Mini 1665: Papers, Please Mafia (Game Over)

[Cheetory6]

People jumped on Ghostlin for saying something that could be considered a slip and then immediately making a post trying to play it off like it wasn't without anyone even pointing it out. It was the nervousness that people called scummy, not the scumslip itself and I personally think that hunting for scumslips is a bad way of trying to find scum. I found him scummy in that game for other reasons and had been voting him from before that had even happened.

P-Edit:

Oh and cheetory we have a deadline so I assume you'd want to meta PB befor then or were you hoping that getting me mislynched would save you the trouble of following up with your statements of intent?

Maybe if I'd felt any sort of sense of urgency to? I don't get any strong inclination that PB is scum here, so unless you think his meta is going to provide some kind of magical insight into his alignment here [hint: it rarely does] then I really fail to see why you're pushing it as oh so scumtacular that I would want to look at him during the night cycle rather than pay attention to shit going on right now.

I already spent like all of yesterday looking over a bunch of shit that everyone just glazed over. Not a single person engaged me on Otolia's readlist other than Stabulous and not a single person engaged me on my Kopcase. All you've done is sling shit at me for having 'weak reasons' for voting there without even going into detail and only now that I'm voting for you.

Oh and DOA is linked in my wiki, it's a hard game to forget and your plays title from there to here is quite different.

I swear if you push this angle one more time without addressing me saying that my play on

D1

in that game was not that different than here, I will fucking votepark you until you're in the ground.

[ChaosOmega]

Chaos said I'm not answering things, what has he asked that I haven't answered?

chaos, your vote to save your skin after putting me as town is good though, helps back up the scummy vibe you were giving. If you flip scum then that helps figure otolio out yes?

Can you explain why your vote isn't on kop or PB one of whom you were strongly scum reading? Omgus hard, much?

If I wanted to vote to save my skin, why wouldn't I vote Kop?

If I'm scum so much, then why not drop your weak-ass push on a lurker and vote me?

If chaos is scum does that implicate otolio or my thoughts on this later.

Or you could take a stand one way or the other before a flip.

I'll be here for deadline.

Hitos vote seems really odd,he isn't reading and isn't explaining. He can't explain any scum motivations for any of my posts but has been trying to FOS me for pointing out lurkers as bad for town since game began.

Wrong song, I should be here around deadline.

Lynching me or votes on me is pathetic play and the reasoning is either non existent or guess what non existent, fucking learn how to play mafia before joining a game and bringing down the collective intellectual level of town.

Town won't vote me because no case no reasons. Everyone else either shitty town or obvscum.

VOTE: ChaosOmega

Bring it. You can't explain your vote and provide reasoning for your switch from putting me as town to the huge swerve to scum.

Hey are to going to try to even make a case by putting something together for your fake read that did a 360 or are you just going to hide behind Hito and his subpar vocabulary skills?

Oh wait I remember when people used gross to describe something, it was third grade. What next do i have to hear? Cooties?

I am sorry that your cooties are making you so mad

hey elusive I have a bad vocabulary and do odd votes but what's my alignment

My vote on guy got me my desired results, we have an active player. I should do quilford next but we probably don't have time.

[xRECKONERx]

Cheetory is very town.

Trying to find his case on Kop right now.

I still think hito is town. I think. Maybe. Probably. Less town than before.

Quil is still inactive and null. Same with UT. Actually, UT's few posts are giant question marks to me, so he might actually be slightly scummy.

PB slightly scummy. elusive less so than Kop, I think.

Not sure where this puts my reads list from most to least scummy. If someone can link to the Kop-case that'd be great as I'm slammed at work atm

[xRECKONERx]

I have reasons for each of those I can explain later. Lots of gut. Mostly based in shit in the game tho

[elusive]

Here let me break down your post for you:

useless crap

No one cares. We have 2 1/2 days left. Post reads and make a vote that isn't worthless.

