NY 172: Another Large Normal (GAME OVER)

[Plessiez]

It's day 4. Deadline for the day is

May 3rd, 12:58

. That means you have (expired on 2014-05-03 12:58:35).

Vote Count 4.3

PeregrineV [4 votes] (Egg, TheWayItEnds, Snork, SiX)

7 players are not voting

: {Damon_Gant, DeasVail, penguin_alien, PeregrineV, projectmatt, SnowStorm, ThAdmiral}

With

11

players alive it takes

6

votes to lynch somebody or to go to night.

Activity

PeregrineV is V/LA until April 21st.

[PeregrineV]

Well, it's there. It was pointed out a while back about he doesn't bus. Next few Mastin scum-games, sure enough, a single bussed scum.

So who is it this game then?

Haven't looked yet, but since I can iso Yates, AP, and Mastin all together, I'm sure something will pop up.

[Plessiez]

ThAdmiral hasn't posted for over 48 hours and hasn't arranged a V/LA. He has therefore been prodded.

[Egg]

So are we gonna lynch Pere now?

[PeregrineV]

So are we gonna lynch Pere now?

No. Wasting the entire day and ending it with my mislynch is not acceptable.

[Egg]

I think it is.

Snork, TheWay, Deas are all clear (Snork not 100% but I'm fine putting him here for right now). Six is gonna be dead tonight (if Snork dies, we lynch Six. If someone else does, fuck it Snork clears someone else). One more player will be cleared by Snork tonight (or he catches scum again and we don't have to worry about anything else but let's assume that doesn't happen because then there's nothing left to discuss right now).

So we have: Egg, Pere, ThAd, Snow, Penguin, projectmatt, Damon minus tonight's clear. So after today's lynch if the game isn't over we have four players in the lynch pool with nine alive. If there is one scum left, that gives us three lynches to find one scum out of four players. If there is SK, the numbers are a little different, but not bad enough that we are in horrible shape or anything.

So literally the only thing to do is pick a name from the process of elimination list. For me, I'm town. Snow is a strong town read. Pretty sure Penguin is town. That just leaves Damon, projectmatt, ThAd, and Pere. I don't really care who gets lynched from those four names. And I personally hope Snork checks one of those names but it's his action and he can do what he wants. But yeah, I think that's our map to ending this in a town win and any new info only makes it easier along the way.

So basically that's why I'm fine just lynching Pere and calling it a day.

[PeregrineV]

I think it is.

Snork, TheWay, Deas are all clear (Snork not 100% but I'm fine putting him here for right now). Six is gonna be dead tonight (if Snork dies, we lynch Six. If someone else does, fuck it Snork clears someone else). One more player will be cleared by Snork tonight (or he catches scum again and we don't have to worry about anything else but let's assume that doesn't happen because then there's nothing left to discuss right now).

So we have: Egg, Pere, ThAd, Snow, Penguin, projectmatt, Damon minus tonight's clear. So after today's lynch if the game isn't over we have four players in the lynch pool with nine alive. If there is one scum left, that gives us three lynches to find one scum out of four players. If there is SK, the numbers are a little different, but not bad enough that we are in horrible shape or anything.

So literally the only thing to do is pick a name from the process of elimination list. For me, I'm town. Snow is a strong town read. Pretty sure Penguin is town. That just leaves Damon, projectmatt, ThAd, and Pere. I don't really care who gets lynched from those four names. And I personally hope Snork checks one of those names but it's his action and he can do what he wants. But yeah, I think that's our map to ending this in a town win and any new info only makes it easier along the way.

So basically that's why I'm fine just lynching Pere and calling it a day.

20 players means 2 scum left.
If there is an SK, could be another.

Is there a particular reason you're not even trying?

[PeregrineV]

Spoiler: Select Mastin-Yates-AP posts (pg 2)

VOTE: Damon Gant.

It's not vanity.
It's

sanity

.

Mastin, talk to me about Damon. Im wondering if he hasn't been a huge blind spot in my peripheral.

I think Im leaning towards a Pisskop vote. He was scummy and the DV kills makes sense for it. Im guessing Talah was SKdVigd.

Vote: RachMarie

Semi-meaningful, mainly for her awful hop onto the Luca wagon, but I will be reevaluating my positions in this game properly in the next 24 hours or so.

Yep, this is scum.

Mastin, talk to me about Damon. Im wondering if he hasn't been a huge blind spot in my peripheral.

