Newbie 1495 (DAY 4) - The One where Everyone got Murdered

[Shinobi]

I've been around, I've just been lurking and not posting much because I just don't see what I can add at this point.

All I want to say is that I'm incredibly unwilling to lynch BBT. I still think he's one of the townier players in the thread, so if we had to lynch between Wolfy and BBT, I'd pick Wolfy.

[Moratorium]

We don't have to lynch between Wolfy and BBT, Mr. False Dilemma.

Is Xayzeck Voldamort in your world? Are you not permitted to speak of him?

[Shinobi]

We don't have to lynch between Wolfy and BBT, Mr. False Dilemma.

Is Xayzeck Voldamort in your world? Are you not permitted to speak of him?

I already told you what I thought of Xayzeck. I keep forgetting that he exists, and I'm not sure if it's his playstyle or because he's scum avoiding the limelight. I played with him last game and he was scum, but he has the same feel of not sticking out in his posts and I'm not sure if it's because that's how he plays or if because he rolled mafia again.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I've been around, I've just been lurking and not posting much because I just don't see what I can add at this point.

All I want to say is that I'm incredibly unwilling to lynch BBT. I still think he's one of the townier players in the thread, so if we had to lynch between Wolfy and BBT, I'd pick Wolfy.

I'm not overly happy with your post given how inactive you have been lately. I was expecting you to add a little more than that. Have you developed reads on other players?

We don't have to lynch between Wolfy and BBT, Mr. False Dilemma.

Is Xayzeck Voldamort in your world? Are you not permitted to speak of him?

This post actually made me lol. Well done.

[Malakittens]

Personally, I beg to differ with BBT. Also your previous posts made me think you were scum reading him
shin only because you couldn't get him to get his reads out.

Ill be amazed at this point if both wolfy and BBT are town. I'm 90% sure at least one is scum.

Mora is town for latest posts. I don't see how people are scum reading him.

Anyways lunch is over so not much analyitiz because I don't have te time til I'm home. And even then I'm tired as hell atm so I might not be around that often

[Xayzeck]

Hi i'm here

catching up from my last post

[Xayzeck]

I already told you what I thought of Xayzeck. I keep forgetting that he exists, and I'm not sure if it's his playstyle or because he's scum avoiding the limelight. I played with him last game and he was scum, but he has the same feel of not sticking out in his posts and I'm not sure if it's because that's how he plays or if because he rolled mafia again.

everyone else remembers me just fine though

[Xayzeck]

Between his post 109 and 160 he changed his read on me from a weak townread to a possible lynch candidate.

why can't i lynch a weak townread?

[Xayzeck]

Ill be amazed at this point if both wolfy and BBT are town. I'm 90% sure at least one is scum.

why can't they both be town?

[Shinobi]

I already told you what I thought of Xayzeck. I keep forgetting that he exists, and I'm not sure if it's his playstyle or because he's scum avoiding the limelight. I played with him last game and he was scum, but he has the same feel of not sticking out in his posts and I'm not sure if it's because that's how he plays or if because he rolled mafia again.

everyone else remembers me just fine though

And I have absolutely no idea why this is.

I just looked through your filter, and you've done precisely fuck all this game. You haven't had any reads, and the majority of your posts are questions or speculation on setup. I've played with you, and I know you like to use proper punctuation and spelling and whatnot, but you don't seem to be doing any of that there.

Now, bear with me, but when I see someone typing incorrectly, I generally want to ignore them because I think less of them. Call me an elitist or whatever, but I think it's possible that mafia could type incorrectly intentionally to have people gloss over their posts, which is what I felt like I was doing. With the majority of the newbies talking and contributing (and one of them being a cop) it feels like you could be doing more.

This is very important. Give us your list of reads, and tell us who you think is scum.

[Moratorium]

but I think it's possible that mafia could type incorrectly intentionally to have people gloss over their posts

That's a first for me. "I think you are scum because typos."

[Shinobi]

Personally, I beg to differ with BBT. Also your previous posts made me think you were scum reading him
shin only because you couldn't get him to get his reads out.

Ill be amazed at this point if both wolfy and BBT are town. I'm 90% sure at least one is scum.

Mora is town for latest posts. I don't see how people are scum reading him.

Anyways lunch is over so not much analyitiz because I don't have te time til I'm home. And even then I'm tired as hell atm so I might not be around that often

I said I had a townread on him a while ago, and I gave the reasoning in #91.

but I think it's possible that mafia could type incorrectly intentionally to have people gloss over their posts

That's a first for me. "I think you are scum because typos."

