Micro 188: Matrix6 (Game Over)

[Sakura Hana]

That post was nothing, just ignore it, it's basically just me saying scum is lurking... but then again anorway was lurking and he flipped town.

[Sakura Hana]

Let's see, suspciions so far
bork - Lucky, KK
mutley - Lucky, KK
Sakura - Lucky, KK
KK - mutley, Lucky
Lucky - mutley, Sakura

So bork, me and mutley suspect both Lucky and KK, and they suspect mutley, but KK suspects Lucky too, KK is more experienced, if Lucky/KK scum team i don't see how they'd let put all the suspicions on themselves at this point, the fact that KK ALSO suspects Lucky is bothering me.

Anyone for a mutley/KK scum team?

[borkjerfkin]

Sakura's frustration reads genuine.

If I had to vote now it would be one of Lucky/KK;

Pairings I still don't like (and I need to devote more time to looking at more relationships between the four players)
Lucky/mutley
Lucky/Sakura

so kittens is probably a better first lynch than lucky.

p-edit: Yeah I'm not ruling that pairing out either.

[Sakura Hana]

I think KK is the most common denominator here

FoS: KK

the Lucky/multey would mean they are busing each other

[borkjerfkin]

It would mean that they were cross bussing D1, which I really don't see a lot in 9p games.

[Sakura Hana]

Still haven't analyzed previous days, i'm mostly going on by what i logically think so far is the best option based on everyone's suspicions.

[Mutleyddmc]

Yes this is what we need we need pairings and deduce common demoninators. Then it should make tomorrow easier as we can deduce the scum buddies and then can narrow it down even further as there will be a NK too.

Personally if bork is scum he deserves to win here

[Mutleyddmc]

And if you are I will lynch you in any game we play to get you back and make sure you never trick me again

[Mutleyddmc]

Thank you bork. I don't know why people are growing this wagon when he hasn't even checked in yet.

He has more than enough ample time to respond. He's dodged all of my questions. Now he deserves my vote.

Ps Mollie will likely be unvoting me.

;shiftyeyes;

Are you considering the possibility that he abandoned the game?

Why are you making defenses or even excuses for him?

Because the argument only works if he was lurking. If he abandoned the game... well it was probably still scum fleeing but.... I had a point in here somewhere I swear.

Why did you answer my question with a question?

How do you know he's not lurking? He's been on the site, he's been posting elsewhere. Why isn't he playing this game? He's ingoring it and hope the fluffy bunnies go away so he can come back to no pressure.

Again you're making excuses for him.

Regardless this is something scum would do so if you're not his partner.. You're likely to be scum.

Why can't I answer the question with a question?

:shiftyeyes:

How can you forget about a game? >.>

Regardless this is something scum would do so if you're not his partner.. You're likely to be scum.

Wait what? Only scum have partners so does this sentence read "...if you're not scum, you're likely to be scum"?

Yes, I'm totally going after low hanging fruit. Ferret is the only one who I'm seeing as scum right now. So apparently going after someone I think is scum is going after low hanging fruit.

Just did a quick ISO of day 1 mal and lucky. This is the interaction of them it took till near the end of the day for any interaction and it definitely doesn't dispel them as buddies.

[Klicking Kittens]

The ONE person I had a confident townread on got lynched. -_-

I've been lurking in a lot of games lately, trying to pick it up. Right now, I personally think Mutley is scum, but I'm not sure of who the second one is. Lucky is a possibility.

- Klick

I'm really just asking for a modicum of transparency behind your collective thought process, which has been decidedly lacking all game. All reads given from you have been incredibly overly-simplistic in nature or outright unexplained. Your pushes have also been weak, and I can't think of a single reason to call you town right now.

If you're town, you really, really need to fix this.

I know this was to Klick, but the limited information he gave me I responded. I tried to flesh it out with what I had, but it doesn't seem satisfactory to you.

The questions imposed to you right now are: "Do you actually plan to listen to anything said?" & "If anything we will say will it change your mind at all?"

Just seems like this is one of those fence sitting comments that realistically never happen.

____

So I'm going to self-meta (I'm not sure how badly this will end for me):

I try not to bus right before a scum-win if I can avoid it, but I will to get cred.

I have a tendency to manipulate Mara in a LyLo, but when she's town and I'm scum. I have done it in games where she's been in hydra's too. I just wouldn't have killed Mara if I was scum. I wouldn't have.

