Open 579: Pick Your (Chocolate) Power -- Game Over

[Flubbernugget]

Why is rvs still relevant

[Mathdino]

It's always relevant. To not use the information at hand is daft.

[droog]

"but thats all meta
you can do better"
yeah yeah yeah ive heard it before

unless someone can ascribe scum motive
this wagon's not worth my time

[Alchemist21]

So Flubber's another randomidget?

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Siveure

[davesaz]

@droog, there are several wagons, which one are you referring to?

[wgeurts]

So Flubber's another randomidget?

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Siveure

Dammit alchemist, why have you changed again without reasons?

[wgeurts]

I've got short pc access, I'm making a read list on everyone complete with quotes and reasons why my read is what it is.

[Alchemist21]

So Flubber's another randomidget?

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Siveure

Dammit alchemist, why have you changed again without reasons?

Whoops, sorry, thought I had posted my problem with him in the post where I voted Flubber. It's because he's excusing another player's lack of scumhunting. Amy's lack of scumhunting could be unintentional and because of noobiness, but that doesn't excuse it and for another player to suggest it's OK to not scumhunt is scummy IMO.

[Mathdino]

Also, Anen's latest post looks really confbiasy. So what if she's not scumhunting?

Actually, I didn't notice this first time around. Hm.

Alchemist, do you believe scum would make a statement as obvious as "It's cool if y'all don't look for us"? This seems like a sentence scum would correct immediately with a simple reread of the post.

[Alchemist21]

Also, Anen's latest post looks really confbiasy. So what if she's not scumhunting?

Actually, I didn't notice this first time around. Hm.

Alchemist, do you believe scum would make a statement as obvious as "It's cool if y'all don't look for us"? This seems like a sentence scum would correct immediately with a simple reread of the post.

I don't know. It's not something I want to just completely dismiss because it seems to obvious. If we give him a pass for it, then even if he's town it gives the scum a pass for it too. This is something we need to push.

[Mathdino]

Hmm. Fair point.

That said, the way you're pushing this is a bit off to me if Siveure's town.

I want to note that it's highly unlikely Alchemist and Siveure are scum together since he shouts at people for choosing 4. At the end of the last game he publicly advised not going for 4 since everyone takes it all the time. So it's unlikely to be bussing. I'm gonna shelve this for now until my read on Siveure evolves.

[wgeurts]

Here is my

UBER DUBER MASSIVE OMG READS LIST!!!

Spoiler: Flubbernugget

This guy has 10 posts, this should be easy.
So he's basically voted three people in these posts:

VOTE: guts

Sheeping dino. I town read him and I suck at mafia right now.

VOTE: amy

Give us a vote pls.

VOTE: alchemist

I'm genuinely fucking pissed he used 4 to ge

The first was an RVS and the next two aren't(?) It's odd that he's been on the only two major wagons up till now without posting any useful posts. However as dino said it looks too scummy to be scum so I'm considering the other option; he's buisy with something in life and is hence isn't able to invest any effort into this game. However this doesn't add up with his "I'm playing terribly at mafia right now" claim so I'm scum reading him.
@Flubber, if you don't have time please replace out.

Spoiler: droog

I disagree with him in areas however he seems to be putting in a little effort in scum hunting. The only thing that feels a little off is this:

town read on alchemist, he seems pretty straightforward and probing
wgeurts is lightly pinging my scumdar. not like he did when i played him scum last though

May just be my paranoia however it looks like he was setting himself up to join my wagon. I need more info from him so he'll stay mild town

Spoiler: Davesaz

This guy is just stating his opinions and asking and probing with useless questions her and der. It feels a little like Wisdom in open 575 early game play to me and it isn't at all like his play in another game which I'll check later to see which alignment he was. A meta case could pop up later as a result of this. I wouldn't mind lynching him as his vote on me looks really bad with his earlier content but I'll first take a look at meta.

Spoiler:

Alchemist now looks town to me, he's probing and scum hunting. He also hasn't been on either of the two major wagons so far which I would have expected from him as scum. He also has provided legitimate reasons for his votes so far however his latest vote feels a tad off. I'm going to await an explanation for this vote.

