NY 160B - Welcome to Castle Zar - TIME FOR FIREWORKS!


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Post Post #900 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:22 am

Post by SnowStorm »

In post 886, Tammy wrote:
In post 841, SnowStorm wrote:
In post 829, Tammy wrote:
So, the fact that I'm still alive kind of makes me doubt SnowStorm being scum. But I also know we are not at Westeros and I probably wouldn't be first choice for a kill around here. somewhat make me doubt a scum SnowStorm also in conjunction with the he always kills me as scum thing.
I don't like that he didn't follow up with it
and was waiting to see his response, but I *think* as scum he'd not bother with questioning me out of everyone else he could have questioned at the start of day 3. Like, a big part of me feels like if he were scum he'd just not want to deal with me as he'd know I was town and that I might get more focused on him if he were to try to focus on me. Does that make sense?


The follow up to that question could take me some time to write and I didn't have time for it. I also don't think it's urgent or even relevant because of rofl's likely breadcrumb, it's just that it bothered me that you stayed with your vote in KM for pressure rather than move it to Baby, whom you seemed to have a scum-read on.


But why? One rofl might not have investigated me, so dropping it like that seems odd. But why did it bother you that I kept my vote on kingmaker? What bothers me a bit about you is that you asked me that at the beginning of day even thugh you voted kingmaker over anyone else and after it was pointed put by two people that rofl might have investigated me.

I guess what's mostly bothering me is about this is that our of all things you could ask you asked why I voted kingmaker, and then say it bothered you for why I kept it there and don't follow up. I mean meta wise, you would know this isn't a thing. I'm like the worst person to look at votes wise, I spend nearly whole days without ever even voting, so im not sure why you focus on it for me and then not follow up especially since you couldn't know I voted kingmaker for pressure until I said it after you asked, so how could it bother you?

It looks to me like you picked up n something convenient and dropped it because most everyone else decided on a crumb.


I know rofl might not have investigated you, and that's why I asked you the question in the first place; because I had doubts about you and didn't want to let you go unnoticed because of the possibility that rofl investigated you. I "dropped" it because I didn't have time to follow up on it at the time and because I thought my limited time would be better put to use reading people who had higher chances of being scum. I still gave you a resumed version of my thoughts on it, which you just quoted.

I voted Kingmaker because he was my top suspect, that was pretty explicit. But you had voted him and had given no reasons for it. You had commented on how you found it weird that I hadn't said anything about KM's lackluster day 1 play, but when I did post about KM you didn't comment on it. I assumed then that the vote was for pressure, that you didn't have any strong scum tells on him and just wanted to see how he'd react to a vote. Nothing wrong with that. What is wrong is you interacting with Baby and apparently getting a strong scum feeling on her, yet opting to stay with the pressure vote on KM. The time passed and KM only made a brief appearance just to prod dodge, he never reacted to anything. Your vote had been useless and was staying useless, when it could have been used to put pressure on someone who you actually thought to be scum.

Your vote also bothered me because you should know KM isn't a very reactive player and pressuring him with votes doesn't usually work. He's constantly getting lynched and mislynched because the votes pile up on him ad he does nothing about it. I had that in mind when I voted him and the difference between your vote and mine is that I presented arguments which he could have answered to while you only had the vote, which he was more likely to ignore. Also, you know KM is an easy target and a common mislynch victim, the fact that you chose to go after him on day two over anyone else didn't make me feel any better about you.
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Post Post #901 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:31 am

Post by Zar »

The Zars have also been involved in difficult modding decisions, including the Condemnation of Faraday to be burnt in the Stake during the Christmas Festivities 85 years ago.


Day 3, Votecount 4

Zachrulez (4): Ser Arthur Dayne, Konowa, SnowStorm, Nobody Special

SnowStorm (3): Zachrulez, DeasVail, Johhog

Not Voting (2):
Empire, Tammy

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline
: Sunday, January 13th, 2013 10:00 PM New York Time. (GMT-5)
Countdown to deadline
: (expired on 2013-01-13 22:00:00)
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Post Post #902 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 5:50 am

Post by Johhog »

FFS guys, 10 hours. I'll hammer this myself in a couple of hours if nobody else does it.
"Það únga rósarblað vornæturinnar góðu hafði hann selt fyrir korpnaðar skinnbækur. Það var hans líf."
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Post Post #903 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 7:21 am

Post by Tammy »

Snowstorm. Couple things.

