New York 180 (Endgame)

[T S O]

Also why not shoot Marquis if you're so confident?

He'll be dead today.

[Kitz]

How does it confirm them? Goodmorning isn't a Friendly Neighbouriser, which would make them conftown. She's just a Neighbouriser.

Well, cut a bit of it then.

I think the best of our interest is to shoot GM to confirm if it's a whole scum team claiming to be neighbourizing (lie), or not.
If GM flips scum with no neighbour role, the ultimate red button.

[T S O]

goodmorning's role is completely unclear and she needs to clarify it the fuck up.

[Shinobi]

Are people even reading what elusive is writing at this point? I'm not.

[T S O]

Kitz, it's pretty unlikely this is a gigantic gambit where they're all scum - I know how great that would be, how open-and-closed it would make the game - but these guys are experienced scumplayers. They wouldn't all commit themselves like that.

[T S O]

I'm going to guess that if I get Marquis lynched today and he flips scum, they'll shoot me. It's optimal play. Whereas in any other scenario, they'd leave me alive.

That means I need to get down my last will and testament to the town.

[Kitz]

T S O, I have a question.
Do you read Wolf as a Town? If so, why?

[dragonspawn]

@Ozgin: I already told you what I thought about Aero.
Specifically, why do people care about my case on Aero when I have 3 different scumreads? Nobody is asking about the other two but they're just harping on this one thing like it's the end-all-be-all of my play.

protecting aero?

Seriously?

and what reason do you think they have for only asking you about aero?

You tell me?

Pretty sure I did.

Btw that was a command not a question.

I'm not protecting Aero for you.

You're seriously not following this conversation

[Ozgin]

Your logic keeps falling to pieces in certain areas and you refuse to address these:

-Why the fuck did I kill Boonskiies n1 if I'm the SK?

I didn't say for certain that you did, but it's possible. Why did you kill pisskop if you're the vig? It could have been blind luck.

-Where's my n2 kill?

You could have missed your shot, because bulletproof people exist. Maybe you shot the same person that scum did.

-Where's the vig's kill n3 if I'm the SK?

Again, if there are 3 killing parties, it's possible for kills to overlap.

-Where's my n4 kill?

By this point you would have realized your claiming opportunity, and made the choice not to kill anyone.

-Why hasn't the vig counterclaimed me?

See below.

And, here's one for the road:

Why the fuck would I set up a Vig claim when the alive Vig would just counterclaim me?

So this is the most confusion part for me, because I simply don't know. This is where my gut has taken me, and this is the only point that I can't reason for. Something is fishy.

So even though I don't have all the answers, like I said: gut read. I'm not even calling for a lynch on you though, so your enormous reaction is strange to me.

Pedit:

I went to the store really quickly when I started this. Coming back to read the posts that happened while I was gone -- TSO, if Marquis is going to die no matter what today, tell me -- why do we have to lynch him? Why don't you shoot him and be venerated tomorrow as the great town vig who nailed a clean shot on a scum?

Again, something is fishy.

@dragonspawn - Why did you never respond to my post where I pointed out that you pretty much misrepped me by saying I wanted to lynch TSO?

[Shinobi]

@Ozgin: I already told you what I thought about Aero.
Specifically, why do people care about my case on Aero when I have 3 different scumreads? Nobody is asking about the other two but they're just harping on this one thing like it's the end-all-be-all of my play.

protecting aero?

Seriously?

and what reason do you think they have for only asking you about aero?

You tell me?

Pretty sure I did.

Btw that was a command not a question.

I'm not protecting Aero for you.

You're seriously not following this conversation

I'm not even pretending to.

[Shinobi]

Your logic keeps falling to pieces in certain areas and you refuse to address these:

-Why the fuck did I kill Boonskiies n1 if I'm the SK?

I didn't say for certain that you did, but it's possible. Why did you kill pisskop if you're the vig? It could have been blind luck.

-Where's my n2 kill?

You could have missed your shot, because bulletproof people exist. Maybe you shot the same person that scum did.

-Where's the vig's kill n3 if I'm the SK?

Again, if there are 3 killing parties, it's possible for kills to overlap.

-Where's my n4 kill?

By this point you would have realized your claiming opportunity, and made the choice not to kill anyone.

-Why hasn't the vig counterclaimed me?

See below.

And, here's one for the road:

Why the fuck would I set up a Vig claim when the alive Vig would just counterclaim me?

So this is the most confusion part for me, because I simply don't know. This is where my gut has taken me, and this is the only point that I can't reason for. Something is fishy.

So even though I don't have all the answers, like I said: gut read. I'm not even calling for a lynch on you though, so your enormous reaction is strange to me.

Pedit:

I went to the store really quickly when I started this. Coming back to read the posts that happened while I was gone -- TSO, if Marquis is going to die no matter what today, tell me -- why do we have to lynch him? Why don't you shoot him and be venerated tomorrow as the great town vig who nailed a clean shot on a scum?

Again, something is fishy.

@dragonspawn - Why did you never respond to my post where I pointed out that you pretty much misrepped me by saying I wanted to lynch TSO?

There is literally 0 incentive for him to not push his reads just so he can shoot someone at night. This isn't fishy at all.

[dragonspawn]

Your logic keeps falling to pieces in certain areas and you refuse to address these:

-Why the fuck did I kill Boonskiies n1 if I'm the SK?

I didn't say for certain that you did, but it's possible. Why did you kill pisskop if you're the vig? It could have been blind luck.

-Where's my n2 kill?

You could have missed your shot, because bulletproof people exist. Maybe you shot the same person that scum did.

-Where's the vig's kill n3 if I'm the SK?

Again, if there are 3 killing parties, it's possible for kills to overlap.