You are selectively heaping scorn on PB for reads and votes but not others who have been doing the same if not far worse. Selective engagement check, I already mentioned this about you prior.

So basically you don't like my vote on GIF for not participating but you FOSed PB pretty hard for actually being more active?

Kop Vs. ChaosOmega actually makes me lean scum on Otolio.

Why?

My progression on Otolia is clear from my ISO. I first thought the speed of his wagon and the reasoning by Dinare was weak (and Dinare never stated it was a gambit to get reactions so I still don't follow his reasons - a gambit is the only thing that made sense at that point). I found it strange that a player needed a replace for VLA so that tells me that this slot probably has an action that needs to be put in. Scum or town? Idk.

Since I'd seen Otolia elsewhere and didn't respond well to his somewhat different way of writing when he was actually town, I was trying to give him the benefit of the doubt.

However, when you broke down Kop's case (instead of Dinare's for example which is the weaker one of the two) it seemed weird because semantics slip is a real thing. It's not hundred percent but once I saw a scum refer to town as an entity outside of themselves but because they waved it off as a newbie thing I didn't pursue it and they were scum and the scum won that game.

Also at that time you seemed less intent on self-preservation over defending Otolio which makes me wonder what's different now that he's no longer under pressure. So I see some sort of connection between your slot and his.

It's possible the same connection between Dinare\Kop but theirs less to work there in terms of interaction or strong pushes. I imagine scum being in one of those pairs: Chaos\Otolia or Dinare\Kop.

So keeping Otolio\Stabulous under pressure is a good thing.

Kop and Chaos can you both do reads list? Where you stand on the players so far?

Town

hito
Cheetory
elusive

Scum

Kop
Dinare

I don't have strong reads one way or the other on anyone else.

So I went from a "strong" town read to the opposite end of the spectrum within a few posts.

Nope, not buying this.

I don't put people as strong town reads unless I have some history with them and am seeing the signs. At least on day one. If a player does do that and then flips when it's convenient, I don't buy it as anything but self-preservation.

It's also interesting to me that your read changed with my progression on Otolio from being null to possibly town to scummier. That also sets me off. I was town when I was defending Otolio and I'm scum now that I'm not. That certainty is only held by scum.

[Cheetory6]

Alright, let's fucking dance.

the Chaos wagon keeps being derailed with people who can't post reasons.

Except hito made a huge post about why he thinks CO is town and I've made posts about how I think CO has been leaning null and that the case people have made on him is shitty?
Are you even reading anything or are you just hoping nobody is going to call you on this?

I also don't like Chaos' putting me as town without reasons and then doing a 360 to vote me as scum when it becomes convenient for him to do so.

How is it convenient for him to do so?

Chaos also using Hito as a shield to "sheep" is bad since Hito himself has stated that his meta includes killing players for stupid reasons. I mean its not like Hito is in the MS hall of fame or a player of repute so sheeping him seems like a scum move on the part of XReck and Chaos. When their targets flip town they can point to Hito and say, "But we were just sheep..baa .."

And yet you're townreading Kop when he's doing the exact same thing?
Inconsistently applied scumhunting. And arguably almost entirely likely because you want to derail your wagon by slinging shit at everyone on it.

My wagon shouldn't happen, it's based on nothing and Hito conveniently doesn't have time to post a case or explain scum motivation.

He literally just made a case on you immediately before this post. It's actually fucking comical for you to say this. Lol: 591
Are you going to address what he's saying there or are you just going to continually endlessly misrep shit without actually talking about anything anyone is actually saying about anything ever?

Your case on CO is based on his vote which is based on sheeping hito's reasoning on your GiF vote being terrible [which it was] and

Ok, so I'm leaning scum because of that. I'm assuming that you read Otolio/Stab as scum as well, otherwise this doesn't make any sense. So with 2 scum reads, you wanna push a lurker lynch before deadline?

He calls you out here and says why he finds you scummy.
And your response is this:

Bring it. You can't explain your vote and provide reasoning for your switch from putting me as town to the huge swerve to scum.

