Open 432: Robo's PYP (Game Over)

[BK201]

Nvm I mis-read that...thought you said Nat never elaborated on Monty again. You pointed out 341.

Goodnight lol.

[Purrfect Panda]

However I DO want to hear more from DV

looking at Monty's then DV's ISOs it seems very plausible it was a bus much more likely than with the Noraa/Brandi slot.

[DeasVail]

Hi

[DeasVail]

There's not much I can say about the suspicion on me. I think the reasoning behind it is fairly good, but I did have Nat as a weak scumread since I replaced in, just with others that seemed more scummy. When it looked like neither of my preferred lynches were an option, I joined the wagon.

Starbuck:

What were your thoughts on other players toward the end of Day 1?

Reckoner:

What do you think of your predecessor?

~~

Right now, I'm really thinking Sawyer is scum because of his lack of comment on the Natalie wagon at all, as well as my reasons Day 1 and a lack of towntells. I expect town to always try to work out what they think of someone who is being wagoned, and Sawyer just says nothing about it. Not "I think it's a decent lynch, but I think we should lynch Brandi instead. Here's why..." which would be what I would most expect from his lack of vote and weak scum read of Natalie earlier. If he had a more opposing stance, that's even more reason to expect comment and even persuasion from him.

His behaviour matches with scum not wanting to strongly oppose the wagon (by telling people to vote Brandi and/or providing reasons why) and not wanting to hop onto the wagon either. What I think is his care to not oppose the wagon is, in my opinion, demonstrated by him telling BK to hop "on the Brandi wagon or the Natalie wagon that formed out of nowhere" without saying that he thinks BK is a better lynch. Another is where he tells everybody to vote Panda, Nat, or Brandi, as they are the only ones possibly getting lynched. Again, more like a neutral facilitator than someone with an actual opinion.

Overall, I just think it completely natural that town-Sawyer would say something of his thoughts on Nat after her wagon and thoughts on her lynch, or attempts to decide which lynch he likes better, but I feel that anything like this is unnaturally absent.

At some point I need to go over the Nat/Sawyer interactions again and maybe even his ISO, but for now:

VOTE: Sawyer

[Brandi]

I support the above.

vote: sawyer

[Sawyer]

I was gonna break down DV's case with responses, but it's all based off one thing summed up best:

Overall, I just think it completely natural that town-Sawyer would say something of his thoughts on Nat after her wagon and thoughts on her lynch, or attempts to decide which lynch he likes better, but I feel that anything like this is unnaturally absent.

You continually pointed out how I never made clear which lynch I liked more and that I didn't try to sway people off the Nat wagon.

First off, take a look at where my vote was. That should've made it pretty clear which wagon I was in support of the most. Secondly, I'm not gonna try to sway people into any one wagon with deadline so close. And I'm not gonna express my disinterest in any wagon to such a huge extent because it won't do anything. Your vote is based off your interpretation of their play, not my interpretation of their play.

--

Otherwise, BK is still alive and with a Vig out there. Maybe scum is that risky in choosing both of those roles and by letting one of them live in hope of getting him lynch. But should all that go wrong, it would fuck them up bad, so I'm gonna guess they're not that big of risk takers.

VOTE: BK

[Shamrock]

I am sympathetic to what DV has to say about Sawyer up above. However, Panda is still so painfully obvscum that it hurts. I could go for either lynch but would prefer Panda.

VOTE: Purrfect Panda

More later when I have more time.

[xRECKONERx]

@DV: I haven't read. Starbuck told me I should replace in so I did, but I never reread games where I replace in after 10 pages.

[absta101]

Quick reply:

Things of interest:
- BK surviving.
- The Vig not killing Panda.
- Slandaar dying.
- etc.

Sorry gotta run.

[xRECKONERx]

INSIGHTFUL

[BK201]

Otherwise, BK is still alive and with a Vig out there. Maybe scum is that risky in choosing both of those roles and by letting one of them live in hope of getting him lynch. But should all that go wrong, it would fuck them up bad, so I'm gonna guess they're not that big of risk takers.

VOTE: BK

Do you have anything besides 'BK claimed JK and is alive'? Don't use this as an excuse to not scumhunt.

