Micro 407: Jurassic Park Mafia - Game Over
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Mathdino Survivor
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Actually, scratch that, insanity townflip gives pretty much nothing as well. Regardless, point stands.-
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Beck Jack of All Trades
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In post 998, Scripten wrote:That looks more like Beck just being Beck.
If that's true why give intent to hammer?Beck =/= The band
Beck = a football player
"Without rules there is Chaos" C. Kramer-
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Mathdino Survivor
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Read his posts, Beck, he was fishing for reactions out of me. He never would've hammered.-
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Mathdino Survivor
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I want to note that if Scripten is scum and thus can't provide confirmation tomorrow, the correct play there (if you're town) would be to hammer because he'll die tomorrow anyway.-
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ArcAngel9 Jack of All Trades
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fferyllt replaces FinnLaw. this is effective immediately.
Due the size of the game and to give fair chance for fferyllt to catchup. the deadline for d1 is extended until the weekend.Inatimeofancientgods,warlordsandkings,alandinturmoilcriedoutforahero.ShewasXena,amightyprincessforgedintheheatofbattle.Thepower,thepassion,thedanger.Hercouragewillchangetheworld-Xena Warrior Princess, Coming Soon!!-
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ArcAngel9 Jack of All Trades
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Last edited by ArcAngel9 on Tue Nov 04, 2014 5:24 am, edited 2 times in total.Inatimeofancientgods,warlordsandkings,alandinturmoilcriedoutforahero.ShewasXena,amightyprincessforgedintheheatofbattle.Thepower,thepassion,thedanger.Hercouragewillchangetheworld-Xena Warrior Princess, Coming Soon!!-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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hi guys.
catching up!
UNVOTE:-
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Grib Mafia Scum
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 27, Beck wrote:has their ever been a micro with 3 scum? if yes i'd love to see that game
I played a themed micro once with 2 scum and 2 3rd parties. Also played a themed micro with two scum and an SK.
In post 28, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Set-up speculation is not good for town.
We should stop doing it.
Is this the bitter experience of a certain mini normal speaking?
page 3, and I like scripten. Beck seems pretty paranoid, which I tend to think town. Or 3rd party. Are we thinking 3rd party is a thing for reals? Post 60 is either coming from town or from a scum who has internalized the hell out of a fake claim. Wondering if AA9 provides fake claims when she sends out role pms or if she waits to be asked.
In post 77, Beck wrote:In post 76, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:In post 29, Grib wrote:All I know is that non-Herbivores must die.
More votes on the fleshchewer BBT.
And for the record, I have been in a micro on this site with a scumteam and a Serial Killer.
This post is the one I really dislike Scripten.
It's like 'Well, I'm town and I'm a herbivore, so everyone else needs to die'.
But it seems scum are omnivores, so if he were scum don't you think he would know a town carnivore would speak up?
I will concede bringing up the idea of scum/3rd party does concern me a little but seeing him explain how he got there calmed those concerns
Why did you think the bolded?
In post 103, Scripten wrote:Yawn.
Do you always suck at reading people this badly? I can see why you got defensive when I voted you.
This post bothers me. Scripten has his vote on beck, but this comment doesn't assume beck is scum. Which makes the comment about being defensive not fit. It's an extremely mixed narrative.
In post 105, Scripten wrote:In post 104, Beck wrote:Except I never got defensive, and I don't appreciate you insulting me. Do it again and ill report you to the mod
Wasn't insulting you, bud. It's your play I was insulting. Your read is so far off it's laughable and you haven't got a leg to stand on.
I voted you, and you responded with an OMGUS vote that you tried to cover up with a half-baked excuse of a case to play it off as something else. Got anything better or are you just going to call me dense and cry when I tell you that your play is poor?
And more. :/
In post 121, yungh0mo wrote:Oh it posted lmaoo my computer was being weird sorry. Just RVS VOTE: Scripten because aggressiveness is kinda bleh
Don't like the above much. So much real data in the thread to inform a vote.
