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Deadline is in
In post 898, toolenduso wrote: @Fitz:My point is that it wasn't consistent. Garmr was fine with "milking" at first, then as soon as Thor challenged him on it, Garmr decided "milking" wasn't a good idea, then in day 2 he's back to the idea of "milking."In post 887, havingfitz wrote:Sure Tool....re: your case in Post 822:
You thought the milking D1 sentiment was fine. Check
Then you provided a D1 exchange between Thor and Gamr (where I think the summary is that Thor is suspecting Garmr for wanting to wait?)....but then you put in a quote (Post 790) from D2 where Garmr is being consistent about "milking the day". Why does his consistency wrt milking the day on D1 and D2 make him suspect? Or at least...what does his D2 comment have to do with anything? As for Thor coaxing him to vote sooner...why does the timeliness of Garmr's ABR vote matter when he had stated his intention to vote ABR already? It's not like Thor talked him into voting ABR out of the blue.
The day 2 part isn't even really that important. What's important is the way Garmr reacted to A) being pressured to comment on ABR; and B) Thor challening his "milking" sentiment. Both examples show Garmr perfectly willing to be pushed toward a town lynch.
And I don't think Thor saw any advantage in lynching ABR sooner rather than later -- or if he did, it doesn't matter. But Garmr took Thor's cue, which does matter if Thor flips scum. ScumThor was just challenging things he didn't agree with with equal opportunity, which he's been doing all game. Garmr thought Thor was trying to provide some subtle direction.
I’m not going to quibble over Garmr. You seem to suspect him. I suspect him. Cool.
As for ICEninja, I have no more opinions that haven't been expressed already, so let me see if I can make it even more clear for you.
Post 794: "How can you typically lynch hiders if you've never encountered one?"
Post 817: "“Typically' would imply you have lynched a hider more than once."
Post 881: "you lied about typically lynching them"
Post 881: "you lied about encountering hiders before"
My answer: ICE never, ever, ever, ever said he had encountered a REAL hider. He said he's encountered people who CLAIMED to be hiders, who turned out not to be. The link you posted to the 2010 game is an example of this.
My initial response to ICE came before he expanded on his comment to indicate he meant he never played with a REAL hider. My issues with his comments don’t really matter whether the hiders were real or not.
Here's what ICE is saying: "I have never lynched a real hider. I have lynched fake hiders."
ATTN TOOL….ICE has never lynched a real OR fake hider. So typically he does NOT lynch them. Capisce?
Here's what you're saying: "ICE said he's lynched a real hider!"
I never said this…you aren’t paying attention.
Post 817: "You realize until you know the hider is real or not it’s all the same."
My answer: That would be true during the game in question, but ICE is talking about games that have already ended. Therefore, he can look back now and know with absolute certainty that the people who claimed hider were not hiders.
But his actions that he is discussing were made or not made when he didn’t know it. Assuming he had ever lynched a hider…to say he always lynched them (because they make good fakeclaims) is crap considering he wouldn’t have known at the time he was voting them that they were in fact fake claiming. And as I’ve said a few times now…pay attention…he has never lynched a hider….real or fake. Typically or not.
Post 881: "you lied about not knowing how they work."
My answer:I feel like this pretty much explains everything.In post 891, ICEninja wrote: That post you linked was years ago and I have no memory of it. By the looks of things, before making that post I read the wiki about what hiders do.
I remembered encountering fake claim hiders before. They're uncommon and therefore unlikely to be counter claimed, and a hider surviving the night is a lot less suspicious than a cop surviving the night. I had no memory of them having informational powers, I always thought it was a survival role (like bullet proof, except requires you to pick the person NOT getting shot).
What would scum say? "Oh….I forgot."
Fact is…he said in this game that he did not realize if a hider hid behind scum they would die. Fact is…in the game I link people to…ICE probably has the most to say on the topic of the hider claim in that game and he details the fact that the hider would die if he hid behind scum. So you can say he forgot he knew it…I say he’s full of shit…aka lying. He knew. ICE is not dumb. Hider is a common enough role to have a basic idea of how they work...which he displayed.
If you insist on pursuing this line of reasoning, I challenge you to quote the post where ICE claims to have lynched somebody who actually turned out to be a hider -- NOT a post where he says he's played a game where somebody CLAIMED to be hider, but in fact was NOT A HIDER.
I never said he said that. Put your reading glasses on and you will see I said he has not lynched any hider (despite claiming he typically does) and that he knows the dynamic of them dying behind scum (which he claims he didn’t know).
Good night.
Got it. Misunderstood what you were saying.In post 902, havingfitz wrote:ATTN TOOL….ICE has never lynched a real OR fake hider. So typically he does NOT lynch them. Capisce?
My first statement was true, as I've said I've pretty much never played in a game where there was an actual hider. I've played in a couple bastard mod theme games that I don't remember very well so it is possible but I'm pretty sure I haven't. I'm also pretty sure I've seen it fake claimed more than once. I have vague memories of being suspicious of it the second time for reasons I've stated but it has been a really long time I could be misremembering.Myself wrote: I've never encountered a hider before. It gets fake claimed a lot, so I typically lynch anyone who claims to be one.
Yeah. I agree at this point that Thor is the lynch for the day and there's no buts about that in anyone's mind.In post 907, Sir Bastion wrote:I'd have to agree with slandaar.
With the exception of skelda everyone else have given their 2 cents and thoughts, so we might as well drop the hammer and resume day 3.
Skelda has been given a grace period to catch up, everyone has given their thoughts so no matter who is knocked off tonight we have content to work with (except skelda of course). So we might as well move on.
On phone so this might be messy.His flip will either clear up a lot of things, or it will bust the game wide open because a ton of people's reads were wrong, and scum is totally manipulating us via night kills (if he's town). I mean, after all, it is possible that scum caught F-16's implication that "if he died" people should look into Thor, and perhaps they extrapolated that he was a Hider based on that. And either way it would be a win/win and Thor would be lynched much more easily if they killed off F-16, a pretty townie player.