Open 573: C9++

[massive]

wgeurts wants to no lynch.
wgeurts doesn't like random bandwagons.
wgeurts wants to hold onto his vote.

I don't know that mafia is the game for wgeurts.

[GrayFoxxxx]

Ok I guess it is hard for you.

What do you do professionally?

star how is this in any way shape or form relevant?

I think he is trying to line me up for a joke that takes my intelligence into question.

[50 Shades of Purple]

Ok I guess it is hard for you.

What do you do professionally?

star how is this in any way shape or form relevant?

I think he is trying to line me up for a joke that takes my intelligence into question.

okay!

~iln

fakeeta: those other posts were by me too!

[MonkeyMan]

wgeurts wants to no lynch.
wgeurts doesn't like random bandwagons.
wgeurts wants to hold onto his vote.

I don't know that mafia is the game for wgeurts.

This is town too.

I am getting a good town block.

Heartless, Nero Cain, Massive and Me.

I think I just broke the game.

Scum:

wreurts, Death Stare

[sthar8]

Ok I guess it is hard for you.

What do you do professionally?

star how is this in any way shape or form relevant?

I need to know whether I'm addressing a spoiled child or an entitled prick.

[GrayFoxxxx]

Ok I guess it is hard for you.

What do you do professionally?

star how is this in any way shape or form relevant?

I need to know whether I'm addressing a spoiled child or an entitled prick.

Textbook strawman.

[sthar8]

I think you need to find a better textbook

[davesaz]

I can see why Anti thinks davesaz is scum. Post 152 is very underwhelming and halfhearted, especially seeing that it distinctly lacks

follow through

. There's no questions about Nero Cain's play style directed at people who know him and there's no accompanying vote on Nero Cain to back up the accusations of empty "-ish" posting. The sentence on wgeurts being null is as uninformative as the rest of the post and the scope of reads (only 2 players) is extremely narrow.

That's my "making a drive-by post on the way to work and see what happens" post style.

This is my "making a drive-by post while a show is on commercial to see if anything else happens" post.

After my shows are over for the night, I'll come back to see if the net has caught anything.

[Death Stare]

I'm tired so I'll comment on other stuff tomorrow.

Death Stare:
You suspect MonkeyMan because his vote on wgeurt is "bad" because (reasons). Then, you argue that after Nacho called him out on having a bad vote, MonkeyMan shoehorned in another reason to vote wgeurt. This is evidenced by (something). These are the reasons for your MonkeyMan vote.
Is all that correct, and if so, could you please fill in the missing links?

tl;dr
(reasons) = didn't bother to state them again after Nacho stated them already.
(something) = multiple factors. The timing of the post (as in, I think as town in general would say something about nacho's comment on his reason for vote being wrong first), and the tone of the post (the way he posted that post suggests that he was looking for other reason to justify his vote while silently ditching his first reason that nacho called bad).

[davesaz]

Wow la, I've just woken up and there so many posts here with so little content... as if the player list consisted of Aneninen. ^_^

I specially liked the part where certain players are willing to quicklynch someone because the Deadline is bugged. I'd suggest reading post 1, box 2, point 8, words 4 to 7.

Oh, you want content. Well, as for 78 from Wgeurts. I think he simply hasn't read the setup which is a null... in itself. Let's see what happens next. (By the way, your name sounds funny if you try to pronounce it in Dutch lololol!)

And now, the weather forecast. Hi there, Sthar8, Antihero and Mollie!

yeah, still want that dead.

scum hunting is really hard these days, you have a ton of players that are intentionally anti-town and then the rest of the players are irrational as fuck so determining if they are bad town or scum is a crap shoot. Can't you at least give me a hint? Is it Mollie and foxxxx?

Why do you think my play could be brash scum dav?

Short and kinda joking (to me) posting style, making assertions but without much logic, not coming back to follow up on the comments. These are the type of posts which can be laughed off as not being really serious. In my experience, posting like this can be an indicator of scum being talkative to look active but not wanting to take a really big stand on anything that they can't back out of. It's not a very strong indicator, but it identifies you as someone to watch. Also a quick perusal of your iso shows that the majority of your posts lack a quote for context, thereby making them a bit more difficult for others to use with proper context. This leaves opportunities for using misrep claims as a defense.

[sthar8]

In the meanwhile, I'd love to hear from sthar concerning his reads on Nero Cain and MonkeyMan.

woggerits has been all about the newbietells all game. Pretty obvious and clear newbie tells too. Like, newbietells 101. But I haven't seen anything scum-indicative from him. And Nero, at least, should be able to tell that wanting to no lynch and being afraid to vote are not scummy in the least

coming from someone without an avatar

. So, pretty basic low-hanging-fruit easy lynch hunting.

