Micro 377: Vengeballs. OVER!!!

[Dr Pants]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Espresso

I've seen enough. There's no way Espresso isn't scum. If I get a venge kill and he's alive, I will kill him regardless of what anyone else thinks.

@ Skelda: I don't have authority to say what is good and what is bad in this game. I only have my opinion, and that is what I'm using. Feel free to agree or disagree.

[FakedBlogger]

Well, if we are just organized and avoid freak hammers and stuff, it could still work. But yeah, I do see your point.

People can be obnoxious

.

It would make even more sense for you to say that if you were indeed a goat.

Assuming you are town, would you have proposed this plan as scum and why?

I for one like the bare odds of a successful vengekill and I trust that the one who eats rope has the best perspective to evaluate how legitimately it came to being. Also, I'm a good day 1 scumhunter and I will deliver a scumfuck if you mislynch me.

[Csareo]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Espresso

I've seen enough. There's no way Espresso isn't scum. If I get a venge kill and he's alive, I will kill him regardless of what anyone else thinks.

@ Skelda: I don't have authority to say what is good and what is bad in this game. I only have my opinion, and that is what I'm using. Feel free to agree or disagree.

Are you kidding me? It is page three, and you already have a "no way he isn't scum"?
There are probably two things that are questionable, but a definite scum read is just silly.
UNVOTE: clusk
VOTE: drpants

This is scummier than scum.

[Dr Pants]

thats fine, I'll take the shot then

note worthy: I just played 2 games with town espresso. this is not town espresso

[Csareo]

So your "No way he isn't scum", is in reality, just a meta lynch?

[Csareo]

Claiming you will venge kill isn't helping your case either.
You are hostage taking those who attempt to lynch you.
Threats are anti-town. I'm willing to take the risk.

[Dr Pants]

truthfully, yes

Espresso didn't play the same way in both town games. But when he was under pressure, he consistently had 2 kinds of responses: frustration/paranoia and defeat. He has never, ever, gone for the jokey sarcastic route. He also knows me well enough to know that my scum read on him was serious. He has also never been this eager to talk setup strategy. Right now he looks spastic, he isn't pushing for any scum at all, is only talking setup, and is defending my read on him with sarcastic posts admitting he's scum.

pedit: oh boo hoo, threats are anti-town, no way could the majority ever be wrong, especially when almost half the town is scum

[Dr Pants]

from just a baseline, there's a 50-50 chance that Espresso is scum. this alone strengthens my read considerably

[Bullish]

Venge kills > lynches because venge kills are guaranteed made by town, while lynches are at least part scum directed.

I've played 2 multi-ball games before, one as scum and one as town. The key is to limit information flow.

[Csareo]

from just a baseline, there's a 50-50 chance that Espresso is scum. this alone strengthens my read considerably

That weakens your reads. A 50-50 gambit isn't as ideal as you would like to think.
@Bullish, yes, you're right about the town "vengekill".

[Bullish]

That weakens your reads. A 50-50 gambit isn't as ideal as you would like to think.
...

Yeah. 9 players 4 scum, 50-50 aren't very big odds at all.

[Bullish]

ACTUALLY, if you ARE town, then there is exactly a 50-50 chance of picking scum.

[Espressojet]

Venge kills > lynches because venge kills are guaranteed made by town, while lynches are at least part scum directed.

I've played 2 multi-ball games before, one as scum and one as town. The key is to limit information flow.

I get what you're saying on the top part, but explain how limiting information is key.

Espresso didn't play the same way in both town games. But when he was under pressure, he consistently had 2 kinds of responses: frustration/paranoia and defeat. He has never, ever, gone for the jokey sarcastic route. He also knows me well enough to know that my scum read on him was serious. He has also never been this eager to talk setup strategy. Right now he looks spastic, he isn't pushing for any scum at all, is only talking setup, and is defending my read on him with sarcastic posts admitting he's scum.

A sample size of two? You must be the best scientist ever!

I play whatever suits my mood at that point in time, right now I'm sick of waiting for people to post in other games, so I'm pretty excited for the new Dr. P game which just started oh wait this is it.

