New York 181 -- Game Over

[Albert B. Rampage]

Point?

You evaded lynch after a roleblock on you. I know how sneaky you can be.

[SilverWolf]

Silver, can you show me a town game where Elusive did the question thing and nothing else for 17 pags? Can you show me a scum game where she didn't? And can you convince me that she is unaware of this meta? If you can do those things, I'll unvote.

I can't. I don't have elusive's meta. Ask ika. I can't link ongoing games. I said I don't think it's scummy until I can see what she does with it. I'm waiting for that.

Also, you calling Wake's post that I voted based on "non scummy" doesn't make it any less scummy than the one that you voted on. I feel that your reasons for voting him were wrong because weird doesn't always mean scum. The post of mine that you have an issue with was me trying to determine why you, in my opinion wrongfully called it scummy. I actually ended up deciding it was an honest mistake. So you saying that I misrepped you just feels weird to me. And even if you say otherwise, it feels like a freakout to me. Like I try to determine your motivations behind an action and before I've even decided on them, you say I'm misrepping you and you vote me. It feels panicky to me.

Except I didn't panick at all. I answered your questioning on it at least twice and I've already explained my problems with how you handled it and the follow up to it, in previous posts.

Silver, do you think Delta stepping on toes and stuff isn't intentional? Tell me why he'd do it as scum. It's bad play regardless but he put effort into the game where he was scum.

I haven't decided if he's scum or not but his play is abysmal and I see nothing warranting a townread. At the least he's anti-town, at the worst he is scummy.

[Garmr]

hello are you guys just going to ignore my post on nik?

No and I think he's scummy, so give examples about him playing a game of survival, please!

Other than most of the things I said about being reactionary game being mostly responses with very little of her own initiative. When things are done off her own accord she discredits them as bitching or they have very little impact in the first place.(Wakes so called walls for example.) She's playing a very safe and flexible scum game.





Talking about wakes post after taking the time to read them again here's a short summary of some of them after a certain point. These are the ones that stood out to me.

There's a lot of ass kissing in 223

Wakes 251 scatter shot would be a lot better if it was a focus shot in my opinion. It's null through and I can't find anything wrong with it.

Wake 313 Basically saying post more I find you scummy and like a act? I don't know it just reads weird like his telling Deltawave to buck up instead of actually pressuring. Kinda null- scummy I guess more confusing.

My opinion of you hasn't really changed much.

[Garmr]

a) whatever you say bub
b) ok so let's take a step back here. please explain why you find my reasoning hypocritical and reaching. and also explain why i should have to push a wagon based on one post on page two. i'm sure i could look through your past games and find a similar situation where someone has made a serious vote early without explaining what it was about until asked. have you attacked everyone who has done this? if not, what's different about this game, or what's different about the way i did it.
c) again, the intent was to bitch about having too many conflicting scumreads, not to provide scumreads.
d) i generally have to wait until my scumreads make a post that i can reapond to with buzzwords, otherwise people just brush me off. vOv

A.Others had said this to toots

B. Your basically saying I was reaching for a reason when you yourself had to reach for a reason after being pushed to explain yourself. The fact you actually felt a need to shows you want acceptance It was also obvious you took time to think of the reason after the vote not before by your post in between the vote and the reason. It's all the small things that add up to one scummy post You haven't really invalidated any of my reason. Also I don't think I have reacted the same way as town scrambling to find a reason after be asked why.

C. You were still posting game relevant information your point which included your scum reads so what if you were bitching? Also that a strawman argument as you taken this way far away from the original topic.

D.Why was it different then when you were pushed by dragonspawn. Why didn't you wait for one of these buzz words.

a) the majority is typically incorrect bby
b) i) how was it reaching, i said your point was bs because wakescum would not specifically want a 2v3v2 wagon instead of a 3v3 wagon. ii) the fact that i felt a need to answer the guy shows that i'm not a complete asshole. iii) it was obvious i took the time to think about it when i said "if i had to put it into words". iv) "scrambling" lool v) you never showed me my supposed hypocrisy, pls amend.
c) it's not a strawman, i've said before that the reason i didn't mention the minimal possibility that i might be correct on one of my two dichotomies was because i wanted to sound like a puny little girl and considering that possibility would have been contradictory to my goal. ik you're just going to keep arguing that since i wasn't explicit it doesn't count tho.
d) i had

H

O

P

E

that this game might be different but guess what, the next two posts after mine included the usual brushoff so i guess that's just normal old hopeless life for you.