-Where's my n4 kill?

By this point you would have realized your claiming opportunity, and made the choice not to kill anyone.

-Why hasn't the vig counterclaimed me?

See below.

And, here's one for the road:

Why the fuck would I set up a Vig claim when the alive Vig would just counterclaim me?

So this is the most confusion part for me, because I simply don't know. This is where my gut has taken me, and this is the only point that I can't reason for. Something is fishy.

So even though I don't have all the answers, like I said: gut read. I'm not even calling for a lynch on you though, so your enormous reaction is strange to me.

Pedit:

I went to the store really quickly when I started this. Coming back to read the posts that happened while I was gone -- TSO, if Marquis is going to die no matter what today, tell me -- why do we have to lynch him? Why don't you shoot him and be venerated tomorrow as the great town vig who nailed a clean shot on a scum?

Again, something is fishy.

@dragonspawn - Why did you never respond to my post where I pointed out that you pretty much misrepped me by saying I wanted to lynch TSO?

Because despite the fact that you say you aren't pushing it, you still are.

[Ozgin]

Except, you know, nobody else being ready to lynch Marquis, so why not try to lynch another decent scumspect and then shoot Marquis tonight?

Pedit:
@dragonspawn

"Because even though you said you don't wanna lynch TSO, you're trying to lynch TSO."

I can't facepalm any harder, holy shit. Is this how TSO feels about Marquis?

[Shinobi]

Except, you know, nobody else being ready to lynch Marquis, so why not try to lynch another decent scumspect and then shoot Marquis tonight?

Pedit:
@dragonspawn

"Because even though you said you don't wanna lynch TSO, you're trying to lynch TSO."

I can't facepalm any harder, holy shit. Is this how TSO feels about Marquis?

Lmao this is how TSO feels about everyone because nobody is listening to him.

Again: there is literally 0 reason for TSO to stop pushing for a lynch just because he has a bullet.

[Ozgin]

Shinobi, I disagree. I think, if the Marquis wagon isn't moving, he should just shoot Marquis and lynch another decent scumspect. But that also depends on how much time we have left -- which I don't know.

[Ozgin]

Also, Shin, dragonspawn is trying to get at the people questioning you about Aero (elusive, me, etc) are defending him, not that you are.

[Shinobi]

Also, Shin, dragonspawn is trying to get at the people questioning you about Aero (elusive, me, etc) are defending him, not that you are.

Oh.

Forgive me for catching the dumb, then.

[T S O]

Lynching likely scum is far better than shooting likely scum. It's more difficult to lynch likely scum because the scumteam can try to disrupt it. So, if we can be successful with our lynch, and trust in the guy who's 1/2 for scum shots, we're more likely to hit 2 scum than not.

[T S O]

Except, you know, nobody else being ready to lynch Marquis, so why not try to lynch another decent scumspect and then shoot Marquis tonight?

Pedit:
@dragonspawn

"Because even though you said you don't wanna lynch TSO, you're trying to lynch TSO."

I can't facepalm any harder, holy shit. Is this how TSO feels about Marquis?

dragonspawn's point is basically correct. You aren't trying to lynch me, but you are trying to discredit me as strongly as you can.

[T S O]

T S O, I have a question.
Do you read Wolf as a Town? If so, why?

Yes. Her play has been town, and her vote on Marquis was extremely town.

I understand your line of thought, Kitz. I really do. She's been seen as town for so long she should be dead. However, there are many extenuating circumstances - three of the four nights, scum likely went for PR's. They haven't had time, except for n3. And she wasn't particularly dangerous in relation to getting scum lynched on d3, so she wasn't an immediate threat on n3.

[T S O]

Shinobi, it really is time to vote Marquis so we can pressurise people into either voting Marquis or claiming scum.

[Marquis]

all i really have to say is that i'm not scum and i keep thinking there has to be a vig that hasn't claimed because tso being town is so unbelievable rn.

i can kind of understand keeping quiet to live and shoot tso tonight, but doing so gets my mislynch instead of lynching tso and potentially shooting another scum. so i'm pretty much just wanting a vig to claim and make this all so much easier to deal with.

ika not extending the deadline makes me think odds are since there's likely no hidden vig claim despite how scummy tso is i'm probably getting lynched.

and i think i'm getting pretty tired of fighting it. yes i'm town, and i really really think i'm obvtown. but people have been siding with tso's reads and "logic" due to the claim alone and that bothers me. and i feel like part of that if tso is actually town vig is that some people are like... the scum in the background bolstering his ego here to eat an easy mislynch on me and then a probably bad gm shot from the vig while shooting tso themselves.

in other words my biggest fear here is me/tso/gm are town and it's like scum are egging us on to murder each other ourselves whether by mislynch or vig. if that's the case i'd probably look at aeronaut or dragonspawn, mostly the former. thought it might have been shinobi but recent posting's made me think town on him again. also been toying with the idea that kitz can't really be this dumb as town either. but ugh

in a different scenario regarding gm too though i remember in quickness mafia being a scum neighborizer, where i recruited people i thought i could easily manipulate and then peppered my hood with town-sounding commentary. whoever it was in the hood, ozgin and wolf iirc, needs to describe as clearly as possible what gm said that's so town. because now i'm not sure if the consensus townreads on her were formed on a bad basis

[T S O]

Hey, Marquis, how sure are you on Aero-scum?

[T S O]

Serious question - because I think he's scum with you, and I want to see where you'll go in relation to lynching him.

[Marquis]

tso if you're town, you don't get to blame my own mislynch on me. i've seen how it works when you get into an unstoppable tunnel (bulba's light/dark game) and if that's the case you can just keep any shittalking in the dead thread to your own play.