@Scripten - how many reads would you expect someone to have formed at the point where you asked beck for more reads and less setup spec?
I like beck's 124. Town thought process IMO.
I don't like 129 by mathdino.
131 - I like this post because thinking what I'm thinking when I'm thinking it.
In post 136, Pine wrote:In post 80, insanity018 wrote:
In post 43, Pine wrote:Got free time faster than expected
No real reads as yet, but I may pass out from all of the stupid fumes being given off from is thread. Even if the mod didn't outright state that it's not carnivores vs herbivores etc,someone outright herpderping that they're a carnivore would've made that obvious.Scum would have to be absolute blithering morons to advertise it otherwise
In fact...yeah. I take it back. Mild townread on Gribble for herpderping, moderate scum read on Blueblood for unreasonable pouncing
Vote: BluebloodedToffee
What are you talking about in the bolded?
This post feels mega defensive (possibly white knighting Grib?) to me.
VOTE: Pine
P-edit: To my understanding, scum are the dinosaurs which don't follow the park rules. They can be herbivores, carnivores or omnivores --> the type of dinosaur is not alignment indicative
Not really sure how it's possible to be defensive when I wasn't being attacked. What was meant by the bolder was that, even if we didn't know per Mod that -vote status wasn't alignment indicative, someone coming out and saying "I'm a carnivore" should be a clue to that effect. It would otherwise be playing against wincon and tantamount to saying "BTW I'm scum"
This thread is moving annoyingly fast. If people could keep all of the personal shit out of it, and make their posts on-topic and worth reading, it would be a lot easier to stay current.
Beck? We've had issues in the past. Talking to you as well as others on this. Please don't pick unnecessary fights and clog up the thread with nonsense
Grib? Stop engaging.
BBT barreling ahead on flavor alone makes me very, very content wi my vote. It's staying on him.
By the way, BBT, I didn't actually defend Grib, more or less at all. I called you out for scummy logic, which you're continuing with
^^ The last line here is pretty much the definition of chainsawing, no?
In post 154, Beck wrote:I mean he knows grib's role pm directly contradicts the pm he supposedly has, yet he believes grib is telling the truth amd isn't suspicious about it.
Town would be suspicious of that, whenever somebody contradicts a town role pm, that means the person is lying.
The alternative would mean that script is being naive but I dont see that as a possibility.
P.edit - By default yes, not by their play
Do you often play themed games?
In post 166, Pine wrote:No, because is don't feel it has merit. It's you using a buzzword.
As for your OMGUS, I came out hard against you, and now you're throwing whatever you can at me to see what sticks. I calls it likes I sees it
^^ The irony here amuses me.
In post 182, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:I like to get town-reads and work with those town-reads.
Helps me narrow down the pool I need to lynch from to find scum.
It bothers me a little that you saw what Pine was doing as buddying, given this. :/
186 - more thinking what I'm thinking. I'm a little less enthused because of his own parallelism fail, though.
In post 219, BlueBloodedToffee wrote:Town -> Scripten, Beck, Insanity
Null -> Finn, Math, Yung
Scum -> Grib, Pine
In order. So Finn is closer to town and Yung closer to scum. Math a true null.
At this point, my off the cuff reads are
Town:
Grib
Beck
Maybe Town:
Insanity (will need to see more here before I can say town, but I like what she's posted so far)
Scripten
BBT
Not So Town:
MathDino
Yung
Pine
Mathdino's 235:
I hate the reasons for the insanity townread even though I'm townreading insanity at this point. And I don't like the conclusion paragraph, though it's possible we develop reads really, really differently. This post didn't do anything to change her placement in my reads list.
And page 10 ends with an L-1 wagon and a claim. :/ Unseemly haste, guys.
I'll post my catch up in 10 page chunks and see how that goes.-
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Majiffy Go with the Flow
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Dont make me a sad jiffy now, ffery. I was already scumreading your slot and your reads are backassward.Only playing in games at personal moderator and/or 50%+ playerlist request.