That's...Simplifying things too much. I think he's scum because he doesn't stand out in any of his posts. A majority of what he has said so far consists of poorly written one-liners, along with meaningless posts about setup. Those "typos" just reinforce the fact that he doesn't want to stand out, especially considering the fact that I've seen him play before with correct punctuation. He's capable of putting effort into what he's saying, but I don't feel like that's the case here.

[Moratorium]

Anyways lunch is over so not much

analyitiz

because I don't have

te

time til I'm home.

Shinobi scumread detected.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Also, I just wanted to make sure that that was all you said/wanted to say about BBT. I'm a little busy right now, but I want to take a look at what you said and say some things because a lot of what you were saying about him bugged me. I'll post my thoughts on your case later.

Can you continue with this please. I was, and still am, awaiting your thoughts.

[Moratorium]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[Shinobi]

Also, I just wanted to make sure that that was all you said/wanted to say about BBT. I'm a little busy right now, but I want to take a look at what you said and say some things because a lot of what you were saying about him bugged me. I'll post my thoughts on your case later.

Can you continue with this please. I was, and still am, awaiting your thoughts.

Oh shit, I forgot about that.

Will do, give me a minute.

[Shinobi]

Here I was looking forward to a lazy Sunday morning... Here's your PbPA FMPOV.

#48, #50, #55, #57, #59, #75, #79, #96, #100, #112, #116, #124 are all posts where you discuss player activity. It's laughable to say you don't want this topic to be at the forefront of everyone's minds. Allows for easy "scumhunting", in my view.

I actually agree with this, but it's clear that he isn't just focusing on inactivity in the thread. I think this part of your case was made during a part of the game when almost half the game was still lurking and before he was interacting with everyone else. (Granted, there are still plenty of lurkers, but almost everyone has had some impact on the thread, however small.)

Looking through his filter, it feels like you're stretching to look for reasons to find him scummy. I simply don't see it at all. He puts emphasis on inactivity, but this game was plagued by it in the early stages.

I know you're trying to say that he's trying to look good, but aside from his agenda of pushing a more active thread, how exactly is he scum for doing this?

#63: "I can't pinpoint why, but I dislike everything about this post."
- I hate posts like this. Be specific. This is a "I'm with you guys" post.

It's a newbie game, and the theme is gut reads because everyone follows the IC. Are you going to shit on everyone that has gut reads? Are you going to push Mala because she loves to think with her gut? There are several players here with gut reads, but you only seemed to be focused on one person for doing so. Why?

#82: "you appear to be gathering evidence from everybody else"
- It's the main theme of the game. You paint it as a fault.

You took this out of context. The complete statement, if I'm remembering correctly, is that he had an issue with you not giving reads and just commenting on what other people were saying. You gave reads on only four players thus far, and a lot of your filter is one-liners poking holes in things rather than actual reads. Your reads at this point, as a whole, would be nice.

#86: "I have probably been the most active person in this thread"
- Pretend you are town for a second. Do you really think this is something a townie needs to say? Or do you think it is something scum feels the need to point out?

I don't understand what you're trying to say here. People are egotistical, and will take credit for the things that they do, town or scum. What reason

specifically

can you find for him being scum for taking credit for pushing activity?

#90: "You have a townread on me...how have you come to that conclusion may I ask?"
- Again, is this the kind of question a townie asks?

That depends. Am I supposed to have reads without explaining how I got them? He's asking for information, and you somehow have an issue with this. I fail to see the problem here.

you have fabricated the link between talking about lurkers and lynching lurkers from thin air with no evidence to back up your claim.

I'll admit, you have not posted the words "I am scum and wish to make easy lynches" anywhere in this game whatsoever. I'm very impressed.

I'm actually completely lost as to when and where he made any statement regarding this, and I don't know what you're trying to say here. In fact, just looking through BBT's filter gives me the vibe that this is actually the exact opposite to what you were trying to say here...I think. The entire concept of him trying to push to lynch lurkers rather than trying to get information from them seems contrived, and diving through his filter makes me believe that you were wrong about this.

Man, that took a stupid amount of filter diving. Remind me never to make a post like that again. Cripes.

[Shinobi]

Is it at all possible that Xayzeck and thatguy2 are a team?

Thatguy2's posts reek of fear, like he's afraid to do anything at all.

[Moratorium]

I don't want to start a quote-down, so I'm going to reduce this to a few points:

1) The main theme of my "case" on BBT at the time was that I didn't like the manner in which he was posting. Both the language and the style, "I'm with you guys" posts, "Hey, look at me" posts, Lynch-all-Lurkers scumhunting. I would say that in the past several pages, the posting has "improved" to where it actually feels like scumhunting.