A)is going nowwhere I'll just accept you can't provide a good enough anwser.

B)i)You admitted yourself only scum think about wagon positioning. So it should be a tool to hunt scum with (even if it's just to break rvs.) Instead you attacked my reasoning even through you thought wake was scummy. ii)No it shows you are cautious of what others think of you. iii)It's not hard to say because of 2v3v2 thing looks like reaching I don't think you need like 40 mins for that. iv)Lol v)The hypocrisy was you accused me of reaching while reaching yourself.


C)I don't find your explanation valid and your going to stick by it and bring it full circle there is no point as I been caught in these circular arguments to many times before and I lost a game because of it.

D)Is more of a emotional response than a logical one.

[Garmr]

I see the case for elusive but I don't feel like she is to scummy for it personally more of a null. I would like to see her thoughts on peoples posts other than the quiz which she is starting to do but hasn't seemed to let go of that yet.

[elusive]

~ Snip ~.

"Strategy" is a very heavy word for "fun\silly, meant to garner discussion RVS quiz." In fact, my actual concern about all the quiz discussions is how fixated certain people (Egg, Texcat, Mika, Shiro and now Garmr) are getting over it instead of asking more critical questions such as:
1. What are your reads so far or thoughts on {players}?
2. Other such SRS BZNS questions

Aww, SilverWolf I will win over your stern ways. What's life without being silly here and there?

However, to be fair to ika I have a very recognizable meta from another site and my scum game is so terrible that you can tell a mile away.

You're over there too? Were you in the Mexican Standoff game there? ( )

Nope. On the other hand I do know ika beyond sites so that may be partially his defensiveness kicking in.

Ika,

Spoiler:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mo4cmTaEDIk

Since when have you known me not to be able to handle a little pressure? I've been in two Titus tunnels, I've yet to see anyone top that

~Snip~

Oh snap you just changed your reason for voting me from the previous post, is that scummy? People keep asking about it and I like responding to questions. Bad logic is bad though.

I am going to say that looking at your ISO, you're not a newbie and you seem to be pretty pushy in your other games here so why are you being a little passive aggressive here?

Also, it's easy as others said to tunnel on fluff or a fluffy poster which is why I find you and Egg a bit troublesome, seeing as how you particularly, haven't done anything else. See "safe target" mentioned by House. Although, I'm not a safe target because I never shut up. Surprise!

Nikanor, can I just know where you get the rainbow text from. It's very important.

T S O, go ahead and question\pressure\tunnel me.

Holy damn, Egg you're still on the quiz. Hmm...your reputation seems to be better than that. Get to it. Also DeltaWave did not call me "retarded," he referred to RVS questions as "retarded" which is a poor choice of words but entirely different and he answered them anyway so he secretly loves them.

Flubber's reaction to me asking him why he expected a vote on him was over done and that pings me weirdly.

Just to clarify, Garmr:

I see the case for elusive but I don't feel like she is to scummy for it personally more of a null. I would like to see her thoughts on peoples posts other than the quiz which she is starting to do but hasn't seemed to let go of that yet.

The first part of this boggles me. You see the case (which means you agree with who? Egg? Mika? Pikachu?) yet you personally decided that even though you see the case you think its a null tell? Then "I would like to see her thoughts on peoples posts other than the quiz" is good which is what I was thinking would be the natural response. But then "hasn't seemed to let go of that yet," usually unless they are asinine I answer all questions that come my way as only scum needs to be difficult.

Ok, I think I caught them all but if I missed your particular stuffs let me know.

[SilverWolf]

Ika,

Spoiler:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mo4cmTaEDIk

Since when have you known me not to be able to handle a little pressure? I've been in two Titus tunnels, I've yet to see anyone top that

I was in a Titus tunnel off site once and here in a game once. I was town both times. She thought I was scum. I sympathize.

[Flubbernugget]

Is anybody following nik vs. garmr right now because I really can't right now.

I also want to note that I stalled a discussion that almost got me pegged as scum once by responding to each line of someone's post by numbering/outlining it. If you're attacking the lines of a post you're probably not actually attacking the post itself.

[elusive]

Ika,

Spoiler:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mo4cmTaEDIk

Since when have you known me not to be able to handle a little pressure? I've been in two Titus tunnels, I've yet to see anyone top that

I was in a Titus tunnel off site once and here in a game once. I was town both times. She thought I was scum. I sympathize.