If he's anything but a scumread, yeah, he's been a blindspot of yours. Dude's pure scum. However...

vote: aptil

for using deadline as an excuse to not post content (and that felt hammer felt like a kneejerk reaction to being pressured)

post 1733-1734 by mastin feel like trying to paint me, damon, and thad badly for the incoming mislynches. Although it could be town suspicious of the wagons. We'll see how mastin plays today.

VOTE: 4nxi3ty.
4nxi3ty is just as much a scumread (if not more, if that's even possible--like, Damon's a top-tier scumread and yet anxiety is just as strong if not stronger than top-tier), and I'm more interested in (re)wagoning him.

Rach's posting overall feels like town, by the way.

I don't know what to make of matinWKing the lynches.

I actually bothered to think yesterday rather than shutting my brain off?

^Thats town enough that we aren't lynching it Today.

Today? Try ever.

This is weird.

Helpful hint: weird = scum.

Sorta caught up, but skimmed the walls.

Town: Nero, Peregrine, Anxiety, aptil (pretty town for vig claim)
Probably town, want to talk to them more: Yates, mastin
Town? Possibly stale reads, could be (probably is?) a scum here: Snork, PA, Snowstorm, Damon Gant
Meh: Pmatt, RM
Scummy: TheWayItEnds, Bipolar, ThAdmiral, DV

@Snork

- I love post 1790 right up until the NKA. I see others have addressed this but yeah - NKA is p-much a wifom bomb.

I'm surprised to see Chemist in the Town list. Can you explain? Other than that, I like your Town list. [oh - bc of his return post? meh]

Also, pisskop slot [TheWayItEnds] is scum. I'm putting matt in the scum pile too.

I might come around on ThAd scum but I want him to be Town. I still have him in my "to be sorted" pile with mastin, Pere and Nero.

SnowStorm is playing a good game. I have him leaning Town but my confidence is shaky. When I start thinking I may be wrong, he responds with a strong post or good logic when pressed. I haven't played with him enough to know what this means but I don't remember him being this - logical? focused? organized? - in Rocky Horror.

I think PA is going to help me read the Rogers slot so I'm not voting there.

how likely do ya all think it is that we have one large scum team or two scum teams and how likely do you think it is we have a SK?

I wouldn't rule out a limited shot SK or some kind of odd-night vs even-night scum team. But I'm inclined to believe Aptil. While I don't do NKA I also don't think scum would waste a shot on a potential easy mislynch. [then again - what an awesome play for an SK to earn an obv-Town read!] I'm playing as if we have one scum team because I don't think it matters.

I'm going to:
VOTE: TheWayItEnds

Looking forward to seeing death or contribution from this slot.

Ok, lets stop bitching at each other over bullshit and actually wagon scum today then?

I need to sort: Snowstorm, matt, damon, dv.

Are you townreading matt at all?

Where are matt and pere? Or even bpc, for that matter?

Once again I'm not liking either wagon and I feel like scum is sitting back and laughing. TWIE is exactly where I'd expect to find scum on the RM wagon. Now I have to go look closer at 4nx.

Town: Nero, Peregrine, Anxiety, aptil (pretty town for vig claim)
Probably town, want to talk to them more: Yates, mastin
Town? Possibly stale reads, could be (probably is?) a scum here: Snork, PA, Snowstorm, Damon Gant
Meh: Pmatt, RM
Scummy: TheWayItEnds, Bipolar, ThAdmiral, DV

Switch Anxiety and, well, everyone in the scummy list except TWIE, and you've got a good start. Because the scum list would be empty, bump Damon down for a start. And work from there.

Town: Nero, Peregrine,

Anxiety

, aptil (pretty town for vig claim)
Probably town, want to talk to them more: Yates, mastin
Town? Possibly stale reads, could be (probably is?) a scum here: Snork, PA, Snowstorm, Damon Gant
Meh: Pmatt, RM
Scummy: TheWayItEnds, Bipolar, ThAdmiral,

DV

Ok cool. I disagree most with the bolded.

Snork's probably town, though.

How many players started in the game? I'm thinking I need one more in addition to 4nxi3ty, Damon, and TWIE (who is scumposting, by the way).

Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaybe Snowstorm, but not sure 'bout that.

Rach looks super-mega-town, btw.

RAWRs cans I interject this rach detour?
[on snow]

probably

totally bussing. (how do I feign excitement about wagoning a buddy? "Let's Do It")

...

vote: SnowStorm

fairly certain snow is attempting to tie himself to me by presenting an intentional wishywashy read;
also wondering if snowstorm is currently bussing thad.