Hey are to going to try to even make a case by putting something together for your fake read that did a 360 or are you just going to hide behind Hito and his subpar vocabulary skills?

Oh wait I remember when people used gross to describe something, it was third grade. What next do i have to hear? Cooties?

^This 100% ignores his bolded point on you and is just slinging shit at him for no reason.
I'm finding it really hard to believe you're being this dodgy unintentionally.
Respond to their actual substantial posts about you.
Respond to this.

[Cheetory6]

So I went from a "strong" town read to the opposite end of the spectrum within a few posts.

How is he saying that you were a "strong" townread?

[elusive]

I already answered each of these questions and actually answered all of the Chaos questions that he re-listed before he re-listed them. Are you not reading, cheetory?

[elusive]

Here let me break down your post for you:

useless crap

No one cares. We have 2 1/2 days left. Post reads and make a vote that isn't worthless.

You are selectively heaping scorn on PB for reads and votes but not others who have been doing the same if not far worse. Selective engagement check, I already mentioned this about you prior.

So basically you don't like my vote on GIF for not participating but you FOSed PB pretty hard for actually being more active?

Kop Vs. ChaosOmega actually makes me lean scum on Otolio.

Why?

My progression on Otolia is clear from my ISO. I first thought the speed of his wagon and the reasoning by Dinare was weak (and Dinare never stated it was a gambit to get reactions so I still don't follow his reasons - a gambit is the only thing that made sense at that point). I found it strange that a player needed a replace for VLA so that tells me that this slot probably has an action that needs to be put in. Scum or town? Idk.

Since I'd seen Otolia elsewhere and didn't respond well to his somewhat different way of writing when he was actually town, I was trying to give him the benefit of the doubt.

However, when you broke down Kop's case (instead of Dinare's for example which is the weaker one of the two) it seemed weird because semantics slip is a real thing. It's not hundred percent but once I saw a scum refer to town as an entity outside of themselves but because they waved it off as a newbie thing I didn't pursue it and they were scum and the scum won that game.

Also at that time you seemed less intent on self-preservation over defending Otolio which makes me wonder what's different now that he's no longer under pressure. So I see some sort of connection between your slot and his.

It's possible the same connection between Dinare\Kop but theirs less to work there in terms of interaction or strong pushes. I imagine scum being in one of those pairs: Chaos\Otolia or Dinare\Kop.

So keeping Otolio\Stabulous under pressure is a good thing.

Kop and Chaos can you both do reads list? Where you stand on the players so far?

Town

hito
Cheetory
elusive

Scum

Kop
Dinare

I don't have strong reads one way or the other on anyone else.

So I went from a "strong" town read to the opposite end of the spectrum within a few posts.

Nope, not buying this.

I don't put people as strong town reads unless I have some history with them and am seeing the signs. At least on day one. If a player does do that and then flips when it's convenient, I don't buy it as anything but self-preservation.

It's also interesting to me that your read changed with my progression on Otolio from being null to possibly town to scummier. That also sets me off. I was town when I was defending Otolio and I'm scum now that I'm not. That certainty is only held by scum.

[Cheetory6]

Your last post didn't show up in p-edit before I made that last post.

I already answered each of these questions and actually answered all of the Chaos questions that he re-listed before he re-listed them.

Are you not reading, cheetory?

[Cheetory6]

And yet you're townreading Kop when he's doing the exact same thing?
Inconsistently applied scumhunting. And arguably almost entirely likely because you want to derail your wagon by slinging shit at everyone on it.

Definitely answered this.
Definitely.
100%.

How is he saying that you were a "strong" townread?

Look at how answered this question is! Wow! I can't believe it!

[Cheetory6]

Definitely addressed your bullshit about apparently having some kind of read on me based on DoA.
Seriously. q.q
hnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.

[elusive]

For him to re-ask those questions means he wasn't reading my posts (regarding for example my read on Hito which I made pretty clear).

