Open 561: Farmer's Market (Game Over)

[mathbandit]

So I missed most of yesterday due to it happening super quick. Didn't really miss much, though. Aronis was pretty obvscum.

edit:
@Xay, Aronis killed DJ's partner.

[Xayzeck]

@Xay, Aronis killed DJ's partner.

Or Aronis didn't check into the QT and so DJ just killed his partner

[Xayzeck]

Come on it's not that hard to consider

[Bins]

Definitely consider it but there are a lot of other possibilities

In my mind there's a greater chance he was framed and the other partner did nothing/passed normally to avoid suspicion of themself

My problem with ice scum is that Aronis claimed Ice didn't pass to him
I don't think he would out his partner like that
He was probably trying to take ice down

[neil1113]

Definitely consider it but there are a lot of other possibilities

In my mind there's a greater chance he was framed and the other partner did nothing/passed normally to avoid suspicion of themself

My problem with ice scum is that Aronis claimed Ice didn't pass to him
I don't think he would out his partner like that
He was probably trying to take ice down

With Aronis flipping scum, I'm pretty sure in my eyes that would clear my slot, Ice's slot, Don's slot, and there was someone else that pushed the hell out of Aronis but I don't remember who. I'll have to check. I'm pretty sure his partner Day 1 tried to distance themselves by either not mentioning Aronis altogether, or by mentioning Aronis is scummy for pretty much no reason (or a crappy reason) but not really pushing the case. After all, whoever is Aronis' partner is pretty much guaranteed to be the one that came up with the gambit toward Ice. And it made since because Ice was already looking scummy as hell after Day 1 with our town flip from the lynch.

Also, I hate to say it, but... the fruiting idea left us with nothing but WIFOM. Yeah we stopped a kill last night, but now we have to wonder. Is is the other group trying to frame someone in the passing lane, or is it truly someone in the passing lane afraid to get caught?

I am interested though, Don, you stated my play all game has been "pretty scummy"... I'd like to hear your case. Why has my play been classified as pretty scummy, rather than null or town motivated? I asked Bins to do this earlier and she couldn't come up with anything either. I feel like that is a classic OMGUS accusation, and Bins just doesn't like my play style for whatever reason. Probably because I exposed her for the sheep she was. Oh well.

I'm going to read through again and see what I can find. To clarify:

Town is: Don, Neil, Ice

We're not lynching from these three today, unless you can provide one hell of a case to prove against the pretty glaring obviousness (from their interactions, flip, and play today) that these are town. That leaves the possible suspect pool of:

Xayzeck, fitz, math, fish, bins.

Although I will say, Fitz made an excellent push Day 1 against what looked like an obvious team (Don and Siv), and seemed pretty interested in the game. Day 2 Fitz was around, but didn't do much pushing (though clearly, no one really did. We had an obv scum so that could be an excuse.) I honestly like Fitz as town right now (without my read through again.)

Math's most recent post here kinda rubs me the wrong way... I'm more willing to look into a possible Math scum scenario. I just didn't like the crap pushes against Math Day 1, which made me believe it was scum motivated. Honestly, while I don't like Math's most recent post, I can still see his wagon and push being scum motivated so the people behind that, I'd like to look at too. But first I'll have to re-evaluate my read on Math.

Xayzeck, I really don't have much of an opinion on. Seems to be under the radar in my reads, as I don't have many notes on them in general. I'm going to have to change that.

Fish is in a similar situation as Xayzeck. I think somebody pushed Fish earlier as scum, and Fish responded rather... fishy (bum dum.. DUM!) and I have that recorded down as a red flag, but besides that not much really pinged my scum-dar with Fish. I'll have to again, re-evaluate.

Bins I don't have a clear, unbiased opinion on. I think she's just sheeping town right now, though I'm not really sure where my town read comes from. The way she bounced around Day 1, throwing her vote around like 1 water bottle split between 56 sweaty, thirsty football players. Day 2, she seemed kind of set on Aronis but in my notes, I feel like she gave herself a way out if the town wanted to push Ice or Don. Especially the way she kept clarifying she wanted to "wait for Aronis." As if she expected something specific. I can also kind of see a little bit of coaching going on as Bins kept saying "I want Aronis to claim Ice didn't give him fruit" or something along those lines, and she said it repetitively over and over again. As if, Bins and Aronis didn't expect Ice to come out on the offensive like that. Bins was trying to feed Aronis an idea to get out of the lynch, and ironically Aronis took it. So Bins "waited" and pondered, and then eventually realized there was no way Aronis was getting out of it, and voted him.

In fact, after typing out my opinion and rereading my notes on Bins from the last day phase, that really, REALLY does look like coaching and distancing practice. In fact, so much, that I'm comfortable doing this:

VOTE: Bins

I'll look back and reread through the others as well to make sure I'm not just biased, but I strongly recommend everyone read the interactions between Bins and Aronis from Day 2, and tell me how she DOESN'T look scummy from it. I'm pretty sure we just caught Aronis' teammate.

[Bins]

The way she bounced around Day 1, throwing her vote around like 1 water bottle split between 56 sweaty, thirsty football players. Day 2, she seemed kind of set on Aronis but in my notes, I feel like she gave herself a way out if the town wanted to push Ice or Don.

[Bins]

Would you say you get mislynched as town a lot?