VOTE: 4nxi3ty.

(Yes, I'm a bit behind.)

It

was

vanity, as far as I'm concerned the whole charade of staying off the main wagons was vanity for all those involved, and it's the kind of posturing that I am wary of.

Except I was right:
Both wagons were on town.

Thus, attempting to get a wagon

not

on one of them wasn't vanity; it was sanity.

Snowstorm's posting just looks plain scum, now, btw. TWIE also looks like scum.

Oh, heck with it.

VOTE: Snowstorm.

Someone tell me if Penguin, Deas, and 4n make sense as scum. Those names were NOT chosen randomly

4nx, yes. PA, doubtful. DV, possible, but not probable.

/largely skimmed, but caught up.

Ya, but he was calling RM town for that reason before Thad got involved at all. I can understand thinking that a scummy player making a scummy push on an easy target makes them more town, but "Bad case on someone --> they are town" baffles me.

But I have less than zero interest in arguing Nero's townread on RM with him right now since I ultimately think both are town.

I've been sort of all over the place Today, so lets monologue about people in the spirit of regrouping:

penguin_alien - I dislike her posts about mastin. She seems somewhat undecided on mastin and shows no real interest in talking to her to resolve that. I'd expect her to be interested in mastin swooping in to add to her snowstorm wagon since she is apparently loosely suspicious of mastin when questioned about her. Reads more like posturing than actually trying to determine mastin's alignment, meh. Still Rogers posts feel unlikely to be from scum? Meh.

Snork - Town. Already largely discussed.

TheWayItEnds - I liked the original posts with Nero, felt like he wasn't nervous. Later contributions have fallen off and his RM votepark is pretty lame and easy. Sketchiest vote on the RM wagon just to take it off, post some bullshit about Yates who voted him, and go back to lurking? Scummy.

Egg - Egg has done fuck-all so far, but replaced BipolarChemist so Scummy.

Nero Cain - Pretty sure he's town. Reads like HPATPL/GoW Nero, aggressive, pointed.

aptil - Gets a pass for Vig claim. Is town barring reason to suspect SK/multiball.

Yates - I like his TWIE vote and that TWIE isn't gaining any traction makes TWIE less likely to be town tbh. Mindset and frustration reads town to me. His follow up on PA looks town-motivated. Town.

projectmatt - Who? Mostly a non-presence. Not doing anything that looks like scum hunting. Throws some townreads around and lurks. Meh leaning toward hm.

PeregrineV - Has basically done nothing Today. Still think hes probtown from Yestreday's posts, would like to see him step it up though.

mastin2 - Lurking is generally not a mastin thing regardless of anything and this is getting a little ridiculous, I realize RL sucks, but I could reallllly use you to bounce reads off of if you are town in this game. 2004/5 feels like town stream of thought, but mastin can fake that sort of thing as scum so meh. Meh. Probably not scum if PA is.

SnowStorm - Shows up to respond to case on him and not much else recently. Writes off my pressure as bullshit and justifies to Anxiety that its easier to detect bullshit about him than other place. Defense is scummy and general lack of proactive play; very reactionary. Scummy.

Damon_Gant - Actually back to leaning town here on an ISO skim. Dont at all get what mastin is seeing here and she should back that up.

4nxi3ty - Suspicion on Snowstorm is town as fuck, since that is something townies tend to be paranoid about. Could be dropping fake tells as scum, but strongly doubt it. Reaction to pressure has felt genuine.

RachMarie - Lol.

ThAdmiral - Meh?

DeasVail - I'd lynch it.

Snow/TWIE team calling it now. That awkward chainsaw/bus is just too much.

@Damon (and anyone else I guess): Why does SnowStorm as scum stop voting for talah (who is a pretty ideal lynch for scum as he's actually a good player) and change it to ThAdmiral?

a) To encourage another wagon and split up town votes more - causing confusion and small potential for no lynch.
b) talah may well be a good player but equally as long as he was in this game an aura of suspicion would have followed him. Keeping a player who a large number of people are suspicious of in the game for a long time can certainly work for scum later.
c) Hunting for PRs - hoping to induce a flashwagon on ThAd.

Also
d) Didn't want to be on a mislynch wagon on D1?
e) Sometimes scum just do shit because they can, no explicit scum motivation behind it?

Why are you focused on this singular point for Snow, DV? That means that all the people who hopped off the wagon and/or back on are town because its such a silly thing to do so only town would do it? No.