[Purrfect Panda]

I am sympathetic to what DV has to say about Sawyer up above. However, Panda is still so painfully obvscum that it hurts. I could go for either lynch but would prefer Panda.

VOTE: Purrfect Panda

More later when I have more time.

Let me know if you actually come up with a case this is so NOT a case

" They are scum because they are so painfully obvscum"??? WTF is that?

oh yeah it is called circular logic... not a case.... not actual scum hunting...

[BK201]

And Slandaar's plan is pretty foolproof. Why would you still want Elmo to be lynched after looking at it? Unless you can find a major flaw in it, I don't see the town motivation in you wanting Panda dead.

Panda is town. I don't think Nat is some genius scum who said this knowing she would die Day 1.

[BK201]

^ In other words, she was encouraging the Vig to shoot Panda. (Probably glad she didn't have to worry about it being on her or a buddy)

[DeasVail]

But Elmo's "slip", WHICH WAS NOT A SLIP AT ALL AND YOU ARE AN IDIOT IF YOU ACTUALLY THOUGHT IT WAS, is the most illuminating piece of information in this game. Post 330 is the truth except for obvtown on BK. When I went V/LA, I just copied and pasted a message into the thread without reading it. I doubt BK read that and didn't say anything about it. And if he did, that's more likely to come from scum who doesn't want to react the wrong way.

Brandi's and Starbuck's reactions scream scum. Starbuck is reluctant to join the wagon, which is extremely scummy. IF YOU THOUGHT IT WAS A SLIP, YOU WOULDN'T WAIT AND LET THEM EXPLAIN THEMSELVES. It actually looks like Starbuck might be waiting for her scum partner to come and save himself.

This seems to support Panda-town to me, as I think taking such an aggressive against-the-norm opinion about a scumbuddy is unlikely.

[Shamrock]

zzzz

requoting this for reck's benefit:

dude I've been on Panda literally almost since the beginning of the day, but okay, let me go through their iso again

quick summary:

• they show no interest in scumhunting, at all (read their ISO, seriously)
  
• they refuse to give any kind of analysis whatsoever when asked repeatedly and directly - if they acknowledge these requests at all they just make excuses (see below, I'm going to put it in a separate post right after this one because it's a long list of quotes)
  
• the few questions they bother to ask other people are complete bullshit
  
• they make blatant OMGUS votes/accusations with no reasoning at all (232, 330)
  
• set themselves up to vote the claimed jailkeeper, as I said above (seriously, what protown motivation is there to lynch a claimed JK in this setup?)

[Shamrock]

DV why have you reversed positions on Panda?

[xRECKONERx]

Starbuck is reluctant to join the wagon, which is extremely scummy.

oh my god yusssss Starbuck is conftown this game and we get to dance and laugh and sing our way to victory

PS Starbuck I'm still sorry about the last WoW Mafia game

Shamrock, does the scumflip from D1 affect your read on Panda at all?

[Brandi]

Oh forgot to say, Hi Reck.
Good to have you here.
This game was literally falling apart and it's nice to see another familiar face since I replaced in. (I mean 8 replacements holy crap :/)

[DeasVail]

DV why have you reversed positions on Panda?

Because of Natalie's play. I'm not completely sold on it, but I'm not that interested in lynching them now.

[Code_X]

I am considering sheeping Slandaar ... there's plenty of WIFOM over his kill but either way he was pretty hard core on Absta.

Unvote

[Brandi]

Who is to say who the vig killed and who scum killed?
IMO the Vig could have just as easily killed Slandaar.

[DeasVail]

I am considering sheeping Slandaar ... there's plenty of WIFOM over his kill but either way he was pretty hard core on Absta.

Unvote

Why the unvote?

[Code_X]

Because .. I like your recent input and think I'm possibly barking up the wrong tree.

[Shamrock]

Because of Natalie's play. I'm not completely sold on it, but I'm not that interested in lynching them now.

Can you be more specific? I looked through both their and Natalie's iso after the lynch but didn't really see anything pushing me further towards or away from the Panda lynch. I don't see how it's particularly unlikely that they're partners.