BOTH THOSE WAGONS WERE TOWN.

When I replaced in, we got 72 EXTRA HOURS, giving us 4 DAYS to get a new wagon going.

4. DAYS.

And no one listened to me, and I was forced to hammer Chair based upon getting a lynch being better than no lynch.

And then YOU waltz in here with your POMPOUS SUPERIOR ATTITUDE. AND JUST, JUST, JUST..... AHSAJKDHLFSHGALFHGLGLJFSAH:KFHG

GOD FUCKING DAMMIT AMRUN. GOD. FUCKIGN. DAMMIT.

[Îdher]

You're not town and I wanted you lynched.

Ether was around; did not have a strong enough read on Chair to fight as I would have.

I hydraed in this game for a reason; we are both short on time but wanted to play.

No apologies.

Especially when you're sitting on the laurels of your craptastic Oversoul vote. Jesus Christ.

-Amrun

[Lady Lambdadelta]

You're not town and I wanted you lynched.

Ether was around; did not have a strong enough read on Chair to fight as I would have.

I hydraed in this game for a reason; we are both short on time but wanted to play.

No apologies.

Especially when you're sitting on the laurels of your craptastic Oversoul vote. Jesus Christ.

-Amrun

How about, next time you call my votes shit

YOU EXPLAIN THE FUCK WHY HE'S TOWN.

OR MAYBE EXPLAIN WHY I'M SCUM.

EXPLAIN SOMETHING.

JUST DON'T BE A USELESS.... AHH. MUST. NOT. INSULT. ;_;

[kunkstar7]

@Mastin: If only one of myself and LLD can be scum, and you seem to believe my treestump claim, are you finally willing to act on your suspicion of LLD and get on her wagon?

@Oversoul and Idher, both of you have LLD down as scum. What makes Ludi a better alternative than LLD? If you can't answer that sufficiently, you should be voting LLD.