Open 577: Hope Plus One! (GAME OVER - SCUM WIN)

[Mathdino]

@TTH: The fact that you said that pretty much outs the town usage, so might as well talk about it.
The scum benefit to outing acryon's doc strategy far, FAR outweighs the town (the town being the doc can avoid saving who he thinks acryon will save). Doc's job is to protect PRs and prevent death. No more PRs to protect, so their job is to prevent death in the night. Now suppose we took this to an extreme length and said everyone knew who acryon protects.
Great.
Doc can pick someone else.
But now the person acryon protects isn't gonna be shot anyway.
The idea is that scum won't shoot who they think acryon is gonna save since there's a very very small chance both docs target the same person. The town motivation in being able to predict acryon is MINIMAL especially since scum have 3 times the brainpower the doc has.

[Aneninen]

I see your logic but a Doc can misread players too. Also, it's way not obvious that a Doc protects the same player as they did last Night. So, in my opinion this info works as a counter-WIFOM. (Scums may start guessing: will he protect the same player again? Or will he protect someone else? Also, what will the other Doc do?)

[Mathdino]

You realise that the more WIFOM there is, the more likely targets will be random, the more likely scum ends up killing town, correct? WIFOMing scum is shooting yourself in the foot.

[Aneninen]

I disagree with your last sentence but discussing the topic now wouldn't help us finding the scums. Maybe post-game. Or in an off-forum. Or PM. Whatever.

[copper223]

@Mod: what do I have to do to get My Milked Eek replaced from this game?

[copper223]

Catch-up, was busy with with work yesterday.

The main topics I have seen are:

- Texcat scum or bait?
- GGG vs Dino
- Aneninen's catch-up and doc save request

let me know if I missed something.

First I second TTH's request for an update from IK.

Regarding Texcat:
I get the point about preemptive defence some of you are making but it is objectively true she did have a reason to kill Boo and if you are going to do a NK analysis as Tex you have to consider that, I also dislike GGG's push on her. I am going with her being bait for now.

GGG:
The problem I have with your 1 scum per wagon read, is that to me it kind of makes sense only if we had 3 town wagons yesterday, and how would you know that? Moreover if that's the case why is Texcat a scumread of yours? If we had at least 1 scum between the three the 1-1-1 split makes much less sense to me, I think in that case a 2-1-0 or a 3-0-0 is more logical, it's likely scum want to avoid their partner getting lynched D1 much more than being afraid of long term associative reads.

Dino: I really dislike his Acryon is confirmed mentality, if for sone reason Acryon ends up being scum I'd lynch him. I also dislike him sheeping IK about the Orcinus wagon being policy driven, but at least he did give his reasons for why he thinks Orci is town at the time. I do like his push on GGG.

Aneninen: I also don't understand why you would ask for the doc save and why he would give it, the value of being able to predict who a doc saves is much higher for scum so the less information there are available on who Acryon thinks to save, assuming Acryon is legit, the better. I see your point about the wagon movements but I don't know if it's relevant because both town and scum want a lynch to occur, it could be if GIF flips scum.

[Cane + Able]

WIFOMing scum being productive or not is irrelevant.

What matters is whether Anen

thought

it was relevant, or if he's trying to cover his tracks.

I think his argument is genuine.

[copper223]

@C+A
Also my impression, that's why I said, paraphrasing: "I don't understand why he did it" instead of "I think he is scum for it"

[Cane + Able]

That was more in response to MD than you, copper.

Continuing the argument with Anen is counterproductive.

[copper223]

@C+A
How confident are you of your town read on Texcat?

[Cane + Able]

@C+A
How confident are you of your town read on Texcat?

I'm solid on it. Even more now that she has picked up her participation.

She's reminding me of NY 177.

[copper223]

@C+A
Ok, I'll roll with this for now:

VOTE: GGG

[Mathdino]

WIFOMing scum being productive or not is irrelevant.

What matters is whether Anen

thought

it was relevant, or if he's trying to cover his tracks.

I think his argument is genuine.

Oh yeah that's a good point actually. His response to my argument fits his town playstyle quite well.

Anen shouldnt do it again but reread shows a townish D2.