K. Are we seriously back to 5 days left until deadline?

Nero, RM, Yates, Anxiety, PV, Snork, [aptil-slot], thadmiral are all pretty town.

Townblock, start suggesting good lynches and why.

I want TWIE, Matt, or Snow right now the most. Could maybe do mastin (not really a scumread, but decent compromise at this point), Egg (replaced Bipolar, doesnt feel like town-egg really).

I think I'd rather not lynch DV today actually. Someone throw something out.

btw, so you know, I think your hops on luca, rach, and snowstorm are

interesting

along with mastin's scumread of you.

Define interesting.

Damon might actually be town. I like more of his reads than I don't.

If this is still valid, Nero (tell me if it's not), then I'll give it a more detailed look later. I might be in the mood to just sheep someone and you're a better bet than most.

Rach's analysis strongly looks town, too.

MAstin, are you still in this game?

Technically, yes. The mod didn't send a second prod thanks to V/LA, and I promised posting later tonight.

Truthfully...well. *points to posting*
...I'm feeling a deep disconnect with the game. Not The Fall levels of bad, not even close, but...loosely akin to that? Like...there's the feeling I can do good, but...that I'm not able to do it, if that makes sense.

Want to vote Mastin, but don't like 4nxiety on there.....

Simple solution, vote 4nxi3ty.

...Though I'm considering going back to TWIE.

mastin, damon, snow, thad, matt are all lynchable to me to some degree. I think a mastin lynch is the right play. The getting into 1v1 with talah -> coming back "remembering talah as town" -> voting talah -> then defending moments before lynch doesn't read as natural change of mind. Tone feels manipulative too.

Or not.

Would prefer Mastin, maybe TheWayitEnds(torn on this slot), maybe anxiety but I think Snow is town, and Egg/BiPolar as town (but agree that now-Egg silence is bothersome). Matt would be a less preferable but currently acceptable.

Honestly, I agree with just about everything here. (Yes, including the bit about me being an okay lynch.)

/88.

There's other stuff here I'll think about when thinking's easier. Still not seeing any particular reason not to lynch SnowStorm. Would lynch mastin I think. Not sure about TWIE. AP, I assume you'll be commenting, but I want to know where you stand on mastin now, given that you were kind of willing to lynch her before her catch-up posts.

I dont see how anyone is townreading Snowstorm at all and didn't like mastin's vote flop over to TWIE and waffle on SS.

So, still want to lynch snowstorm but would entertain mastin lynch. Im not seeing any strong town-mastin indicators. Mastin brings up Mini 1521 where I mis-lynched mastin whilst saying that, but I dunno. I reallly don't see anything that looks all that town from mastin and that is worrisome. Bringing up The Fall could easily be a way to get PV and me to not vote her over her extreme lack of presence this game. I want to say the lack of zeal is a straight up scumtell, but I cant. I think mastins post look a little shallow.

Might sheep Yates if it comes down to it, but going to hope for Snowstorm support for now.

Why does it take you so long to end up over here then?

Because I still think 4nxi3ty is scum and still kinda want to wagon him?

Uhhh, what would you expect scum PA to do different.

Her to treat me differently? It's kinda difficult to describe, but, her attitude seems like it was a town one to take about me.

Uhhh, You just posted this about DV. Except their reads aren't THAT in sync.

Doesn't matter? Like...DV's posting looked really good. Damon's posting also looked good, but in a different way, with reads not quite the same but making it even more reason to think him town rather than less.

Im not buying that you 'forgot' why he was scummy.

You scum this game, AP?

You're asking a lot of somewhat-loaded questions here, and even those that aren't are either things you already know or are getting wrong that I really wouldn't expect. I've rambled about my bad memory in a LOT of games, as both alignments, and telling the truth every time. You know this. Like...you can argue that it's convenient for a scum-me to forget. That's an okayish reason. (Not great, though.) But you're not.

Really, you are going to bring that game up?

Well, Xenogears wasn't over at the time, and what I really meant was 'like Xenogears' when Xenogears was 'like The Fall', so...kinda? It's not as bad as Xeno, which wasn't quite as bad as The Fall. But it's the same type of feeling, just a lesser severity, if that makes sense.

You feel like you are coasting here.

I guess I am? I mean, I'm giving content. I'm contributing. I'm posting. But my heart's not into it, and it's a struggle, and I'm not doing a good job at it, so I suppose I am. I'll try to figure something out to fix it.

Talk to me about my reads.

Alright.

Mister Rogers/PA
Snork
AngryPidgeon
BipolarChemist/Egg
Yates
PeregrineV

PA's null to me overall right now.
Snork's posting looks town, but feels like it has to be an alt. It feels like this level of drive and familiarity could only come from an insider. So if Snork really weren't an alt, I'd actually feel like scum if that makes sense.
AP's a concern, since he's not feeling the townvibes.
I liked BipolarChemist's posting and Egg's has continued the trend.
Yates is null, as is PV. Don't really remember anything from either of them.

With a lynch list of {Snork/PA/Yates/AP/PV/Thad}, basically the only one I wouldn't want lynched is ThAd, whose posting does look town to me.

I haven't done anything yet. How can you compare my play here to hard boiled? What are you seeing in my play that is similar to Hard Boiled?

You've done enough for me to get that same vibe from you. Admittedly, your vote on matt seems like a divergence from what I remember about you (and thus, is a concern), but literally everything else I remember about you feels like, "I'm kinda forgetting that this game's not Hard Boiled", if that makes sense.

The scummy thing about Matt is he isn't doing anything to make enemies. He has given no scum reads at all but throws a few strong town reads out. That doesn't fit the picture of a lurker who lost interest.

That looks like scum trying really hard to be on everyone s good side with minimal input.

And he out of the blue conjures a singular scum read for zero logical reason up after getting called scummy for not having any. It's looks like active lurking.

Yates, where are you? Talk to me about your thoughts on current events please. I don't think mastin is a good lynch today. Where do you stand on Thad?

@Matt: I may go summarize that in a bit, but Ive talked about Snow quite a bit Today.

the way you talk about me paints a different picture

Not so much my strength of read on you as my strength of read on others, kinda sorta.

If anyone has a problem with this lynch, explain why, because I haven't seen a single good reason to believe that ThAd is town.

Everything about him is ridiculously town, even if not sheeping-town. Look at his posts from his perspective. They're not calculated. They're not artificial. They're not precise. These are all traits of a scum ThAd. They're impulsive. Rash. Emotional. Argumentive rather than manipulative. He's not trying to push an agenda; he's frustrated about the game. His posting looks genuine, like he's trying to figure out the game.

Like, I'm just about as disjointed from the game as can be, yet I can tell all of this basically instantly.

They're not calculated. They're not artificial. They're not precise. These are all traits of a scum ThAd. They're impulsive. Rash. Emotional. Argumentive rather than manipulative.

Pretty much this. (thank god mastin is town).

I dont see how Snow is pulling "Thad is being manipulative" out of this. There is really no direct point to Thad doing this as scum, unless you want to argue hes just trying to look town by doing something townie. But making that distinction is gonna take more backing than "its overdone" cause saying Thad is being manipulative is... well...manipulative.

P-edit: I'd still rather not lynch him, I think there are way better people to lynch.

Six and Rm are town. I think I'm leaning town on Egg more recently.

On phone

I also really liked the comment about "the 2 off the wagons because RachMarie said so". When the wagons were almost ENTIRELY split in half the playerlist, AND were both on town, you cannot use that kind of dumb logic to scumhunt... by some kind of arbitrary fucking formula.

I meant it when I said RM is blacklisted. I hope someone fucking shoots her. I want her out of this game regardless of her alignment. She's a fucking liability.

VOTE: Snork.

This is not town ranting.

Wondering about a Snork-PA-TWIE-4nxi3ty scumteam.

Pere, I agree that if anyone has a null red on Mastin they should say why. I can't see the kind of null where they just can't pull any info out of his posts. What I could see is someone wavering in their read.

I agree, as my own read on her is wavering. Her initial posting seemed like scum-Mastin to a T. Only the last few posts have given me any town feelings.

Not this post specifically, but general area around here, PV's very strongly town.

Top Wagons
TheWayItEnds [4 votes] (DeasVail, mastin2, PeregrineV, Damon_Gant)
ThAdmiral [3 votes] (SnowStorm, RachMarie, Nero Cain)
projectmatt [3 votes] (4nxi3ty, penguin_alien, Egg)

Holy shit that matt wagon sucks.

Matt's town. Never lynch him.

ThAd's also town, even though the only possible scum name I see on there is SnowStorm and I don't think he's scum.

But I do really like the TWIE wagon.

So I guess I can go back there.

VOTE: TWIE.

Snork, AP said projectmatt was lurking, giving town reads, and going back to lurking in response to my noticing projectmatt lacking scum reads. Nero didn't like my trusting that AP was telling the truth about that without researching it on my own. So I asked Nero if AP was lying.

And I'm actually kind of thinking Nero is right about Six, but I'd rather lynch mafia than find out right now.

Preview edit:
Yeah looking for town more than scum is fine. But even if that is what you are doing, you need to call someone scum at some point too. Not doing so just seems like scum wanting to fly under the radar and not step on toes.

And I might actually be changing my mind on Six from when I started this post. I might be ok with lynching him sooner rather than later.

Preview edit again:
Rach, don't worry about it yet. Trust me. Please.

Egg's posting here is looking worse and worse.

I am town JOAT no friggen way would we have TWO town JOATs.

Rach, trust me. He's town. You're town. Let's not get distracted on townVtown and instead focus on lynching scum.

Anyway. I'm going to be late for work if I post anymore, so I'll continue from page 100.
Egg's posting on Six seems opportunistic, though.

Rach: what did you do last night?
Six: What did you do last night?

I dont really see a scenario where I vote someone other than Six right now since the 1x vig claim looks like a lie.

Ok. So. Six is accusing me of being a Serial Killer.

He is accusing me of not shooting last night (despite there being two kills?)...and framing him for a kill that I apparently didn't make and that his slot claimed on N1.

He is a claimed JOAT now but didnt use his bodyguard action on cofnirmed town RM or anyone else last night.

Sometimes, it really is this easy.

VOTE: 6

RachMarie is surely a JOAT. SiX could be scum.

Let's worry about this after an AP flip.

Yes its clearly here because it can false guilty me and probably false inno the Serial killer probs six).

The false guilty would be on vig. So that makes Six more believable. Although the 2nd kill is concerning. I don't see how the SK would provide a false negative if you are suggesting we have an SK and scum since both 4nx and Nero were SHOT.

I wanted to comment on this yesterday but Mastin was hammered before I could add my snarky comment:

Wondering about a Snork-PA-TWIE-4nxi3ty scumteam.

This looks like a scum slip. 4 person scum team [with mastin]. Also seems very likely he included one of his buddies in that "read." If Snork is right about AP [and I see no reason to believe he's faking] he's confirmed. 4nx flipped Town so he's confirmed. That leaves PA and TWIE for my microscope tomorrow.

Seems a little OP if I can check 2 of the 3 types of anti-town roles.

Well, the counter is you could have "caught" our vig if Aptl hadn't used his power immediately and wanted to save it for when he had a higher probability shot.

So anyway, if AP flips SK this is all moot. BUT - it looks like mastin slipped a scum team of 4. A second scum team also seems OP. That's the only thing that has me thinking SK at this point because otherwise I have no explanation for the 2nd shot. 6 scum seems like too many. Plus Aptl claimed one of the kills. IDK.

PE: UNVOTE: mastin
Good idea.

I don't want to check SiX tonight. I'd rather check one of the unknowns.

Yeah. Check someone else. Pretend you are a cop and treat SiX like a Miller claim. Aptil admitted he would show as having a gun and there's no reason not to believe that. I'm not sure what a second check would prove/disprove.

I'll protect you so you can at least get another read out.

Can we not just lynch AP?

Can we just wait for Snork? We have two weeks and this lynch will go down in less than two HOURS. Plus, like 1/3 of the player base hasn't even posted yet today.

Note the bolded parts. I guess we should

wait for everyone to say their bit

...

Sorry. I see why you would think that was directed at you [since I quoted you] but that was a response in general [and more specifically to SiX]. I just wanted to add on the part about how a bunch of people haven't posted today and have yet to react.

Day 2 VCs were more valuable to me when I was looking at them last night.

I'm trying to communicate something to you without saying it.

Ready?

Look at counts 2.10 and 2.11. Assume Snow and Egg are Town. Think about it...

For now, it's not worth worrying about.

Agreed 100%.

a kill was probably stopped

Twice? Both nights resulted in two shots. One shot each night for the mafia kill. Done. One shot N1 from Aptl/SiX. Who was the second shooter last night? Or are you thinking SK also has a "shot"

flavor

[for lack of a better word].

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... &start=200

[Egg]

I'm voting for the player who most of the townie players agree is likely scum. How is that not trying?

[PeregrineV]

I'd like to give Yates a chance to put me under the microscope

I'm not doing that today. Feels rather like chasing my own tail.

Yates, I assume you think ThAd is scum?

Yeah. I realized how stupid that message was about 5 seconds after clicking submit. I'm a totally leet spy.

But yeah. Thad is flying under the radar. He was suspected by numerous conf Town. He's had a wagon on him consisting entirely of Town reads and conf Town. Mastin - AP - Thad is a scary scum combo. Anyway, it's at least something I'd want to rule out - but that's just me. Pretty much the only wasted investigation would be on SiX, RM, and probably Snow.

PE: woah! Will read these in a sec...

From page 3

[PeregrineV]

I'm voting for the player who most of the townie players agree is likely scum. How is that not trying?

Well, lack of bothering to determine it on your own.

If you aren't invested in me as scum, then you aren't looking for my partners, which means you aren't scumhunting.

If you think I am scum, you still don't seem to be looking for my partners.

If you think I might be town and you just can't be bothered to check, then you're not looking for scum.

See, it kind of looks like you are not scumhunting. In a mafia game.

[PeregrineV]

I'm V/LA due to a brew competition this weekend. I'll be active starting Monday.

That said... what is this?

Would also throw a vote BBMolla's way for scum-placing out.

Does BBMolla

actually

have a track record of replacing out of games as scum or are you being terrible for no reason? You are better than this.

VOTE: PeregrineV

Looking back at Yates first post, this overreaction might make more sense now. Need to look at Matt reads through the game.

[Plessiez]

penguin_alien hasn't posted for over 48 hours and hasn't arranged a V/LA. She has therefore been prodded.

[Egg]

If you're scum, Mastin, AP, and Yates were your partners. Maybe there's another. Maybe not. Why should I assume five scum? If you are SK, you have no partners and looking for them is a wild goose chase. And of course you might be town. Anyone could. Welcome to mafia.

[PeregrineV]

If you're scum, Mastin, AP, and Yates were your partners. Maybe there's another. Maybe not. Why should I assume five scum? If you are SK, you have no partners and looking for them is a wild goose chase. And of course you might be town. Anyone could. Welcome to mafia.

You should assume

9 players: 7 town, 2 scum
12 or 13 players: 9 or 10 town, 3 scum
16 players: 12 town, 4 scum
20 players: 15 town, 5 scum
24 players: 18 town, 6 scum or 16 town, 8 scum (usually two teams)

because that's been the generally understood range to account for the last of non-verbal clues that forum mafia has against it.

[TheWayItEnds]

And those numbers line up with you being the SK and PA being the last maf so whats the problem.

Seriously why isnt this dead yet?

[PeregrineV]

And those numbers line up with you being the SK and PA being the last maf so whats the problem.

Seriously why isnt this dead yet?

I thought PA was already dead. Need to look back through.

[Egg]

If you're scum, Mastin, AP, and Yates were your partners. Maybe there's another. Maybe not. Why should I assume five scum? If you are SK, you have no partners and looking for them is a wild goose chase. And of course you might be town. Anyone could. Welcome to mafia.

You should assume

9 players: 7 town, 2 scum
12 or 13 players: 9 or 10 town, 3 scum
16 players: 12 town, 4 scum
20 players: 15 town, 5 scum
24 players: 18 town, 6 scum or 16 town, 8 scum (usually two teams)

because that's been the generally understood range to account for the last of non-verbal clues that forum mafia has against it.

Eh. I'm honestly not as comfortable as you are with assuming that there is no SK.

[penguin_alien]

And those numbers line up with you being the SK and PA being the last maf so whats the problem.

Seriously why isnt this dead yet?

The numbers line up with me being Mafia? Heh, good one.

Will take a look at the case PV for scum; for me it's between SnowStorm and PV from what I remember, but I haven't looked at things recently.

P-edit: AP is dead, I am not...

[PeregrineV]

Matt is town.

I think that Mister Rodgers is town. There's opportunistic scum and then there's the kind of town who plays on the offensive, "I want to win so badly!' mode. It seems pretty blatant that Mr. Rodgers is an alternate account who is trying to come off as very confident. In terms of getting him read successfully - it works. I'm pretty sure that he's town, but I don't exactly agree with all of his analysis.

Townread on Zdenek. Townread on DeasVail. Tentative townread on bjc. Tentative townread on RachMarie.

I know most of you are calling out Damon Giant for voting bjc, but [Doc's] post is actually a

worse

sin. This looks like a way for Doc to essentially give himself wriggle room to vote BJC later in the game. The rest of his play hasn't given me much of an indicator of his alignment, though.

Pretty dang certain this slot's town. (Though, I still prefer Molla. Molla, I can obvtown. You, not so much.)

Damon gant - There's something about the way he posts that screams slightly-inexperienced town. Stubbornly going after bjc, questioning zdenek for accusing him of being scum without any explanation. town

Look at his joindate, ThAd. Damon's had plenty of games; he's anything but inexperienced.

This is important and needs responding to.

Fairly certain I already did? There's less than a handful of people who really get me as a player. Like, literally, the only one I can think of off the top of my head is AP. There's others, of course, but he's the only one in my mind who has that 100% accuracy. Others have tried, and scum have claimed they can, but they either failed or lied.

You seem way more focused/calculating as scum.

Yeah, I'm fairly good as scum. However, I'm not nearly as good this year at it as I was last year. In 2013, I had a decent towngame and a solid, SOLID scumgame. This year, my towngame has been meh-at-best so far, and my scumgame's also taken a severe hit in strength, too. I suspect both actually have a root in the same problem: people are expecting my play to be more than it actually is, assuming I'm better than I actually am, alignment-regardless. Heck, even my theory capacities have gone downhill; it's been three months, and there's barely been a ping on me making an MD thread so far. (Well, there has been, but I need to refine the idea so that it doesn't send off the wrong message of condoning something rather than the intended effect of potentially offering an explanation for said something.)

(Yates is town, by the way. His stances don't come from scum, like...at all.)

[PeregrineV]

If you're scum, Mastin, AP, and Yates were your partners. Maybe there's another. Maybe not. Why should I assume five scum? If you are SK, you have no partners and looking for them is a wild goose chase. And of course you might be town. Anyone could. Welcome to mafia.

You should assume

9 players: 7 town, 2 scum
12 or 13 players: 9 or 10 town, 3 scum
16 players: 12 town, 4 scum
20 players: 15 town, 5 scum
24 players: 18 town, 6 scum or 16 town, 8 scum (usually two teams)

because that's been the generally understood range to account for the last of non-verbal clues that forum mafia has against it.

Eh. I'm honestly not as comfortable as you are with assuming that there is no SK.

I don't usually include the SK in the scum numbers. Really depends on the game size and power allocated to town.

[PeregrineV]

And those numbers line up with you being the SK and PA being the last maf so whats the problem.

Seriously why isnt this dead yet?

The numbers line up with me being Mafia? Heh, good one.

Will take a look at the case PV for scum; for me it's between SnowStorm and PV from what I remember, but I haven't looked at things recently.

P-edit: AP is dead, I am not...

Yeah, I noticed. There is no case for me, nor will there be. This doesn't seem to be that kind of game.

And if your town, now's the time to do something.

[penguin_alien]

I'll read the triple ISO soonish and see what shakes out. But yeah, as far as I can tell the case is that we've decided ThAd is an unlikely partner and nothing explicitly eliminates you as a possibility.

[SnowStorm]

Prod-dodge.

[Damon_Gant]

There are 11 players alive: Damon_Gant, DeasVail, Egg, penguin_alien, PeregrineV, projectmatt, SiX, Snork, SnowStorm, ThAdmiral, TheWayItEnds

My conclusions have been made by a process of elimination.

Damon_Gant: Obviously I know where I am
Snork: As close to confirmed town as we have.
DeasVail: Confirmed by Snork
TWIE: Confirmed by Snork
SiX: I highly doubt SiX is of the scumteam for fairly obvious reasons - very possibly the SK.

Leaving 6 candidates for scumteam: Egg, penguin_alien, PeregrineV, projectmatt, SnowStorm, ThAdmiral

Egg: AP and Yates both attacked this slot - particularly telling is how Yates pushed to make sure we were aware the infamous "fake-vig incident" was not a towntell. Read the relevant portions of this post. Mastin went the other way on this slot and constantly said it was town - but then that was just going along with the general grain of the town I think. I definitely feel like there's enough evidence in the scum ISOs to confidently say Egg is town. Plus I've seen nothing scummy from this slot at all.

projectmatt: Coasting badly, as I mentioned earlier. However, after thought and consideration matt is definitely my most gut town. He's made some nice posts, particularly earlier on. I also feel like Matt would have posted more if scum - and been more of an active lurker rather than just a lurker. I have no meta evidence to back this up, it's just what I think. Mastin pushed matt as very strongly town. Mastin also did that with both talah and Luca on day 1. I doubt mastin would make such a strong read on a buddy. Yes, all of this is basically just justifying the fact that projectmatt-town is a gut read for me, but there you go. I'd be open to changing my mind on this but for now I think a lot of people think the same anyway.

That leaves 4 more interesting candidates in my opinion. That's all I have the energy for tonight so I'll continue tomorrow.