Open 544: Tit for Tat (Game Over)

[Sakura Hana]

Vote Count 1.05

Flames of Disaster (5) - Tlachta C, Captain Picard, Hopkirk, Ibarra, MTD [L-2]

Celebloki (3) - Lorantheceae, Lincolm, No Stone Unturned
Tlachta C (2) - Flames of Disaster, Celebloki
Malakittens (1) - Saki

Not Voting (1) - Malakittens

With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

Please let me know if you see any mistakes

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2014-01-31 06:08:00)

[Captain Picard]

it seemed opportunistic bc the reason was really weak (I find arguments based exclusively on where people's votes are, not putting a vote etc. tend not to be valid) and it felt like you threw it on there just to have an excuse to jump on the wagon. then it felt like you were setting up for a jump back onto him later by claiming yo uwere "giving him a pass", even after you admitted it was weak. however, your recent posting has been better and I think this may just be your general tone

how much experience do you have? you don't seem new 0.0

It wasn't a wagon at that point, why are you calling it that? At that point, it was Tla and myself. 2 people.

So, instead of looking at what was going on, you voted me because "my reasoning was weak"? You didn't comment at all on the other wagon, so how should I judge your reasoning to vote me?

the initial reasons for voting him (saying someone was scummy but not voting them) were bad and I'm inclined to agree nitpicking on votes isn't a good argument. I'm inclined to agree he hasn't done much scumhunting. his reaction to tlachta reminds me of my reaction when I think scum is pushing on me but it's easily fakeable

I'm thinking he is a VI, do you concur?

[Captain Picard]

thoughts on Hopkirk and Lincolm?

I'll answer you when you answer me. I asked you first, afterall

how much experience do you have? you don't seem new 0.0

Is this relevant on my alignment? If not, why even ask?

[No Stone Unturned]

It wasn't a wagon at that point, why are you calling it that? At that point, it was Tla and myself. 2 people.

So, instead of looking at what was going on, you voted me because "my reasoning was weak"? You didn't comment at all on the other wagon, so how should I judge your reasoning to vote me?

1. any vote is still a "wagon". it just consists of only 2 votes
2. by voting him it could easily move the wagon along and make it get bigger. so it could still have easily been an opportunistic jump especially considering it seemed like the wagon would take off

what makes you think I wasn't looking at what was going on? I looked at what was going on and I saw you making a jump with weak reasoning

I'm thinking he is a VI, do you concur?

while I don't like calling people VIs I'm inclined to agree that although he looks scummy there's a good chance that can be attributed to him being new. so yeah

I'll answer you when you answer me. I asked you first, afterall

sry I must have missed it. link plz

Is this relevant on my alignment? If not, why even ask?

yes. if you're new I'd feel very comfortable with you town bc your play so far seems really town motivated for a newbie. however if you're experienced I wouldn't wanna write you off as town yet bc you would more likely be able to fake. it helps me read you if I can attribute certain behaviors to being new as oppose dto necessarily scum, or in this case if you do smth town motivated that a new player would be less likely to fake

[Lincolm]

@Lincolm: Eh, where does that vote come from! As far as I see, nothing in your post hints at it, still you put an "=" before it as if it was the logical consequence...

Because I want lynch him ASAP?

Because he isn't doing anything. He only commented everything on general. Indeed, as town and as scum someone can do this, but I consider this as active lurking. Town or not, he deserve a wagon IMO because you know why.

@NSU

: ^

That's isn't logical consequence, I just use it as divider of my post. I use it because it is easy to read and use.

For NTU being a hydra,

I am seeing a serious fucking lack of participation here

What? I don't get this. I like you to elaborate this more, please? (Anyway, Singaporean?)

This is bad, and if you're town, you should feel bad.

care to explain why? while I agree it doesn't accomplish much it looks town motivated

I would agree that Flames's reason is "something" (though I consider because his newness), but discrediting vote with assumption and he think how his reason will be accepted by everyone are terrible. What I mean, scum can make a "reason" also.

The post that I quoted, at least it is sum everything I thought about him, he is opportunistic and survivalist as fuck. He is suspecting a person who vote him, seriously, which give me not-so-important scum ping at him. It can be a scum who scum-paint someone, but I don't think this is the scenario, probably.

