You could be anyone II - Game Over

[TheWayItEnds]

No, TD is absolutely scum. Yeah, it is possible that it's just an unhealthy (for TD) coincidence that d3x was brought into the hood, but d3x outing himself as the doc and then dying immediately after points MORE to TD being scum than town. You say scum-TD wouldn't be so bold to invite d3x into hood, find out that he's the doc, and then off him, I say it's the complete opposite. Scum-TD has ZERO choice to keep d3x alive after finding out that he's doc since there are likely 2 scum left and if PV is protected long enough, they'd be caught.

Yeah, so I agree with you about Doc/Cop with tailor dead putting a timer on scum.
But at the same time, unless you believe that one/both of you are likely to be investigated... It sorta doesnt make sense to rush it.

Like... I guess I just dont see the benefit of trading a scum flip on the immediate doc kill, rather than giving the cop another investigation that most likely doesnt hit scum?

Yeah...

Except that it seems suicidal for TD to have actually killed D3x after claiming doc in the hood and knowing that there was already suspicion on him.

Did d3x claim night 4 or night 5?

D3x claimed at the beginning of day 5, almost immediately after joining the hood and reading through it.

Also, d3x's last words were how I could be SK, not scum.

...

Let's put it this way, TWIE and TD are seemingly the only people who knew d3x was the doc due to d3x's claim in the hood (which was a poor decision on his part since everyone seems to be ignoring the obvious). Ignoring this and just assuming d3x was killed b/c he was just townie in thread is fucking stupid.

The first part of this is semantics. SK is a flavor of scum.

The second part is debatable. I actually think that being able to claim the docs actions is a pretty big boon. And I'm not entirely convinced he died because of his hood claim.

Also a note to dex you bloody idiot wtf did you claim dr in a neighborhood i was setting up kise to take the scum bullet and if there was scum in the neighborhood that outed you you ruined my plan and got yourself killed that was so so dumb. If there isn't then I fucked up and my plan would of never worked.

You should stop acting like this was some master stroke of your genius plan. This is like the stupidest/scummiest thing I've ever seen someone happily admit to doing.

@TWIE:

D3x's last words to us were about how scum kthx is

Is ^this in fact what was said in the hood QT?

D3x's last actual post that wasn't him saying how bad yours and Garmr's day end posts were, was an analysis of why he thinks you're probably the SK.

[Ankamius]

Day 1 stuff. I'll do the rest later because this kinda took a while.

Interesting Notes:

1. #1103 has the earliest and last votes on the TD wagon flipped. One scum is very very likely in the middle {TheWayItEnds, KthxBye, StrangerCoug}
2. #1763 has two scum flipped on both the Hostile Intent and Hex-Hydra wagons. Willing to bet at least one scum is on the TD wagon. {Pirate Mollie, Kthxbye}
3. #716 was the last time two flipped scum were the only people on the Mom wagon. IaI immediately after switched to Hex-Hydra before the next vote count, while Nero Cain went townards a relatively more background choice in Hostile Intent afterwards. Scum strategy right now seems to be to spread out as much as possible to see what sticks. The TD wagon springing up at that point from 3 to 7 votes shortly afterwards supports this. {TheWayItEnds, Kthxbye, StrangerCoug}
4. #1103 ---> #1165: suddenly two scum switch over to Hex-Hydra. Nero was very against the TD wagon at the time while Aunt Jemina was very wishy washy about it. Probably will be more useful info later once more flips happen, but nothing that telling right now.
5. #1446 has two flipped people out of 7 on the HI wagon that sprung up out of nowhere. It's virtually a guarantee that there's at least one unflipped scum on there. {RachMarie, TiphaineDeath, Nachomamma8, Kthxbye, StrangerCoug}
6. #1633 likely at least one scum on the TD wagon {Nachomamma8, Kthxbye}
7. #1846 is when the Hex-Hydra wagon wins out. TD and Rach's votes look the worst out of all the unflipped {TiphaineDeath, RachMarie}

Miscellaneous Notes:
1. Pine and StrangerCoug aren't scum together because of Nero Cain #741 (only two in scumlist not flipped, all flipped scum are in nulls or towns)

[TheWayItEnds]

Yeah, ya'll are derpy d3x shoulda died a long time ago, he was like the most town of anyone, except maybe PV.

This is like the main problem I have with D3x died and it must be TD.

D3x was the towniest person in this game by a not small margin.

But at the same time, if yesterday I thought that there was like a ~5% chance of TD scum, then today its up to like 30%. Like I still think its more likely that scum, knowing that they couldnt kill PV, shot at the most town person they could. But the timing is so convenient that it gives me pause.

@Those not voting, who would you be voting for today at this point in time and why? I think if we can get most of the non-voters to answer this, we can move this along and do a VCA with PV's results.

Probably you or Garmr.