Not a whole lot, but certainly better than a random vote. And the immediate reaction of "omg reasons NAO!!!" tickled my funny parts. Hence my refusal to cooperate until more of the playerlist had posted.

As of right now, I'd be happy to lynch monkey or nero, especially since neither has been able to articulate what makes wogglydeegort scummy.


Monkey much more than Nero, since Nero actually has had a process, easy to fake though it is.

Almost done with work, more when I get home.

Yes, including the candyland nursery-school handholding for fox. Assuming he doesn't just

explode

from not getting his way RIGHT NOW DAMMIT.

[Death Stare]

Also a question to wogg.

If I were to not "divert attention" and followed the flow, what would I be doing?

[davesaz]

As of right now, I'd be happy to lynch monkey or nero, especially since neither has been able to articulate what makes wogglydeegort scummy.


Monkey much more than Nero, since Nero actually has had a process, easy to fake though it is.

I found it interesting that Monkey unvoted under pressure, but apparently not on a change of heart with regard to wgeurts.

Nero paid a lot of attention to the discussion regarding wgeurts, but still keeps DS as a scum read and has not moved his vote.

I think it was instructive to see who was concerned about a quick lynch of DS, even though at L-3 with days to go it never seemed to be a serious possibility. My vote and at least one other on that "wagon" are leftovers from RVS. I left mine there in part just to see what might develop if someone read the numbers without looking real deep into the support for a lynch or lack thereof. Since it doesn't seem to be generating any useful discussion, no point in keeping it there.

UNVOTE:

I have seen massive in another game, though he was NK'd before I replaced in so none of the interaction was in real time. I'd like to see more of him in this game.

wgeurts wants to no lynch.
wgeurts doesn't like random bandwagons.
wgeurts wants to hold onto his vote.

I don't know that mafia is the game for wgeurts.

This is town too.

I am getting a good town block.

Heartless, Nero Cain, Massive and Me.

I think I just broke the game.

Scum:

wreurts, Death Stare

I fail to see how MonkeyMan can get a town read on Massive from just one real post. It's a little too convenient to use it in a "town block" like this, like he's reaching for someone non-controversial to add to the list. The other members of the "block" seem to have only their suspicion of wgeurts in common. I don't identify town that way, too much chance to confbias yourself into ignoring scummy behavior that conflicts with block membership.

In fact, having thought about it long enough to write and edit this post, I think someone has some 'splaining to do.

VOTE: MonkeyMan

[Aneninen]

Oh My Gods, 4 new pages appeared while I was away!
I'll read everything as soon as I can.
Nero, you asked something in 141 and I asked back in the next post. Do you still need an answer for or has it become obsolete by now?

However, I decided to check Stavrogin before reading the thread. He has been active on this forum but, he hasn't posted a single thing here. I know it's possible, though very unlikely that he hasn't read his Role PM (and as far as I know the Mod won't reveal this). But in my opinion, he's lurking hard. I've seen townies fighting and lynching each other while one or more scums were lurking and doing nothing too many times. (Both in real life games and in online games too.)

I think it's very possible that he's scum.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Stavrogin – I may change this vote if I find something blatantly scummy while reading the forum.

[GrayFoxxxx]

Yes, including the candyland nursery-school handholding for fox. Assuming he doesn't just

explode

from not getting his way RIGHT NOW DAMMIT.

Im actually about to explode as I'm typing this. Pls rspnd.

[GrayFoxxxx]

[quote="In post 180

This post is what I need you to focus on.

[GrayFoxxxx]

Dont focus on my formatting error though.

[davesaz]

Another thing I've noticed. MTD voted Aneninen for fluff...

Spoiler: longish post

Simply not understanding the setup is null.

I wrote the same thing. And C9++ is not an easily-comprehend-able-ish setup, after all.

But

he said he isn't new to mafia...
I agree however that this is no tell.

I am not sure about him currently, he sure hasn't acted mega-towny, though.

Wanting to NL is normal for people coming from other sites.
Btw
@wguerts: You say we shouldn't lynch someone yet, and attack people for voting because you want to put pressure on people first. Just fyi, the most prominent way of pressuring people happens to be votes. And no, lynches don't happen because of 2 or 3 votes.

in general: It is quite obvious noone currently wants to quick-lynch anyone, so quit whining about it pls.