[TellTaleHeart]

@TTH: The fact that you said that pretty much outs the town usage, so might as well talk about it.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
You were the one calling Anen scummy for it.

[theelkspeaks]

My Milked Eek

has been prodded.

[Aneninen]

Continuing the argument with Anen is counterproductive.

^
I agree.

Also, I'm short of scumreads. My only ideas are GiF and GGG. I don't think a GiF wagon happens today so I'm supporting the GGG wagon; because of my own reads and because of the players on it.

VOTE: GGG

[theelkspeaks]

Vote Count 2.2
With 11 Alive, it is 6 to lynch.

GuyInFreezer (1)

- texcat

Mathdino (1)

- GGG

GGG (4)

- copper223, Cain + Able, Mathdino, Aneninen

(expired on 2014-12-28 14:00:00) will be the deadline

[GGG]

GGG:
The problem I have with your 1 scum per wagon read, is that to me it kind of makes sense only if we had 3 town wagons yesterday, and how would you know that? Moreover if that's the case why is Texcat a scumread of yours? If we had at least 1 scum between the three the 1-1-1 split makes much less sense to me, I think in that case a 2-1-0 or a 3-0-0 is more logical, it's likely scum want to avoid their partner getting lynched D1 much more than being afraid of long term associative reads.

This is what TTH was saying yesterday and it is a possibility and I do consider it. Disagree that their would be three scum on one wagon though.

I'm more interested in math Dino now as he appears to me to be scum mad at getting accused for what he sees as his pet peeve, stupid logic and bad math. Rather than a townie defending himself

[copper223]

@GGG
You're right, I missed that post from TTH because I was focused on Rudi at the time.

Your reply makes little sense to me though, first you change your scumreads, Tex Anen and MME based on the all-town assumption and then you give scumreads that directly violate said assumption by including Tex in them.

Further you can argue you said probably but if you base the whole gameplan on it, you are arguing semantics, why is it probable that the 1-1-1 split happened and and that Texcat is scum?

If your defence is Dino is the scum here I can respect that approach, can you make a post that summarizes where he reacts as scum being caught today?

[GGG]

@copper

1438 in particular this section.

Right, okay, so you're saying I'm lurking sitewide to make way for lurking in this one game as scum for no reason?
Your buzzword doesn't work. What am I doing here as scum? Because I find the first statement to be absolutely true based on other players' behaviours in my games.

[GGG]

@GGG
You're right, I missed that post from TTH because I was focused on Rudi at the time.

Your reply makes little sense to me though, first you change your scumreads, Tex Anen and MME based on the all-town assumption and then you give scumreads that directly violate said assumption by including Tex in them.

Further you can argue you said probably but if you base the whole gameplan on it, you are arguing semantics, why is it probable that the 1-1-1 split happened and and that Texcat is scum?

If your defence is Dino is the scum here I can respect that approach, can you make a post that summarizes where he reacts as scum being caught today?

I changed my town reads based on all 3 scum being on the same wagon being highly unlikely.

[Idiotking]

Also to me that reads like a texcat confession.

vote:texcat

Vote GGG

this is so wrong i dont even

NOBODY CONFESSES IN THIS GAME. NOBODY. Not unless they want to get banned for playing against wincon. This is so blatantly awful. And then there's the self-admitted confirmation bias on Math, but that didn't stop GGG from voting.


Will update reads list after I sleep.

[Mathdino]

These 3 tabs are staring at me.

Judging me.

UNVOTE: 3G
until I finish and get rid of those 3. Don't really like IK putting him at L-1 for only that post, which isn't really the scummiest of today. Want to see that reads list.

[TellTaleHeart]

I love that screenshot. My favorite part is the bookmark folder "Inspirational Crap." (That's just behind the TV Tropes tabs and the link to the Caltech Harvey Mudd Math Competition.)

[Cane + Able]

These 3 tabs are staring at me.

Judging me.

UNVOTE: 3G
until I finish and get rid of those 3. Don't really like IK putting him at L-1 for only that post, which isn't really the scummiest of today. Want to see that reads list.

Is that a Lost tab I spy with my little eye?

I guess you can't be

all

bad.

The guy that played Jacob is in another series I'm watching called The Tomorrow People. Cheesy title, but decent storyline.