SilverWolf, I am blocking some of the trauma now but it was hundreds of back and forth posts (long ones too). And the first time we were both town. The second time though she was scum and I was town and I turned off my instincts and she totally owned that game. Titus is the best and also most frustrating mafia player I know. I could go on and on about her, lol.

Flubber, are you speaking of a particular occurrence in the thread or being passive aggressive or castles in the sky? Be direct, it doesn't cost extra.

[SilverWolf]

Ika,

Spoiler:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mo4cmTaEDIk

Since when have you known me not to be able to handle a little pressure? I've been in two Titus tunnels, I've yet to see anyone top that

I was in a Titus tunnel off site once and here in a game once. I was town both times. She thought I was scum. I sympathize.

SilverWolf, I am blocking some of the trauma now but it was hundreds of back and forth posts (long ones too). And the first time we were both town. The second time though she was scum and I was town and I turned off my instincts and she totally owned that game. Titus is the best and also most frustrating mafia player I know. I could go on and on about her, lol.

First time, she was scum and I was town. Second time we were both town. If anyone can relate, I can.

[Garmr]

@elusive
Isn't asking for more information about peoples just another way of saying give me a read ;/. I stick by my thought you haven't let go of that quiz.

Ika,

Spoiler:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mo4cmTaEDIk

Since when have you known me not to be able to handle a little pressure? I've been in two Titus tunnels, I've yet to see anyone top that

I was in a Titus tunnel off site once and here in a game once. I was town both times. She thought I was scum. I sympathize.

SilverWolf, I am blocking some of the trauma now but it was hundreds of back and forth posts (long ones too). And the first time we were both town. The second time though she was scum and I was town and I turned off my instincts and she totally owned that game. Titus is the best and also most frustrating mafia player I know. I could go on and on about her, lol.

Flubber, are you speaking of a particular occurrence in the thread or being passive aggressive or castles in the sky? Be direct, it doesn't cost extra.

On a side note I have never ever been wrong about titus alignment in all of my forum games and out of the skype games I was wrong about 3 times out 50-70? she has always been wrong about mine on forum gave . I have been in a titus scum tunnel multiple times I always seem to come out on top.

I just finished a game where I got her lynched as soon as she replaced in. (tbf her slot was null to most except i was scum reading it when she came in.) Not only did she try tunneling me but it caused her teammate that was in a good position to be outed and he got lynched lylo because of it. (Well one of the reasons)


http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=60083

I think honestly it's my play style that puts titus off as I'm not a normal type of person. As fferylt puts it I have a scum mindset. (This was an excuse to brag)

[Wake1]

Nobody Special, please put me down on Limited Access for the next four days. By no means am I out of this game, and I will contribute as I can gather my thoughts. The hospital I am working at is experiencing a staffing shortage, and they have asked me to cover for them.

[Wake1]

Dammit.

Nobody Special, please put me down on Limited Access for the next four days. By no means am I out of this game, and I will contribute as I can gather my thoughts. The hospital I am working at is experiencing a staffing shortage, and they have asked me to cover for them.

[dragonspawn]

liking House, texcat for town.
Wake, elusive, dragonspawn look scummy. elusive less so than the others, just one post is pinging me, where she got her back up over the sauron joke.
all my reads are conflicting though. like, probably only one of garmr/wake and one of dragon/elusive are scum. but i'm scumreading all four. it sucks.
whine whine whine

i also just skimmed five pages so my reads are prob shit

Why is texcat town?

[dragonspawn]

HRMPH. UNVOTE:

We have 20 peeps in this game. Some may not know this, but I also played in NS's 3rd Picking Simplicity game. As for my state of mind at this very moment, large games like this tend to make me feel overwhelmed, lost, and paranoid as all hell. If we're going to get through this alive we're going to need to rely on one another in order to survive.

What we shouldn't do—and I know it can be tough—is get angry with one another. Don't raise your voice: improve your argument. And if you feel angry, try counting to ten first instead of doing something you'll regret later. Though I've played for a little while, I'd say I'm really not that good, and even now I struggle with trying to coordinate my move and get done the things I want to get done. Some overestimate me far too much, while others underestimate me too much as well and, what can I say? It's something you have to live with and yet another wave to try and navigate through. Everyone here—whether Town or Scum—wants to win. The best way for us Townies to win is to pull together and act like a team, otherwise we're simply making Scum's work that much easier.

