Micro 151: Mafia in New-Newbie Land (Game over!)

[Quilford]

“What is new in the world? Nothing. What is old in the world? Nothing. Everything has always been and will always be.”
― Sai Baba

Prodding elvis_knits.

>>>

Jake from State Farm

(2) mothrax, borkjerfkin <<<

mothrax

(1) Jake from State Farm

Not Voting (1) elvis_knits

###

With 4 alive, it takes 3 to lynch.

Deadline hits in (expired on 2013-05-24 05:26:25).

[elvis_knits]

Dammit. I am sorry. I will read today and make a useful contribution.

[elvis_knits]

Okay. I have skimmed all plus read some stuff in greater detail.

I'm kinda ready to vote Jake and end the day.

@bork and mothrax, do you want me to read everything more thoroughly and discuss everything with you to make sure we're really sure, or are you okay with me just hammering?

[Jake from State Farm]

You will be making the wrong choice, please don't skim. Take the time and read please

[mothrax]

I'm as sure as I'm going to be right now. Like I said, if bork is scum we deserve to lose for letting him lead us around by the wang.
I know I'm town, you are conftown, so by POE that leaves Jake. Lets just end it.

[borkjerfkin]

I am too drunk too be ok with shit right now.

Elvis this isnt ending the day, this is ending the game

Is my shit compelling? Is mothrax town? I need some analysis from you.

[borkjerfkin]

UNVOTE:

I hate this hedge from mothrax. I need some time.

[elvis_knits]

Mothrax has been mostly absent and mostly unhelpful and called majiffy town for BS meta reasons.

He's could totally be scum.

I have to read the last few pages of your interaction with Jake before I comment on him.

[mothrax]

Borks 1681 cements that he's town.

[Jake from State Farm]

This is me responding to mothrax from the previous page

I don't buy the reaction test thing. It looks to me like it was forced and you were trying to get townie cred by stating intent to hammer.

If I was trying to get townie cred, wouldn't I have just hammered him?

And your sudden switch from me to bork is still bad. You come in agter both players state intent to vote me, say you will too, even though I'm on your town read list prior to that, then when we start considering other options you go to bork, then back to me. Over eager scum in mylo

i already explained my switch to bork, I was basically frustrated and angry. And over eager scum? really? because Bork actually had a chance of getting lynched today? no he didn't. If I am scum, my switch to bork would have been the absolutely worst thing i could have done. It's much better to just tunnel you til the end of the day.

Not necessarily true. Bussing scum buss whenever they need to. (Self meta: I warn people in pregame QTs when I'm scum that there will be no buddying. AGar taught me well.)

true, scum can bus whenever they want but in a game where there is most likely 2 scum, getting rid of your partner day 1 makes the game a near un-winnable situation.

In the first paragraph again that is not indicative of my alignment. This is the second time you've come up with jiffy behaviors that somehow are telling of my alignment. Have you never seen scum buddy town for exactly this reason?

fair enough, I guess I could be wrong. And yes I have seen scum buddy town, but why would he buddy you and not someone like Bork?

As for the second paragraph, after our exchange I had a pretty solid town read on him. I stated as such. He didn. Change that read, I was wrong, but being wrong isn't a scumtell

yes I realize being wrong isn't a scumtell, lord knows I am wrong more than my fair share.

[mothrax]

Mothrax has been mostly absent and mostly unhelpful and called majiffy town for BS meta reasons.

I have to read the last few pages of your interaction with Jake before I comment on him.

I never used meta to defend jiffy. I've never played with him. After our exchange D1 he came off looking town. That read carried over.

[mothrax]

@Jake: you wouldn't hammer your PR unless you absolutely had to. That's pretty clear from your statements on bussing.

Your second point: there had been some suspicion on bork from ek before your switch and I had stated I was wary of bork from how townie he had been looking. So saying that throwing a vote on bork was the worst thing you could have done is patently false.

[Jake from State Farm]

And you don't think this situation was an "absolutely had to" one?

