Mini 1427 - Slenderman Mafia - Game Over

[Aj The Epic]

Ah. I had to look that up just now to understand that at all.

Fuzzy, I'd be very disturbed if there was more than two. We'd be in mylo day 2 if we mislynched today.

[fuzzybutternut]

One would think that in a slenderman Mafia, there would only be one. :S

[Aj The Epic]

That would be one hell of a mafia member, they'd have to drain it all they way to a 2v1 situation, making the town mislynch the whole way. That's highly improbably for any scum.

[fuzzybutternut]

I've seen scum do it, and I was a part of the scum team when it happened. Hilarious to watch, by the way.

[Lord Mhork]

but this... [quotes serrapaladin] is an understandable point.

Which is what makes it scummy and a misrep. Scum will twist words because they aren't 100% clear and present an opportunity. Does not fly.
He puts words in your mouth then says "woah dude I was just asking a question." Does not fly.
Now he's trying to engage me in an attempt at defining how he can get away with this nonsense later if he isn't lynched now. Does not fly.

I'm not a serrapaladin fan right now and feel better about my vote with each post.

I very much agree with this

UNVOTE:
VOTE: serrapaladin

I'm just gonna point out that this is bad and y'all should wagon levy with me instead of Serra.

Also I'm pretty sure that there is more than one mafia man, purely based on the idea that mafia's advantage is to be the informed minority, implying a teammate. A 1 on 10 situation just sounds silly.

[leviathan93]

^^^^^ and your reason for it being bad IS?

just because you say something is bad doesn't mean it is. i see no way how it can be bad. I agree with serrapaladin twisting my words.

to me, i switched my vote from someone i had nothing on to someone that did something that i deem as possibly scummy and since i don't have a scum read on anyone else at the moment. serra paladin works for me.

[Mr_Ree]

@Yates, in the Inbetweeners I was in one of two scum teams. I was still very much scumhunting for the other team. I couldn't get a solid read on you all that game. I don't know if that game set a baseline for how I view your play but I get the impression you're more on the ball this time around. Comes across as town. I'm just trying to get some kind of PoE going so I have something to work with tomorrow. 3 strong townreads or one solid scum read is all I need for a jumping off point. find myself uneasy with my reads day 1 in most, if not all my games. Which is where you come in.

I'd like your thoughts on Aj the Epic. I kind of think you guys are barking up the wrong tree with SP and/or Fuzzybuttern,uts so I won't be too offended if you think I'm doing the same.

@AJ, your math is off. If it was 3 Mafia, start with 3/8 after mislynch & NK, it's 3/6, again and it's 3/4, so Mylo would be day 3. Either way, speculation gets us nowhere at this point. Too many variables. There's no freaking way there's only one. I know it was said jokingly but still...

[Yates]

@Yates, in the Inbetweeners I was in one of two scum teams

Ah right. I forgot there were two scum teams in that game. I feel better about your benchmark.

Re: AJ - I've only been in one game with him that I can recall. Aj The Epic was confirmed VT when I replaced in and died that night so I don't have much in terms of meta knowledge on him. I think you may be slightly jaded towards AJ due to his RVS vote on you so keep that in mind as you assess his play. I think characterizing his "I know myself to be Town" statement when giving the logic behind his stance in post 45 as a "softclaim" is a farce. Honestly, the only "questionable" post he has made was his "sarcasm" post. I didn't read that as sarcastic in the slightest either, given that he voted with me in the same breath. That said, he is agreeing with me on a player I have been unimpressed with thus far so I'm not judging that too harshly and appreciate the wagon support.

I kind of think you guys are barking up the wrong tree with SP and/or Fuzzybuttern,uts so I won't be too offended if you think I'm doing the same.