Aneninen's looks somewhat scummy to me. His posts are nearly all fluff, the only things he has really said about other people is

Wgeurts' play is indeed a bit strange, especially because he said that he wasn't new to Online Mafia though, I think he simply didn't undertstand the setup.

Basically saying that there is nothing interesting there and

MonkeyMan is changing his vote all the time.

Which is damn obvious.
In general I have the impression he is trying to make a good impression without risking anything. I don't like that.

VOTE: Aneninen

Death Stare is prob town, dunno about the other hydrae.
I don't really like GrayFox so far, but there's little to go on there.

Also I just realized that massive is

old

.

But then goes to post a bunch of

Spoiler: fluff

He meant my Mafiascum age.

exactly.

No idea why you assumed I knew his real age.
Or why you do.

@MTD: his real age is on his page.

uhm.... is it?

Well, there actually is the possibility to change votes, you know....

Just explain yourself itsn't that hard if you're town.

really, this isn't that hard.
Hint: there is a difference between reasons for voting someone in particular and reasons for placing a vote (regardless of the one you vote for).

This is nowhere near as important so my vote stays where it is, but keeping MTD in mind for later.

[davesaz]

[quote="In post 180

This post is what I need you to focus on.

Noted for future reference. I won't spoil your interaction by interjecting my thoughts just yet.

[GrayFoxxxx]

[quote="In post 180

This post is what I need you to focus on.

Noted for future reference. I won't spoil your interaction by interjecting my thoughts just yet.

I would love to hear them, but it's your call.

[GrayFoxxxx]

See them...its late.

[sthar8]

I'm typing right now. Don't die.

[sthar8]

although you might explain what you think a strawman is, just for the entertainment factor.

[sthar8]

OK fox, let's do this. Have you exploded yet?

Spoiler: Open if you have Fox-level reading skills

Your last line admits that you don't really have a scum read on Nero, and you are waiting to see if he drops one.

I don't think you and I are reading the same thread. I don't see anything in that post that implies this, no matter how you twist it.

"I wont tell you why I seriously voted you"

yes

"I voted you for reactions"

No. I never said or implied that.

"Wait I still haven't given any reasons!"

Sure, but you're implying a contradiction that doesn't exist. I had to point out that I hadn't given any reasons still because

you

were having trouble following the conversation.

Actually, if your post 154 wasn't providing reasons what was the point of it ? I literally cant see anything other than vague reasons for a serious vote.

read better. the word of the day is context. c-o-n-t-e-x-t. context.


I asked nero why i would refuse to explain as scum, he answered. Then he asked why I might refuse to explain as town, and I answered with five reasons I

might

do so. Not, you will notice, reasons to vote him in the first place. Not, obviously, the actual reasons I was withholding reasoning.

You say you wont tell scum why you voted.

I didn't, actually. Please fact check yourself before you spout fiction.

Are you calling me scum by not giving your "real" reasons?

no. is that something you found in your 'textbook?'

You need to understand that making petty demands based on your own failed understanding is goofy as shit. Following that with wildly inaccurate speculation that compounds your own errors is downright annoying. And when you start being annoying, pretty much everything else gets prioritized over you.

@Anti-heart I could get behind a dave wagon or a monkey wagon right now. I don't see deafnote being the play unless you see something more compelling, and nero's looking better.

I'm waiting for more limericks to move my vote.

There was something else I wanted to say, but I forgot what...

[Aneninen]

First of all, can't we call the hydras their hydra names, pretty please? It's really confusing to follow things whenever someone refers to them by one of their heads.

As for the catch-up:

Spoiler:

Sthar8, 145 –

"nero and monkey are good lynches atm, but it was easier to leave my vote on nero than CHECK THE VC and CLICK THE TAGS BUTTON and PREVIEW MY POST."

– good

lynches

? Isn't it a bit strong on Page6? (Even if both of them were FoS at that point, as far as I can remember). By the way, I asked before and you haven't answered:

why are you sure that Nero is scum?

154 might have been an answer after all. Though, as GrayFox pointed it out in 162, a weird reason. (I mean, why Nero? Why not someone else?) Catch-up edit: also, see later in this post!
Also, why is it important to check the VC before voting for someone? The only reason for this I could imagine is if someone is near to lynch and I want to avoid derphammering them by accident.

DeathStare, 151 – well, thanks a lot, you're really helpful by doing that. ^_^

Davesaz, 152 –

"Reasoning can be a two edged sword for town. If you explain too much, scum can figure out how you're reading them and adjust accordingly."

