Open 474 - Friends and Enemies - Game Over!

[Docteur Gudsight]

Wait holy fuck this just completely dawned on me

NicCage rode out the serra wagon based on my push, saying if he flipped scum, Els was scum with him

But since he flipped town (which Nic knew going in), he said Els could be town

Fuck this makes complete and total sense

...I think?

^

An example of making evidence to fit reads. He says Nic is scum, he says i'm scum

then

he suddenly pulls a reason for us to be scum.

[Human Destroyer]

Find scumreads first, make connections later

...why is this scummy?

[Human Destroyer]

VOTE: Nic

Did a Ctrl+F through GM's iso for NicCage and Nic

She expresses a scum read on him all day that's shoddily explained and rarely revisited, but even when Panzer starts the counterwagon on Nic at the end of the day, she states support on it, but

she doesn't join.

It's weirder because...it's her counterwagon? If Nic was town, she'd be jumping ALL OVER his wagon.

P-Edit: I think it was wrong to use against Jacob, yes.

My thinking changed when I realized "Okay, serra flipped town, I'm doing something wrong here."

I don't think Jacob is as scummy as I made him out to be D1.

Nic is scummy independently of you

Well, els' whole flip-around on serra was bullshit, I even pointed out how bullshit it was

The hydra was pushing all of Day 1 for a serra lynch...but when Day 2 comes...defends serra for defending a wagon where GM was supposedly the counterwagon,

when there was also a goddamn counterwagon on Jacob

.

I.E. hydra wants towncred for serra flip

You are scummy independently of Nic

Wait holy fuck this just completely dawned on me

NicCage rode out the serra wagon based on my push, saying if he flipped scum, Els was scum with him

But since he flipped town (which Nic knew going in), he said Els could be town

Fuck this makes complete and total sense

...I think?

Associative tell between the two of you

So...what exactly about this is scum-driven?

[Docteur Gudsight]

After flips, making connections is town yes. Just 2 hours after having declared your scumreads, it's just a cheap and scummy way to overpush a case.

[Human Destroyer]

And you haven't explained how it's scummy; rather you've just stated it is.

Why shouldn't I make connections between my two scumreads to make myself more confident in the reads as well as sell them to everyone else? Why wouldn't it make sense to do that from a town perspective?

I'm calling bullshit here.

[Docteur Gudsight]

Because like with the Jacob "towntell" you realized 1 hour after having voting him, despite having had commented on that post, and had a full night to read isos, the fact you "realize" this fact 1 hour after having posted your scumreads looks incredibly fake and a cheap way to say "oh look i'm posting my thoughts aloud, please sheep me"

[Human Destroyer]

Oh look

I'm posting my thoughts aloud

Please sheep me

[Human Destroyer]

And again,

you haven't explained why town can't do that.

You've just gone "lol it's scummy because it looks fake and cheap"

Except WAIT

I HAVE THOUGHT PROCESSES

OH MY GOD WHAT A CONCEPT

[Human Destroyer]

And I already explained why I didn't read it overnight

So still pushing that is absurd

[Docteur Gudsight]

lol it's scummy because it looks

fake

and cheap

It is fake because the timing is off. Both the Jacob thing and the "omg Doc might have defended serra for towncred" (which is again beautiful a "i won't give townpoints for townacts, because scum can do it too", aka bullshit) are things you could/should have thought before your original votes/scumreads.

[Docteur Gudsight]

And the fact that you "explained" stuff doesn't suddenly make it disappear.

I don't expect scum to say "oh sorry, you caught a scumslip, my bad. I will do better next time".

[Human Destroyer]

Because I'm totally not a ridiculously impulsive player that doesn't check everything 50 times before doing something

And when you flip scum

I'll be happy to be right on your defense of serra was, in fact, a towncred grab

P-Edit: Holy. Fucking. Shit.

Are you kidding me?

Are you seriously comparing a

fucking scumslip

to a reason why I wouldn't read overnight?

I mean, seriously, are you even

trying

to look town anymore?

Because if you are, that is probably the most bullshit fucking case in the world and I'd be literally shocked if you flipped town here.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Docteur Gudsight

[Docteur Gudsight]

+ Faking scumhunting
+ Having pushed only town wagons
+ Faking thought processes
+ Overpushing cases

No, the case is not empty. Let's see how much sheep you get this time, that will listen to your cases based on ... um that i'm attacking you? that i defended serra yesterday on a "bullshit" reasoning?

[Human Destroyer]

1) You haven't proved anything I've actually said is fake, you've just said they're fake
2) SCUMSLIP ALERT: YOU KNOW JENNIFER AND JACOB ARE TOWN, YOU MUST BE SCUM
3) See #1
4) Playstyle

Again, empty case is empty

[Cheery Dog]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: [Human Destroyer

[Docteur Gudsight]

1) You haven't proved anything I've actually said is fake, you've just said they're fake

I'm specifically thinking of

this

here.

2) SCUMSLIP ALERT: YOU KNOW JENNIFER AND JACOB ARE TOWN, YOU MUST BE SCUM

I obviously speak only about those of day1 and day2. You aren't pushing Jacob. I consider Jennifer town yeah.

[Human Destroyer]

I was pushing Jacob for half of D1, where the hell have you been?

[Human Destroyer]

OH LOOK I HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION ON SOMETHING THAN YOU

MUST BE SUPER-FAKE

[Docteur Gudsight]

Indeed, I forgot that between the Jennifer wagon and the Panzer wagon, you went on Jacob. Let's say then that your voting record on day 1 doesn't look exactly good, given you basically voted for three different wagons, but omitting the scum one.

OH LOOK I HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION ON SOMETHING THAN YOU

MUST BE SUPER-FAKE

^ Trying to misrepresent my "this looks fake" as "i disagree with HD", while my "this looks fake" were purely based on timing.

[NicCage]

VOTE: HD

Explain why you think els is scum, and I need reasons that aren't from today alone.

[Human Destroyer]

Um yeah

The whole idea of your thinking my scumhunting is fake there is

"Do you think it's filler?"
"No."
"But it's filler."
"No it isn't."

Yeah not fake

P-Edit: Wow someone hasn't been reading my posts and/or is defending their scumbuddy. How about you take a look?

[NicCage]

Is that all though?

[Human Destroyer]

Their case on me is also pretty shitty

They tried to push a meta argument based on a single scum game yesterday >.>

[NicCage]

I'll admit that the case explicitly presented against you to isn't the greatest, but what you did was weird. It struck me as weird before it was pointed out. I wasn't going to vote you over it, but you blew up and have basically been throwing any small reason at els since. It's looks like OMGUS
Did you have any other reasons than the one you stated for voting me?
Why is this argument enough to tip the scales from me to els?

[NicCage]

I misread your post, yeah I remember that. What I said still stands though, and I still like my questions.