Why bother dropping it f you knew it was possible that I wasn't investigated in the first place? I don't care how little time you had, it doesn't make sense to ask me the question in the first place because you found it suspect and thinking I might not have been investigated and then dropping it basically because it was possible I had.

Do you realize how hypocritical you sound? You followed me onto kingmaker, and are now telling me you don't like my vote on kingmaker for a myriad of reasons. Also, didn't you argue against the empire going after ns due to it being an easy mislynch because scum don't need to do that and sometimes the easy vote is actually on scum. You don't get to now use that reason against me after discounting the idea in general.

I really don't care that you gave reasons. Giving a bunch of silly reasons. Doesn't make one vote better than the other, and doesn't mean that it was for pressure. If you look at the end of day one, i said moi, baby and kingmaker needed more attention day two. You know that because I also said I was worrisome that you didn't comment on him, and what do you do at the start of day two? Make him your top suspect. It's pretty convenient to use the he didn't react to your vote and completely ignore that I asked him a question and commented on something to him. He replaced out so of course I didn't get to interact with him. Also, ALSO if you notice I was immediately here interacting with his replacement,

So what's the problem you're having again? And just so your aware the " Also, you know KM is an easy target and a common mislynch victim, the fact that you chose to go after him on day two over anyone else didn't make me feel any better about you." is disingenuous as fuck. Who was that second vote on the kingmaker wagon? Oh that's right. It was you.

I'd also like to point out that you called me town day one, so what is this "feeling better" about me nonsense. You're also essentially using buddying me as a scum tell with zach, which makes no sense whatsoever if you don't think I'm town. You're using meta on kingmaker and a lame argument against me concerning the matter of a vote while disregarding the issue of voting meta for me. When and where I place my vote has never been able to be used with me. You're also convieniently disregarding the interaction I had with dgb, which makes your whole argument really shallow and short sighted.

-----------------------

All right I'm heading out for a bit. I'll be back well before deadline and will hammer then if no one else has. Pretty sure empire said he wanted to post something so at least wait for him to hammer.
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Post Post #904 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 8:44 am

Post by DeasVail »

Has Zach claimed yet?
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Post Post #905 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 8:55 am

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You're right, Tammy. It was wrong of me to doubt my earlier town read on you and I should have kept my paranoia to myself.

No Deas, I don't think he has.
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Post Post #906 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 11:43 am

Post by Empire »

Johhog, you don't have to worry about a No Lynch. I literally don't have anything to do today so I'll be around all the way up to deadline.

Tammy, I may have asked you this before, but can you talk to me a little bit more about Snow's meta (specifically, his scum play)? I feel like a lot of his pushes have had meat to them, not just the Zach, and I don't know about Snow's level of competence as scum so I can't say if he's capable of faking all of that.

DV, approximately how surprised were you that roflcopter flipped a town PR and how competent of a player would you say he is?
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Post Post #907 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 11:55 am

Post by DeasVail »

Not particularly surprised. I'm pretty sure this was my first game with him, and I didn't really think he was a great player to be honest. I don't feel I can really make a proper judgement based on one game though, and his read on MoI could have been correct.
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Post Post #908 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:14 pm

Post by Tammy »

Okay, I'm back. I'll be here until deadline...after I eat dinner.
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Post Post #909 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:54 pm

Post by Tammy »

In post 905, SnowStorm wrote:You're right, Tammy. It was wrong of me to doubt my earlier town read on you and I should have kept my paranoia to myself.


I never said that and you know it. I don't care if you doubt a town read on me, what I care about it determining whether or not it's genuine.
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Post Post #910 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:18 pm

Post by Empire »

In post 908, Tammy wrote:Okay, I'm back. I'll be here until deadline...after I eat dinner.

Yeah, I just got back from dinner so I'm down for whatever.
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Post Post #911 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:29 pm

Post by DeasVail »

I can hammer Zach, but would rather at least see if he can get here and claim. (and I'm around until deadline)
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Post Post #912 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:55 pm

Post by Tammy »

In post 906, Empire wrote:

Tammy, I may have asked you this before, but can you talk to me a little bit more about Snow's meta (specifically, his scum play)? I feel like a lot of his pushes have had meat to them, not just the Zach, and I don't know about Snow's level of competence as scum so I can't say if he's capable of faking all of that.



