micro 429: m9++. epilogue.

[TierShift]

She is very very okay with her lynch tho

Maybe too much idk
But let's lynch this today.

[VysePresident]

I'm a bit confused. Why is the case bad?

[TellTaleHeart]

VOTE: tth
Reread tth's fu case, needs lynching.

Sry hawk I'll sort you tomorrow if I live
But probs not

Like I said. Threat mitigation.

[TellTaleHeart]

That big post matched my expressed opinions on the game too well for coincidence.

Right...
Quote the derivative parts of that post.

[mykonian]

I don't know the English expression for it, but cyrus/you is like a lame duck? That's what google translate gives.

Can you give me the dutch expression?

I don't get your case on either of brantz or vyse. Could you give a 3 sentence max case on both?

"aangeschoten wild".

For either when the game was hectic they made posts that had as a purpose to wait out and see where things were going before stepping in. Both showed opportunistic votes afterwards. Vyse's last bunch is pretty obvious, brantz return to sordos after the vote on me wasn't viable is another example.

I don't get why other Dave is not up for lynch anymore. And I don't understand telltale's(btw, I love the adventure games you make) murderboner for me. He asks why people are town reading me, than when reasons are given he finds ways to poke holes in the reasoning......like he is making an effort to push his agenda.

Brantzs fence sitting from early on does bother me a bit more now, if we have to move off of other Dave I would prefer the lynch be between these two.

QFT

[davesaz]

Paraphrasing to see if I'm understanding that right.

BRantz and Vyse are scummy because they seem to be waiting to see what position is safe to take, and then are opportunistic.
You agree that TTH looks like she's pushing an agenda.
If the lynch isn't me, you'd prefer BRantz or TTH.

[BRantz]

That is manipulation of what happened to suit your theory myko. I unvoted you after you finally decided you would play this game instead of actively hindering the rest of the town by being obtuse. I liked what your logic was, and changed to sordros; this was well after any wagon on him. The whole time I was on sordros I was the only one on sordros. Explain how that is an opportunistic vote?

[mykonian]

Paraphrasing to see if I'm understanding that right.

BRantz and Vyse are scummy because they seem to be waiting to see what position is safe to take, and then are opportunistic.
You agree that TTH looks like she's pushing an agenda.
If the lynch isn't me, you'd prefer BRantz or TTH.

not quite.

First sentence is spot on. "BRantz and Vyse are scummy because they seem to be waiting to see what position is safe to take, and then are opportunistic." is exactly right. You probably said that better than I did.

I don't have as much as an opinion on TTH as I have an opinion of how the wagon on her formed. Also, while cyrus's early game was iffy, later one that didn't get followed up like brantz and vyse's.

If the lynch isn't brantz or vyse, I'd lynch you. You are awkward in many ways, could very well be scum, but I can't tell as well as with the first two. If you are town, I don't trust you too much to be a force for good, but that shouldn't be a reason for a lynch ideally. You seem to be trying.

[mykonian]

That is manipulation of what happened to suit your theory myko. I unvoted you after you finally decided you would play this game instead of actively hindering the rest of the town by being obtuse. I liked what your logic was, and changed to sordros; this was well after any wagon on him. The whole time I was on sordros I was the only one on sordros. Explain how that is an opportunistic vote?

Because it's on sordros. The one person some of us said might look scummy from reactions, which didn't work out.

It's hoping for a wagon to happen on him, because as a town we threw some shit at him and watched what happened. Anyone could have made that vote and it would have looked bad. But it happened to be one of the people who had a bad early game anyway.

[BRantz]

You and I don't agree on the context of opportunistic for the game if mafia, buy I get where you are coming from.

The thing is it was very obvious that tier wasn't interested in a sordros lynch, and fairly obvious you weren't, so with both of the main wagon pushers off the lynch, what is the opportunity there? Also call it a weak early game if you must but I can't do anything about the fact that I went to work near the beginning of page 2 and when I got home we were on page 4 or 5 and out of rvs/early game.

[Bicephalous Bob]

Official Vote Count

TellTaleHeart

(3): BRantz, SB, TierShift

FuDuzn

(2): TellTaleHeart, VysePresident

BRantz

(1): mykonian

TierShift

(1): ProHawk

davesaz

(1): FuDuzn

Not Voting

(1): davesaz

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline

: (expired on 2014-12-30 09:31:49)

[mykonian]

the opportunity lies in the voted person, not in the game state.

[davesaz]

I'll be kicking myself if TTH turns up scum, but she's not scummy enough to lynch atm.

VOTE: BRantz
My top scum reads don't see to be options, so settling for a lesser one.
I'm not very happy about all the chaos this game, and in particular some of the inexplicable town reads.
Reading people on the quality and timing of their approach vs. the content just seems wrong.

[VysePresident]

@Myko - Lengthy defensive post alert! (+FuDuzn read that I want your opinion on.)

