Mini 1536 - Silph Co. Reverse Mafia (Game Over)

[TierShift]

I still have no idea why anyone would vote whiskers, who voluntarily shared role info with us. Does anyone truly believe an anti-town 3rd party would just claim 3rd party? Really?
I think she actually is third party by now, seeing how long she keeps this up.

Dry, why don't you come over for a bulba vote? I'm actually down to vote max as well, but it seems like there is less support for a max lynch.

Tier's going for

any lynch

again?

Maybe I do somehow have him and pasch mixed up with alignments.

The there's maxous. He's helpful, tries to scumhunt, but it all seems a bit superficial. He doesn't strike me as overly scummy, but 382 doesn't look like town. I'd be down to lynch him, but I'd rather lynch this guy.
Bulba.

Hmm?

@Bulba: I don't think mad role speculation will help us with anything. Maybe you got the flavor right, but guessing the exact role is hardly possible.

[Cheery Dog]

It's more the timing of when you made the comment that made me thoughtful, your next post after Dry-fit mentioned he was considering moving off Max.

[Maxous]

Max, Bulb has been extremely town today. You're barking up the wrong tree.

dude, idk anymore. This game is hard.
It's making me think the scum are in the good players. Bulb is #1 on that list, and the fact that RBD + Emp thought he was scum kinda helps too.

You seemed to be thinking Tier-scum awhile ago. Why the sudden reverse, and why so downhearted about it, as if we are twisting your arm? Is it because Tier is saying he'd be willing to lynch you?

Tier willing to lynch in a weak manner is irritating me and I'm a bit doubtful he would be doing that as scum.
the 'downherated' thing was about cheery who is being so goddamn stubborn he might be town..plus I'm rather tired of going nowhere with the arguing.

[Kenobi]

Hey guys, sorry, I get home and my net's shitting itself. I've caught up as best I can, insofar as being able to read one page every 10-15 minutes can be considered catching up. Currently, I'm seeing no reason to shift my vote from Pasche, Cheery's seeming fairly town to me, Aj is still solid, and I honestly have no smegging clue what Tier's doing any more. I'll try to post more frequently, but honestly it's gonna require me to actually have internet, so for now consider this a prod-dodge.

[Bulbazak]

and the fact that RBD + Emp thought he was scum kinda helps too.

RBD and I haven't been getting along recently, and Emp was just playing bad.

Tier willing to lynch in a weak manner is irritating me and I'm a bit doubtful he would be doing that as scum.

Why?

[Espeonage]

Hey guys, stuff has been hectic the past week. My gf's 21st, and I slipped down a tile staircase at work so I've been in quite a bit of pain. However I am back now and will update today.

[Dry-fit]

so Pasch can track Whiskers and prove he is a tracker role at least, but we can't trust Whiskers verifying it because Whiskers claimed a third party role.

Why in the world would we waste a track on Whiskers at this point?

Dry, why don't you come over for a bulba vote? I'm actually down to vote max as well, but it seems like there is less support for a max lynch.

I don't really think Bulba is scum.

[Paschendale]

Hey guys, stuff has been hectic the past week. My gf's 21st, and I slipped down a tile staircase at work so I've been in quite a bit of pain. However I am back now and will update today.

Take care of yourself, buddy.

[Espeonage]

Vote Count

Bulbazak:

TierShift, Maxous

Maxous:

Dry-fit

Tiershift:

Bulbazak, Aj The Epic

Paschendale:

Cheery Dog, Kenobi, Whiskers (L-3)

Whiskers:

Paschendale

Not Voting: cxinlee

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

Thanks for your patience guys.

[Maxous]

Tier willing to lynch in a weak manner is irritating me and I'm a bit doubtful he would be doing that as scum.

Why?

true, it's assuming he is playing optimally but you don't puncture your life raft do you?

so Pasch can track Whiskers and prove he is a tracker role at least, but we can't trust Whiskers verifying it because Whiskers claimed a third party role.

Why in the world would we waste a track on Whiskers at this point?

I was pointing out Cheery's logic, not advocating paschendale track whiskers.

~

Since i'm not getting Cheery or Bulb lynched i'll

unvote, vote: Whiskers

I would rather avoid the potential king-maker scenario where we are begging for whisker's help tomorrow when he can easily turn around and go "lol fuk u"
he is helping the town today because it is optimal but tomorrow in a lylo situation it will be optimal for him

not to

. I assume he will be playing to his win condition and not helping us out of sympathy.
claiming third party isn't just in the town interests, it's in his own as well - he's guaranteeing to avoid a night kill. if he is lying about being thirdparty..well

dont lie

better than a paschendale lynch at any rate.

[TierShift]

claiming third party isn't just in the town interests, it's in his own as well - he's guaranteeing to avoid a night kill.

This shit is good max.

I'm finally seeing why an anti-town 3rd party would claim 3rd party.

Problem that we're having, is that we will probably be in the same situation tomorrow as today. I think there has been far too little discussion as to who is scum, people refuse to see other people's points, etc.

So, whiskers would make a decent deadline lynch but I'd hugely prefer if we caught scum today. I'll be rereading a bit and maybe show some new insights afterwards.

[Bulbazak]

Maxous, where are you getting that we'll be in Lylo tomorrow?

[TierShift]

Holy crap is that a SK slip.

[Maxous]

Maxous, where are you getting that we'll be in Lylo tomorrow?

if we mislynch and there is a successful night-kill there will be 8 remaining...so lylo

[Bulbazak]

Maxous, where are you getting that we'll be in Lylo tomorrow?

if we mislynch and there is a successful night-kill there will be 8 remaining...so lylo

Typical scum team for a 13 player game is 3, so that would be Mylo.

