Shadow's terminally happy Newbie 1451 game over,mod exploded

TierShift · Post Post #500 (ISO) » Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:05 am

Skip to the next next vote count, which is not the next one but the next one after that.

@emerald: There is just one scum alive, do you think it's me or do you think it's rothwell? Why do you think I'm scum? Because I was defensive once?What do you think about nat/mala?

@Mindgamer: I don't really see how the fact that you weren't killed tonight makes you sure that rothwell isn't scum. Huntress was townread even more universally AND was convincing enough to get scum lynched. I would say Huntress was more dangerous to anyone than you.

emeraldemon · Post Post #501 (ISO) » Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:06 am

(I've cut the quotes some to keep readable)

In post 487, TierShift wrote:Stuff that pings:
In post 174, emeraldemon wrote: [...]
Trying to keep things as clear as possible: I assume NP was talking about my post here.
[...]
This is the big question for me right now.
@Rothwell, please understand. [...]
First part wasn't necessary at all, second part is directing attention away from NP and to rothwell.

First, you may think it was unecessary, but I wanted to clarify my post and make sure I wasn't misrepresented by huntress or NP. Second, yes, I was very focused on rothwell at that time. So yes, I was trying to keep attention/pressure on him.

In post 487, TierShift wrote:
In post 184, emeraldemon wrote: Huntress's case against neater plastic actually makes some sense to me, I think I'm on the "huntress is town" wagon [...]
You say that Huntress's case on NP makes sense without actually doing anything witht that information. You just seem to be agreeing for the agreeing and nothing more. I also notice how NP/yiley stay in place 4/5 of your reads list all the time.

That's not true, I did do something with that information: it made huntress town to me. You can like the cases people build without sheeping their votes. And NP was 4th because there were 3 people who worried me more: rothwell, you, and d_cobbz/natirasha. That shouldn't be a surprise if you ISO'd me up to this point.

In post 487, TierShift wrote:
In post 320, emeraldemon wrote: So it looks like Yiley has two finished games, 1429 and 1446. I read over both of them and he was... bad. Sorry bro, I am newb also, but your play is not exactly inspiring.

Yiley you said in 1446 that you wanted to trust your gut since it's usually right. What is your gut telling you? You said you would post reads earlier but then never did. Can I get a read list from you?
Your interaction with yiley has been of this caliber, extensively commenting about him but never really engaging. What are you trying to say with: "yiley has played badly?" You use it to prove nothing.

Alright, you're starting to bug me now. "never engaging"? I am the one (1) hunting down and reading his meta, and (2) asking questions to try to pull him out and get a read on him. What did you do during this time? Where's your yiley analysis?

yiley did play badly, but importantly (as I say later) his play seemed consistent between those town games and this one. It's a moot point now since obviously he was scum and I was wrong, but your play around this meta is still a sore point with me.

In post 487, TierShift wrote:
In post 327, emeraldemon wrote:So you think nati's vote on yiley is a bus attempt? Or buddying huntress maybe?
Why'd you say a vote on yiley is a fucking bus attempt. Especially if it's the first vote on a player. Would make sense if you'd known yiley was scum.

You probably just ISO'd me and missed the context on this one. mollie asked me "What do you think about nati/yiley scumteam?" while nati's vote was on yiley. Go back and check.

In post 487, TierShift wrote:
In post 352, emeraldemon wrote: Re: yiley. What little he's posted is consistent with his towngame as I've seen it, but that isn't saying much (and I don't have any scumgames from him). [...]
How is what he posted consistent with his townplay, in the sense that he played badly (which I don't agree he did in his towngames) or what? I don't see anything that's the same.
The most preposterous thing about this is that you have picked on rothwell for being inactive from page 2 on and now yiley is inactive and you say "oh well, perhaps he should post more". Doesn't make sense. You also miss that yiley is lurking harder than rothwell was.

Again it's pretty easy to say "yiley was so scummy" now that he's flipped scum. I was wrong, I misread. I want to make a few things clear though:

1) At the time of that post, yiley had posted more recently than rothwell, and rothwell was still being infuriatingly vague/lurky about why he thought there was a jailkeeper. I don't think you can say yiley was lurking more.