He got lynched, if I was scum I would have absolutely would have hammered him

[Jake from State Farm]

Smh, I need to proofread before posting.

[mothrax]

You had no way of knowing he was going to self hammer and his wagon had been stalling out at l-1 for a while. Wisdom wagon could have still gained ground.

[Jake from State Farm]

True, but I wouldn't pretend to want to hammer like that with my partner. Once everyone said go ahead I would have just hammered. It's retarded to do what I did if I was scum.

[elvis_knits]

I want to vote jake

[elvis_knits]

This is what Jake has done this game:

1) Coached Majiffy scum not to vote mothrax for townslipping:

mothrax town slipped btw

Coached Majiffy again not to vote chkflip:

@ Majiffy - why is pala/chk scum? - make a case. Changing your vote close to deadline is horrible because you know nobody is going to follow you.

2) Pushed for Wisdom to be lynched. Wisdom is pretty much the only person he ever pushed, and when i look at the reasoning not it seems pretty weak, especially to be his only scum read THIS ENTIRE GAME.

my reasoning for voting Wisdom was the fact I just caught him active lurking. He hadn't posted in 2 days and moments after I drop a vote he shows up to question it. Doesn't question any of my other posts or anything.

3) Subtley affirms the Xegarus wagon while still voting wisdom.

so reading up on what I missed over the weekend and I'm still good with my vote on Wisdom but I think elvis made a good point about X, the OMGUS is strong with that one. I'd still rather lynch wisdom. he hasn't done a damn thing pro-town

X would be my alternative vote

4) Defends majiffy

I rarely see majiffy provide good reasons for his vote. Fuck in a game we played together I found scum and majiffy got all the credit and people just thought I bussed.

majiffy not giving reasons is par for the course imo

mainly gut, I don't recall if I have ever played with majiffy as scum but all of his earlier posts reminded me of games we played. I could be reading him wrong but I don't see anything scum motivated. The only thing that really stood out was the vote on mothax who committed what i took as a town tell.

Defended Majiffy to chkflip when chkflip called majiffy scum:

Your vote flip-flopping, scumbutt. You're worse than a politician.

Welcome to the new MS, vote hopping isn't scummy anymore.

yeah the nk is hard to figure out cause you have to ask yourself

would majiffy scum kill chk and paint himself into a corner or did scum kill chck trying to set up majiffy.

majiffy's switch makes him look bad, but he is an erratic player sometimes. I'm not ruling out Majiffy scum but I honestly don't think he would kill chck. Majiffy likes to argue and he could have easily left chck alive and argued with him all day creating a distraction if he was scum.

OK WOW THAT IS A LOT OF DEFENDING MAJIFFY.

[borkjerfkin]

Let's just fucking do this. I don't have any more layers to peel back and I'm leaning Jake still.

VOTE: Jake

[elvis_knits]

OK I ready to hammer.

[Jake from State Farm]

Whatever, towns gonna lose

GG scum

[elvis_knits]

So your response to my case on you is "whatever"??

[Jake from State Farm]

yes pretty much because I am not wasting my sunday on this game and ultimately all comes down to nothing but WIFOM.

what you call coaching, isn't coaching. I was making my way through each page at the time and was tossing out stuff I felt was relevant.

everything else I can't really defend myself because all you guys will do is say "well that's wifom"

I tunnel on people, that is what I pretty much do in every game. Mastin even made a comment about me in his mafia QT when he was describing players he was familiar with.

I also don't hard defend my scum buddy, I distance myself from them.

your whole case is "coaching", "tunneling", and "defending"

so basically my response is NUH UH

if you want more from me you will have to wait til Monday.

if you want to vote me and lose the game, go right ahead.

[Jake from State Farm]

1 more post before I leave the house.

