Mini 50 (Newer York Confidential) Game Over!

gslamm · Post Post #250 (ISO) » Sun Sep 07, 2003 1:19 pm

UnFos: FishBulb

That explanation makes sense. Sorry for the confusion. Let me try stating my point and answering questions again:

You followed the Masons last night. OK
Riven "says" they were together night 2. (duh)
I did not get my info from the thread I DO investigations. Proven since I named Fishbulb BEFORE he said anything in the thread!
Riven named someone as being with JazzRed AFTER they had established a relationship
mneme would not mispell carnegie the s and g are seperated on the keyboard and he is a classical musician.
The win condition of "Survive the game" is crap. So if you die you lose even if the town or more likely the anti-town group wins.

Riven · Post Post #251 (ISO) » Mon Sep 08, 2003 6:32 pm

gslamm wrote:mneme would not mispell carnegie the s and g are seperated on the keyboard and he is a classical musician.

I'm not stupid enough to make such a spelling mistake, infact if i was to create myself a PM from mneme, I would read it over at least 5 times to make sure it was all correct. But I just loaded up my PM, and did a straight copy/paste, without checking it.

Come on towns people, we've got a murderer here out in the open.

If you believe me, then lynch gslamm.
If you dont, then lynch me.

Simple as that

gslamm · Post Post #252 (ISO) » Mon Sep 08, 2003 11:08 pm

Riven wrote:If you believe me, then lynch gslamm.
If you dont, then lynch me.

Simple as that

Now there is something I can agree with.

Fishbulb · Post Post #253 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 1:02 am

I don't see it as being so simple. FinalFear and Night Stalker are serious possibilities as well. And if Night Stalker doesn't speak up, that is where my vote is going. He said he would post his theories after the weekend...

Night Stalker · Post Post #254 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 1:54 am

Ok. We've had a night worth of research, and I'm even more confused then I was yesterday.

Here's my thoughts on each player.

Riven: Posted a role claim, and backed it up. I'm inclined to believe him. (her?) Doesn't show any signs of being evil or insane. The only non-cop investigator left. The only weird thing is some typos in your role claim. It would suck to get lynched because the mod made a typo...

CARNIGIE

JazzRed: "Ex" Mobster? You're not even mafia anymore, you're "ex-mafia"? I'm starting to get the feeling that even if you're pro-town, your win condition requires me to be dead.
If there weren't so many investigators vouching for you, you'd be at the top of my suspicios list.

Someone: Same as JazzRed, only quieter and less suspicious. Hasn't posted today, for that matter.

Remember, Riven invesitgated them on Night 2 (when there wasn't a "mafia" kill) and not last night, when there was.

THE COPS

When I first joined this game, after reading the thread, I found myself thinking "if both mafias are innocent... then maybe the cops are the killers?"

Gslamm: If you're guilty, you've done an excellent job acting innocent. I find you far less suspicious then your police compatriots. Still, someone I trust has fingered you as guilty. And how do you know Mneme is a classical musican? Even if he is, that doesn't make him a perfect typist.

FishBulb: You haven't been acting suspiciously either. And, durring the day, you haven't acted in concert with Gslamm, you're likely partener if you are mafia. Which could just be a sign of two clever mafia members...

FinalFear: The most suspicious behaving of the cops. (Not to mention he voted me today.). On the other hand, he had the guts to post his role. Based on that and his name, he seems less likely to be part of the killing team then our other two cops.

If all three cops are mafia, and we don't lynch one today, they win the game tomorrow morning.

I'm half tempted to leave gslamm be for now, and lynch one of the other cops. But the evidence and the momentum seem to be on him. Still, gslamm, before I vote for you, I want to see your role. Post it, please. You still have a chance to convince me...

Has anyone else seen or read LA Confidential? The cops start murdering the mafia... so they can take over all the rackets.

gslamm · Post Post #255 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 8:35 am

Night Stalker wrote:If all three cops are mafia, and we don't lynch one today, they win the game tomorrow morning.

That is true of any two or three mafia. If we don't get this lynch right they win. If the cops were anti-town the game would be 5 -vs- 7 and remember there were two cops killed day 1. Capt. Happy was killed by the machine gunner(s).

Night Stalker wrote: I'm half tempted to leave gslamm be for now, and lynch one of the other cops. But the evidence and the momentum seem to be on him. Still, gslamm, before I vote for you, I want to see your role. Post it, please. You still have a chance to convince me...