____

The thing that scares me the most right now is how good it is for scum to have Lucky AND I alive if we are both town. Both of us have a large number of suspicion which makes us easy targets for a fast LyLo win.

I always have a problem with someone voting straight off the bat and when Mutley voted in LyLo it pinged my scum radar. I know it's a null tell because both town and scum do it, but I don't think town would take a risky "reaction" test that could have cost them the win.

____

Multley:

What is #658?

Is it because I didn't call anyone but Ferret scum when I was engaging with Lucky?

If anyone knows, but 244 was sarcastic as fuck (The beginning was).

Also don't call me "Mal" since I'm not evil. Thanks.

[Sakura Hana]

then again mutley is mutley, I just pointed the suspicions and my analysis for reference, so we can find the scum from there.

[borkjerfkin]

The questions imposed to you right now are: "Do you actually plan to listen to anything said?" & "If anything we will say will it change your mind at all?"

Just seems like this is one of those fence sitting comments that realistically never happen.

I mean do you want to keep throwing bullshit underhanded attacks at me (like that anorway chainsaw) or do you actually want to engage me on something relevant and current so I can react to it? Why the hell

wouldn't

I care about something you had to say if it were

substantial?

Are you trying to call me scum? You are not drawing any conclusions, just throwing scenarios around without talking about the likelihood of any of them being true. That is not interesting or useful AND it's a thing scum do to try to keep town from figuring out exactly what possibilities they should be ruling out.

And I have to ignore your self-meta; if you're so aware of what you'd normally do as scum then it's not hard to deliberately NOT do it as scum. Other than that the act of attempting to self-meta is null and should be ignored; I've certainly seen town do it.

Give me a read list and explain the list, concisely, in one post. I don't think that's too much to ask.

Also I'm really really obvtown and you're ignoring that. You have not really commented on my alignment all game. Why?

[borkjerfkin]

I try not to bus right before a scum-win if I can avoid it, but I will to get cred.

You basically just described the whole philosophy behind bussing in general; nobody actively

wants

to bus, and anyone who

is

bussing is doing it for cred...so I don't see where you're going here.

[Klicking Kittens]

The questions imposed to you right now are: "Do you actually plan to listen to anything said?" & "If anything we will say will it change your mind at all?"

Just seems like this is one of those fence sitting comments that realistically never happen.

I mean do you want to keep throwing bullshit underhanded attacks at me (like that anorway chainsaw) or do you actually want to engage me on something relevant and current so I can react to it? Why the hell

wouldn't

I care about something you had to say if it were

substantial?

Are you trying to call me scum? You are not drawing any conclusions, just throwing scenarios around without talking about the likelihood of any of them being true. That is not interesting or useful AND it's a thing scum do to try to keep town from figuring out exactly what possibilities they should be ruling out.

And I have to ignore your self-meta; if you're so aware of what you'd normally do as scum then it's not hard to deliberately NOT do it as scum. Other than that the act of attempting to self-meta is null and should be ignored; I've certainly seen town do it.

Give me a read list and explain the list, concisely, in one post. I don't think that's too much to ask.

Also I'm really really obvtown and you're ignoring that. You have not really commented on my alignment all game. Why?

I been calling you town in our QT since Day 2 opened since that was one of the two reads Mollie WAS confident with. I been calling Lucky scum because of Mac's side of the reads. You just called them WIFOM because it's NKA.

I'm not calling you scum - it's an important question. If someone is set on a read there's VERY little someone can do to change their mind.

Actually; you can ignore it all you want, but it's something that can be proven as a fact rather than a false fact. I'm AWARE of a lot of things I do as scum and what I don't do as scum. There's ONE clear thing I won't do as scum if I can avoid it and I tend to do it a lot as town. I try not to mix my meta if I can avoid it. I don't fake drop town tells either.

I'm not ignoring it.. I been calling you town since Day 2, but I'm certainly allowed to question my town reads right or is that something that's unorthodox to do also? Apparently I never called you town on the thread just like I never called SC town either on the thread because you both were town in my mind and nothing was changing from that.

[Klicking Kittens]

This is why Klick was townreading Anor (yes it's paraphrased)

-His hammer was not a purpose-filled quick hammer vote as it was accidental.
-He explained how he accidentally hammered and Klick thought it was a genuine response.
-There was a delay between the hammer and his intent to hammer. He didn't have to wait.