I try to mix up my playstyles every game, even just a little. I've said it before and I'll say it again "People play differently in different games"

I mean, come on buddy. I don't think you're necessarily scum, but this push is dumb and just plain wrong! Was I not part of the initial setup discussion in FTL? Did you ever consider I may have opened sarcastically in one of the many games I've played without you? You "knew" I was scum by the third page?

I'm not very good at scumhunting, I'll be the first to admit, but I take TIME to develop my reads.

Also, I did NOT know that your initial scumreads was serious, which is why I continued to be sarcastic, and which is why I'm currently upset with you.

[Skelda]

Well, if we are just organized and avoid freak hammers and stuff, it could still work. But yeah, I do see your point.

People can be obnoxious

.

It would make even more sense for you to say that if you were indeed a goat.

Assuming you are town, would you have proposed this plan as scum and why?

I for one like the bare odds of a successful vengekill and I trust that the one who eats rope has the best perspective to evaluate how legitimately it came to being. Also, I'm a good day 1 scumhunter and I will deliver a scumfuck if you mislynch me.

Would I have proposed this plan? Probably. It was what I thought about when I first discovered this setup and so I already had thought of it before I got my alignment. So I might suggest it as scum just to try to act like Town-Skelda would, if that makes sense. I'm pretty sure there is no scum advantage to this plan. I just try to do things that I would if I were town as scum regardless of whether or not they directly benefit my game. And with this it is just setup speculation, so it definitely wouldn't hurt or help a scum game very much. It is obvious that you people aren't going through with it.

[Espressojet]

One thing more, pants: you were also wrong about my being scum in those two games I was town. If you're so sure you can use both of those games as evidence against me, why have you not considered this?

Has anyone ever told you the definition of insanity?

[Skelda]

from just a baseline, there's a 50-50 chance that Espresso is scum. this alone strengthens my read considerably

Shouldn't that just increase the likelihood that everyone is scum? I get that you see a suspicious player and think that since there are so many scum, you can just pick one and lynch them. But it doesn't make one player any more likely than another, and it seems like you are jumping the gun on this one.

[Skelda]

One thing more, pants: you were also wrong about my being scum in those two games I was town. If you're so sure you can use both of those games as evidence against me, why have you not considered this?

Has anyone ever told you the definition of insanity?

Ooo, that's certainly a little twisty, isn't it? I was Town the last two times and you thought I was scum, so obviously I'm scum this time. Your alignment there has no relevance here though, and supposedly he is reading you as scum for different reasons. I think that actually increases the chances of Espresso-scum for me.

[Skelda]

Edit: obviously I'm NOT scum this time

[Espressojet]

The fact that you had to clarify it though...

... Doesn't necessarily help your case

[Dr Pants]

One thing more, pants: you were also wrong about my being scum in those two games I was town. If you're so sure you can use both of those games as evidence against me, why have you not considered this?

Has anyone ever told you the definition of insanity?

lol what. by the end of day 1 in both games i was town reading you

[Bullish]

from just a baseline, there's a 50-50 chance that Espresso is scum. this alone strengthens my read considerably

Wait I misunderstood.

[FakedBlogger]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Espresso

I've seen enough. There's no way Espresso isn't scum. If I get a venge kill and he's alive, I will kill him regardless of what anyone else thinks.

@ Skelda: I don't have authority to say what is good and what is bad in this game.

I only have my opinion

, and that is what I'm using. Feel free to agree or disagree.

You'd also have a vengeball

if you were town.

Case closed.

[Espressojet]

One thing more, pants: you were also wrong about my being scum in those two games I was town. If you're so sure you can use both of those games as evidence against me, why have you not considered this?

Has anyone ever told you the definition of insanity?

lol what. by the end of day 1 in both games i was town reading you

Does page three look like the end of day one?

[Dr Pants]

no, but you straight up lied
in 2 previous games, I ended up getting a correct read on you before the end of the first day
in the last game, i even stopped you from getting mislynched
so your suggestion that I'm bad at reading you is incorrect

[Espressojet]

Straight up lied? When?

I wasn't suggesting you were bad at reading you. You townread me in other games, you'll do so here as well in time.