I'm not really an expert in snowstorms meta. I think I said before that he tends to garner a lot of suspicion and get mislynched a bit. He's not mislynch bait but people tend to find him suspicious, and I've probably read him as scum more than I've read him as town. Once I tried to get him lynched because I thought he was lying about being the town doc when he was run up to claim, and another time I tried to prove he was a traitor after he was night killed (our roles don't flip when we die and sometimes neither do our alignment).

I correctly suspected him his first time as scum because he wasn't scumhunting and was being very noncommittal. The second time was somewhat similar but he started scumhunting, I was tunneled on someone else that game so I don't remember much about his play except I had him on my suspect list. I know the third time I correctly investigated him, mostly because his scumhunting was a bit off and he was disengaged. I just read his iOS from the last game in which he was scum, and he corrected a lot of the issues he had in the first couple games. He is becoming competent as scum. The case against kingmaker he could easily make as scum, not sure about the case on zach. That more reads for the type of case I expect from him as town.

I don't even know if I can really verbalize how I read snowstorm. I can read him best by reading how he interacts with his suspects/reacts to suspicion and progresses over time. I'm not really confident in my read on him either way right now, but right now I think he has a better chance of flipping town than scum.
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Post Post #913 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:57 pm

Post by Empire »

Anything you want to ask me? Otherwise, I'm fine with waiting until about 9:30 PM EST to lay down the hammer (in case Zach comes in and claims).

(Literally missing the Golden Globes for this game.)
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Post Post #914 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:59 pm

Post by DeasVail »

In post 913, Empire wrote:(Literally missing the Golden Globes for this game.)

Don't if you'd rather not. I'm sure with Tammy and I here, we'll make sure a lynch goes through.
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Post Post #915 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:19 pm

Post by Tammy »

Meh. I just read through moi and zach again. I don't feel confident in anything about this game right now.
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Post Post #916 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:23 pm

Post by Tammy »

In post 913, Empire wrote:Anything you want to ask me?


Yeah, can you pick me up from waffleville? I'm tired of my visit.
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Post Post #917 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:24 pm

Post by Empire »

In post 916, Tammy wrote:Yeah, can you pick me up from waffleville? I'm tired of my visit.

I would if I weren't stuck there myself.
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Post Post #918 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:32 pm

Post by Empire »

Ok so, it's 30 minutes til deadline and Zach shows no signs of being here and claiming. Permission to hammer from you guys?
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Post Post #919 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:32 pm

Post by DeasVail »

My townreads on both of you, Johhog and SAD are more confident than they usually are for me in games, and this is generally agreed upon, so I don't think things are as bad as you guys feel they are, especially if the scum end up being in Konowa/Snow/Zach or something.
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Post Post #920 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:32 pm

Post by DeasVail »

And yeah, sure.
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Post Post #921 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:34 pm

Post by Tammy »

Yeah, go for it. I just was reading through babyspice, but I just really don't know. Might as well put an end to the day.
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Post Post #922 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:34 pm

Post by Empire »

Alright...

[]==================
==================[]

Vote: Zach


Please, dear god, let this be a scum flip.
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Post Post #923 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:37 pm

Post by Tammy »

Zar's online so hopefully we'll know soon. *cross fingers*
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Post Post #924 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:42 pm

Post by Zar »

Some decisions from the incumbent Lord Zar, however, have caused uproar. The pizza revolt of 1990 involved an angry mob asking for economic sanctions on Lord Whiskeyjack of Westeros' Olive industry. The Olive-Gate scandal, as it is traditionally referred to, involved an applied embargo on the Mushroom trade based on the use of inside information from the department of modding.


Day 3, End of Day Vote Count

Zachrulez (5): Ser Arthur Dayne, Konowa, SnowStorm, Nobody Special, Empire

SnowStorm (3): Zachrulez, DeasVail, Johhog

Not Voting (1):
Tammy

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline
: Sunday, January 13th, 2013 10:00 PM New York Time. (GMT-5)
Countdown to deadline
: (expired on 2013-01-13 22:00:00)


Zachrulez has been lynched. Scene coming later. I'm watching the Golden Globes. Go do the same.
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Scott Pilgrim Vs. The Mafia, coming soon your way.

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