Micro 269: See Nine Minus Minus (Game Over!)

[Sakura Hana]

This game should show DBK how dangerous i am with a vigilante role.

I mean considering my scumread on SC they probably would have died before they even claimed.

[Stuffed Crust]

Oh, I -never- would have claimed if I knew there was a possible vig in the setup.

[DoctorPepper]

And i'm just gonna leave this thread with an

I told you so!

But oh well, no one ever listens to me anyway...

Funny Sakura, Im gonna say the same thing about you with regards to Titus

ANyway sorry for lurky ness in the hydra. I'm kinda guilty for constantly letting my hydra partners pick up the slack in some games, so Im gonna stop hydra-ing for a while. This has happened to both you and Who.

GG scum.

[TierShift]

@bard: thanks, I get townreads from it a lot of the time, tho. I think it's more playstyle than anything. I find it really hard to make substantial posts in the first few pages, so I do it like this, regardless of alignment.

Things I think I did wrong/should improve on as town:
1. Be less naive (I can't BELIEVE that I actually bought SC not attacking bulba due to possible no kill or roleblock)
2. Never ever try to speedlynch anyone without letting them talk regardless of how much I think they are scum (bulba lynch ugh >.>)
3. Always have an eye on who's posting and their style and what scumpairs are possible (possibilities were bulba/CDP, bulba/titus and SC/titus and I should have realised that the people posting were only possible scum+a very naive player (no offense bard, I was too) and I should definitely have waited for more input from CDP and bulba)
4. Keep an eye out for scum IIoA (Titus, and she was just too damn friendly and unsuspicious of me the last page)

Thoughts on my current list and what to add?
I won't take offense at anything just say it

[Stuffed Crust]

-Never believe someone who wants to convince you of something. Always come to your own conclusions.
-Never believe anyone's claim. Ever.

S'bout it.

[Sakura Hana]

Looks nice, also trust people that are willing to work with you more often (I was scumreading you though not much as SC, yet I was willing to work with you and figure your motives if you didnt realize). Check overall play outside of claims (Who was more scummy overall regardless of claims Bulba or SC) and then check whether their targets make sense with their play.

Overexplanation, Scum tends to overexplain things more often than town.

Who's more reckless, who's more survivalistic, who's more careful, most of these are playstyles but there's some disntinct difference between the 2.

Also you could ask mastin2 on some pointers in the mafia academy thread in mafia discussion, he's a great teacher, you could also read his guides if you want to.

PEd.

-Never believe anyone's claim. Ever.

This is worth double on closed setups and triple on role madness or theme games (where scum usually has fake claims provided by the mod)

[TierShift]

-Never believe someone who wants to convince you of something. Always come to your own conclusions.
-Never believe anyone's claim. Ever.

S'bout it.

I tend to do the first part...mainly because I'm new and other people's points sometimes make more sense than my own thoughts. That's bad? (Honest question)

Why can't I believe people's claims? If their play seems consistent with their claim, wht shouldn't I?

@Sakura: I did think bulba was more scummy than SC. Their targets tho

I've read mastin's guides when I just started but I'll reread them. I don't really have a concrete question to ask him, I think I'll just keep on learning by playing and afterwards asling comments on my play.

Thanks guys I'll reference myself to this thread every time I'm completely sure of anything and slap myself in the face and read these comments

[TierShift]

also trust people that are willing to work with you more often

I think I did this. This is why I thought Fu less likely to be scum and als made me have doubts about you vs titus for scum. Is this always a good indicator of alignment?

[TierShift]

Why did the mafia feel like they had to fakeclaim?

It was damn risky and I would possibly have pulled in a bulba lynch regardless. Furthermore, neither of you were likely to get lynched D3.

[Stuffed Crust]

I wanted to rush a win, and it'd give me a bit more power to do so. If it didn't work out, Titus could bus me for towncred.