[PeregrineV]

Day 1 stuff. I'll do the rest later because this kinda took a while.

Interesting Notes:

1. #1103 has the earliest and last votes on the TD wagon flipped. One scum is very very likely in the middle {TheWayItEnds, KthxBye, StrangerCoug}
2. #1763 has two scum flipped on both the Hostile Intent and Hex-Hydra wagons. Willing to bet at least one scum is on the TD wagon. {Pirate Mollie, Kthxbye}
3. #716 was the last time two flipped scum were the only people on the Mom wagon. IaI immediately after switched to Hex-Hydra before the next vote count, while Nero Cain went townards a relatively more background choice in Hostile Intent afterwards. Scum strategy right now seems to be to spread out as much as possible to see what sticks. The TD wagon springing up at that point from 3 to 7 votes shortly afterwards supports this. {TheWayItEnds, Kthxbye, StrangerCoug}
4. #1103 ---> #1165: suddenly two scum switch over to Hex-Hydra. Nero was very against the TD wagon at the time while Aunt Jemina was very wishy washy about it. Probably will be more useful info later once more flips happen, but nothing that telling right now.
5. #1446 has two flipped people out of 7 on the HI wagon that sprung up out of nowhere. It's virtually a guarantee that there's at least one unflipped scum on there. {RachMarie, TiphaineDeath, Nachomamma8, Kthxbye, StrangerCoug}
6. #1633 likely at least one scum on the TD wagon {Nachomamma8, Kthxbye}
7. #1846 is when the Hex-Hydra wagon wins out. TD and Rach's votes look the worst out of all the unflipped {TiphaineDeath, RachMarie}

Miscellaneous Notes:
1. Pine and StrangerCoug aren't scum together because of Nero Cain #741 (only two in scumlist not flipped, all flipped scum are in nulls or towns)

Did you see where I got an innocent on StragnerCoug? Or do you think he is Godfather?

[Pine]

There was a Tailor, PV

[PeregrineV]

There was a Tailor, PV

So the contention would be Nero targetted StrangerCoug night1 giving me a false innocent?

[Ankamius]

Day 1 stuff. I'll do the rest later because this kinda took a while.

Interesting Notes:

1. #1103 has the earliest and last votes on the TD wagon flipped. One scum is very very likely in the middle {TheWayItEnds, KthxBye, StrangerCoug}
2. #1763 has two scum flipped on both the Hostile Intent and Hex-Hydra wagons. Willing to bet at least one scum is on the TD wagon. {Pirate Mollie, Kthxbye}
3. #716 was the last time two flipped scum were the only people on the Mom wagon. IaI immediately after switched to Hex-Hydra before the next vote count, while Nero Cain went townards a relatively more background choice in Hostile Intent afterwards. Scum strategy right now seems to be to spread out as much as possible to see what sticks. The TD wagon springing up at that point from 3 to 7 votes shortly afterwards supports this. {TheWayItEnds, Kthxbye, StrangerCoug}
4. #1103 ---> #1165: suddenly two scum switch over to Hex-Hydra. Nero was very against the TD wagon at the time while Aunt Jemina was very wishy washy about it. Probably will be more useful info later once more flips happen, but nothing that telling right now.
5. #1446 has two flipped people out of 7 on the HI wagon that sprung up out of nowhere. It's virtually a guarantee that there's at least one unflipped scum on there. {RachMarie, TiphaineDeath, Nachomamma8, Kthxbye, StrangerCoug}
6. #1633 likely at least one scum on the TD wagon {Nachomamma8, Kthxbye}
7. #1846 is when the Hex-Hydra wagon wins out. TD and Rach's votes look the worst out of all the unflipped {TiphaineDeath, RachMarie}

Miscellaneous Notes:
1. Pine and StrangerCoug aren't scum together because of Nero Cain #741 (only two in scumlist not flipped, all flipped scum are in nulls or towns)

Did you see where I got an innocent on StragnerCoug? Or do you think he is Godfather?

That's what is making this game annoying. Everything about StrangerCoug's play across the last around three day phases doesn't tell me he's town at all, yet this is one of the stronger SKs I've ever seen if he is one and I don't even know how likely it is that he got tailored N1.

There is no godfather on that team. I would ragequit if there was.

[PeregrineV]

There was a Tailor, PV

So the contention would be Nero targetted StrangerCoug night1 giving me a false innocent?

I would think that scum would tailor the scummiest of their team, or the strongest PR. Do you think Stranger was particularly scummy day1 where he would warrant an investigation?

[TheWayItEnds]

That's what is making this game annoying. Everything about StrangerCoug's play across the last around three day phases doesn't tell me he's town at all, yet this is one of the stronger SKs I've ever seen if he is one and I don't even know how likely it is that he got tailored N1.

There is no godfather on that team. I would ragequit if there was.