1. If majiffy wasn't even voting Mothrax when I replaced in, how could that be perceived as coaching?
2 why as scum would a quickly chsnge my vote off X onto Wisdom after he proved he was active lurking? That's the #1 scum tell IMO. The fact he was town doing that is frustrating as hell and I'll probably avoid playing with him on the future.
3. Why is my defending majiffy worse than mothrax's defending him? Or bork's soft attack of him? That's the only 1 glaring thing I see is you have 2 defending scum and 1 semi-attacking him.

[Jake from State Farm]

now I have a few minutes of quiet time, let me go through your case

1) Coached Majiffy scum not to vote mothrax for townslipping:

so you really think I retroactively coached majiffy? When I replaced in Majiffy's vote was on somebody else, see the vote count right before I replaced in - http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 9#p4856429

Coached Majiffy again not to vote chkflip:

1. asking majiffy for a case isn't coaching
2. trying to start a brand new wagon with less than 24 hours til deadline is NEVER a good idea.
3. If I was scum with majiffy, why would I not want him to start that wagon? anything that could potentially force a NL would be good for us.

Pushed for Wisdom to be lynched. Wisdom is pretty much the only person he ever pushed, and when i look at the reasoning not it seems pretty weak, especially to be his only scum read THIS ENTIRE GAME.

he is pretty much the only person I voted, you got that right and I already explained why. I saw nothing pro-town from him. Tunneling is something I do in just about every game, the fact that we lynched someone else day 1 and that person flipped town pretty much sold me on Wisdom scum. You almost never see 2 wagons that are both on town.

Subtley affirms the Xegarus wagon while still voting wisdom.

there is absolutely nothing wrong with either of those 2 quotes. You seem to forget to point out that those comments were made when there was less than 24 hours until deadline. When you are near deadline you have to agree on SOMEONE else we have a NL which is bad for town.

Defends majiffy

and?

Defended Majiffy to chkflip when chkflip called majiffy scum:

so bork can say vote hopping isn't scummy, but I'm not allowed to? I realize you are pretty much confirmed town and all, but idk how you can call 1 person scummy for that and excuse another person for essentially the same thing

Spoiler:

What's scummy about vote hopping in and of itself? Nothing

OK WOW THAT IS A LOT OF DEFENDING MAJIFFY.

and?
defending someone is a null tell and I have HUGE issues with you trying to use that as a scumtell, even if it was scum I was defending, OMG it's possible I was wrong.

also if you have an issue with people defending jiffy, what about morthax's defending him?

Spoiler:

Jiffy is probtown. Too much Wifom there.

To explain what I said about jiffy:
Jiffy doesn't strike me as the type of player who would create that much Wifom for Wifom's sake. I don't think he would kill chkflip, especially because jiffy seems to like conflict and that was his number one source of conflict, so I don't think jiffyscum would have done that.

Jiffy is still probtown.

I do. Jiffy reminds me a lot of Fate, and I was fairly competent at reading him back in the day. I still don't like the way the night kill went down and I don't see him trying to pull that off. Really, it looks like someone else who doesn't know his playstyles trying to frame him. As for the other cases on him, they are mostly meta based and I don't give much weight to those.

They way jiffy has been bored with the game screams town to me. I don't see scum sighing at the amount of bleh that has been this day, or yesterday for that matter. In fact, they would rejoice at the pants on head play of town in general, someone with a playstyles like what I've seen from jif in this game would take advantage of that and maneuver themselves into a leadership role.

What about this quote after jiffy self hammered

What the ever loving fuck...

Jiffy flipped scum PR, that reaction screams anger at jiffy imo.

also I have issues with this quote

The only scenario I could see it not being is if scum purposely no killed to throw us down this path. But I'm gonna go with no on that and if we are still here after today then I will say my piece on that. Today, we lunch who Mac says to lynch.

this to me looks like posturing to seem annoyed at the NK, why would he have a problem with scum NK'ing as it will more than likely help town? I am pretty sure I also mentioned this at some point, if not I know I wanted to. The scum NK plan would ONLY work if it was someone who for sure wasn't going to be blocked. The only person who was a town read for just about everyone was mothrax.

That;s all I got for now

good night