Scummies 2014 - Nomination Thread!

[Not_Mafia]

I should be nominated for having the skill to get quickhammered. To be serious though, lolhammers are fun but I wouldn't call them award worthy

[reinoe]

Up to date.

Nominate everyone in this game http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=44815 for kodak moment because page two scum lynch

Please be more specific as to who the nominees are and why, "everyone" is a bit too broad of a nomination for Kodak moment.

Are the five players on the rvs wagon suitable?

[Guyett]

I should be nominated for having the skill to get quickhammered. To be serious though, lolhammers are fun but I wouldn't call them award worthy

this

[mastin2]

Nominate Svenskt Stal for Don Corelone

.

There's no specific game I have in mind. Just in general, Sven is a badass scum player. Every game I've seen him be scum in, he's managed to do extraordinarily well in. His grip on scum tactics during the night phase isn't the strongest, but he is an absolute MASTER at looking town...even in a town filled with players who have seen him play scum before! Every time I've seen him as scum, at least one player will comment along the lines of, "This isn't the Sven from *previous Sven scumgame*, among other reasons, so I think town", but it's not simple meta manipulation; the dude just has a way of looking really, REALLY town when he's scum.

Most recently, you can see it in Left 4 Dead, but I'm sure there are a ton of other examples. Anything Goes and Amnesiac Mafia seem to be frequently-cited games, for instance.

[Burning_Earth]

I agree, my nomination was bad: I just wanted to have a scummy really

[Burning_Earth]

Up to date.

Nominate everyone in this game http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=44815 for kodak moment because page two scum lynch

Please be more specific as to who the nominees are and why, "everyone" is a bit too broad of a nomination for Kodak moment.

Are the five players on the rvs wagon suitable?

Also, probably that.

[Burning_Earth]

Nominate Svenskt Stal for Don Corelone

.

There's no specific game I have in mind. Just in general, Sven is a badass scum player. Every game I've seen him be scum in, he's managed to do extraordinarily well in. His grip on scum tactics during the night phase isn't the strongest, but he is an absolute MASTER at looking town...even in a town filled with players who have seen him play scum before! Every time I've seen him as scum, at least one player will comment along the lines of, "This isn't the Sven from *previous Sven scumgame*, among other reasons, so I think town", but it's not simple meta manipulation; the dude just has a way of looking really, REALLY town when he's scum.

Most recently, you can see it in Left 4 Dead, but I'm sure there are a ton of other examples. Anything Goes and Amnesiac Mafia seem to be frequently-cited games, for instance.

2nd

[Desperado]

Most recently, you can see it in Left 4 Dead, but I'm sure there are a ton of other examples. Anything Goes and Amnesiac Mafia seem to be frequently-cited games, for instance.

he got fucking modkilled in AG, are you shitting me?

[mastin2]

Most recently, you can see it in Left 4 Dead, but I'm sure there are a ton of other examples. Anything Goes and Amnesiac Mafia seem to be frequently-cited games, for instance.

he got fucking modkilled in AG, are you shitting me?

The modkill wasn't for anything he did in the game--it was for something meant as a joke outside the game, which was judged to be for the game (and thus, bringing outside influences into the game) even though it was incredibly ambiguous and not a call that was clean-cut. My understanding is, essentially, that he started a thread about who you'd nightkill as scum, when he was scum during the night of Anything Goes. And that it was interpreted as being for Anything Goes, rather than a joke.

Look at his PLAY in Anything Goes. There's a reason why he was the outlier in AFB's god-reads; he was playing such a strong game that nearly nobody had him caught, and even those that suspected him didn't have him near the top. That was true up to and including the time when he was modkilled. If he hadn't been modkilled, we would have won that game a day earlier. And it continued to be true in other games he's been in, L4D among them: he might be suspected by a few (especially later in the game via POE and his chosen claim), but for the majority of the game was MASSIVELY considered town by the majority of players.

So yes, I am serious.

[Faraday]

I mean, let's not ignore his thread was about a very specific occurrence that happened to be going on in that game. but yes, sure nom him but don't try to play it down which is what your post feels like.

Citing it as a good example is p lol, tho.

[ZZZX]

EDIT: 2nd Nominate Best Performance Pro-Town Team - Micro 322 - Managerial Merry Go Round Mafia

Our team was just so great in that game claiming a nearly totally clean win (Outside the daykill which I will talk about)

Even thou we daykilled a village duo to a comp role we ended up hitting the busdriver which helped us analyize all our actions corrently. Duo to good neighborizing/tracking/hiding combo and choosing the correct played to target we were able to survive 2 nights without a single night kill. We then went on and lynched both the scum in nights 1 and 2.