2) To me, yiley and rothwell were both lurking, but in a very different way. rothwell was antagonistic, obstinate, "I'll lurk if I wanna". Yiley was rarely there, but seemed like he was trying. Also, the quickhammer Day 1 from rothwell, the "I don't want to be mislynched" stuff, it all rubbed me the wrong way. rothwell seemed like the better choice to me.

If you really want to get into comparing the meta from the past town games to this one we can, but it's probably a waste now that yiley's lynched. I'll say again: I was wrong.

In post 487, TierShift wrote:
In post 475, emeraldemon wrote:Well, I picked a bad weekend to be away from this game I guess. If yiley flips town I think I wanna lynch tier tomorrow.
Really? Some cheap shot to take some townie points?

I really get under your skin when I say you're scummy, huh? I'm gonna post reads after this including reads on you, but for now I'll just say you were suspicious to me.

In post 487, TierShift wrote:
In post 477, emeraldemon wrote:I'm still unhappy with the way you made the yiley vote decision, although maybe I should wait for the flip to make up my mind. Also your overall tone is pretty defensive whenever someone I you about anything (like 360). I dunno, if I'm wrong about yiley I could be wrong about a lot of things.
You give shit reasoning, the only reason I see for wanting to lynch me is because mala already said she would want to. The last sentence is showing that he doesn't want to take responsability for a me mislynch.

Like I said, more on you later. We can talk more if you still think my reasoning is shit.

Sorry for the wall, it's kindof unavoidable.

Shadowmod · Post Post #502 (ISO) » Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:23 am

Vote Count

emeraldemon

(1/4): TierShift

Malakittens

(2/4): Natirasha, Mindgamer

not voting

(3/6): Rothwell, emeraldemon, Malakittens

6 alive, 4 to lynch, 3 to no lynch

Day 1:

(expired on 2014-01-02 15:00:00)

Mindgamer · Post Post #503 (ISO) » Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:25 am

In post 500, TierShift wrote:@Mindgamer: I don't really see how the fact that you weren't killed tonight makes you sure that rothwell isn't scum. Huntress was townread even more universally AND was convincing enough to get scum lynched. I would say Huntress was more dangerous to anyone than you.

Be aware that I'm not 'sure' of anyone. At this point I'm inclined to believe Rothwell is town but we'll see what happens along the road.
It's not about a town reputation contest between Huntress and Pirate_mollie. Huntress was leaning Emerald for scum in her last few posts, I was going towards Rothwell. Then Huntress died and I lived. In general it's not wise to base reads entirely on night actions, but they shouldn't be ignored either (imo).

emeraldemon · Post Post #504 (ISO) » Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:31 am

In post 500, TierShift wrote: @emerald: There is just one scum alive, do you think it's me or do you think it's rothwell? Why do you think I'm scum? Because I was defensive once?What do you think about nat/mala?

Sooo, I'm actually not sure about this one any more. I think Rothwell may be 1-shot BP. It almost explains his fear of getting lynched if he doesn't want his PR wasted. And his assumption about a jailkeeper makes perfect sense, since he thought he would be notified if he blocked a shot, pretty much explaining 346-356. If he were BP, he would know there was no doctor. I think it's ok to say this now since most people seem to think claiming is good anyway.

On the other hand, the refusal to lynch yiley is pretty suspicious, and it still doesn't explain the quicklynch D1.

Rereading nati and mala now. Will have more up shortly.

Natirasha · Post Post #505 (ISO) » Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:21 pm

Blah those posts are pretty terrible mindgamer.

Malakittens · Post Post #506 (ISO) » Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:45 pm

Yeah huntress was more universally town read than anyone else here. Mollie wasn't as universally town read as her, but was pretty much in second line. So you saying you don't get how you weren't NK'd over her seems fake, but that's just me.

Emerald I would have been happier if you didn't just pr-speculate rothwell. You doing that just doesn't sit right, but it's more because I associate a player who pr-speculates as more potentially Maifia based because they want to kill a pr while trying to NK a player.

Emerald you and Roth both share the refusal to lynch Yiley.

