Mini 1627: Ninja Mini Mafia

Boonskiies · Post Post #1600 (ISO) » Sat Jan 03, 2015 5:25 pm

Former, can you give me your reads list, please? I don't want you to put reasons. I just want a simple town/scum (leaning if need be).

Varsoon · Post Post #1601 (ISO) » Sat Jan 03, 2015 5:27 pm

Reads would be dope from everyone

Shinobi · Post Post #1602 (ISO) » Sat Jan 03, 2015 7:21 pm

Vote Count

killerjester

(1): Varsoon

Varsoon

(1): killerjester

Boonskiies

(1): Zebulin

Zebulin

(1): Boonskiies

Not Voting

(2): acryon, Formerfish

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Deadline

: (expired on 2015-01-15 15:00:00)

Formerfish · Post Post #1603 (ISO) » Sat Jan 03, 2015 7:57 pm

Former- Town
Acryon- Town

Boon- Null

Varsoon- null scum

Zeb- Scum
Killer- Scum

acryon · Post Post #1604 (ISO) » Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:35 am

In post 1598, Boonskiies wrote:
In post 1591, Zebulin wrote:VOTE: Boonskiies Still think he's the scummiest, for all the reasons prior.

Alright
, so I'm thinkig the last scum is Boonskiies or killerjester.
I don't think Acryon or Varsoon are the last scum, as they are both gut townreads, and Formerfish seems to be the most active and contributing, so I don't think he's scum either. KJ has been inactive, but I don't think that's enough by itself to be lynched. Boonskiies has been scummy all game.

Formerfish: I'm pretty sure anyone would've killed Orc in the night, he was basically conf town after both Thor and Xiao hating him and then dying.

He thinks it's either me or killer, and there's a wagon on killer, and he chooses to vote me. I don't see how it's not Zebulin.

VOTE: Zebulin

Come on.

Wouldn't him choosing to start a new wagon over one with traction be indicative of him being town if anything? How is it scum to have 2 scum-reads and vote for the one that doesn't have a wagon?

Zebulin · Post Post #1605 (ISO) » Sun Jan 04, 2015 5:21 am

Boonskiies, I'm voting for the scummiest player. You're the sfcummiest player. I don't see how it's scum to vote someone with no votes, and your vote on me seems like the OMGUS bs that you accuse me of. I also said that you're my scumread much more than Killer and I'd much prefer a wagon on you.

Reads:

Very Town:
Town:

Acryon

Leaning Town:

Varsoon

Null:

Formerfish, Killerjester

Leaning Scum:
Scum:

Boonskiies

Very Scum:

killerjester · Post Post #1606 (ISO) » Sun Jan 04, 2015 7:51 am

In post 1596, killerjester wrote:Varsoon > Zebulin > Boonskiies, although the latter two are much less preferred.

In addition, acryon and Formerfish are town.

acryon · Post Post #1607 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 2:39 am

I just don't understand Boonskies play this game. He has now, on two different occasions, given terrible reasons for why Zeb is scum. I actually don't know if I can imagine scum giving reasons that bad for voting someone. At this point, even though I don't feel their play seems as scummy as Boonskies, I think there is actually a much greater chance one of Killer/Varsoon flips scum.

@Zeb: Why is Varsoon leaning town for you? (this isn't an interrogation; genuinely curious for your reasons)

acryon · Post Post #1608 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 5:24 am

Going through D1 again, and I have some observations. The Varsoon/Thor interaction didn’t really read MvM. On the other hand, if scum-Thor is going to create a pseudo hard-push on someone D1 that in reality has zero chance of going all the way, then it would make sense for it to be on a scum-buddy. This early distance is very important.

One of the critical points to look at is the opposing wagon situation.
Initially, the primary wagon opposite Thor’s was Allyra’s. Boonskies, Thor, and Konowa all resided on this wagon, and all seemed quite confident on it. When Allyra replaced out, Thor unvoted and switched to randommidget. A handful of posts later, Boonskies follows suit, and all of a sudden Thor has a new counter-wagon.

Zeb voting Allyra in 335 is weird, but it also doesn’t seem scummy to me at all. It doesn’t make sense from a scum-perspective to vote for someone like Allyra who most people seemed to be town-reading at the time, especially after the rage-quit.

343 has Boonskies trying to call out a scum-slip (this is a theme for him this game). In post]344[/post], Boonskies says he will be ok lynching Allyra (town), after Randommidget (town), and Orc (town). Not long before this, Boonskies mentioned in 254 that he would be ok lynching Thor. In the 344 post, we don’t see Thor mentioned, but instead he is standing in agreement with him.

Now that Zeb came in and voted for Allyra, Boonskies decides to switch away from voting with Thor to working on another alternate wagon – Allyra.
Xiao in 387 mentions 3 people and comments on their potential alignment. Zebulin – Town. Me – Town. Varsoon – Unsure, but not playing typically. I don’t see him voting his one scum-buddy and calling out his other for weirdness here at the same time, so this makes Varsoon look better.

Boonskies then hammers, presumably for town-cred as he knows that Thor is scum. There isn’t a reason to hammer there as town, and as Orc pointed out in 403, Boonskies trajectory on Thor was anything but natural.

Never mind 166, 421, 564, 570, 881, 883, 904, and 1193, in which Boonskies talks about "I would have/wouldn't have X if I were scum." He says this an absolutely unnatural amount if he's town.