2) BBT overuses the word "evidence" (fun exercise: Iso BBT, search for "evidence"), which is the point of your last quote of mine. It's a game of inferences and implications, true scumslips are a lot rarer than most people seem to think. So my comment is regarding how demands for "evidence" is a scummy ploy because it is often difficult to translate "This doesn't look right" into "This doesn't look right because of X".

Is it at all possible that Xayzeck and thatguy2 are a team?

Thatguy2's posts reek of fear, like he's afraid to do anything at all.

You fence-sit. A lot. You unvoted 100 posts ago. You ask vague hypotheticals.

Xayzeck, are you annoyed that your partner thatguy2 is lurking so much?

Remember that one for your next scum game.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

2) BBT overuses the word "evidence" (fun exercise: Iso BBT, search for "evidence"), which is the point of your last quote of mine. It's a game of inferences and implications, true scumslips are a lot rarer than most people seem to think. So my comment is regarding how demands for "evidence" is a scummy ploy because it is often difficult to translate "This doesn't look right" into "This doesn't look right because of X".

If somebody accuses/asks/infers/thinks something about me, they can only gain that information from my posts. Therefore, they should be able to provide said posts, as evidence, to back-up what they are saying. I don't think that's a very difficult thing to do. If you have no evidence for what you are claiming, then don't say it.

For example, she accused me and Wolfy of posting similar posts/reads and that one of us was sheeping. When in actual fact, there is no evidence to support this claim whatsoever, backed up by your VCA graph (evidence). If she cannot provide some sort of evidence for her accusations, she should keep them to herself until she can.

It should also be noted that opinions are very different from accusations/claims. I'm sure I didn't need to tell you that.

I tried to get the word evidence into this post as much as possible by the way.

[Moratorium]

If you have no evidence for what you are claiming, then don't say it.

I don't agree. That sentence, in the context of this game where half the players are playing on "gut", would result in the top poster being JacobSavage.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

If you have no evidence for what you are claiming, then don't say it.

I don't agree. That sentence, in the context of this game where half the players are playing on "gut", would result in the top poster being JacobSavage.

I'm not talking about gut feelings, I should have clarified that as well.

[Wolfy]

...if we had to lynch between Wolfy and BBT, I'd pick Wolfy.

Why? Any particular reason?
What's your read on me? Where are you getting it from?

[Malakittens]

Mala - My initial read was town, but that was based on gut feeling. Due to her inactivity levels and not much pro-town action, I am leaning towards scum

These two posts are

almost

exactly the same in reads, anyone want to guess why?



Also, the more I read BBT and Wolfy's ISO's back to back the more I see similar posts by them. Ugh, makes me believe there's a chance one is scum, but I need more time to figure out which.

Either he's scum parroting you or you could be scum. A majority of your posts are similar in terms of content. You started talking about twilight, he started talking about twilight. You worded that there wasn't enough protown activity from me; he worded it the same.

Also, Wolfy, did JS ever replied to you in regards to me?

JacobSavage.

Also, nevermind, that wasn't you. It was BBT.

Also, I'm focusing on why BBT and Wolfy's reads are almost the same. As for BBT/Mora, I'm getting a huge experienced scum player coaching ingame an inexperienced scum player vibe, but considering it's a newbie this game shouldn't be applied as heavily as other queue games.

I explained that w/o the two other players it's making it harder to read them.

I'm getting a vibe that at least one of {BBT and Wolfy} are scum. Leaning towards former than latter.

Also I'm still liking Xayz for scum~

They are mostly gut vibes which can't be fully explained at this point. I mean if you have been reading any of my posts which have some decent points as to why I'm feeling that way you would understand better. I just can't fully explain it perfectly

You can't explain it because your reads are all over the place. You're either not paying much attention, or you don't care much how you're coming across.

Since I said I was leaning scum on you, you have been trying to scum-read me. I'm gonna go ahead and assume that you're reading my posts having already decided I am scum and looking for scum tells.

First, you say that me and Wolfy are providing the same reads. That's fair enough, they were similar, but there was also noticeable differences. You follow this by saying the more you see our ISO's back to back, the more similar posts you can see. Can you provide some evidence for this?

The post about the twilight talk is absurd. I don't believe for one second you believe that's good enough to use as a scum-read.

You then moved onto the fact I had messaged a mod asking about a rule-break. So you know I am watching you, does that worry you?

You then moved on to state that me and Mora were working together as well, experienced and inexperienced scum. Can you provide some evidence to support this claim?