Pr edit: He has explained, splendid.

Rest coming later, I'm gonna eat smoked sausage.

[Amy Farrah Fowler]

(1) Right. Other people were speculating too, and I didn't know about what helps who. Speculation seems pretty neutral to me.
(2) The town choice thing didn't occur to me. This is the first time I'm playing this setup, so I don't really know the current meta regarding this. I just went with what was in my head at the time.
(3) Analysing people's posts - and say what about them. I had nothing to say at that point.
(4) Asking others - why? I don't see the point.
(5) Talk about other PRs - and have you or someone else accuse me of rolefishing or whatever they'd feel like calling me out on? Mathdino talked about the vig and the vengeful, so I decided to discuss that and say what I thought of them. I didn't just randomly pick roles out and talk about them y'know.
(6) I don't typically read the full wiki page of each setup I play so it didn't occur to me that the scum talk differed from the norm. Say what you want about that.
(7) My readslist was about recent posters as of when I started typing up because long reads lists are boring to write and even more boring to read. I didn't pluck out random people, so read the full post before calling me out.
(8) And if you say that setup spec helps scum more than town then call mathdino out if you're looking for someone who talked about the setup.

(More numbers has been added by me)

(1) You might think so, but early-speculation helps the scum more, in most cases.
(2) That may or may not be true.
(3) Uhh, I didn't like that. Analysing others' posts is a cornerstone of scumhunting. This means, you're not scumhunting.
(4) Why? To make things clear that you don't understand or concerns you. Again, this means you're not scumhunting.
(5) I didn't say that talking about other PRs would have been a good idea but it was strange that you had been talking only about those particular PRs.
(6) Regardless of your alignment, it's useful to read everything about the setup. Well, you know... it helps scumhunting.
(7) Everyone knows that I'm far not the best player as it comes to producing short posts. Still, many players are able to write short playerlists and neither making them, nor reading them is boring. Producing and reading readlists help the flights of those cute little Painted Ladies (

Vanessa cardui

and whenever you post a readlist a Night Fairy smiles. Also, it helps scumhunting.
(8) It is a thing done by MathDino but so far he has done nothing else which has been scummy.

TL;DR version: Amy is not scumhunting at all.

(1) Many people were speculating, what makes me so special?
(3) I had nothing to say about them back then when we had two or three pages of guess what? Setup spec.
(4) I didn't need to make anything clear and if I'm concerned with something I'll go at it instead of asking questions so scum can prepare an easy reply.
(5) Other people were discussing those PRs at the time, read the discussion.
(6) At this point 'It helps scumhunting' is just a line you felt like putting there to reinforce your 'case'.
(7) I disagree nonetheless.
(8) If you look at the point where you started having a go at me, math did roughly the same setup discussion things I did. I'm not accusing math of being scum because I don't use shit reasoning for my votes but if you're intending to follow your theory then you may want to check that out. In fact math said even more about vigs, going so far so as to talk about the strategy for them and vengefuls. Who's discussing specific PRs now.

TL;DR - Your reasoning is a pile of crap. And I am scumhunting, I found scum.

Vote: Aneninen

[Mathdino]

(8) If you look at the point where you started having a go at me, math did roughly the same setup discussion things I did. I'm not accusing math of being scum because I don't use shit reasoning for my votes but if you're intending to follow your theory then you may want to check that out. In fact math said even more about vigs, going so far so as to talk about the strategy for them and vengefuls. Who's discussing specific PRs now.

I was about to call this post clueless town until I saw this. Which reeks of deflection that's trying too hard to be self conscious.

[Venrob]

OK so i caught back up... Still getting some decent town reads, not really seeing anything scummy enough for me to vote. In re to the above post by math, honestly I can see myself making a post like that as town so I wouldn't be too quick to call that a scum post. It seems more like frustration than scum tbh.

Ankamius, I don't think we've played a game together... Maybe you're thinking of Venmar? I took a quick scroll through my wiki and we haven't been in any games together that I can see. Regardless, welcome to the game!