Nati happens to be a bit more suscipious only because he was first on the wagon so to speak and Huntress was killed instead of him. So either we are sitting with mafia is off the wagon or we are sitting with a risky scum who decided to kill someone on the wagon thinking they wouldn't be caught with that move. Really I need to do more with VCA to figure out that for sure, but with site going down and me being still sick I don't have time to do it. When the site is more reliable I probably will, but takes me a while to do so.

Anyways bed I go.

Natirasha · Post Post #507 (ISO) » Fri Dec 20, 2013 11:07 pm

Because the correct play as scum is to start off day two after no night kill by bussing your partner..?

TierShift · Post Post #508 (ISO) » Fri Dec 20, 2013 11:17 pm

@Emerald: all right!
UNVOTE: emerald
Lemme explain: I made that case on you, because at the time I thought you were scummy. Directly after I posted it, I reread and I thought "wow, this is one weak case -_-". And I truly didn't have more to attack you with. So I thought: "let's leave it as a reaction test", which you passed. You invalidated all points without deflecting, good job.

I still want to hear why exactly you townread yiley and what logic there was to the last 2 posts before night 2. Also, if you have decent arguments as to why I would be scum, I'd love to hear them.

Rothwell needs to get his ass in here, but as I'm not truly convinced he's scum, I'll remove my blinkers and look for scum on the yiley wagon. I'll point out stuff that bugs me.

Mindgamer, you keep pointing out that you replaced into an obvtown slot. Stop it, please, saying that is not gonna be helpful.

Mala, I'm absolutely digusted by your last post. I don't like how you call out emerald for speculating PR's, while completely disregarding anything else that he's said.

Then you point out that rothwell and emerald share a refusal to lynch yiley....and it just feels fake. You don't actually seem annoyed by it or see it as scummy, but then I feel like you are secretly using it to bolster your propaganda of an emerald or rothwell lynch.

Afterwards, you are wondering why

natirasha

wasn't the NK and say it makes him suspicious, while you just called out mindgamer for being fake about how he didn't get NK'd instead of huntress and you implied that huntress was the finest NK. And she was, because her reads were spot-on, she was convincing and there was no way huntress would be mislynched. So your point is contradictory and invalid.

I don't like that you say that you support rothwell and enerald lynches today, while what you are really trying to do is throwing out suspicion of nati, someone you have been pushing for all game but now don't support a lynch of. Me=puzzled.

VOTE: malakittens

L-1

Rothwell don't you ****ing dare to ****ing quickhammer....

Mindgamer · Post Post #509 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 1:34 am

...

So at this point I'm suffering from some kind of 'transfered obvtown narcissism'. I'm just going to drop the subject before town gets any crazier ideas. Night kill analysis isn't something that should be discussed in the open anyway.

@ Malakittens
Who do you want to lynch right now?

Natirasha · Post Post #510 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 2:03 am

Give mala a chance to claim as well. Tier's selling me on emerald, though.

Which is pretty sad because I thought emerald was town and a half.

Mindgamer · Post Post #511 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 3:23 am

In post 510, Natirasha wrote:Give mala a chance to claim as well. Tier's selling me on emerald, though.

And don't forget we need to hear from Rothwell before we lynch anyone (since he's the last to claim Doctor/BP/nothing). Btw, Tier just said his case was weak and filled the purpose of a reaction test. Doesn't that have any effect on 'Tier selling you on Emerald'?

Rothwell · Post Post #512 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 3:33 am

This constant site downtime is really annoying.

Claiming BP

Emerald was right in his speculation.

TierShift · Post Post #513 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 3:39 am

Yay
But who the fuck would try to kill rothwell N1?????

Malakittens · Post Post #514 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 5:16 am

I really don't have time now to do VCA I need two hours or more flat out. So if you can avoid hammering me before tonight and the sites not down I can do it after work.

Tier I understood what emerald said, but I still didn't like it. Whereas Mindgamer's post came off fake at first, but still doesn't change my town read I have on the slot.

Probably wouldn't have wanted a rothwell lynch anyways at least not today. Also just because someone has a refusual to lynch scum doesn't make them scum. Hell in fact my first IC game I was refusing to lynch scum only because I didn't like the wagon, but it didn't change my town role pm. Which is why you can say I don't find it scummy as for annoyed I was annoyed the site came back up 330am when I was asleep and that's when I posted, but as for someone refusing to lynch another player doesn't make me annoyed.