I can't quote my PM as it's gone. Not that I couldn't compose one that said what I wanted it to say, if I were scum. Go back and read my second BIG problem with Rivens claim. The only legitimate win condition that requires a player to be alive at the end is SK.

JazzRed · Post Post #256 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 9:44 am

Night Stalker: By ex-mafia I meant more along the lines of "I don't kill anymore". My win condition does not require you to be dead - unless of course you are evil in which case it is (duh!).

Now, I'm willing to lynch FinalFear, Night Stalker, or gslamm as I'm very suspicious of all of them. I'm sure all of you can go and read 'bout why I think what I do so let's pick one and go with it.

Fishbulb · Post Post #257 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 9:57 am

Night Stalker wrote:Remember, Riven invesitgated them on Night 2 (when there wasn't a "mafia" kill) and not last night, when there was.

Not this again...

I followed JazzRed last night. He just met with Someone in a diner. That is all

. They couldn't have done it.

Night Stalker wrote:When I first joined this game, after reading the thread, I found myself thinking "if both mafias are innocent... then maybe the cops are the killers?"

I thought that, too. In fact, getting the names of five other cops, even before I saw that a "corrupt cop" was killed, I knew one or more of them had to be scum. And I still believe that. If you think it is just flat out, Cops = Scum, I can assure you that is not the case. I cannot, however, give credibility to gslamm or FinalFear. They are both as suspicious as you in this, and if anyone has a good reason to go for any of them, I'm all for it.

NS wrote:Gslamm: If you're guilty, you've done an excellent job acting innocent. I find you far less suspicious then your police compatriots. Still, someone I trust has fingered you as guilty.

Why do you trust him so much? More later...

NS wrote:FinalFear: The most suspicious behaving of the cops. (Not to mention he voted me today.). On the other hand, he had the guts to post his role. Based on that and his name, he seems less likely to be part of the killing team then our other two cops.

Guts? How about not following the rules? How about most likely faked anyway?

And finally:

NS wrote:Riven: Posted a role claim, and backed it up. I'm inclined to believe him. (her?) Doesn't show any signs of being evil or insane. The only non-cop investigator left. The only weird thing is some typos in your role claim. It would suck to get lynched because the mod made a typo...

Back to this... Why is it you trust him so much? Granted, he was most likely telling the truth since he can't fake the newspaper thing through Mneme, but why are you so trusting? In a game as crazy as this, you would realize that anything is possible, he might not be on your side, so why are you clinging so tightly to him?

Anyway, I'll list mine in order of suspiciousness, but won't bother with reasons since I have posted them several times. Most to least:

gslamm + Night Stalker (tie)
FinalFear
Riven

Basically, someone needs to get me off the fence on gslamm and NS before I will vote. Some real evidence one way or another. I'm just about sold on Riven's innocence, but I still have a lagging doubt.

Riven · Post Post #258 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 10:08 am

Fishbulb wrote:I thought that, too. In fact, getting the names of five other cops, even before I saw that a "corrupt cop" was killed, I knew one or more of them had to be scum. And I still believe that. If you think it is just flat out, Cops = Scum, I can assure you that is not the case. I cannot, however, give credibility to gslamm or FinalFear. They are both as suspicious as you in this, and if anyone has a good reason to go for any of them, I'm all for it.

How about this then..

i followed gslamm, and found him with CoolBot last night!!

I currently believe that the last remaining killers are
gslamm (caught him with coolbot last night)
FinalFear (two bigs in a mini is very unlikely, and i believe his role-claim less than Night Stalkers)

I reckon we lynch gslamm today, and get Night Stalker to vig kill FinalFear tonight (thus also proving Night Stalkers ability) and if i'm right, then game will end in a town victory in the morning

Riven · Post Post #259 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 10:09 am

Riven wrote:FinalFear (two bigs in a mini is very unlikely, and i believe his role-claim less than Night Stalkers)

Err that should read

FinalFear (two

vigs

in a mini is very unlikely, and i believe his role-claim less than Night Stalkers)

FinalFear · Post Post #260 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 10:29 am

so, you're lynching gslamm tonight, and having Night Stalker kill me, even though he can't? there is not two vigs, there is one. Me.

vote: night stalker[/]

lynch him, and i'll kill gslamm for you.

mneme · Post Post #261 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 10:32 am

note that

vote: target [/] will not actually be counted as a vote.

Fishbulb · Post Post #262 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 10:38 am

Riven wrote:How about this then..
i followed gslamm, and found him with CoolBot last night!!