No, I'm town reading Kop for reasons stated including have experience with him in another game. Can you rephrase why I'm town reading him? See it was in my post, but if you aren't reading it - then you probably missed it along with some other points.

He stated that his strong reads included me being town and that all his other reads were not strong, I underlined it for you - maybe I should requote the whole thing once more? Third time's the charm.

I have a read on you based on DOA, you've claimed to not remember DOA past day one or your interactions with me. So again, you're using subpar logic and reasoning here to deflect. Why?

[Cheetory6]

I have a read on you based on DOA, you've claimed to not remember DOA past day one or your interactions with me. So again, you're using subpar logic and reasoning here to deflect. Why?

Are you fucking serious?
Are you.
Fucking serious?
If you read my post again and this is what you take away from it I will actually start frothing at the mouth.

I underlined it for you - maybe I should requote the whole thing once more?

Okay fine. This point isn't entire shit. Good work. Even enough monkeys on typewriters can write shakespeare given enough time.

[Cheetory6]

No, I'm town reading Kop for reasons stated including have experience with him in another game. Can you rephrase why I'm town reading him? See it was in my post, but if you aren't reading it - then you probably missed it along with some other points.

Chaos also using Hito as a shield to "sheep" is bad since Hito himself has stated that his meta includes killing players for stupid reasons. I mean its not like Hito is in the MS hall of fame or a player of repute so sheeping him seems like a scum move on the part of XReck and Chaos. When their targets flip town they can point to Hito and say, "But we were just sheep..baa .."

And yet you're townreading Kop when he's doing the exact same thing?
Inconsistently applied scumhunting. And arguably almost entirely likely because you want to derail your wagon by slinging shit at everyone on it.

Definitely hit the nail on the head with this answer.

[elusive]

Your engaging in faux theatrics, cheetory. Not a good look for you.

I suggest you calm down, before I start quoting DOA in this game.

You've been trying to discredit me for some time now to protect Chaos. You can't have a scum read on me because you have no sensible points. You tried to degrade Kop when he's been far more reasonable and logical then you.

I'm going to say this once;
STOP WITH THE FAUX THEATRICS AND BEING A DICK ON PURPOSE

[elusive]

I've played with Kop who was super town. He has a certain style. Why don't you describe it to me. Or meta him and tell me what's different here.

You aren't doing the work. You aren't even looking at DOA because you already know the answers and they don't look good for you. I went back to DOA and then looked at your scum game that recently complete. You have a clear differentiation in meta.

It's always interesting. Some players are disgusting little fucks as scum while others feel guilt and are much nicer. I guess I'm partial to the latter.

[Cheetory6]

I suggest you calm down, before I start quoting DOA in this game.

Except you'd need to go into like D2-D3 and pull shit from there to make a comparison which would be a fucking hard dishonest misrep of how I play.
My earlygame is slow and as I get more and more invested in a game I start posting differently.
Fucking read that game again and then feel super fucking dumb for pushing this over and over again without actually trying to pretend like you're thinking about what I'm saying in response to you.

You've been trying to discredit me for some time now to protect Chaos. You can't have a scum read on me because you have no sensible points. You tried to degrade Kop when he's been far more reasonable and logical then you.

Oh man you fucking got me. You endlessly misrepping people before this page over and over again is literally nothing. Keep pretending like it is.
You're being so fucking dodgy about everything you're saying.
Like, how hard are you dodging the point of what I'm saying about Kop in order to sling shit at me? Like fucking seriously.

[elusive]

What point are you making about Kop, repeat it here?

If the point is applicable to multiple players in the game then what specifically about Kop is giving you scum vibes over let's say the other 3-4 players who are doing the same thing?

Have you played with Kop in another game or looked at his town game and noted the similarities or differences?

As I said, I replaced into DOA on day two and didn't closely read the first day. Your day two and onwards you didn't engage in faux theatrics which is a scumtell for you and you were calmly working with players, asking questions, etc. I can quote the posts that I found key in describing your town meta.