It's more because I figured that the NK would have been either first on the wagon or at least off the wagon. Which most likely makes the scum either {Nati/Tier}. Learned this from jiffy a while back and I use it every now and then.

I'm probably gonna go back to sleep then work. So wont see me again until after.

TierShift · Post Post #515 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 6:30 am

In post 514, Malakittens wrote: It's more because I figured that the NK would have been either first on the wagon or at least off the wagon. Which most likely makes the scum either {Nati/Tier}. Learned this from jiffy a while back and I use it every now and then.

I don't get it. Can you explain?

emeraldemon · Post Post #516 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 9:19 am

I know you all wanted another wall of text!

Spoiler: rothwell

Spoiler: mindgamer

Spoiler: natirasha

Spoiler: malakittens

Spoiler: tiershift

Questions to everyone, but especially rothwell and mindgamer:
#1) What do you make of tiershift's vote on yiley? legit, or bussing?
#2) What about natirasha's vote? Would scum counterwagon their partner this way?
#3) @mindgamer specifically: your vote on malakittens was basically process of elimination as I understand it, how do you feel now that she's at L-1?

TOWN
rothwell
mindgamer
natirasha
malakittens
tiershift
SCUM

Honestly mala and tiershift are probably tied at last place for me, but I can't vote malakittens so

VOTE: tiershift

emeraldemon · Post Post #517 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 9:29 am

Quick addendum: the timing on tiershift's malakittens vote is suspicious to me, but the reasons themselves sound fair enough. I'm feeling conflicted.

Natirasha · Post Post #518 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 10:22 am

Damn, 1-shot BP =/

Malakittens · Post Post #519 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 11:05 am

No one is stopping you from voting me emerald. It's just you'll be hammering me that's all.

Anyways hour left of work and then ill be home and try to do VCA fast

TierShift · Post Post #520 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 11:21 am

Wow emerald, your posts get solider and solider....

I agree that I basically just sheeped huntress on yiley, yes. I'm also defensive when someone accuses me, but I wouldn't say that's an indication of alignment; it might be in other people's play, but in my play it's not. I always defend myself when attacked.
I'm wondering if the fact that I sheeped someone on scum is clearly making me scum....have you got more to attack me with?

And please don't tell me that my vote on mala is bad because she is scumreading me, your vote on me is equally bad in that perspective.

P-edit: looking forward to that VCA

TierShift · Post Post #521 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 11:30 am

Ftr I think that scum is in mala/nat with a slight lean on the former.

TierShift · Post Post #522 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 11:34 am

Oh and emerald your walls aren't bad, you post your thoughts in an organized way which is nice.

I still want to know why yiley was town according to you.

Shadowmod · Post Post #523 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 11:40 am

Vote Count

emeraldemon

(0/4):

TierShift

Malakittens

(3/4): Natirasha, Mindgamer, TierShift

TierShift

(1/4): emeraldemon

not voting

(2/6): Rothwell, Malakittens

6 alive, 4 to lynch, 3 to no lynch

Day 1:

(expired on 2014-01-02 15:00:00)

Malakittens · Post Post #524 (ISO) » Sat Dec 21, 2013 2:38 pm

Okay so my VCA is all done, but just need to spoiler it and grab something from another game and it will be posted.

A few things though:

Nati explain your vote on me as you failed to do so as I asked of you.

Also you say you 'bussed' Yiley right out of Day 2 which is ... wrong... Secondly, your vote on Yiley lacks everything, including pressure after the vote. Just seemed like a spot to lay your vote down rather than you actually thought he was suspicious. I mean really if you did why didn't you push?

Tier you been so 'umg' roth is going to lolhammer, but you put me at L-1 why aren't you afraid of him lolhammering this day phrase? I also noted that both you and Yiley used a similar defense when questioned. Also is it just the fact my post "sucked" because I recall you townreading me Day 2 for 'weak reasons', but quick to call me town after I hammered Yiley, but then after seeing two votes on me you were like your posts were bad "vote".