Lincolm's stuff is a bit more, but it also looks more than it is contentwise, relevant statements are mostly, that some things from Picard are bad and a short conversation with Flames. And the there is that out-of-thin-air Cele Vote.

I don't like to explain when I'm not being asked (I thought Pieguy knows this? Nvm). Just saying.

how much experience do you have? you don't seem new 0.0

Is this relevant on my alignment? If not, why even ask?

Tbh, I'm hoping the cat out from his sack.

I'm thinking he is a VI, do you concur?

while I don't like calling people VIs I'm inclined to agree that although he looks scummy there's a good chance that can be attributed to him being new. so yeah

He is new.

=

it feels like you're scared to admit you're wrong

I agree with this, but do you think this is alignment indicative or meta? (I think it is the latter btw)

@Pieguy/NSU

: Answer please.

=

Dunno why, but both of you (NSU and Picard) are stuck in my head. Stop make noisy noise at my head. You guys are distractions for me.

Vote : Hopkirk

This guy is scum.

[Captain Picard]

thoughts on Hopkirk and Lincolm?

I could get behind a Hopkirk lynch, he is in my top 3, I don't like how he limped onto the Flames wagon, he also hasn't participated much, though the game is still fairly new.

Lincolm I was null on, his last post gives him more town cred though.

I don't like using VI either, I just wanted to use the most offensive term for a newbie I could to see your reaction.

And no, I am not new, though I haven't played a game in awhile. Probably been a year and a half or 2 years since I last played.

[MTD]

Lincolm's post is looking good IMO.

I don't think I can support a Hopkirk lynch yet, but still,
Hopkirk, you have some playing to do.

[Hopkirk]

Picard is null town on while flames is mildly scum.
Mtd and celi seem town. Tlanctar and ibaraa seem nice.

Lincoln is suspicious. So far i've made a vote with no revealed reasoning and put a few questions out that haven't been answered. So his response is a vote on me with no reasoning (and my questions aren't being answered either).

@Mtd: Two questions. Firstly if having 4 posts+wondering about wagons is bad why are you talking about me rather than saki who has said they want to pick between wagons, has 4 posts and no reasons for anything.

[Hopkirk]

@Picard: Why is lack of activity one of your biggest scum tells.
(And how can you not like someone with your avatar in their name)

[Tlachta C]

Hi guys
Firstly,
VOTE: Vote: MTD
I'm getting bad vibes from this slot.

Flames looks slightl better recently, I like that he openly conceded that point to Picard, and I can buy into the argument that he is just a flailing newbtown. His case on me is obnoxious but I think that’s just his freshness, hehe.

@Flames, I read your post #98 and it was tedious to do so. It’s funny you accused me of nitpicking when you’ve now go back through my iso nitpicking out every single thing possible to question. Why didn’t you ask me any of those questions at the time?
My answers:
-it’s scummy because your words didn’t match up with your actions
- Ibarria is town because I don’t see scum doing an opening like he did. Picard is town because his defences sound very genuine.
-of course.

[Tlachta C]

@Tla: Picard's only reason back then was trhat Flames didn't vote and I don't think that's a great argument when flames stated himself, that he is not sure.

Flames said his gut felt it was scum so why wouldn’t you go with your instincts and just vote? Ib had 2 votes on him so it wouldn’t have led to a quickhammer or something. That’s the reason it was so bothersome, because it felt like Flames wasnt backing up what he was saying, his acctions didn’t match his words. Which, by the way, for page 2, is a FINE argument for someone being scum. I mean, seriously MTD what sort of arguments are you expecting on page 2?

I agree with this. The interaction between Tla and Flames has irked me. I'm having a hard time differentiating between if Flames is being scummy or just being newbie-ish. His vote on Piacrd was obviously OMGUS and he seems to flame any post Picard makes.

Tla's initial vote on Flames was for a reason that was flimsy at best and Tla hasn't really contributed much since the vote other than to tell people to join the wagon. It either looks like Tla is taking advantage of Flame's newbie-ness or is Bussing him if they are buddies.

Pfffft. If I was buddies with flames I’d be voting myself.
Can you clarify what has irked you exactly about our interactions?

[Tlachta C]

Lincoln has gone into thee town pile.