[borkjerfkin]

I'm not ignoring it.. I been calling you town since Day 2, but I'm certainly allowed to question my town reads right or is that something that's unorthodox to do also? Apparently I never called you town on the thread just like I never called SC town either on the thread because you both were town in my mind and nothing was changing from that.

As I said, I've not SEEN you comment on my alignment: how am I to know you're doing it in your QT if you never tell anyone? You think I should not take issue with the fact that you're posting stuff in the QT and posting very little of it in the thread? And I don't appreciate your trying to spin that as my getting on you for questioning a read; do you think I mind someone questioning reads if they can give

reasons

for things?

If someone is set on a read there's VERY little someone can do to change their mind.

Have you seen how many times I've gone back and forth on people this day alone? I'm really, really torn right now; you're the only read that I'm even close to confident on, and that read happens to be a scum read.

Sakura is gaining ground as my "do not touch this town" read.

Actually; you can ignore it all you want, but it's something that can be proven as a fact rather than a false fact. I'm AWARE of a lot of things I do as scum and what I don't do as scum. There's ONE clear thing I won't do as scum if I can avoid it and I tend to do it a lot as town. I try not to mix my meta if I can avoid it. I don't fake drop town tells either.

Noted, but as I have only your word to take from that right now, can you give me meta that backs that up?

P-edit: anorway isn't terribly relevant anymore.

[Klicking Kittens]

Klick thinks there's one scum between Lucky & TSO (now Multey)
Before he thought they were partners, but them being partners didn't make sense due to what could be seen as weak busing during Day 2.
He also thought Lucky's #48 made him scum, but if that was true then Bork or SC was the partner.

I had a town read on SC all game so I disagreed with the {48} comment and Mollie had a town read on Bork which also made me disagree with the possible partner speculation post.

I already stated that I'm leaning scum on Lucky due to how his Day 2 posts appeared to me. He looks overcautious like he's trying to avoid gaining suspicion and then along with my NKA.

I don't really have a good read on Sak. I was taking in views of other people whom have played with her before {Anor, SC}. I have played with her once, but my read was done on faith by Mara. Anor and both SC thought Sak was likely town. Due to this I'm leaning Sak into a town list.

Which really sucks because if I take into account of all these reads of dead players I come out to TSO/Lucky being scum together which I already previously disagreed with. -_- Either I'm wrong or one of my town reads right here are wrong.

[Klicking Kittens]

My biggest town/scum tell difference is Night Kill analysis.

I will do it more often as town, but when I'm scum I either don't do it at all or I'm reluctant as fuck to answer it; if it'e directly pointed to me.

[Sakura Hana]

Either I'm wrong or one of my town reads right here are wrong.

Or you're scum, that is also a possibility...

Back to my suspicion list:

bork -

Lucky

, KK
mutley -

Lucky

, KK
Sakura -

Lucky

, KK
KK - mutley,

Lucky

Lucky - mutley, Sakura

Everyone suspects Lucky...

bork - Lucky,

KK

mutley - Lucky,

KK

Sakura - Lucky,

KK

KK - mutley, Lucky
Lucky - mutley, Sakura

Everyone but Lucky suspects you...

if Lucky/KK i can believe on you busing Lucky while Lucky doesn't bus you, i don't think scum would cross boss in this situation but you never know.

So the question of the year
Lucky: Why did you... at that point, not suspect KK?

[Sakura Hana]

Putting that aside, mutley isn't very suspected because of his trolly / risky / gambity playstyle
I could pretty much be looking at a possible mutley/Lucky team.

[borkjerfkin]

I could pretty much be looking at a possible mutley/Lucky team.

D1 interactions make this unlikely, IMO.

[Klicking Kittens]

I have eliminated town due to this ^ type of thing before, but it's usually in earlier days before LyLo hits. If the majority of a player list is calling one person scum then it's more than likely they are town. I used that to eliminate Alice back in TfT which is why I had you down as possible scum due to a CW, but Mara disagreed with me.

You're only putting one part of the equation where you should be putting two instead and then piecing it together. I did something similar when Bork was scum and I was town to eliminate Mollie's slot from being scum in Jiffy's game.

[Klicking Kittens]

I could pretty much be looking at a possible mutley/Lucky team.

D1 interactions make this unlikely, IMO.

So do D2, imo.

[borkjerfkin]

I want to see where Sakura's line of questioning goes before I have anything else to say.

[Klicking Kittens]

Also

Sak question.

Why haven't you said anything regarding me calling Rach out for hammering Alice without a claim or an intent any different from me calling out Anor for doing something very similar?