I think you're mistaking genuine rusty Town play for scuminess. I haven't really been able to dive into this game, and it shows. I can show you my scum game if you want - it isn't even a month old. I was a little off the wall at times, but for the most part, I'm quite capable of presenting a strong front, and I was getting strongly Town read for it until I was stupid enough to chainsaw for an apathetic partner. Even then, I hit back hard enough that I nearly got a mislynch with a JK Guilty on me.

It's not that hard when you know everyone's alignment.

I'm Townreading you for your play, because it's consistent with how I'm reading you, but I don't feel you're on the right track at all. As near as I can tell, you've already pre-determined what the Town response to early game would have been, and you're letting that cloud your judgment. Yeah, it's a possible reaction. Does it really fit so well with my play? This isn't chat mafia. Heck, I've never even played anything but forum mafia.

I let myself get distracted by a crumb I felt Hawk had pointed out. This threw off my reads, and I've since realigned them, because the game stopped making any sense for me. At this point, I'm fairly confident in my FuDuzn read, (And yes, it's because of TTH hitting mostly the same points I was seeing. Take that as you will.) It's consistent with my own scumhunting experience.

He avoids the Sordos wagon, instead creating one on the next weakest guy - because Dave is totally obv-scum!, mind you - and I don't think he's really scumhunting. He just locked onto a target, while still adding fuel to other lynches. (Cyrus) Your defense for him? He hit his stride quickly. How is that Town? That's

easy

for moderately savvy scum, and the Dave vote was about as safe a wagon to start as you could hope for.

I'll accept BRantz as possible second string scum, but not quite for the reasons you're pushing, per se - To reiterate, I'm okay with him when I feel he's actively going in a direction I disagree with, but I'm leery of him when he's not really pushing forward. In other words, his mid-early game was better than his opening, and his more recent play. He also has a connection with FuDuzn via a weak Townread early on. Hawk is likewise a decent candidate, but less likely to be aligned with FuDuzn. (If we're dealing with FuDuzn/Sordos(Hawk), then I would have expected a bus. That's iffy, though.)

[BRantz]

Dave you know what helps get your top scum reads lynched? Voting for them. You wanna talk about being opportunistic, pot meet kettle.

[FuDuzn]

I didn't jump on an easy lynch with other Dave, he was the first person to seem scummy early on so I voted him and he hasn't done anything to make me think otherwise. And brantzs fence sitting jumped out at me more than cyrus's which I didn't really even notice as much, possibly since I haven't been too I.vested in this game the last week or so. And as explained, tth just seems to be trying to manufacture scum tells just to fit an agenda.

[VysePresident]

So, BRantz. What's your read on FuDuzn at this point?

[BRantz]

Assuming I don't get lynched today, I will be rereading the game over the course of the night phase. I've been needing to do that, but haven't really had time. Will have more and better direction tomorrow (game day) assuming I am alive.

pedit: Let me iso Fu real quick and get back to you Vyse.

[ProHawk]

VOTE: TTH

Don't want to lynch Brantz

[davesaz]

Dave you know what helps get your top scum reads lynched? Voting for them. You wanna talk about being opportunistic, pot meet kettle.

I did vote them, and people called me crazy and scum.

[davesaz]

See that comment about inexplicable town reads?

[VysePresident]

I didn't jump on an easy lynch with other Dave, he was the first person to seem scummy early on so I voted him and he hasn't done anything to make me think otherwise. And brantzs fence sitting jumped out at me more than cyrus's which I didn't really even notice as much, possibly since I haven't been too I.vested in this game the last week or so. And as explained, tth just seems to be trying to manufacture scum tells just to fit an agenda.

Except I agree with TTH? And I was seeing some of those even before she posted.

I'm a bit confused as to what you mean when you say you didn't really notice Cyrus as much as BRantz. You were calling him really scummy a while back, in 159 165, 174. Are you saying that's changed, or that BRantz is worse, or...what?

Also, a list of reads would be nice, at this point.

[VysePresident]

Dave you know what helps get your top scum reads lynched? Voting for them. You wanna talk about being opportunistic, pot meet kettle.

I did vote them, and people called me crazy and scum.

Then you explain your reads, adjust as necessary, and defend them if you want. You're not wrong just because you're getting scumread for it. (Mind you, I disagree with your reasoning, and I think you needed a course correction.)

This is the kind of stuff that has me wondering if you're just playing us. Stop doing this, please.

[VysePresident]

Also, your opinion on FuDuzn?

[BRantz]

There really isn't a lot of substance to Fu at all is there. Using his own words, he seems to have a murderbone for dave, and has spent very little time talking about anything else. Almost half of his posts are promises to catch up (which in this game I think is fairly null but still annoys me). He just jumped way up my scum list.

My top 3 scum reads:
Cyrus/TTH (though this one has gotten a bit weaker with TTH's posts, I am still not convinced this slot isn't scum)
davesaz (I just don't know how his play could come from a town perspective on the whole)
FuDuzn (not much substance, which is why he was null earlier, but there is a lot more to have been talked about at this point)

Tier and myko are both town in my eyes. Everyone else falls in between.

Though as I said, some of this may change with a reread.