[elusive]

I have misrepped no one in any way. I have quoted players directly to let their words stand for themselves.

[Equinox]

Vote Count 1.25

ChaosOmega (5) - Kop, Quilford, Dinare, Wrong Song, elusive
elusive (4) - xRECKONERx, ChaosOmega, hitogoroshi, Cheetory6
PeaceBringer (2) - Stabulous, Untrod Tripod
Kop (1) - PeaceBringer

Not Voting (1) - Ankamius

With 13 alive, it will take 7 to lynch.

The deadline is Saturday, May 9, 2015, at 11:30 PM EDT (UTC-4), which is in (expired on 2015-05-09 23:30:00).

[Cheetory6]

you didn't engage in faux theatrics

Has it not occurred to you that maybe my tolerance for your fucking shitty attitude is just getting lower with every game I'm playing with you?
Like, I've illustrated how you misrepped CO and hito more than once on this page alone and now you're misrepping me again by implying that I haven't. You have literally no interest in actually engaging me on anything here. You're just trying to posture with empty bullshit about how I'm supposedly playing differently.

Have you played with Kop in another game or looked at his town game and noted the similarities or differences?

Why in the fuck should I need to? I've made points on him and your entire response there is to just wave his meta at me and sneer at me for not metadiving every single person in this game.

which is a scumtell for you

No it isn't.
I can literally pull up examples from that fucking game in which I got angry at you.

If the point is applicable to multiple players in the game then what specifically about Kop is giving you scum vibes over let's say the other 3-4 players who are doing the same thing?

Because other people aren't being fucking dodgy about it?

I have no interest in engaging this any further.
I'm not voting someone other than elusive. I want her toxic shit out of this game and she's possibly scum. IDEGAF anymore.

[elusive]

Ok, town so while cheetory once again tries to derail me - faux theatrics (false anger, false emotionalism, yelling, etc) are his scum tells. As scum he also tries to distract town.

There are certain things he does in game of either alignment (talking about people ignoring him for example, I can see why now though in certain cases).

Oh and here's him in ISO in his town game that I've now referred to multiple times (http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p6594738)

Day One and Onwards posts that show:
1. active questioning of multiple players,
2. tone is relaxed and less hysterical as it has been in this game and his recent complete scum game,
3. he votes people but also questions them and doesn't form solid reads without more questioning,
4. reads progress and makes connections between players (for example mentions two possible scum based on associations)
5. language is more "I don't think," or "I'm feeling" or " rather then firm 100% sure stances
6. Asks about and refers to meta and what he knows about players
7. Differentiates between meta and scum tells
8. Cheetory6 is one of those players who is tangibly different when town or scum. I should know because we're the opposite.

As town he's relaxed, calm and figuring things out and working with multiple players. As scum he's abrasive, rude, and gets into stupid arguments that make no sense or fixates on useless points.

These are example of Cheetory6, town posts:

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p6601216
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 9#p6607919

[elusive]

Cheetory6, you have to prove your points with evidence from this game. I see you talking without backing up your points. I've made a case on why I think Chaos is scummy. Are you ignoring it? I believe so.

As for Kop, again restate the case in summarized form here. Give me actual evidence to look at. I'm doing the research and work, you're frothing like a rabid scum that wants to either protect Chaos.

In fact, Chaos was more calm and reasonable then you are or have been.

Trying to justify a vote park is pathetic. You aren't even stating that you think I'm scum because you know this is my town game but that you don't like my attitude.

Aww....poor scum...whenever I'm onto them they start this whining BS about attitude and stuff. Its so weird cause town rarely if ever does it, its almost always scum.

[elusive]

And I'm just going to be clear now, when scum have this reaction and have had this reaction that you're promoting as okay - it tells me I'm doing everything right and should not only keep it up but amp up the volume to full blast. So thanks scumfucks.