Open 595: Elemental Mafia (Town Wins!)

[lane0168]

what do you think of your back and forth about me, and how he knows 100% you're not scum. Or he at least wants us to believe you're not

[Ricastle]

The only possible way to know it was obviously a joke is to know choofs alignment. Why so eager to defend choof?

The only possible way you can say his vote should be 0% serious is to know choofs alignment.

Unbelievable. You're actually proposing the idea that scum!choof could have -seriously- claimed scum on themself and their partner on page 3, and using that to cast suspicion on me? I don't know what to say other than that's the scummiest shit I've read in ages.

You asked plot Why he changed his vote. He answered you. You asked him again. He answered again. You asked him for a third time and yet again, he answers for a third time. Why are you not reading the answers to these questions?

If you read my posts properly, you would understand that I wasn't taking Plotinus's reason as material, which I justified in the post you quoted. That's why I kept asking him. You must know this as my posts explicitly broadcasted that mentality. You're leaving key elements of my posts out to solidify and satiate your suspicions of me; again, scummy as shit.

I would have gladly got on a Flubber wagon if this idiot hadn't gone and exposed himself. Sorry guys.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: lane0168

Pedit: Scarecrows are not advisable gravedigging tools, but you seem to be doing well with this one, all things considered. I never said choof was town. It's flat-out fucking stupid to claim 50 was anything other than a joke. Simple. That's what my go at Plotinus was about. I'm not taking any stance on choof themself based on that.
Pedit 2: OH MY GOD

[lane0168]

Haha Woah, lets settle down. I agree, it is highly unlikely choof would do that. But there is only one way you could be 100% convinced that its a joke.

The fact that it's so unlikely, and people know that, make it more likely. However, I'm not saying Jeanne and choof are partners with you, yet. I'm saying you're aggressive defense of choof can only come from someone who knows his roll.


Why did you stop asking plot then, as his answer hasn't changed. Do you think you should still be pushing for a better answer?

[lane0168]

Also, you did say choof was town. When you said it was obviously a joke, and that to vote him is 100% wrong

[farside22]

“as I reason?”

I do not understand what you are exactly asking. I assume it is about my vote.

I did not vote in my first one because I thought more people had voted flubber and wanted to know where he was before placing my vote. I realized after I posted that the VC was right there and there was only one vote added after. I was mistaken when I thought he had a fast developing wagon – there just seems to be some interest there.

Your post seemed like the wagon on him was fast, but you never explained what you found scummy or why a concern for a fast wagon.

[farside22]

Reading the back and forth here between ric and lane, I get what lane is saying about being satisfied with the response and ric keep pushing, the rest I got lost on and the whole town choof read I just rolled my eyes at

[lane0168]

It's one vote ricastle... why so emotional? Why so jumpy? you mad bro?

[lane0168]

What do people think when you see someone in your game posting frequently elsewhere but not in your game? Do you think that's any sort of tell one way or another?

[Ricastle]

You don't seem to get it.

Even if choof was scum, the post would STILL be a joke. That's the nature of the post. You're insinuating there's a chance that they

seriously

claimed scum there when there is, logically, none.

I never said voting choof was 100% wrong or that he was town. Wth. You're pulling words out of nowhere.

I couldn't care less about the vote. Your reasoning is what's so ridiculous, and frankly, I find it hard to believe it doesn't have an agenda.

I gave up on Plotinus because it was clear I was wasting my time trying to look for more. His reasoning doesn't make sense but at that point continuing the conversation would not have improved my read on him.

[Plotinus]

@lane: Depends how long it's been. If it's been less than a day it might mean just mean the other game is at a more exciting place. If they're in danger of a prod then I do think it's suspicious. But it depends on how much they've contributed to this game you're in and it also depends on whether people are waiting for a response from them. If lots of people have asked them questions and they're off posting elsewhere for hours and hours then that's suspicious. If they've shared their thoughts and are waiting on responses from others and are catching up on their other games while they wait, then not suspicious.

[lane0168]

There is a chance he's scum. I'm sure it's happened before and I bet it works pretty awesome since people can't seem to fathom it would ever possibly happen.

[lane0168]

In general, do you think it's a good or bad play to claim scum during rvs?