*Sigh* I hate to say this, but I don't think we can leave Boonskies alive. If we lynch someone else, we only have one day of a NL and then LyLo. We can't let him get to LyLo, or we are screwed, and just so many of his plays scream scum that he has to hang.

Is anyone interested in a LyLo with Boonskies present? Good luck winning that. If we lynch him here, we have tomorrow to talk and NL, and then LyLo, where I think we will have a good chance of figuring out who it is.

VOTE: Boonskies

acryon · Post Post #1609 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 5:25 am

To be clear, this is not strictly a policy lynch. It is primarily an effort to lynch the final scum, although our inability as town to let him live to LyLo was the deciding factor for me.

Zebulin · Post Post #1610 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 5:55 am

In post 1607, acryon wrote:I just don't understand Boonskies play this game. He has now, on two different occasions, given terrible reasons for why Zeb is scum. I actually don't know if I can imagine scum giving reasons that bad for voting someone. At this point, even though I don't feel their play seems as scummy as Boonskies, I think there is actually a much greater chance one of Killer/Varsoon flips scum.

@Zeb: Why is Varsoon leaning town for you? (this isn't an interrogation; genuinely curious for your reasons)

Gut.

I feel like Varsoon is being incredibly foolhardy with what he's posting, but hasn't done anything really scummy (other than that bad case on Orc at the start of Day 2). As scum that's very difficult to pull off. Orc (conf town) also said he was town on multiple occasions, and Orc correctly called both Thor and Xiao, so there's a good chance he got some of his other reads right. It's not a very strong read, hence "leaning town".

P-Edit: That about sums up the Boonskiies case. Boonskiies, do you have a defense?

acryon · Post Post #1611 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 5:57 am

In post 1610, Zebulin wrote:
In post 1607, acryon wrote:I just don't understand Boonskies play this game. He has now, on two different occasions, given terrible reasons for why Zeb is scum. I actually don't know if I can imagine scum giving reasons that bad for voting someone. At this point, even though I don't feel their play seems as scummy as Boonskies, I think there is actually a much greater chance one of Killer/Varsoon flips scum.

@Zeb: Why is Varsoon leaning town for you? (this isn't an interrogation; genuinely curious for your reasons)

Gut.

I feel like Varsoon is being incredibly foolhardy with what he's posting, but hasn't done anything really scummy (other than that bad case on Orc at the start of Day 2). As scum that's very difficult to pull off. Orc (conf town) also said he was town on multiple occasions, and Orc correctly called both Thor and Xiao, so there's a good chance he got some of his other reads right. It's not a very strong read, hence "leaning town".

Agreed.

Varsoon · Post Post #1612 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:04 am

I was under the impression that xiao hated Boonskies.
Worried about acyon playing scum.

acryon · Post Post #1613 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:09 am

In post 1612, Varsoon wrote:I was under the impression that xiao hated Boonskies.
Worried about acyon playing scum.

Bussing is a thing.

Also, in what scenario do you see town winning with Boon in LyLo?

acryon · Post Post #1614 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:10 am

In post 1612, Varsoon wrote:I was under the impression that xiao hated Boonskies.
Worried about acyon playing scum.

Also don't be worried. Not scum.

Varsoon · Post Post #1615 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:13 am

One which boon is scum and we lynch him there?
We need to come to a conclusion here.
What I am worried about is boon town more than boon scum.

Varsoon · Post Post #1616 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:14 am

Wait, no, killer or boon has to be scum.
Figured it out, gimme a sec.

Varsoon · Post Post #1617 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:16 am

Blah, I messed up. Thought it was 3 to lynch.
I figured that the fact Killer wasn't hammered when he was at 2 votes cleared people.
Shucks.

acryon · Post Post #1618 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:18 am

The point is, if Boon is town, I would much rather figure that out with a mis-lynch now than a loss in LyLo. That being said, I think there is a decent chance he is actually scum. See my post for the laundry list of offenses.

Varsoon · Post Post #1619 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:20 am

I was tempted to fake a cop innocent on him just to mess with you, but I did that recently in a game, I think.
I think I am going to be tonight's kill. :/
I want to win today.

acryon · Post Post #1620 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:23 am

In post 1619, Varsoon wrote:I was tempted to fake a cop innocent on him just to mess with you, but I did that recently in a game, I think.
I think I am going to be tonight's kill. :/
I want to win today.

I'd love to win today too, and there's a reasonable chance that actually happens with a Boon lynch. I also think a Boon lynch today, if he doesn't flip scum, greatly increases the chance of a win in LyLo. Trying to win today without thinking about LyLo is a little too greedy I think.

Varsoon · Post Post #1621 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:34 am

Yeah, true and true, but what if, just what if...
There were 4 scum
?!!?!

acryon · Post Post #1622 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:37 am

In post 1621, Varsoon wrote:Yeah, true and true, but what if, just what if...
There were 4 scum
?!!?!

Seems unlikely. Seems far more likely the last scum is a PR. And if there are four scum, then we are doubly screwed.

Varsoon · Post Post #1623 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:51 am

Well, acryon, let's say that I go with you on this boon lynch, against everything that's in me saying boon is town.
What happens when we hit lylo?

acryon · Post Post #1624 (ISO) » Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:53 am

In post 1623, Varsoon wrote:Well, acryon, let's say that I go with you on this boon lynch, against everything that's in me saying boon is town.
What happens when we hit lylo?

Well I'm not quite sure what happens, because we will be down Boon plus another townie. That being said, tomorrow is a discussion free-roll, so we will have plenty of time to talk about what to do after the flips.