I will admit that the biggest "hole in my swing" mafia wise would be derp play. I often find it incredibly difficult to distinguish between bad play and scum play when logic is all but nonexistant. I was most recently in 0 Percent Flavor with -L- and HD, as an example. I had a hard on to get Monkeyman lynched Day 1. People convinced me I was on a witch hunt and that he was just derp. As a result he lived until Day 4 and guess what? =4711737]He was scum. Conversely, -L- played like a complete tool. I ended up switching my vote to her Day 1 and helped =4665635]lynch our Gunsmith. Honestly, as bad as -L- was playing that probably ended up being part of the reason we won in retrospect but it didn't make me happy. I don't think I ever voted for scum HD that game, btw, which shows you that I can sometimes be equally fooled by competent play. *shrug*

So I guess what I'm saying is that I think serra is scummy/playing poorly enough that his lynch could be good for Town one way or the other in lieu of an obviously superior lynch candidate. So, I'm comfortable with his wagon unless you can convince me that you have a way better lynch candidate.

[Aj The Epic]

I'm just gonna point out that this is bad and y'all should wagon levy with me instead of Serra.

While we're discussing meta: Levvy has an interesting complex of making moves that makes you want to slap him or yourself. I played against him in a bonsai (tree stump) game. It was incredibly weird, to say the least, since he sheeped the conftown so hard, when I replaced in, I was massively worried about him. With him, you basically have to go "Would average scum players do this?" and walk through what it would gain him for doing so. Yeah, sheeping Yates, but I've seen him do this before. I eventually lost the game by sitting him in L-1 thinking he was scum.

[Human Destroyer]

I don't think I ever voted for scum HD that game, btw, which shows you that I can sometimes be equally fooled by competent play.

My play was anything but competent that game; I've had far,

far

better scum games.

[Yates]

My play was anything but competent that game; I've had far,

far

better scum games.

That may be true from a scum-team perspective but you still read as Town and presented as logical, which is my point.

Also, regarding setup spec, I hate setup spec on Day 1 since we have zero info outside of the number of players. It could be 2 scum and a 3rd party, it could be 2 scum and a vig, it could be 2 scum and investigators with sanity issues... It's just way too soon to worry about that since we have no baseline for making assumptions on any of this stuff.

[Human Destroyer]

I kind of think you guys are barking up the wrong tree with SP

What makes you think so?

[Human Destroyer]

That may be true from a scum-team perspective but you still read as Town and presented as logical, which is my point.

Nah I think you were just happy I was helping you push Monkey and that kinda blinded you.

[/offtopic]

[fuzzybutternut]

For some reason I'm getting a scum read on Yates, but I can't figure out if it's gut or something else.

[Mr_Ree]

I kind of think you guys are barking up the wrong tree with SP

What makes you think so?

It's very much a gut call but I've learned to trust my gut in early game. I've been playing a bunch of newbie games recently. Fuzzy comes across as new town to me which is why I asked about experience. I'll see if I can dig up the post(s) that gave me a town read on SP.

For me, especially this early, it's more about who's posts set off alarm bells on the initial read through. I've gotten better at looking past derpy plays. They still mess with my reads, just less so
now. I'll chalk that up to dealing with too many newbies recently.

As for my reads being skewed from AJ's vote, you could very well be right. Going after my wagon has always been a big part of my M.O. though and I'm not about to change that anytime soon. Going after an RVS wagon of one would be silly on it's own but combined with the defensiveness and an unfamiliar posting style, I'd like to keep my vote here until I get a better feeling for both AJ and his posting style. I'm just not seeing a lot of pro town behavior and every second post sets off alarm bells for me.

[PiggyGal15]

Vote Count 1.3

• serrapaladin
  - Yates, Aj the Epic, Human Destroyer, leviathan93
• leviathan93
  - Lord Mhork, CareyHammer, serrapaladin
• fuzzybutternut
  - kiwieagle
• Aj the Epic
  - Mr_Ree
• Not Voting
  - -L-, fuzzybutternut

Looking for a replacement for -L-

With

11

alive, it takes

6

to lynch.
Deadline in (expired on 2013-03-09 23:13:19)

[serrapaladin]

Is there really a possibility of more than 2 scum in this setup, or did Levy just town tell really hard in post 127?