One thing that I've learned throughout the games is to question everything. Another thing is that you shouldn't be afraid of criticism, because no matter what you say or do someone is going to jump in and criticize you for it. Just get over it and play—if you can. Sometimes the crushing constraints of time makes things we want to do impossible. For the newbie players in this game, and those who have moderate experience, please try to be patient and calm with each other. Mafia's not just a game of truth and lies, but also a very social and philosophical game where all manner of concepts therein apply. We need to work together. Being at each other's throats will not help, and do nothing but weigh the odds against us. The wisest thing you could do at the moment is lay down your petty contentions and rise above it. Communicate and collaborate with calmness of mind and an earnest—and honest—desire to discuss these things.

Now, let's get down to business.

Silverwolf

is that kind of player who, in my mind, has untapped potential. As with

House

,

KlingonCelt

, FA_Q2, and

dragonspawn

, they started out making newbie mistakes and are now, ha, pretty darn good. For this game,

I get the feeling that she's Town

, because she hasn't, from what I've seen, get angry which, to be honest, is something that I recall when she was Scum in the past. Now, of course, I could be completely wrong, and SW here, who has been nothing but pleasant, calm, and inquisitive, could simply be Scum with a newfound sense of emotional control. When you think of it it's quite scary, to be honest with you. But since when is fear not a valid part of faith?

Now—and it must be said—the matter of her 47 must be discussed, because it's a valid issue to talk about, and she has very good reason to bring it up. More often than not, as Town, I do tend to reserve my vote, because the matter of mislynching is something I find wholly unsavory, whether it be on my end, or someone on the end of my spear. What ought to be noted, though, is the two votes of mine she quoted were, by nature, meaningless, because they were RVS votes, and in no way were intended to be serious. Unless, of course, you do believe that Egg should be lynched because he's an egg, or that only Scum can be vengeful with their actions, behaviors, or abilities. Should you think those votes were serious, there may be more to you that I cannot reach a personal level, because it's nothing short of insane. Indeed, I fired two RVS votes in rapid succession. If you think that means I am Scum, I daresay there is a flaw in your thinking, and that perhaps those around you are trying to capitalize on your intellectual mis-endeavor. The point where that arrow breaks is where Silverwolf then realizes and acknowledges that, in fact, I have voted right away as Town before and have been conservative with my vote as Scum, too, as is said in 172. The real question is whether or not anyone can gauge my moody mood and know what exactly I would do as either alignment. For one, I feel bored, and am currently enjoying my first weekend off in over three months. Having fun with the other players by also sending out RVS votes is something I may just be inclined to do.

As for the rest of her posts

, I'm kinda craving breakfast and sweets now, and I don't really recall

dragonspawn

fluffing a lot in general. If memory serves,

Aneninen

is one to fluff, though, but fluff in itself isn't really something to worry about, so it may be better to look elsewhere. As for

dragonspawn

being defensive—per your 162—I'd have to actually see where in fact he's being defensive.

Your pointing out what you perceive to be fluctuations in the metas of others does ring Townish to me.

I absolutely do not like

deltawave

's

vote on

Silverwolf

, and, honestly, found the exchanges between her and

Egg

worthy of further discussion. I am not willing to vote for her today, and I am Townreading her a bit based on her current ISO.

Fair assessment. I don't think we are all going to survive this though.

I'm going to watch wolf a bit more. But it is looking like her town game.

What do you think of elusive so far?

[dragonspawn]

mkay elusive is 100% town. and anyone who tries to lynch her will be going though me.

How exactly did you come to this conclusion ?

she has played on another site with me, i know her meta and its not her scum meta

also VOTE: wake

How did you reach this one?

[dragonspawn]

Wake can you post a tl;dr version of that huge wall pls

idk flub seems like a smart & talented young man ready to take on the world armed with naught but his wits and dashing good looks

You can't take the time to read it? What if he said "I am scum" in the middle of it?

[SilverWolf]

Wake can you post a tl;dr version of that huge wall pls

idk flub seems like a smart & talented young man ready to take on the world armed with naught but his wits and dashing good looks

You can't take the time to read it? What if he said "I am scum" in the middle of it?

He'd be lynched by the rest of us and his scum buddies would be pissed I imagine. But he didn't so we are good.

[Garmr]

I answer all questions that come my way as only scum needs to be difficult.