[Cheery Dog]

Have we ruled out survivor as the win condition? Otherwise it could be mylo today.

[Whiskers]

he's guaranteeing to avoid a night kill.

Except, not in the slightest.

[Whiskers]

I still have no idea why anyone would vote whiskers, who voluntarily shared role info with us. Does anyone truly believe an anti-town 3rd party would just claim 3rd party? Really?
I think she actually is third party by now, seeing how long she keeps this up.

Dry, why don't you come over for a bulba vote? I'm actually down to vote max as well, but it seems like there is less support for a max lynch.

"Wow, how can 3rd party claim and be bad?"

claiming third party isn't just in the town interests, it's in his own as well - he's guaranteeing to avoid a night kill.

This shit is good max.

I'm finally seeing why an anti-town 3rd party would claim 3rd party.

Problem that we're having, is that we will probably be in the same situation tomorrow as today. I think there has been far too little discussion as to who is scum, people refuse to see other people's points, etc.

So, whiskers would make a decent deadline lynch but I'd hugely prefer if we caught scum today. I'll be rereading a bit and maybe show some new insights afterwards.

"Wow, after that one line, I

FINALLY

see how 3rd party can be bad and claim." Didn't take a whole hell of a lot of convincing. There's a lot of gravity in how you phrase this-- like you've been looking for the answer for a long time, and Maxous' dissertation really made you think, and reconsider things. No, dude. It was one line, in direct response to your question that you asked like, a post ago? OH THANK GOODNESS, FINALLY!
Also you're playing the good townie "yey lets lynch scum!" Yeah, great-- go ahead and do it. You reread yet?

Also

might be worthy of note, is that your previous post, you're all like, "damn, I'd like to lynch MAxous so much, because he's scum" and now you're going, "Aw yiss, Maxous knows what's up, better listen to him."

Holy crap is that a SK slip.

holy crap-- are you joking?

[TierShift]

Uh, are you suggesting I'm looking for a reason to join your wagon? I'm pretty sure it's not necessary.

The fact that he thinks it would be lylo means 2 NK's thus he knows there's a SK. Not a slip?

[Aj The Epic]

So Whiskers, can I interest you in a tiershift lynch yet? It's rather obvious that we're getting close to an endgame for the mafia... we've gone 2 lynches with no success and they've gotten a free kill. Given a third party as well, and the fact that Coney Island games do generally have at least three mafia members, we should at least suspect that we need a mafia lynch.

Which is why it is even WORSE that people want Whiskers today. That, at the end of the day, is still a win for the mafia fraction because it just is one less person towards the 50/50 Town/mafia ratio wincon. Lynching a third party player at this point over trying to get scum hung is strictly anti-town due to the fact that we gain no ground against the scum team. We can't afford to not lynch scum at this point in the game.

[Dry-fit]

AJ the thing is we've had an extra kill in this game night 1 in a game that already has a flipped town killing role. So Whiskers could well be anti-town.

[Whiskers]

I don't have a kill.

There, you happy?

now

I'm "guaranteeing to avoid as nightkill."

@AJ: I was on Tiershift's wagon before pasche decided we should 1v1. I have no problem going back, although perhaps you should consider he's one of the few players who

hasn't

suggesting lynching me. (Because in the post where you say, "let's lynch Tier!" you also say, "voting whiskers is antitown!")

[Maxous]

There, you happy?

now

I'm "guaranteeing to avoid as nightkill."

which would imply that beforehand, you felt that you were leaving yourself open to the possibility of drawing the nightkill.
see, the problem I have with this is - since you are third party - if you drew the nightkill, presumably

you would lose

you are expecting us to believe that you are playing detrimental to your independent win condition and helping us out because we are sucking and mislynching.
I don't think so. If I was third party in your position, I would chuck the town to the wolves if they weren't pulling their shit together.

Sidenote: If whiskers is telling the truth and he did not shoot the extra kill, that would mean somebody else did. Another third party did. A second town vig would of claimed by now.
If there are 2 third party roles in this game, (has there ever been if a 13 player game? ), that would suggest a 2 mafia team because otherwise it would be a bit unfair.

Typical scum team for a 13 player game is 3, so that would be Mylo.

and yeeeeeah, yourself being more interested in correcting my terminology than addressing the points I made regarding Whiskers?
Lemme jot that down as another reason you're scum here bulba.
You have been poking Whiskers from a safe distance this entire time.
Trying to learn his role but not going in aggressively so you won't be shot by him.

[TierShift]

I've done a bit of rereading. I don't see bulb and pasch as scum together, seeing how bulb handled pasch's claim. Pasch is probably town anyway, I see now.

What keeps jumping out at me, is this:

Bulb: Why would you know that 'flipflopping and bad play, are part of [Tier's] town game'?

Because I've played with town Tier before. And I would charactarize Tier's play as having a sort of genuine earnestness behind trying to figure things out.

Before you're metaing on this scale, have you also played with him as scum?

Not yet, but I expect that there would be a difference in the way he would reach conclusions.

Using a lynch he pushed to springboard other lynches leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

It still doesn't look like a genuine scumread to me and the way how this is his only argument for me-scum versus all the others he has given for me-town really stinks.
Plus, the way in which he didn't really doubt pasch's claim at any moment, but just acted a little bit surprised and then went along doesn't really look like a town reaction to someone claiming, more like scum who know the claim to be true.

[TierShift]

I'm liking cx less upon a reread. He has a sense of...not wanting to figure things out...being happy just to stroll by. He seemed to scumread pasch but then unvoted in an unexplained manner. He townread emp for whatever reason I can't see but still decided to vote him. He doesn't actually care about his reads day 3. He's been posting elsewhere but just letting this game rot.

Does anybody have meta on him?