If anything I'm gonna be watching siv and flubber a bit more due to the wgeurts wagon.. I agree, it seemed a bit too fast. Dave still strikes me as town though, as does math.

Anyway, I gotta go. I'll probably be back online in an hour or 2, though.

[wgeurts]

OK so i caught back up... Still getting some decent town reads, not really seeing anything scummy enough for me to vote. In re to the above post by math, honestly I can see myself making a post like that as town so I wouldn't be too quick to call that a scum post. It seems more like frustration than scum tbh.

Ankamius, I don't think we've played a game together... Maybe you're thinking of Venmar? I took a quick scroll through my wiki and we haven't been in any games together that I can see. Regardless, welcome to the game!

If anything I'm gonna be watching siv and flubber a bit more due to the wgeurts wagon.. I agree, it seemed a bit too fast. Dave still strikes me as town though, as does math.

Anyway, I gotta go. I'll probably be back online in an hour or 2, though.

Please just post a list of reads and just vote the top scum read. If people are ties use random.org, just do something!
Other reads are delayed but not cancled, back to phone posting.

[Alchemist21]

Is it just me, or has wgeurts' English improved considerably since Open 574?

[wgeurts]

Is it just me, or has wgeurts' English improved considerably since Open 574?

Mmm, I am taking English lessons as I need them for some cources.

[Alchemist21]

Ok. I remember last time a lot of us gave you a pass due to English being your second language, but I'm not letting that be an excuse this time around unless there's some really advanced vocabulary involved.

[Siveure DtTrikyp]

I'm of the opinion there are a great many players who don't have a clue how to scumhunt. I'm one of them. Scumreading someone purely for not scumhunting is dumb. Of course, there are scum ways and town ways of not scumhunting.

Besides that, I don't really get why I'm being voted lol.

[Venrob]

OK so i caught back up... Still getting some decent town reads, not really seeing anything scummy enough for me to vote. In re to the above post by math, honestly I can see myself making a post like that as town so I wouldn't be too quick to call that a scum post. It seems more like frustration than scum tbh.

Ankamius, I don't think we've played a game together... Maybe you're thinking of Venmar? I took a quick scroll through my wiki and we haven't been in any games together that I can see. Regardless, welcome to the game!

If anything I'm gonna be watching siv and flubber a bit more due to the wgeurts wagon.. I agree, it seemed a bit too fast. Dave still strikes me as town though, as does math.

Anyway, I gotta go. I'll probably be back online in an hour or 2, though.

Please just post a list of reads and just vote the top scum read. If people are ties use random.org, just do something!
Other reads are delayed but not cancled, back to phone posting.

VOTE: Flubber

[Ankamius]

Ok, I skimmed through the game and got some gut reads for you all.

Town:
Mathdino
droog
Amy Farrah Fowler
Alchemist21
Venrob

Scum:
Siveure DtTrikyp
davesaz
Romitelli

Null:
wgeurts
Aneninen (FYI: probably never going to change)
TheAdrienC
farside22
Flubbernugget

[Ankamius]

Amy wagon at this point is bad. The way she handles the pressure is town.
Siveure trying to discredit Mathdino leaving the wagon is slimy as hell. Nothing about his ISO really gives me any good iggly wigglies either.
Something about Venrob's reads sounds town. Probably because of the Amy townread. The feeling I get from his play is that he wouldn't just close off that avenue so easily as scum.
Romitelli does a good job at trying to appear like he's doing something while not doing anything.

Those are the main things that stood out to me.

[Siveure DtTrikyp]

In relation to my discrediting math, look at my #199. That whole fiasco was completely based off me being an idiot and misunderstanding math's post, (that he was invoking her meta/experience level to dissolve the wagon) and I later realized what he actually meant (that her meta was irrelevant to the discussion).

Also, Ank, why are you scumreading dave?

Amy, anen, NOBODY except you two find either of you scummy. If you really want the other guy lynched, you'll need to engage everyone else, and not just be arguing with the "scum".

[Ankamius]

I don't remember. What I DO remember is that I got that read in the first like 1/3 of the game and never got any real town shift to balance it out.