I'm assuming you have experience on another site. The meta on mafia scum is different than other sites I looked at and from what I heard the site titus is on is extremely different. Due to the amount of elitist on this site it's more strict. There will be scum that answer your questions cause people have caught on to thinking like this ages ago.

While you consider titus the best player. On this site she is around average (some consider her below average due to her uniqueness) as am I (Through I feel like my scum game is typically above average I feel like I finally got my town on a level where it's suitable just needs to be less gambity so decided to pick a open set up where it be less tempting to gambit)


There are power houses like thor(scum powerhouse),fferylt(town powerhouse),Slandaar and desperado(to lesser extents). This isn't even mentioning the veterans that retired from mafia.

[dragonspawn]

Scattershot

(texcat)

———✹[/color]

Out of curiosity, why are you voting for Garmr?

(ika)

———✹[/color]

Glancing at 216, is buddying part of your Scum-game?

(dragonspawn)

———✹[/color]

A deeper justification for voting texcat would be helpful.

(Mikazuki)

———✹[/color]

You needn't be shy, Mikazuki.

(Egg)

———✹[/color]

My desire to not be read is found throughout most of my latest games.

(artistincompre)

———✹[/color]

Are you alive?

(Flubbernugget)

———✹[/color]

Why do you focus on House?

(Albert B. Rampage)

———✹[/color]

I like 166; more, please.

(Nikanor)

———✹[/color]

I know you asked nicely, but it's not so huge as you say.

(Silverwolf)

———✹[/color]

A flutter of curiosity struck me with your 206.

(T S O)

———✹[/color]

Is your Aneninen vote still set?

(House)

———✹[/color]

I don't fully understand your shift from dragonspawn to Aneninen.

(KlingonCelt)

———✹[/color]

Knowing you are a force in these games, your presence is desired.

(Garmr)

———✹[/color]

If you have a case, you should bring it—I'll tear it apart.

(Aneninen)

———✹[/color]

Would you succinctly tell me how you feel about House and SIlverwolf?

(deltawave)

———✹[/color]

Please post more. We like when people are social.

(Shiro)

———✹[/color]

If you had a Lynch List with three slots, would Egg or Garmr be on it?

(elusive)

———✹[/color]

Not sure how worthy Nikanor really is of being voted currently.

(davesaz)

———✹[/color]

Could we have more of your thoughts on the other players, please?

I'm feeling hurt. You didn't include me

[SilverWolf]

I'm feeling hurt. You didn't include me

Yes he did but the color is hard to read. Check again.

[dragonspawn]

But, there are some players who I find more scummy, soon I'll post about them too.

Nikanor.

210 looks like a bunch of reads but in the last sentence he discards his own reads. The later posts are nulls and excuses for not answering (eg. Elusive's questions) and not reading (eg. Wake's long post).

Lean scum.

Texcat.

95 makes no sense, nor the "bonus part" sentence in 164. 167 answers nothing, 219 helps nothing, 253 answers nothing.

Scummy.

Deltawave.

One single naked vote. Need I say more?

Lean scum.

Dragonspawn.

Intentional fluffing started in 58. ISO him so as to find that despite he has 20 posts he has done nothing.

Scummy.

VOTE: Dragonspawn

I've done quite a bit. I've gotten conversation started.

Then I took a day off. What exactly were you expecting?

[Nikanor]

Is anybody following nik vs. garmr right now because I really can't right now.

I also want to note that I stalled a discussion that almost got me pegged as scum once by responding to each line of someone's post by numbering/outlining it. If you're attacking the lines of a post you're probably not actually attacking the post itself.

garmr is really good at saying "i fundamentally disagree with the way you play mafia and i think you're scum for it" in incredibly circuitous ways.
me breaking it down into lines is the only way to show people that he's full of shit.

[Flubbernugget]

Flubber, are you speaking of a particular occurrence in the thread or being passive aggressive or castles in the sky? Be direct, it doesn't cost extra.

Is garmr vs. nik not a particular occurance

[Nikanor]

liking House, texcat for town.
Wake, elusive, dragonspawn look scummy. elusive less so than the others, just one post is pinging me, where she got her back up over the sauron joke.
all my reads are conflicting though. like, probably only one of garmr/wake and one of dragon/elusive are scum. but i'm scumreading all four. it sucks.
whine whine whine

i also just skimmed five pages so my reads are prob shit

Why is texcat town?

pls don't do the thing where you ask questions as you go along, it's super obstructive and this is already a big game. /: