Newbie 1170: DarthYoshi's Medieval Mafia! (Fin--Who won?!)

[Velazanth]

I'm really sorry about the triple post, but Fakinha: What makes you think Lyingbrian is town? I'm nowhere near as convinced as you are.

Also, what does voting for Shinki before have to do with anything? Why are you defending your lack of vote for Shinki with the reason that you don't want to end the day when you don't even really suspect her? (She's not in your top 3, so why would you vote for her in any case?)

No 100% sure about hit but so what? Can't I think someone is confirmed town? Sorgster was 100% on my eyes before he died, for exemple.

Stupid questions, not worthy response. Do an ISO of me or whatever.

Both you and Shinki have played the entire game with this retaliatory logic. Your vote for me only enforces what I already believe. If Shinki flips scum I think we know who to hunt next.

HoS: Fakinha

[Fakinha]

Are you guys serious? Sorgster was obv town. And for me, Cjdrum (now Kirbyoshi) was pretty much townie too. He is still low on my suspect list, but none here is confirmed town on my eyes like Sorgster was.
But I didn't thought Sorgster would die, I thought LyingBrian would be the dead one, since he is the IC.
And It's not because I disagreed with some of Sorgster's posts that I wouldn't think he was town.

LyingBrian is doing his scum hunt and I get a town vibe for him, sometimes I don't agree with him but I don't have anything on him YET.

UNVOTE: Velazanth
He won't get lynched anyway.

PEdit: Calm down, scum boy, we will get you.

[Kirbyoshi]

Asking questions is pro-town. Suppressing them is scummy. So is actively refusing to answer them. Shinki=scum. Lynch her.

Also, Fakinha, I love how you call Vela "scum boy," assumedly simply because he disagrees with you. Smooth. Very smooth.

[LyingBrian]

Shinki: When I ask questions it is often not for scumhunting. A lot of the time it is so that I can get someone's thoughts on something or get them to explain something which was not clear when they posted.

As for my hesitation to vote, big deal! Wow, I'm just soooooo scummy because I said I would have voted for duckhunter if he wasn't at L-2. It's almost as if LB has assumed that I'm scum and is explaining my actions considering that I'm scum. The tiny problem with this is that I'm town, but of course, when I challenge his "reasons" for my actions, it's not anything he didn't expect. Obviously I'm lying because I'm already scum, right?

the bolded portion stuck out to me.
@DeasVail, how do you scumhunt, then?

i also think your manipulating sequence of events in the above post a little. it was your hesitation to vote that set off a red flag, and upon deeper analysis i found a common thread of seeming like you were trying a bit too hard to get town approval for your vote. i didn't make the case that you were scummy, then go back to old information to reinforce the case (explaining your actions under the assumption you're scum). i used all of the information at once to build the case that you are scum, and now i'm using this manipulation of how i built the case as reinforcement of the point.

good scum don't often make huge mistakes to paint a target on their back, sometimes it's a small misstep.

Are you guys serious? Sorgster was obv town. And for me, Cjdrum (now Kirbyoshi) was pretty much townie too. He is still low on my suspect list, but none here is confirmed town on my eyes like Sorgster was.

you have yet to reveal to us what sorgster said that made him an angel in your eyes. i went back and reviewed his posts, and didn't see anything that was extremely towniesh. in fact his hammer of duckhunter was extremely scummy (as i've said multiple times before)

Asking questions is pro-town. Suppressing them is scummy. So is actively refusing to answer them. Shinki=scum. Lynch her.

Also, Fakinha, I love how you call Vela "scum boy," assumedly simply because he disagrees with you. Smooth. Very smooth.

really? after over 3 days of inactivity, you come back to the game w/ a 2 line post? lurk much? what are your thoughts on the developments since your last post?

FOS: Kirbyoshi

[DarthYoshi]

Prodding DaLetterEl.

[DeasVail]

LyingBrian: I do scumhunt by asking questions and by considering the posts people make and the possible motivations behind them. My point was that when I ask a question, I'm not necessarily trying to figure out if the one I question is scum. A lot of the time it is because I want people to share their thoughts for discussion or explain something which was not clear in their post.

The nature of your case was generally: DeasVail did this because of (insert scum motivation), and did this because of (insert scum motivation), assuming that I'm scum without considering the actual reasons why I hesitated in voting duckhunter. You had a decent point, but I'm amazed that it's what makes me the most suspicious to you at this stage and that people won't answer my questions because they're also assuming I'm scum. And I realise now that there's nothing I can do to fix this because people hardly change what they think over the course of the game (e.g. fakinha's town reads) It is your inclusion of irrelevant points such as me mentioning my suspicion of Fakinha and wanting duckhunter to clarify what he thought of his sheeping that make me think you may have been more concerned with how convincing your case was (including as many points as possible) than whether I'm actually scum or not, a reason why I suspect you.

[LyingBrian]

LyingBrian: I do scumhunt by asking questions and by considering the posts people make and the possible motivations behind them. My point was that when I ask a question, I'm not necessarily trying to figure out if the one I question is scum. A lot of the time it is because I want people to share their thoughts for discussion or explain something which was not clear in their post.

The nature of your case was generally: DeasVail did this because of (insert scum motivation), and did this because of (insert scum motivation), assuming that I'm scum without considering the actual reasons why I hesitated in voting duckhunter. You had a decent point, but I'm amazed that it's what makes me the most suspicious to you at this stage and that people won't answer my questions because they're also assuming I'm scum. And I realise now that there's nothing I can do to fix this because people hardly change what they think over the course of the game (e.g. fakinha's town reads) It is your inclusion of irrelevant points such as me mentioning my suspicion of Fakinha and wanting duckhunter to clarify what he thought of his sheeping that make me think you may have been more concerned with how convincing your case was (including as many points as possible) than whether I'm actually scum or not, a reason why I suspect you.

at first your response to my pressuring you seemed like you were squirming for a defense, but this reply is well thought out and logical. your motivation for hesitating will never be truly known until after the game is finished, and i'm still not happy w/ how you approached the vote. i'm not satisfied that your vote wasn't scummy, but i am going to focus my attention elsewhere. closing question for you, DV. who is most likely to be Shinki's partner?

unvote

vote: Kirbyoshi

his performance on Day 2 so far has been less than extraordinary, and i really don't like how he showed up after 3 days of absence w/ a small post that didn't really contribute to the game. also, his vote on Shinki seems more opportunistic than actual scumhunting.

[DeasVail]

If Shinki was lynched right now and revealed scum, I would look at:

-you because it seems like you may be diverting attention away from Shinki

-kirbyoshi because I find the certainty with which Shinki was insisting that kirby is scum suspicious

-Fakinha because he has always made it clear how he suspected Shinki, but was never willing to attempt to lynch her.

All in addition to other things I find suspicious about them.

I'd probably decide on who is most likely and find interesting interactions if I had a good re-read, but I don't want to do that yet.

[DarthYoshi]

Day Two, Vote Count the Sixth

DeasVail (1): DaLetterEl
Shinki (3): Kirbyoshi, DeasVail, Velzanath
Kirbyoshi (2): Shinki, LyingBrian
Not Voting (1): Fakinha

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch and 4 to no-lynch.

The deadline is currently set for 8:00 pm Pacific Standard Time on Tuesday, November 8.

DLE has picked up his prod and remains in the game.

As ever, any questions or concerns, please let me know.

[DaLetterEl]

Sorry for you needing to prod me, Yoshi =/

Will re-read and post something substantive tomorrow right after classes get out.

Not much has changed in my reads from the bit that I have read,

and Velazanth is instatown for saying 420 ftw.

[Kirbyoshi]

Brian: My tendency is simply to not post huge walls. Is that scummy?

[Fakinha]

Asking questions is pro-town. Suppressing them is scummy. So is actively refusing to answer them. Shinki=scum. Lynch her.

Also, Fakinha, I love how you call Vela "scum boy," assumedly simply because he disagrees with you. Smooth. Very smooth.

Seriously, no one read my posts to see who am I suspecting? ;/

[Shinki]

1st - concerning questions from you to me in D1, are you referring to post 183? If so, i fail to see how that's relevant to the current discussion.
2nd - i'm glad to hear that you realize there is no case against Kirbyoshi right now. if all you have is your gut, then why are you pushing so hard for us to lynch him? do you expect us to trust you w/o a cop claim that he is scum based on your gut?
3rd - i can't say that the case against you is totally unfounded. if you are claiming someone is scum w/o something besides your gut to back it up, how would you expect us to react?
4th - concerning the second quote i've listed: you've CLAIMED townie, doesn't mean you are. this is another WIFOM argument. what is the difference between scum that is unhelpful to the discussion, and a townie that is unhelpful to the discussion? the answer is: not much. the reason lurking is so scummy is b/c the more a person talks, the more you get to examine, analyze and determine if that person is town or scum. the same is true w/ being helpful to the discussion. if you are not contributing positively to the discussion, i have to assume you are scum, b/c a townie would want to contribute regardless of whether or not they get lynched b/c that discussion will help lynch scum the next day. that's why i added the phrase "on principle" to the end of my statement.
5th - i'm curious WHY you think i'm scum? is it b/c i'm pressuring you, or is it another gut feeling?

1 - That's not relevant to the discussion, but I still would like to know. It's not about this game, it's general stuff.
2 - Of course not. But trying doesn't hurt, and you'll like when he flips scum. :3
3 - Not like DeasVail reacted at least.
4 - So, do you think I'm townie or scum?
5 - I don't think you're scum, I think you're scummy. By "scumlist" I should've said scummy list, but nevermind this one

Asking questions is pro-town. Suppressing them is scummy. So is actively refusing to answer them. Shinki=scum. Lynch her.

Haha, oh wow.
By the way, why are you voting me again, Kirbyoshi?

hmm, found this interesting:

And I already said that. I don't have a solid, concise and explendid case against Kirbyoshi, it's mostly gut.

can you point me to WHERE you said this, Shinki? b/c i just ran all posts from you, and i don't see that mentioned anywhere, but maybe i'm overlooking it.

Here

It's cool how you ignore my questions about the game being the IC.
But whatever, I'm a VT and that's all, and

[irony]SURE I'll give you you an awesome, solid and concise case, as the experienced player I am.[/irony]

[DeasVail]

Shinki, I don't really remember reacting much to you saying kirby is scum and it's definitely not the main reason why I think you're scum. Why did you mention my name?

[Shinki]

LyingBrian.

DeasVail questions are really something a townie would do?
'cause you know, I'm a townie, but whatever I say I'm being questioned about. His questions are different from yours. Yours I see that there is a point that you're trying to clarify or achieve, but DV questions are just unnecessary and pointless in my point of view, that get us nowhere. Almost ANYTHING I say he proceeds with a questionary. Do I really have to ask so much useless questions to a "suspect" ('suspect' I mean because I got three votes, even if I don't really know why) to be townie? Or he's doing that to LOOK LIKE a townie? Really, I'm a townie and I'm almost being lynched, but I don't feel the need to go around asking question like that and deflecting on others that I didn't suspected beforehand to confirm my alignment. To be honest, I don't even know exactly how to confirm my alignment, but I do see that DV is doing it wrong.
I want to contribute, but asking this kind of questions is the only way?

Hey, Deas.
What are you trying to achieve doing that?
And your answer is: Just because, what's the problem? Does it really matter?

-

IMO, Kirbyoshi and DeasVail are most likely to be scum and that's it. I really believe both of them are scum, but if only one of them is, LyingBrian may be the other, being the IC and experienced as player and deceiving all the newbies like us. But that only a remote chance about LB.

[Velazanth]

Not much has changed in my reads from the bit that I have read,

and Velazanth is instatown for saying 420 ftw.

Take a solid look at Shinki. I'm pushing for a lynch.

PEdit: Calm down, scum boy, we will get you.

If I'm NK, for the love of Christ, remember this post.

[DeasVail]

My problem is with you answering LB's question with the "not like DeasVail reacted at least", accusing me of reacting in some sort of unexpected way. I had no idea what you were talking about, and I wanted to know, so I asked you.

[LyingBrian]

If Shinki was lynched right now and revealed scum, I would look at:
-you because it seems like you may be diverting attention away from Shinki
-kirbyoshi because I find the certainty with which Shinki was insisting that kirby is scum suspicious
-Fakinha because he has always made it clear how he suspected Shinki, but was never willing to attempt to lynch her.
All in addition to other things I find suspicious about them.

here's what i don't like about this post DeasVail, and this seems to be a common thread in your posts. you are manipulating information. i am not diverting attention away from Shinki. there is a clear difference between diverting and ignoring. i'm ignoring the bandwagon on Shinki, 1)b/c i really don't think she's scum. 2)i find the case against her weak.
i do however find her bulldog attitude that Kirbyoshi is scum to be suspicious, but i get the feeling she's just being stubborn.

Brian: My tendency is simply to not post huge walls. Is that scummy?

posting/not posting huge walls of text is not the issue here. the issue is that it has been 3 days since you posted, and you have failed to contribute more than 2 lines. do you honestly not have anything to say about either case? if you are not scumhunting, i'm guessing it's b/c you already found them (yourself). if Shinki is scum, who is her partner?

1 - That's not relevant to the discussion, but I still would like to know. It's not about this game, it's general stuff.
2 - Of course not. But trying doesn't hurt, and you'll like when he flips scum. :3
3 - Not like DeasVail reacted at least.
4 - So, do you think I'm townie or scum?
5 - I don't think you're scum, I think you're scummy. By "scumlist" I should've said scummy list, but nevermind this one

1. remind me at the end of the game, and i'll answer them.
2. *sigh* repeating it over and over doesn't make it true. move on, or be lynched
4. honestly, i think you're a townie who's playing poorly.

[LyingBrian]

Here

It's cool how you ignore my questions about the game being the IC.
But whatever, I'm a VT and that's all, and

[irony]SURE I'll give you you an awesome, solid and concise case, as the experienced player I am.[/irony]

i see where you say that you don't have a solid case against him, but where do you say it's a gut vote?

LyingBrian.

DeasVail questions are really something a townie would do?
'cause you know, I'm a townie, but whatever I say I'm being questioned about. His questions are different from yours. Yours I see that there is a point that you're trying to clarify or achieve, but DV questions are just unnecessary and pointless in my point of view, that get us nowhere.

Almost ANYTHING I say he proceeds with a questionary.

Do I really have to ask so much useless questions to a "suspect" ('suspect' I mean because I got three votes, even if I don't really know why) to be townie?

Or he's doing that to LOOK LIKE a townie? Really, I'm a townie and I'm almost being lynched, but I don't feel the need to go around asking question like that and deflecting on others that I didn't suspected beforehand to confirm my alignment. To be honest, I don't even know exactly how to confirm my alignment, but I do see that DV is doing it wrong.
I want to contribute, but asking this kind of questions is the only way?

was this directed at me? sometimes it's really hard to read your posts, Shinki. the bolded sentences are ones that i didn't understand

LyingBrian may be the other, being the IC and experienced as player and deceiving all the newbies like us. But that only a remote chance about LB.

the argument that i'm mafia b/c i'm the IC is WIFOM. just sayin'.

[DeasVail]

LyingBrian: Although my post could have been worded better, I don't think I've been manipulating anything. I'm only saying that you may be diverting attention from Shinki by focusing on other players. By ignoring Shinki and suspecting Kirby you could be scum trying to prevent Shinki's lynch if she is your scum partner by convincing us that she is not the most likely to be scum.

I am by no means certain that you are diverting attention from Shinki and I think my post conveyed this.

[Kirbyoshi]

Brian: Posting one-liners is null, and is more likely to be a sign of a busy RL than a person's role. If Shinki is scum, Fakinha is her partner. It seems like they're using the fact that they know each other to subtly communicate in-thread. As far as reactions to cases, I don't see any cohesive cases on anyone really. I see some passing unwarranted suspicion of Vela. Vela is playing pro-town, and there's no reason to suspect him. DV has been rising on my scumdar recently. I believe I said before that I think he's buddying me, and I haven't decided yet whether it's newbtown buddying the SE or scum buddying town.

Oh also, +more scumpoints to Shinki for trying to cast suspicion on the IC simply on the basis of being the IC. Brian has no more pure chance of being scum than anyone else in this game.

[Kirbyoshi]

Shinki played around 7 mafias or more.
One being mafia godfather, one being SK, 2 being doc and one being gunsmith. The others I don't know what he is since he's still playing or got replaced out and I dunno what he is. (Mostly of these mafias were on a BR forum)

So, um... you're not inexperienced, Shinki.
I'm starting to think that you're not being scum, just the worst and most despondent town play I've ever seen from you.

Hint for Fakinha: faking n00biness is scummy. I know you complained about how no one was reading your posts to see who you found scummy, but this is the closest thing I found. I know you don't want to end the day early, but is there anything else keeping you from voting for Shinki?

[DeasVail]

I agree with Shinki's point about LyingBrian being the IC and being able to manipulate and deceive everyone if he is scum.

Kirby: I believe I asked before, how have I been buddying you? And how am I rising on your scumdar exactly? It seems to me like you could be scum and regretting defending me earlier now that it looks like I might not be lynched today because your increasing suspicion of me sounds really fake.

[Shinki]

was this directed at me? sometimes it's really hard to read your posts, Shinki. the bolded sentences are ones that i didn't understand

Yep, I want to know your opinion about DV play style in this day, if it's townie or scummy.

Almost ANYTHING I say he proceeds with a questionary. Do I really have to ask so much useless questions to a "suspect" ('suspect' I mean because I got three votes, even if I don't really know why) to be townie? Or he's doing that to LOOK LIKE a townie?

Basically, DV's questionary after every one of my posts is a townie or a scum-trying-to-look-like-townie thing to do?

honestly, i think you're a townie who's playing poorly.

You're right.
So, how can I improve?

[Shinki]

Oh, and

i see where you say that you don't have a solid case against him, but where do you say it's a gut vote?

I didn't said anything about gut-vote before, only about the concise, solic, etc.

And I already said that. I don't have a solid, concise and explendid case against Kirbyoshi, it's mostly gut.

I know that here I said as if it were the whole sentence, but it's not, sorry if I wasn't clear.