How To Win Every Game At Mafiascum (The Flowchart)||In case anyone was unsure...
Svenskt Stål (23:38) majiffy, worst mod on ms? we talk to a surviving victim of his game-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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When do we ever agree on day 1?-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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Also, if you're going to diss my reads, kindly do so with details.-
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Majiffy Go with the Flow
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Finish catching up first.Only playing in games at personal moderator and/or 50%+ playerlist request.
How To Win Every Game At Mafiascum (The Flowchart)||In case anyone was unsure...
Svenskt Stål (23:38) majiffy, worst mod on ms? we talk to a surviving victim of his game-
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Beck Jack of All Trades
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In post 1008, fferyllt wrote:Why did you think the bolded?
Misread the mods post and.thought that was what she said.
No I don't play many themesBeck =/= The band
Beck = a football player
"Without rules there is Chaos" C. Kramer-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 1013, Beck wrote:In post 1008, fferyllt wrote:Why did you think the bolded?
Misread the mods post and.thought that was what she said.
No I don't play many themes
That kinda helps put some of your posts into perspective.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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^^ What was it about the 2 posts that gave you the feel of unaligned pairs? Why do you feel like it couldn't be town vs town?
255 - I like this post.
257 - this reminds me. I replaced into a game where beck-scum had replaced out recently. One huge difference in his play here vs there is how much less in-your-face he was there.
262 - Scripten, why were you more sure Pine was town here?
263 - if beck is involved in another L-1 grandstand in the next 30 or so pages I'm probably going to want to put my vote where Finn had it.
In post 269, Beck wrote:If it makes no sense, why did you unvote?
P.edit - I know you arent l-1, doesn't matter. People unvoted you cause you soft claimed and it doesn't work like that. Your partner umvoted first, causing insanity to also unvote.
Proper play is a person refuses to claim = death by lynch.
If mafia were played by hard and fast rules like this, it would be an easy game for scum and a boring game for town.
Page 12, and Pine looks a lot better. Grib looks worse.
309 makes my head hurt. Beck am I gathering correctly that you come from a chatmafia background?
311 is dramatic as fuck, but drips town IMO.
320 trips one of my pet peeves.
329 it's maaaybe possible my vote would have been here if I had been in the game at that point, but the composition of yung's wagon here gives me pause. But, I really like the explanation in BBT's 332 because this is what I disliked about yung's RVS post.
man you guys sure like flashwagons (page 14).
352 <3 my predecessor. Totally agree with the first paragraph.
357 however, I can see someone voting a person because they dislike something they don't think is alignment indicative.
In post 367, Beck wrote:OK so in the meantime we lose 2 townies before we Lynch scum, that's not a trade off I'm on with
This looks like a scum slip, maybe. :/
But, beck's page 16 posts are so stubborn and singleminded (and thoroughly wrongheaded) that I want to call him town anyway.
Also, nobody else picked up that potential slip?
In post 402, Scripten wrote:Welcome to the game, Majiffy!
BBT:Wait, you're scumreading Beck, Grib, and Majiffy's slot? Can you give a rundown on their order of scuminess? Just curious.
Do you base your reads on how many scum think are in the game?
411 pings.
420 also pings, mostly for moving the vote. I know some players think that voteliness is next to godliness, but it still bugs me when people move their vote rather than unvote and regroup.
421 has a lining up lynches feel to it.
In post 426, Beck wrote:Single minded? No
Speaking the truth? Yes
Cop/tracker/watcher/role blocker/doc/gunsmith/bodyguard/big
None of those are confirmable. Some would argue big could be bu that could be SK.
There's not a single role that is ACTUALLY confirmable, that can't be confirmed today.
This is a very short list of possible roles. And there are some confirmable roles that can't be confirmed on day 1. There are more roles that are confirmable wrt actions but not 100% confirmable as to alignment. But, mafia isn't a game of blacks and whites, except wrt to the role cards themselves. Players are all shades of grey. That's why it's a social game.