So, so far, you've claimed you're getting 'gut vibes' that two inexperienced scum are working together and then you claimed that an experienced scum and an inexperienced scum are working together. Have you made your mind up as to which one you have chose? Can you provide some evidence to support your thinking?

Going off gut vibes when we have 11 pages comes across as lazy. As stated earlier, you're either not paying attention to what is going on, which is feasible given your activity levels and pro-town activities so far, or you don't care how you're coming across. At this point, you should at least have developed reads on Mora, Xayzeck, Wolfy, Shinobi and myself. At the very least.

That's right; my reads are all over the place. Why because they aren't solid since my Day 1 reads are usually never solid unless I have flips to analyze.
Also, you are right, I don't really care how I come across.

I haven't decided you are scum. I think there's a possibility you are scum, so yes, I'm looking at your posts more carefully because I do believe you are scum, but no it's not set in stone.

It's the timing of him giving his reads list and then your timing of changing your reads which make it similar to his. Yes, there's differences, but there's overlapping sheeping reads that reeks of oppurnitism.

I'm not using it as a main reason to scum read you, but your reply makes me think scum caught for all the wrong reasons.

No, you following my other games doesn't bother me a bit, but you aren't taking into consideration that I don't play the same way game to game. I play similarly, but there's noteable differences depending on the player list and how I think of how I have to play the *certain* role I get and what status I am. All of those things factor into my games.

It's just him giving you the article about scum-hunting halfway through the day phrase that bothered me or why you asked then, but not when you replaced in. It's the timing, it felt awkward and pure coaching.

No, I haven't made up my mind because it's still really in gut stage. I'm trying to figure out which is the stronger of the two. I just feel you are scummy, but also that your flip would be informative also.

I don't care; I don't have a strong day 1 unless SE's are those whom I have accuracy in reading. If I can narrow the suspects from 8 to 6/5*, depending on how many SE's are playing and/or how I read them I can get a better feel for the newbies. I have zero experience with the SE's and I have no experience with the newbies. So this game is a lot harder. I can't use my normal scum hunting tools because newbies do not have established meta, Xayz is really new to the game even though he's an SE, Mora has just came back from a leave of absence so his meta is outdated. I have other personal scum hunting tools which don't really apply to newbies well because you guys are still too new and commit them like every other post.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

That's right; my reads are all over the place. Why because they aren't solid since my Day 1 reads are usually never solid unless I have flips to analyze.
Also, you are right, I don't really care how I come across.

I haven't decided you are scum. I think there's a possibility you are scum, so yes, I'm looking at your posts more carefully because I do believe you are scum, but no it's not set in stone.

It's the timing of him giving his reads list and then your timing of changing your reads which make it similar to his. Yes, there's differences, but there's overlapping sheeping reads that reeks of oppurnitism.

I'm not using it as a main reason to scum read you, but your reply makes me think scum caught for all the wrong reasons.

No, you following my other games doesn't bother me a bit, but you aren't taking into consideration that I don't play the same way game to game. I play similarly, but there's noteable differences depending on the player list and how I think of how I have to play the *certain* role I get and what status I am. All of those things factor into my games.

It's just him giving you the article about scum-hunting halfway through the day phrase that bothered me or why you asked then, but not when you replaced in. It's the timing, it felt awkward and pure coaching.

No, I haven't made up my mind because it's still really in gut stage. I'm trying to figure out which is the stronger of the two. I just feel you are scummy, but also that your flip would be informative also.

I don't care; I don't have a strong day 1 unless SE's are those whom I have accuracy in reading. If I can narrow the suspects from 8 to 6/5*, depending on how many SE's are playing and/or how I read them I can get a better feel for the newbies. I have zero experience with the SE's and I have no experience with the newbies. So this game is a lot harder. I can't use my normal scum hunting tools because newbies do not have established meta, Xayz is really new to the game even though he's an SE, Mora has just came back from a leave of absence so his meta is outdated. I have other personal scum hunting tools which don't really apply to newbies well because you guys are still too new and commit them like every other post.

You should care how you come across. If you come across as a weak-town, and your lazy and you don't contribute, you could cause a mislynch.

Also, you talk about the timing on Wolfy's reads and then my updated reads. My reads come almost 80 posts after Wolfy's reads and if you look at what happened during the time between the reads, there was a lot going on and I thought it would be a good time to provide some updated reads. Also, Mora's VCA shows that Wolfy and myself have been all over the place, so I'm really not sure where you're going with this.

I wasn't even going to mention your play style in other games. Obviously every game is different, it was a different subject entirely.

You make it sound like Mora gave me that article personally. He posted it in the thread, for everybody to see.