Great analysis by everyone in the PRO-TOWN team. This game was aweasom.

Am I doing this right?

[Faraday]

Sure. Linking is nice tho!

[Desperado]

The modkill wasn't for anything he did in the game--it was for something meant as a joke outside the game, which was judged to be for the game (and thus, bringing outside influences into the game) even though it was incredibly ambiguous and not a call that was clean-cut. My understanding is, essentially, that he started a thread about who you'd nightkill as scum, when he was scum during the night of Anything Goes. And that it was interpreted as being for Anything Goes, rather than a joke.

lol

you're the best, mastin

[ZZZX]

Sure. Linking is nice tho!

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=46314

[Untrod Tripod]

The modkill wasn't for anything he did in the game--it was for something meant as a joke outside the game, which was judged to be for the game (and thus, bringing outside influences into the game) even though it was incredibly ambiguous and not a call that was clean-cut. My understanding is, essentially, that he started a thread about who you'd nightkill as scum, when he was scum during the night of Anything Goes. And that it was interpreted as being for Anything Goes, rather than a joke.

No. You're wrong. Stop.

His play might have been fine, but making an MD topic about the game which led to him getting modkilled overrides anything that was going on in the game. His actions were against his wincon. And I don't have a grudge against him, he's still allowed (and playing in currently) to be in my games. But you're hilariously and predictably wrong about both big-picture and detail issues here.

_________

And also I'm a scummies judge, so I can guarantee you this kind of thing gets taken into account.

[Tammy]

Most recently, you can see it in Left 4 Dead, but I'm sure there are a ton of other examples. Anything Goes and Amnesiac Mafia seem to be frequently-cited games, for instance.

he got fucking modkilled in AG, are you shitting me?

The modkill wasn't for anything he did in the game--it was for something meant as a joke outside the game, which was judged to be for the game (and thus, bringing outside influences into the game) even though it was incredibly ambiguous and not a call that was clean-cut. My understanding is, essentially, that he started a thread about who you'd nightkill as scum, when he was scum during the night of Anything Goes. And that it was interpreted as being for Anything Goes, rather than a joke.

Um you do realize that the night that you guys were debating over whether or not to kill who you thought the vig was and he was arguing against shooting the "vig", he made the thread in which he asked if you were on the scum team and you know who the vig is do you shoot him or someone else?

I don't see how that's ambiguous or a joke.

[ZZZX]

Most recently, you can see it in Left 4 Dead, but I'm sure there are a ton of other examples. Anything Goes and Amnesiac Mafia seem to be frequently-cited games, for instance.

he got fucking modkilled in AG, are you shitting me?

The modkill wasn't for anything he did in the game--it was for something meant as a joke outside the game, which was judged to be for the game (and thus, bringing outside influences into the game) even though it was incredibly ambiguous and not a call that was clean-cut. My understanding is, essentially, that he started a thread about who you'd nightkill as scum, when he was scum during the night of Anything Goes. And that it was interpreted as being for Anything Goes, rather than a joke.

Um you do realize that the night that you guys were debating over whether or not to kill who you thought the vig was and he was arguing against shooting the "vig", he made the thread in which he asked if you were on the scum team and you know who the vig is do you shoot him or someone else?

I don't see how that's ambiguous or a joke.

I don't know honestly as I haven't read that game but its a general question that would be identified by list mods/game mod only to be related to the game. its the same as asking for general advise before the game. I dont know about it being a reason to get modkilled but I might be wrong. (

Actually duo to it being the mod decision it is correct.

)

[Tierce]

The modkill wasn't for anything he did in the game--it was for something meant as a joke outside the game, which was judged to be for the game (and thus, bringing outside influences into the game) even though it was incredibly ambiguous and not a call that was clean-cut. My understanding is, essentially, that he started a thread about who you'd nightkill as scum, when he was scum during the night of Anything Goes. And that it was interpreted as being for Anything Goes, rather than a joke.

Undersigning UT here, and adding that it sure is a joy to have to make a call on whether an MD thread is a "joke" or an actual reference to an ongoing game. You think it's ambiguous? Now imagine being on the team who has to make a call on whether to nuke something like that from orbit or not. An MD thread purposefully made to get advice about a situation that you're currently in, jokingly or not, is absolutely not kosher. That "joke" could have ruined the moderators' work, the players' work, put the entire game in jeopardy, and make innocent posters in MD feel like

they

were at fault for presuming nobody would be so stupid as to make a thread in those circumstances.