Page 18 and 19 BBT goes from pretty mild townreading of my predecessor to hard-defending Finn. This makes me feel really odd.
486 comes off incredibly town to me.
In post 488, Beck wrote:In post 485, Grib wrote:Itisfucking scummy because he claims he can prove it.
Why don't you get this.
Its not though, it town believes every soft claim, scum would never get lynched.
I get you don't share my opinion, just like I don't share yours but scum HAVE gotten lynched while fake claiming that means town players exsist that share my opinion. Saying my opinion is scummy is factually wrong cause I have proved it wrong
I've seen scum fake claim considerably more often than soft claim. I've seen town softclaim more often than I've seen scum softclaim.
It's all anecdote, and you haven't proven anything at all. Neither have I. Neither has anyone else. Claims and softclaims come in the context of the player's play prior to the claim and after.
And that's page 20.-
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Mathdino Survivor
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486 was the mod.-
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Scripten Mafia Scum
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In post 1008, fferyllt wrote:
Beck seems pretty paranoid, which I tend to think town. Or 3rd party. Are we thinking 3rd party is a thing for reals?
Interesting. I never considered the third party angle. Why do you think his play might correspond with a third party?
In post 1008, fferyllt wrote:
This post bothers me. Scripten has his vote on beck, but this comment doesn't assume beck is scum. Which makes the comment about being defensive not fit. It's an extremely mixed narrative.
Scum make reads, too. They're just fabricated instead of genuine like the town's reads. That said, I no longer scumread Beck like I had then, for clarity.
In post 1008, fferyllt wrote:
@Scripten - how many reads would you expect someone to have formed at the point where you asked beck for more reads and less setup spec?
I didn't have a number in mind. I picked a player that stood out and pushed for more information to move the game further. It... worked, but not exactly how I was expecting it to, tbh.
His reaction to my vote read townie. Specifically, that he reacted at all. Seems to me that scum would, upon realizing that my vote was an obvious reaction test, just avoid commenting on it at all.
Not sure what you mean by this?-
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Beck Jack of All Trades
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In post 1015, fferyllt wrote:309 makes my head hurt. Beck am I gathering correctly that you come from a chatmafia background?
Nope, 2010 to present mafia scum
2007 or 2008 to 2010 - another forum.
I mean I did play epicmafia some but mainly trolledBeck =/= The band
Beck = a football player
"Without rules there is Chaos" C. Kramer-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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I'm going to respond to this post separately because of it's length and content.
In post 512, Mathdino wrote:Alright, reads.
Grib:His defence of hopping on the Scripten wagon was slightly WIFOMy but I'm not getting the wagon on him. He seems like just a medium activity townie who's speaking his mind. He still hasn't answered to one thing though:
Grib, what ARE your reasons for voting Scripten back there?
Can you give some examples of town speaking his mind posts?
Beck:I said it before, I really don't like Beck given the ISO of him/Scripten. But pushing a possible PR lynch like this is plain anti-town. Softclaiming is not a scumtell. Scripten isn't even scummy. I'm confident with this vote.
VOTE: Beck
And what was the scum motivation for Beck making such a huge bag of noise out of himself, to the point where some players at this point talk about voting him just to get him out of the game? Also, have you meta'd him? Because I have a beck scum game you might be interested in. http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=58487 bonus: it's my most recent scum game as well.
Scripten, like I said, very much reads town. Question though,
Scripten, can you restate the reasons for going after Grib?
Overall he reads town, but there were some posts on page 4 or 5 or so that gave me a little pause when I did my readthrough.
BBT's meta seems pretty consistent when it comes to his tone and aggressiveness, but at the very least it looks like he's pushing a town agenda. Not really seeing scum motivation in his Grib-tunneling, and very much not seeing it in the fact that he's been townreading people a lot this game.