Yeah I think tailor removes godfather from the pool pretty concretely

[Ankamius]

Serial Killer (bulletproof?)

vs

Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon
Mafia Encryptor
Mafia Tailor
???

vs

Town Bomb
Town Doctor
Town Cop
Town FBI Agent
Town Neighborizor

I'm starting to wonder if a massclaim is viable here. If this is all the power town has, I'm reasonably sure we're dealing with a bulletproof SK and another goon or two. Pooooossibly a mafia bulletproof/watcher/?

[PeregrineV]

Day 1 stuff. I'll do the rest later because this kinda took a while.

Interesting Notes:

1. #1103 has the earliest and last votes on the TD wagon flipped. One scum is very very likely in the middle {TheWayItEnds, KthxBye, StrangerCoug}
2. #1763 has two scum flipped on both the Hostile Intent and Hex-Hydra wagons. Willing to bet at least one scum is on the TD wagon. {Pirate Mollie, Kthxbye}
3. #716 was the last time two flipped scum were the only people on the Mom wagon. IaI immediately after switched to Hex-Hydra before the next vote count, while Nero Cain went townards a relatively more background choice in Hostile Intent afterwards. Scum strategy right now seems to be to spread out as much as possible to see what sticks. The TD wagon springing up at that point from 3 to 7 votes shortly afterwards supports this. {TheWayItEnds, Kthxbye, StrangerCoug}
4. #1103 ---> #1165: suddenly two scum switch over to Hex-Hydra. Nero was very against the TD wagon at the time while Aunt Jemina was very wishy washy about it. Probably will be more useful info later once more flips happen, but nothing that telling right now.
5. #1446 has two flipped people out of 7 on the HI wagon that sprung up out of nowhere. It's virtually a guarantee that there's at least one unflipped scum on there. {RachMarie, TiphaineDeath, Nachomamma8, Kthxbye, StrangerCoug}
6. #1633 likely at least one scum on the TD wagon {Nachomamma8, Kthxbye}
7. #1846 is when the Hex-Hydra wagon wins out. TD and Rach's votes look the worst out of all the unflipped {TiphaineDeath, RachMarie}

Miscellaneous Notes:
1. Pine and StrangerCoug aren't scum together because of Nero Cain #741 (only two in scumlist not flipped, all flipped scum are in nulls or towns)

Did you see where I got an innocent on StragnerCoug? Or do you think he is Godfather?

That's what is making this game annoying. Everything about StrangerCoug's play across the last around three day phases doesn't tell me he's town at all, yet this is one of the stronger SKs I've ever seen if he is one and I don't even know how likely it is that he got tailored N1.

There is no godfather on that team. I would ragequit if there was.

Since they have
Goon
Goon
Framer
Encryptor
??
??

And neither being a blocking role, I suppose GF isn't too far of a stretch. (Fun fact- last "You can be anyone" game I investigated the GF)

But, I think it's not likely. Stranger was scum roleblocker in the first "You can be anyone game", and he play seems vastly different from there to here, at least to me.

[TheWayItEnds]

Massclaim could probably be better revisited tomorrow after another Mafia flip on PV's result.

[PeregrineV]

Serial Killer (bulletproof?)

vs

Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon
Mafia Encryptor
Mafia Tailor
???

vs

Town Bomb
Town Doctor
Town Cop
Town FBI Agent
Town Neighborizor

I'm starting to wonder if a massclaim is viable here. If this is all the power town has, I'm reasonably sure we're dealing with a bulletproof SK and another goon or two. Pooooossibly a mafia bulletproof/watcher/?

Still think 6 scumteam myself. 4 down, minus today's (unless I caught the SK), means 1 mafia + 1SK.

Massclaim is pointless since we have today's lynch. Maybe tomorrow.

[Pine]

There was a Tailor, PV

So the contention would be Nero targetted StrangerCoug night1 giving me a false innocent?

It's not likely, but plausible. Just mentioned because you seemed to rule out the possibility. This only goes for SC, though, because he's the only living innocent you got before the Tailor died, and after Nero Cain was lynched, further innocents are probably accurate. It's highly unlikely that the scumteam would have both a Tailor and a Godfather

PE: Tailor != Framer.

[Ankamius]

Oh right, you have a guilty. Yeah, save massclaim for tomorrow.

[TheWayItEnds]

Theres almost no point in having a cop if you're giving the mafia team tailor and godfather.

And they dont have a roleblocker, which indicates to me that tailor is supposed to be your counter I think?

And then mafia team gets like an extra goon/goon upgraded into power because town have a bomb?

So still 6 scum?

Thats what I've been thinking.

[TheWayItEnds]

Or still 2 more for 6 group scum + sk I think.

[PeregrineV]

There was a Tailor, PV

So the contention would be Nero targetted StrangerCoug night1 giving me a false innocent?