Nominate all you want, but don't presume to say that game moderators make "ambiguous" calls as if it is somehow their fault that players talk about ongoing games.

[Oversoul]

And also I'm a scummies judge, so I can guarantee you this kind of thing gets taken into account.

dat bias

[Untrod Tripod]

oh you're not allowed to judge any awards that have nominated games you participated in (in any capacity). I'm not judging this year, but even if I was I wouldn't even be allowed to judge that category.

in case that wasn't assumed.

[mastin2]

Point of clarity: I did say "my understanding" for a reason; my memory isn't the greatest and I never read it in detail. I remember essentially a conversation of, "What was the Sven modkill for, anyway?", the mods explaining it, and the majority of the reaction being, "Eh, I can see why the call was made, but I don't think it was that clear-cut." (Point of clarity two, I'm not sure if the right word for the thread was "joke", again because I don't remember it that well.)

Citing [Anything Goes] as a good example is p lol, tho.

Putting aside the debate about the modkill/thread, though, it IS a good example, off of his play. His dayplay was amazingly good, both in that game and in all scumgames since and some before then that I've seen and heard about. I don't think there's a better player at looking town when scum than Sven. Sure, yeah, there are scum players who are VERY good at it and competent in other areas, too, but Sven is much stronger in that area than I've seen from others, and is no slouch when it comes to other areas, either.

His actions were against his wincon.

His actions outside the game, potentially (and even probably) accidentally. Not inside. Inside the game, he was playing a top-notch gameplay during the day.

Undersigning UT here, and adding that it sure is a joy to have to make a call on whether an MD thread is a "joke" or an actual reference to an ongoing game. You think it's ambiguous? Now imagine being on the team who has to make a call on whether to nuke something like that from orbit or not.

I'm not trying to start a debate about the validity of a months-old modkill or attack the people who made the decision, here. It happened; the call was made. However, my point is that discarding a good scumgame because of a modkill that was for something outside the scumgame shouldn't be the case, when it was not clear-cut. I have no doubts it was a hard decision. But that's the thing--if it was an easy decision, then it'd be clear-cut, and the fact that it wasn't an easy decision by its very nature means that it wasn't clear-cut (thus, ambiguous). Not sure how that logic isn't clear.

The decision was made. I understand the logic behind why the decision was made. I know the logic behind why the decision was made. But the nomination is

not

about the decision being made. In this case, it's about intent. (Purposefully made to get advice about a situation you're in vs. not having intended it, but the risk being there.) If Sven did not intend harm, then he did not mean harm, and thus, he should not have the game disqualified because of it. The risk of harm was there--thus the eventual modkill. But I feel the game should not be discarded off of a mistake that was innocently made (there's a reason I ask mods about writing MD articles that use content from a current game, generally--it's specifically to avoid this, but I'm paranoid about it and someone less paranoid can make the error), even if said mistake resulted in a modkill, because it was a mistake that was not inside the game and the nomination is for something that is explicitly for inside the game.

[Untrod Tripod]

Yeah that was kind of your cue to stop posting

And as one of the two people who made that call, it was not at all a hard decision.

[Tierce]

I'm not trying to start a debate about the validity of a months-old modkill or attack the people who made the decision, here. It happened; the call was made. However, my point is that discarding a good scumgame because of a modkill that was for something outside the scumgame shouldn't be the case, when it was not clear-cut. I have no doubts it was a hard decision. But that's the thing--if it was an easy decision, then it'd be clear-cut, and the fact that it wasn't an easy decision by its very nature means that it wasn't clear-cut (thus, ambiguous). Not sure how that logic isn't clear.

Still undersigning UT. It's 'hard' because it sucks to modkill someone. The thread made the decision pretty clear-cut--being a hard decision to make because "it sucks to modkill someone and affect the gamestate due to someone's idiocy" doesn't make it

ambiguous

.

And if you don't remember the thread (I do!), then perhaps you should simply shut up when it comes to dismissing it as a reason to modkill, mastin. As I said, make the nomination all you want, but when someone speaks up with issues that are actually very relevant to the games you mention, you either have data points to offer or you don't. Vague memories and vague dismissal don't do anything to justify your position.

[Oversoul]

oh you're not allowed to judge any awards that have nominated games you participated in (in any capacity). I'm not judging this year, but even if I was I wouldn't even be allowed to judge that category.

in case that wasn't assumed.

it was a joke. sorry if I offended you. >_>

I'm just going to stop talking now

[Thesp]

If a player plays a good scum game, except they slip up and claim scum and get lynched for it, did they still play a "good scumgame"? If not, why would earning a modkill be any different?