Ok, so you are a meta player. Now I'm very curious what games of Beck's you meta'd.
I can't say I agree with insanity's case onFinnLaw, because while it may be true that this post was useless, useless =/= scummy. I'm finding it difficult to see FinnLaw purposefully manufacturing that post and fluffing it up, he reads like town trying to consolidate his thoughts on the game.
This is a much more nuanced read the prior ones. hmm.
Got nothin on Pine and Majiffy, obv not willing to lynch a replacement this soon.
Pine had put a fair bit into the game thread at this point. Why are you lumping him with a lurky slot you're not willing to lynch yet.
insanityis pinging me but I'm having issues explaining it. I think my main issue is her case on FinnLaw; it seems rather opportunistic, and she's been consistently going after people who are being useless rather than scummy. She had a scumread on Beck earlier but nothing came of that, instead making a case on Finn and then wagoning Yung.
FoS: her
Don't like this either.
I don't like either of your main scumreads here.
This is where I'd have my vote at this point in my readthrough.-
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Mathdino Survivor
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Spoiler: 1. I don't remember exactly what posts I meant back then, but looking back, I do like these posts.
2. Haven't meta'd him, no. Scum motivation was to strongarm a claim out of a townish player.
3. I've played with FinnLaw and BBT before, thus a higher quality of their reads. The probability of me metaing someone is directly proportional to A. my frustratedness at figuring them out, and B. the amount of effort I put into the game.
4. Because of the lower number of posts he'd made, I couldn't get a read yet. They looked like they could easily come from any alignment.
5. insanity read had a lot to do with the fact that I felt the Finn wagon was unwarranted and a bit iffy. IIRC my FoS on her was nixed in the next page, not sure if I mentioned that.
6 (there was no six but whatever). Yeah, my posts lack content and general quality. My townishness is pretty much directly proportional to how much effort I feel like putting in, and tbh, this game's clusterfuck demotivated me from wanting to figure it out. Also why I'm procrastinating on my own read of the game (and reads in general). Then lack of effort snowballs into being even more confused, thus my half giving up for D1 and going after yung's slot.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 1017, Scripten wrote:In post 1008, fferyllt wrote:
Beck seems pretty paranoid, which I tend to think town. Or 3rd party. Are we thinking 3rd party is a thing for reals?
Interesting. I never considered the third party angle. Why do you think his play might correspond with a third party?
Third party was being talked about at that point, which was why it occurred to me. Thinking about my own tendencies when I get a 3rd party role, I could see a 3rd Party player jumping hard on every little thing. As the game is unfolding so far, I'm not getting the feeling of odd sorts of eddies in the reads that multifaction usually generates.
In post 1008, fferyllt wrote:
This post bothers me. Scripten has his vote on beck, but this comment doesn't assume beck is scum. Which makes the comment about being defensive not fit. It's an extremely mixed narrative.
Scum make reads, too. They're just fabricated instead of genuine like the town's reads. That said, I no longer scumread Beck like I had then, for clarity.
You weren't pushing him about fake reads. It felt like you were pushing him about being bad town, not scum. That sometimes happens to me. I won't realize I've flipped over to a town read until I actually read my post and see that I'm talking to the person like I think they are town. Sometimes I do it intentionally to see what sorts of echoes I get back when I treat a player like they're town.
This was the one thing that really felt off about your play. Otherwise I've liked most of your posts up through page 20-ish.
In post 1008, fferyllt wrote:
@Scripten - how many reads would you expect someone to have formed at the point where you asked beck for more reads and less setup spec?
I didn't have a number in mind. I picked a player that stood out and pushed for more information to move the game further. It... worked, but not exactly how I was expecting it to, tbh.
Ok. Was curious why you picked out that particular player, but "that stood out" is a decent enough reason.
His reaction to my vote read townie. Specifically, that he reacted at all. Seems to me that scum would, upon realizing that my vote was an obvious reaction test, just avoid commenting on it at all.
What was your read prior to that?