How is 127 a town tell? Levi didn't say anything about how the setup.

There's not much point in discussing the setup for now.

---

Look, yeah, Yates is probably town. We don't need to preach that to the world, most people with eyes can see that.

sounds a bit awkward.

---

I could go on a rant about how wrong Yates is about fuzzy and me, but I don't find him particularly scummy, so unless he has anything particular for me to answer, I'll look at levi instead:

I still don't like 82 as a response to kiwi's accusation.

95 calls Carey's sheep either obvscum or obvtown, which is by definition not obv-anything and thus an empty post.

127 seems sympathetic towards me (and he'd given fuzzy and me a townread previously), at least he calls my interpretation "understandable". Then after Yates reiterates how he thinks I was deliberately misrepping, levi pulls a 180 and votes me, even though Yates didn't really bring up any new argument against me between 127 and 133 (the vote). If he agrees with the case which Yates summarized, he should have done so before the summary, and hence have no reason to call me understandable. Yates' case, even though wrong, was clear enough not to need a summary.

In 137 he jumps at me calling his behavior sheeping. If he's town and truly agrees with the case, he should have no problem with his behavior being labeled as sheeping, which is alignment neutral.

[fuzzybutternut]

The whole "there is a possibility that everyone is scum" thing gave me a town read on him, but, now that I look back at it, I'm willing to take that much back.

[Aj The Epic]

sounds a bit awkward.

Really? Because calling people town as a general acceptance is a good way to get that person killed.

[Yates]

calling people town as a general acceptance is a good way to get that person killed.

Quoted for truth. Part of the reason I started posting with a more surly demeanor is because I was becoming obvtown too soon and getting killed N1 or N2. By not pulling punches I've found that I get better results even if people aren't super happy with my "no kids gloves" demeanor. Also, scum seem to think I'm mislynch bait as a result. Also, I'm sometimes wrong which makes scum even more sure they can get me mislynched or try to get me to focus on their Town mislynch du jour.

As an aside - That's that uncomfortable feeling that you can't explain, fuzzy, so stop being dumb and accept I could be scum. You don't know. Or do you?

[Yates]

oh yeah. /self meta.

[fuzzybutternut]

what are you talking about Yates? When did I say you couldn't be scum?

[Aj The Epic]

We're talking about a post by Mr_ree.

[fuzzybutternut]

I was referring to his "aside."

[leviathan93]

@serrapaladin

I disagree with your analysis of my 4 posts

82, not much to say because its a matter of opinion. you don't like my post as a response. My response: oh darn. i could care less if you don't like it. that doesn't mean shit.

95. i do hold by what i said. It does make him obvious one or the other. i just can't put my finger on which one and i would need a little more analysis on that fact. I personally feels it makes him obvious scum, but i would then suspect scum to KNOW a move like that would make them obviously seem scummy and not do it. which i would therefore see as him being obvious TOWN because of it. it just depends on how much you are willing to look into it. I wanted other opinions on this.

127, it wasn't being sympathetic. I was understanding you. I can see how you can get that from the post. but unfortunately you were wrong and to me it looks like you were twisting my words to make me look bad. whether that was the point or not, you were making me look scummy and i know that ain't true. so of course i had to step in a look at whether you knew that you were purposely trying to make me look bad which would make you Scummy or if that wasn't your intent would make you town just trying to find answers. I chose the first one. and thats where i currently am.

137. Of course I jump at you calling my actions sheeping. just cause someone agrees with something doesn't mean they are sheeping. sheeping to me is where someone votes someone just because someone else does and has no reasons besides the fact that someone else voted them, or just trying to end the day by having a lynch happening and not caring who. Because i was doing none of these, i was not sheeping. I was agreeing with another's statements. thought about them and think its a point to be made.