It's not likely, but plausible. Just mentioned because you seemed to rule out the possibility. This only goes for SC, though, because he's the only living innocent you got before the Tailor died, and after Nero Cain was lynched, further innocents are probably accurate. It's highly unlikely that the scumteam would have both a Tailor and a Godfather

PE: Tailor != Framer.

Yeah, Framer makes town look like scum. Tailor can do that, but can also make scum look like town.

The most common variant of Framer is Tailor, which can

also

target scum to have them investigate favorably to Cops. The name comes from the role tailoring investigative results to the user's liking.
In games without Cops, Framer/Tailor variants can exist that alter results given to other investigative roles (such as Tracker).

[PeregrineV]

Theres almost no point in having a cop if you're giving the mafia team tailor and godfather.

And they dont have a roleblocker, which indicates to me that tailor is supposed to be your counter I think?

And then mafia team gets like an extra goon/goon upgraded into power because town have a bomb?

So still 6 scum?

Thats what I've been thinking.

I ran a 24 player normal with 6 scum and an SK. And this is a theme, 25 players, and no vigs. There is at least a 6 man mafia team.

[TheWayItEnds]

I'm starting to wonder if a massclaim is viable here. If this is all the power town has, I'm reasonably sure we're dealing with a bulletproof SK and another goon or two. Pooooossibly a mafia bulletproof/watcher/?

Actually mafia watcher would explain a couple things.

[PeregrineV]

I'm starting to wonder if a massclaim is viable here. If this is all the power town has, I'm reasonably sure we're dealing with a bulletproof SK and another goon or two. Pooooossibly a mafia bulletproof/watcher/?

Actually mafia watcher would explain a couple things.

Yeah, they watch me night4, see D3x visit, kill him last night.

[TheWayItEnds]

I was guessing that mafia had a tracker based on how freely Titus was claiming it, but watcher would make a lot of sense to me.

[Kthxbye]

rather than giving the cop another investigation that most likely doesnt hit scum?

This this few people left and 2 kills a night...it most likely DOES hit scum

The first part of this is semantics. SK is a flavor of scum.

I disagree with this. I'm sure if d3x were still here, he would to. SK is a loner and looking for scum as much as town, he just cares less if he's wrong. Scum have links to their faction in some form or another, even if it's just VCA linkage. You don't have that with SK. That's just a few of the differences.

And I'm not entirely convinced he died because of his hood claim.

Then you are over thinking it. It's pure and simple logic. You just don't WANT to believe it.

But the timing is so convenient that it gives me pause.

As well it should. It's connecting the dots. The simplest answer is usually the correct one. Trying to turn it into just 'coincidence' takes a lot more work and assumptions.

There was a Tailor, PV

^This bothers me more than a little. We've covered this the first time it came up. It doesn't make sense that the Tailor would target a scum-SC. I don't like that Pine is still trying to instill doubt about PV's town result. I'd be up for a Pine lynch if ya'll refuse to see logic today on TD.

Serial Killer (bulletproof?)

vs

Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon
Mafia Encryptor
Mafia Tailor
Mafia Neighborizor
????

vs

Town Bomb
Town Doctor
Town Cop
Town FBI Agent

FTFY

Yeah, they watch me night4, see D3x visit, kill him last night.

I'll give this a maybe and slow down on TD a bit. I'm not gonna tunnel here and I really didn't think about that....Still, it's too coincidental on the timing to make me just take this and go with it without a flip of a watcher/tracker.

[Kthxbye]

Also, of note, PV, TWIE, Ank, Gamr, and myself have been pretty active this day AFTER PV let it known he has a guilty and today's lynch is solidified. What that says to me is that the afore mentioned people are probably town because none of them have slowed the posting which says to me that none of them are worried about the investigation results other than to lynch said investigated guilty. SC is cop cleared.

That leaves Pine, RachMarie, Kise, TD, and Nacho. I'll bet money that the guilty is in this group. Nice to practically know that there are 3 anti-town in that group of 5.

[TheWayItEnds]

Actually mafia watcher and killing D3x on that day makes things very non coincidental.

You know you want to kill the claimed cop. You know the doc wants to save the cop.

You try and kill the cop and watch him simultaneously and then you either kill him or find out who the doc is.

And thats the first day that a mafia watcher would be guaranteed to find the doc if there was one.

Then you are over thinking it. It's pure and simple logic. You just don't WANT to believe it.

This probably has some truth to it, given that I gave up my TD scum read upon being neighborized, and I'd rather not feel stupid.

I'll give this a maybe and slow down on TD a bit. I'm not gonna tunnel here and I really didn't think about that....Still, it's too coincidental on the timing to make me just take this and go with it without a flip of a watcher/tracker.

Yeah, but we're only lynching PV's guilty today. So we get another look at the scum team makeup and take a better shot at whether watcher is likely or not tomorrow before deciding.