[Bins]

I asked Bins to do this earlier and she couldn't come up with anything either. I feel like that is a classic OMGUS accusation, and Bins just doesn't like my play style for whatever reason. Probably because I exposed her for the sheep she was. Oh well.

1. I did say why I suspected you.
2. See above for question.
3. Really? REALLY? You were the one saying "Bins, you're following Siv like a lost puppy blah blah how can you be so blind? Vote him he is obvs scum blah blah." You "exposing me" was nothing more than exposing me to be following a town you wrongly accused.

[don_johnson]

neil: who did you fruit? I say your play is "scummy" because I feel you've been overly aggressive about small things while being overprotective and almost "whiteknightish" when it came to mathbandit. however, I still think math is more likely to be scum. his post today seems completely dismissive of everything we went through yesterday. bins seemed like obvtown to me. I fully expected bins to get shot.

also, there is no sane reason for scum to have not killed last night if they weren't giving fruit. this line of thought also implicates mathbandit.

neil: why are you clearing your own slot from aronis flipping scum?

[havingfitz]

We're not lynching from these three today

Last time I looked you had one vote. And all three of the people you list have no reason to not be considered. Maaaaaybe Ice based on Bins recent points in his favor. But you and don? No.

[IceGuy]

VOTE: neil

Something seems very off here. More to come.

[Xayzeck]

Aronis was partnered with IceGuy.

DJ was paired with Bulge.

Aronis flippsed scum, Bulge got killed.

Therefore, purely because of setup, I don't think IceGuy and DJ should be anywhere near endgame.

Because Bulge either died because:
DJ was scum
Scum were paired

Because all the other pairs went through(i think too lazy to confirm this).

So can we lynch both of them and get this over with? Why are there votes on other people right now?

[Xayzeck]

Because Bulge either died because:
DJ was scum
Scum were paired

Ok this isn't accurate, I kinda just realised after I posted.

I still stand by that neither of them should be close to endgame, though I'm more insistent on DJ than I am on Ice, because if it was Aronis/Ice I'm not sure why they bussed.

VOTE: DJ

So if you've got any reason for us not to lynch DJ ever, then please do bring it up.

If not, we're gonna end up lynching him anyway, and I'd like that to happen now.

[Bins]

Just because he has a different possible situation in no way makes him scummier.

I was thinking of this last night.

Aronis died. Aronis submitted the kill. Wanna know what the other partner did? Nothing. He could be equally any single one of us. Don didn't kill Bulge. Aronis killed Bulge. There was no reason to kill Bulge other than to FRAME Don.

So yeah, scum hunting and stuff woooo.

[Bins]

(ofc wifom and stuff)


I'd rather look at Aronis' comments, see the wagons, and scumhunt today.

[Xayzeck]

hi please explain to me why aronis killed bulge

what if aronis just didn't fruit and flaked the night

and then DJ had to kill his fruiting buddy

[Xayzeck]

There was no reason to kill Bulge other than to FRAME Don.

OR DON COULD BE SCUM

AND ARONIS, LIKE HOW HE FORGOT THE GAME

FORGOT TO CHECK INTO THE MAF QT

AND BADABING BADABOOM

[Bins]

Aronis came into the day saying, "I forgot to pass, I'm so sorry." That was scum's strategy for the day.

Why the fuck would scum think that's a good idea?

I think they were counting on us lynching Don Johnson. I think that was their only plan. And maybe Aronis was MIA and unable to talk in the scum QT but I don't see why they wouldn't have submitted the kill through the MIA person. The partner would have assumed Aronis wouldn't be there to fruit, why would he submit the kill and not fruit as well? I'd make Aronis do it. Especially if he wasn't there.

[Xayzeck]

but I don't see why they wouldn't have submitted the kill through the MIA person.

you can make other people submit stuff

right I almost forgot that

[Bins]

It could have been anyone of us equally. Maybe a liiiiiittle more Don_Johnson. But I think we should look at Neil's babbling and consider him as a bigger candidate today. Maybe even Math.

[Xayzeck]

Is that common knowledge? Because I don't think I've seen that in any of my scum qts

[Bins]

Someone had to tell me in game that it was possible, but yeah I didn't see it anywhere on a scumQT or role pm or anything.

[Xayzeck]

Someone had to tell me in game that it was possible, but yeah I didn't see it anywhere on a scumQT or role pm or anything.

or maybe you did it in the scumqt that's why you brought it up DUNDUNDUN

lol jk i don't think so

[Xayzeck]

Xayzeck, I really don't have much of an opinion on. Seems to be under the radar in my reads, as I don't have many notes on them in general. I'm going to have to change that.

i am town

Really though, I replaced in because TSO I think had to replace out of almost all of his games? So I decided to replace into one of his games just to help mods out and what not.

The setup was fun for the 3 pages I played in my last game.

And honestly, I have not read up yet, since setup has taken down 1 scum lynch already. I'm not particularly concerned about catching up, I'll probably just read from interacting in the current situation. I've got like mild townreads and scumreads already

Soooooo yeah

Just read me as town and move on, or lynch me and pray maf kills and you fruit so you can get conftown

[Bins]

Yeah, no scumread on Xay. I like Don's point about the fact mafia would kill if they weren't fruiting.


I think the lynch should be among those people.

In my preference, something like:

Neil > Math > Don > Ice > me !

But eh, I'll wait for Neil to respond to me before voting.