[Plotinus]

I have seen actual scum do it before. I have no idea how common it is because I'm pretty new around here (I have one completed game), and I would like to see numbers for how often people who do it are town vs scum before I was ready to lynch based on it, though. So yes, I think it's a bad play, even as a joke. Even if people don't believe you, it plants the seed in their minds, and I think it can colour their gut read of you.

[Ricastle]

What are you gathering from my posts? Of course they have a chance of being scum. What I am saying is that scumreading them based off of the contents of 50 is idiotic because it's clearly a joke that should have no bearing on any serious read of their alignment.

There is a massive difference between joking about being scum IN RVS and claiming scum. Choof's not seriously claiming scum. If they were scum they wouldn't be seriously claiming scum. Got it?

[lane0168]

Got it

[Senator]

Lane,

-how likely do you think it is that the scum actually claimed and are hard defending one another?
-So 26, 27, 28, and 29, 30, and the claim in 50? And Ricastle's 'immediate defense' of Choof?

Walk me through like I don't get it. Because I don't.

[lane0168]

But what I am saying is that the only way you would know that choof is 100% joking, is that you know his alignment. whether he was joking or not, it's a terrible thing to say. You need to remember that my vote is on you, not because you think it's unlikely that anyone would do that, but because you said there's 0% chance choof isn't joking, hence 100% chance he's scum. And that's only true for someone who knows his alignment.

[lane0168]

"Immediate defense"? Are you quoting me here? Cause I don't remember saying that. I think I used eager, and aggressive. Anyways I'd say about 5% chance?

Senator, I'm not making the claim that choof and Jeanne and ricastle are all partners. I'm making the claim that ricastle is.

Anyways, I liked faq2s comments about flub... besides that he was afraid if a quick wagon, I get where he was coming from that it seemed like the was more pressure on flub than there really was.

Plot, I brought that up cause Jeanne has been posting in another game but has one post here.

Arent there more people in this game? Where he hell is everyone?

[Senator]

I don't see it. Ricastle has been correcting people and hasn't been looking easy ways to look town. Ricastle is interpreting it as a joke; and I think you are taking his proclamation too literal. Do you think it was a slip?

[Ricastle]

But what I am saying is that the only way you would know that choof is 100% joking, is that you know his alignment. whether he was joking or not, it's a terrible thing to say. You need to remember that my vote is on you, not because you think it's unlikely that anyone would do that, but because you said there's 0% chance choof isn't joking, hence 100% chance he's scum. And that's only true for someone who knows his alignment.

No. I just explained to you: They're 100% joking because the post in nature is blatantly a joke, and you're only contesting that because it

could

contain a partial truth, which might I add, is obvious to anyone who knows how to play this game. That alone is a void reason to suspect anyone, period; using that logic I could label any post in any game as scummy because its poster has a chance of being scum.

The point is, it's not a sincere claim, regardless of ANY other factors. End of.

[Plotinus]

so i was actually curious about this so i went through the completed games here in central park, in order. i'm just looking at the scum here, don't have time right now to do a close survey. just going to check 10. i'm skipping any games that were abandoned or rebooted or similar.

Spoiler: hidden for people who don't care

In 580, one scum claimed "Death Miller Jester Bomb Cult Leader" obviously a joke
in 579 no one did
in 578 one scum asks a town-aligned person when was the earliest they had caught scum
in 577 one scum predicts his scumbuddy will fakeclaim at L-1 in RVS
in 575 one scum rvses his buddy.
in 573 1 scum mentions that a bunch of people are scum
in 572 1 scum mentions that scum's winning chances
in 571 nobody does
in 570 nobody does
in 569 1 scum says someone scumslipped in rvs

i didn't keep count of town doing it but i didn't see much of it in my skimming.

[Ricastle]

None of those are at all the same as jokeclaiming scum.

[Plotinus]

you're right. although the first one sorta is (it's also very obviously a joke, but any of those claims by itself in a game in which those roles are possible would be serious). every game is different. it seems from my unscientific survey of ten games that scum are more likely to mention scum (including joking about it) in rvs and town seem more likely to joke about other things. I shared the results even though it didn't confirm that 100% of the time scum make the exact same joke that choof made (which isn't what i was expecting to happen anyway) becaue I had spent a while looking into it and i thought it was interesting.

Anyway, we could continue bickering about this or we could get on with the game.

[lane0168]

Jeanne? Where you at? What you thinking about?

[Papi Bear]

Prod dodge... I'll be focusing on this game after my Newb game day ends.