Not sure what you mean by this?
I wondered because at the point where your scumpile had 2 players, mine had 3. They can't all be scum unless there's something really odd about the game set up, but I'm not pushing one of them to null just because 3 are too many. So I was wondering if you were fitting your reads into your expectations for the set up.-
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Scripten Mafia Scum
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In post 1021, fferyllt wrote:
Third party was being talked about at that point, which was why it occurred to me. Thinking about my own tendencies when I get a 3rd party role, I could see a 3rd Party player jumping hard on every little thing. As the game is unfolding so far, I'm not getting the feeling of odd sorts of eddies in the reads that multifaction usually generates.
I've actually never played a game here with a third party before, so I haven't any clue on how to tell if they are in the game or how to hunt them yet.
In post 1021, fferyllt wrote:
You weren't pushing him about fake reads. It felt like you were pushing him about being bad town, not scum. That sometimes happens to me. I won't realize I've flipped over to a town read until I actually read my post and see that I'm talking to the person like I think they are town. Sometimes I do it intentionally to see what sorts of echoes I get back when I treat a player like they're town.
Hm... I was scumreading him at that point, I remember for a fact. Perhaps a subconscious thing, but I can't really postulate further.
Light town read, close to null. He moved into a more solid town slot after that test.
In post 1021, fferyllt wrote:
I wondered because at the point where your scumpile had 2 players, mine had 3. They can't all be scum unless there's something really odd about the game set up, but I'm not pushing one of them to null just because 3 are too many. So I was wondering if you were fitting your reads into your expectations for the set up.
I'll be honest, I've been treating this game like a 2-scum setup, just because that's what I'm used to. If it were a 3-scum setup, things may change, but I'd need some time to think about interactions before making any judgement calls.
Also, was your reference to (486) a typo or a joke? I mean, the mod is the most confirmed alignment we've got in this game, for sure.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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I like MathDino's page 22 'hey let's slow down' regarding the beck wagon at L-1. Where was this concern earlier? Note to self - check back and see if she was posting at the same time as the earlier wagons.
524 damn it I hate when my scumreads post really town stuff. :/
538 - there's some truth to the bit about SK hunting.
In post 543, Grib wrote:It's exactly that because he's been coasting on that reason for literally the entire game. I asked him for other reasons and he failed to deliver anything.
Finnis lynchablebut not my first choice.
The bolded pings, but otherwise on this page I'm getting lots of frustrated townie vibes.
564First post by insanity to bug me.
566Another reason to townread MathDino. :/
567This may be a pretty decent case on Grib. I want to dig into this a little more once I've finished my readthrough.
In post 575, Beck wrote:Bbt looks desperate to me
Why?
Grib's 585 is pretty persuasive on the face of it. Adding this to my dig-into list.
624 I feel like I have to be misunderstanding something here. 626 clears it up.
In post 645, Beck wrote:In post 642, Grib wrote:if not one I can get behind
The if implies you can get behind it.
Now my grammar and language usage is pretty bad though
No it doesn't imply that.
665 there is a fair bit of recent majiffy town meta that this can be said about.
In post 725, Scripten wrote:Can you both just answer each other? Because this is seriously annoying.
^^ Pretty much sums up my feelings about the last 2-3 pages.
In post 728, Pine wrote:^dat scumpost
Like I said, Grib's in "anyone but me" mode. I don't feel inclined to oblige
I can definitely see this PoV. However, I co-modded a newbie game where scum-Grib snowed most of town to win the game. From memory, his play this game isn't at all similar. Note to self - review that game.
Readthrough is complete through page 30. I'm probably going to start responding to the game like it's real time for the last 10 pages prior to my catch-up.-
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fferyllt Titan of Trajectory
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In post 1022, Scripten wrote:Also, was your reference to (486) a typo or a joke? I mean, the mod is the most confirmed alignment we've got in this game, for sure.
was a typo, but would have made a great joke. I meant 483.
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