Nah, just get more confident in your own thought process and so on. Sometimes people's points will make a lot of sense, and sometimes they are right, but most of the time people are trying to convince you of something for reasons that only benefit that person.

A good player can always make his play consistent with his claims. Town should only ever need to claim when it is absolutely necessary (Claims at L-1, Mason, Cop if their investigated town are at L-1, etc). S'bout it.

[Titus]

I felt a fake claim was an option but not required. I was surprised SC claimed when he did. Personally, I figured he'd wait until L minus one.

Also, I felt the strongman missassumption was helpful. Everyone supposes a strongarm gets used day 1. I cannot see why. I wanted to keep it until it became necessary or useless. As town, I would one shot cop n1 but hold off until much later with the others.

[FuDuzn]

So I am the only one who thought Titus was obv scum? Good though, now I don't have to buy any of you a beer

Seriously though, I wish I had more time when the heat wad starting to pour down on me, I feel.as if I let the town down buy not having the time to display a proper case on Titus.

Also, stop being so scummy bulba. And Big Balls, you were just the same big balls all along.....I guess I was the one who was different

[FuDuzn]

Holy typos, I used to be able to hold my liquor and still type on my phone.

Also, well played scum, you deserved this victory.

[Titus]

Well, you can do it now. I'd love to learn why you thought I was so scummy. My scum play is improving, but I still have a lot to learn.

[FuDuzn]

Felt like you were tunneling me in a way, everything I said and did you found a way to make it seem like it was coming from a scum perspective. Honestly I think that says a lot to how well you played as scum, only I was able to pick up on it since only I knew I was coming from a townie mindset.

The onus is on me for not being able to find the time to put together a good case on you, but even though I may have been buried too deep. You played well as scum.

Next time though you won't be so lucky

[Titus]

Fu, if you were scumreading me for tunnelling, then you'll lynch me damn near every game LOL. I've been trying to cut back on tunnelling. This time it worked though bc my target was already perceived as scummy.

I really like the C9 and JK setups as scum. They allow for much more strategizing than purely closed or open setups.

[BBmolla]

Would have INSTA LYNCHED that Roleblocker claim

gg wp

[Bulbazak]

I get swamped and can't post immediately, and you guys go off the handle because you can't notice PR play. You guys are idiots...

Good job Varsoon and Titus. You guys had me fooled.

[Bulbazak]

And like I said, and was going to say again: We shouldn't be lynching PR claims in Mylo. The whole point was for PoE and to lynch out of the non-PR claims.

[TierShift]

If one of bulba or Titus isn't scum I will buy you all a beer.

Bulba wasn't scum, so one of them wasn't scum, aka you owe me a beer

[FuDuzn]

Jeez, still twisting my words to your liking are we?

Titus was scum, ergo one of them was scum.......no beer for you !

[Bulbazak]

- Is anyone interested in a See Nine "Finale?" It's not going to be something only people in the See Nine games will be able to play, but the flavor (yes, actual flavor!) would be related to this and Open 512. I'd also probably need a few people to help design the setup since I'm not too great at designing normal setups from the ground up.

Heck yes! /pre-in

Policy lynch varsoon day 1 in finale

That's what we said at the end of last game. You can see how well that turned out...

4. Keep an eye out for scum IIoA (Titus, and she was just too damn friendly and unsuspicious of me the last page)

Did you also notice where she outed her scumteam during the NKA?

also trust people that are willing to work with you more often

I think I did this. This is why I thought Fu less likely to be scum and als made me have doubts about you vs titus for scum. Is this always a good indicator of alignment?

It's not. Mastin's fooled me like this before.

Also, stop being so scummy bulba.

Diddo to you. You were OMGUSing something hard.

And this is another example of how much potential Sakura has as a player. It's sad that she's leaving due to being unable to separate her emotions from her play.

[Titus]

/pre-in.

I am ready to kick ass again.

Tier, being cooperative is good as either alignment. I tend to foster overcooperatoveness as scum.

[quadz08]