– And we can read those changes too.

Nero, 159 – Wgeurts' gameplay is strange indeed but not an alignment-tell. By the way, have you ISO'd him on his home-site yet?

Heartless, 160 – Like wow, a naked vote! 164 Even if it was a joke, I suppose, you called Massive and me scum in 42. It's strange that you didn't remember your own post.

Wgeurts, 165 and in general – for Gods' Sake, vote for someone, pleeeease! A lot of us have been explaining that No Lynch doesn't help the town! Also, blitzwagons are very rare on this page. (In my very first game I thought that I might be blitzwagoned and lynched. Later realized I that I had been deeply wrong about that.)

Heartless, 169 – can you give some details about this? Maybe it's only me but I can't see the connection between the quote and your comment on it.

Nero, 176 – why do you think that Davesaz is scum? 'till that point he had hardly posted anything and he hadn't been the only one doing that. Self-note: as for DeathStare, I'll ISO them later because I'm unsure about their wagon; I want to find out whether they're scummy or the wagon is a scum-pushed one.

GrayFox, 180 – I agree with this post. Totally.

Sthar8, 191 – Uhhhh, I disliked this.

MTD, 207 – did that mean that you were townreading Sthar8? Or did that mean that you were understanding Sthar8's gameplay?

Heartless, 213/214/217 – lol, I've never been called "cute and disarming", nor "trying to be like that". Most people says that I'm fluffing on the first couple of pages and I've never denied that.

"*sigh* I'm already not able to follow a few people. Namely: Antihero, sthar8, Death Stare"

– OLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL! Antihero is your other head! As for your questions for

Sthar8

,

DeathStare

and 50Shades: I too want to hear the answers for those. (In general, I liked the TTH-head catch-up. Seems to be genuine.)
Catch-up edit: DeathStare's one is found. It's quite vague, in my opinion. Sthar8's answer is found too if I'm doing my catch-up right and it has been 235. It may be genuine though, I don't think most of us consider Wgeurts a low-hanging-fruit. Though, they may have considered. And Nero jumped on the DeathStare wagon in 176. We should remember that later.

Monkeyman, 216 – can you re-summarize your case against Wgeurts? (My reason for asking this is more or less the same as DeathStare's one in 220, point 2.) 221 – eeeew, was that a joke?

50Shades, 223/224 – the latter one is a good question, but, in general, will you start providing some content, pretty please?

Massive, 225 – thanks,

that

post helped a lot. ^_^

Sthar8, 229 and some posts nearby, especially 248 later – please, stop doing this! Mafia is a f-cking game, attack the posts, the cases, the votes or whatever but don't attack the players themselves. We've known each other for a while and I've never experienced such a thing from you before.

Davesaz, 232 – this may or may not be true, we're going to find it out later, I suppose. 234 – Why did you dig up those posts? Nero has posted plenty of other things since those... 237 – as for the first part, we should remember this if either Davesaz or DeathStare flips scum. As for the second part: wow, I haven't realized that. What if it is a scumtell on Monkeyman? 242 – You're wrong here. MTD is most probably town.

GrayFox, 239–245 – did you really think that Sthar8 will post sooner or faster if you urge him? 16 minutes passed between the two posts I liked. Why the hell did you suppose that he had been online at all?

Conclusions. (Not many, but better than nothing)

Spoiler:

Probably town:

MTD (I'd been townreading him before and this hasn't changed)
GrayFox (though, the latest posts about urging Sthar8 is a thing I don't like)

Lean town

Heartless (the Antihero head was null-ish, but the TellTaleHeart head seems to be very town)

Unsure/Unsorted

Davesaz (his latest posts seem to be more-or-less townis, but there are disturbing things too, see above)
Nero (I can't read him. Some of this posts seems to be genuine scumhunting but some of them, especially his scumreads are weird)
Deathstare (either I'm unable to read them or their fluff/content ratio is very bad) – can someone summarize the case against them?
50Shades (very little content) – see the next comment here
Massive (technically no content) – I would like to see much more relevant content from both of you or else I'll think that you're lurking

Lean scum

Monkeyman (he was FoS in my eyes before and his later posts have only strengthened that)

Probably scum

Sthar8 (I don't like that he's not giving away his reasons for most of the time. His play was entirely different in another game – though, I must admit that he replaced into that game and my gameplay is different too if I'm a replacement. Also, 235 gave me some town vibes.)
Stavrogin (see my previous post for my reasons)

Also,

Spoiler:

You have been pigeoned! TROLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!