[Tlachta C]

Tla's explanation(or lack thereof) fails to account for these questions, and is clearly a shallow reasoning to place a vote and push a mislynch.

The C doesn't stand for clairvoyant, y'know.

[Loranthaceae]

Either way I have a scum lean on both Tla and Flames but don't feel like putting flames at L-1 so instead

Do you have any townreads?

[Captain Picard]

What? I don't get this. I like you to elaborate this more, please? (Anyway, Singaporean?)

I would just think, with 2 people playing they would have more to say, possible they are scum and they have to wait for each other to confer in their hydra channel so they don't slip up/say something that contradicts what the other head said? Just thinking as town, there would be no reason to lie, so... *shrug* I've never hydraed before.

@Picard: Why is lack of activity one of your biggest scum tells.

It isn't.

Lack of activity in and of itself isn't a scum tell, you have to look at the meat of the posts, you could have someone with a ton of activity, but it could all be useless fluff vs someone who posts just once a day but generates a lot.

[MTD]

@Tla: Picard's only reason back then was trhat Flames didn't vote and I don't think that's a great argument when flames stated himself, that he is not sure.

Flames said his gut felt it was scum so why wouldn’t you go with your instincts and just vote? Ib had 2 votes on him so it wouldn’t have led to a quickhammer or something. That’s the reason it was so bothersome, because it felt like Flames wasnt backing up what he was saying, his acctions didn’t match his words. Which, by the way, for page 2, is a FINE argument for someone being scum. I mean, seriously MTD what sort of arguments are you expecting on page 2?

Ok, I know that was the reasoning presented, I still don't think you have to vote someone because your gut says so and otherwise you are scum.
Also I think his actions did match his words, they wouldn't if he had said " I'm pretty sure he is scum" or something, but as he stated he wasn't sure, I do believe it matches that not to vote. I know that that vote wouldn't have been a terrible move, but I also know that some people are generally more reluctant to vote than other, you know, it still feels bad to have started the wrong bandwagon
I know that you can't expect the best arguments on D2, that's why I am not weighing it as heavy as Flames' very bad argument ("he is annoying") on the same page, but still I don't really like it.

[Hopkirk]

@Picard: Then why would you say voting scummy people is bad? Otherwise the two reasons for me being your top scum read aren't even things yo think are scummy.

[MTD]

Picard is null town on while flames is mildly scum.
Mtd and celi seem town. Tlanctar and ibaraa seem nice.

Lincoln is suspicious. So far i've made a vote with no revealed reasoning and put a few questions out that haven't been answered. So his response is a vote on me with no reasoning (and my questions aren't being answered either).

@Mtd: Two questions. Firstly if having 4 posts+wondering about wagons is bad why are you talking about me rather than saki who has said they want to pick between wagons, has 4 posts and no reasons for anything.

Because NSU asked for opinions about you and not about Saki? I never said you where the worst, right?

Also there were some questions directed at you, that still need answering as well.

[MTD]

Also that was only one question and not two...

[No Stone Unturned]

I'm not really awake yet, but I wanna chip in and say that I feel really uncomfortable about the speed that the Flames wagon filled up.
Will give this more input and stuff when my head doesn't feel like a block of cheese.

-V

[No Stone Unturned]

Like, Thlatcha feels more like an 'abandon ship' than anything else, and it really feels like this is the point where the wagon is either abandoned or pushed through, so this is the best point to figure out who is pushing what and why.

-V

[No Stone Unturned]

I feel like the Flames wagon is scum-motivated, for the record. No way does a wagon get 5 votes in 5 pages on D1 without scum being there.

-V

[Hopkirk]

I feel like the Flames wagon is scum-motivated, for the record. No way does a wagon get 5 votes in 5 pages on D1 without scum being there.

-V

Just to confirm: You read flames as strong town?

[Captain Picard]

Good god, what a stupid question.

I don't think anyone reads him as "strong" town.

Town, yes, leaning that way, but strong? Hell no.

He could be as noob scum as he is noob town.

I know you asked NSU, but that was a dumb question, almost like you were "attempting" to scumhunt. Why would you ask that, do you not know the answer already?

[Hopkirk]

I have an important reason for asking the question obviously and it's not a question for you.
They are unlikely to say yes but if i ask them my real question directly they will attempt to say flames is a strong town read to avoid it.