Oh yeah, forgot about that. Sorry! I think I ignored it at the time since it seemed like you were just trying to pin it on him. Like I said, I don't entirely trust you. However, we will find out tomorrow if the newspaper isn't about gslamm and CoolBot. I don't think we have to worry about being outnumbered since it's obvious that of the remaining four, that not ALL of them are evil. Maybe two, but not all four. If gslamm is innocent, we'll lose another tonight, then tomorrow we will know the truth about Riven, FinalFear, and Night Stalker. And that is a worst case scenario. I think it will work.

Riven · Post Post #263 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 12:22 pm

Fishbulb wrote:
Riven wrote:How about this then..
i followed gslamm, and found him with CoolBot last night!!
Oh yeah, forgot about that. Sorry! I think I ignored it at the time since it seemed like you were just trying to pin it on him. Like I said, I don't entirely trust you. However, we will find out tomorrow if the newspaper isn't about gslamm and CoolBot.

I write the newspaper articlae and submit it to the mod, who then posts it. Its a way of letting people know what i got in my investigations the night before.. however since i have role claimed, and also got a result that points straight at a killer, i thought it would be inthe towns best interest to know who to lynch today.

Fishbulb wrote:I don't think we have to worry about being outnumbered since it's obvious that of the remaining four, that not ALL of them are evil. Maybe two, but not all four. If gslamm is innocent, we'll lose another tonight, then tomorrow we will know the truth about Riven, FinalFear, and Night Stalker. And that is a worst case scenario. I think it will work.

What are you suggesting here? another no lynch.. thats sounds scummie to me

FinalFear wrote:so, you're lynching gslamm tonight, and having Night Stalker kill me, even though he can't? there is not two vigs, there is one. Me.

vote: night stalker[/]

lynch him, and i'll kill gslamm for you.

How about we lynch gslamm, then you kill Night Stalker, and Night Stalker kills you.. who ever is left alive of the 2 of you is the true vig

Fishbulb · Post Post #264 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 1:07 pm

Riven wrote:What are you suggesting here? another no lynch.. thats sounds scummie to me.

Oops, sorry again. While I was typing all of that, I was agreeing with everything you had said. I was going to close with a vote on gslamm, but before I hit send I saw the FinalFear comment was added and I erased the vote to hear discussions about that.

Night Stalker · Post Post #265 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 4:12 pm

I'm surprised at all this doubt that I have the ability to kill at night. What possible reason would I have to take credit for two kills that everyone assumed were mafia, if I couldn't kill?

At the same time, "testing" FinalFear's "vigilante" ability by having him try to kill me tonight is counter-productive. If he is mafia, I'll wind up just as dead as if he's the vig, and it'll just look like the mafia didn't do a kill last night...

Night Stalker · Post Post #266 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 5:08 pm

However, if FinalFear doesn't believe me, I'll be more then happy to prove it to him personally this night.

Riven · Post Post #267 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 5:14 pm

Night Stalker wrote:However, if FinalFear doesn't believe me, I'll be more then happy to prove it to him personally this night.

How about you do that

and

vote for gslamm.. then i reckon we'd be all sweet

gslamm · Post Post #268 (ISO) » Tue Sep 09, 2003 10:51 pm

Riven wrote:
Night Stalker wrote:However, if FinalFear doesn't believe me, I'll be more then happy to prove it to him personally this night.
How about you do that
and
vote for gslamm.. then i reckon we'd be all sweet

Better plan follows:
Lynch Riven today
FinalFear "Attempts" to kill me
Night Stalker kills FinalFear (proven killing ability)

With Fishbulbs plan we have a possibility of two -vs- two and that = scum win.

Fishbulb · Post Post #269 (ISO) » Wed Sep 10, 2003 12:48 am

gslamm wrote:With Fishbulbs plan we have a possibility of two -vs- two and that = scum win.

Not my plan. That was Riven's. If you are confused, make sure and read all of the posts. I think I managed to screw up the general idea of that post, but I did clear it up soon after.

gslamm · Post Post #270 (ISO) » Wed Sep 10, 2003 3:10 am

Fishbulb wrote:Oh yeah, forgot about that. Sorry! I think I ignored it at the time since it seemed like you were just trying to pin it on him. Like I said, I don't entirely trust you.

..
Sorry for attributing the plan to you Fishbulb

Riven is still trying to pin the Coolbot thing on me, and I was meaning to appeal to you for help here.
.

Fishbulb wrote: However, we will find out tomorrow if the newspaper isn't about gslamm and CoolBot. I don't think we have to worry about being outnumbered since it's obvious that of the remaining four, that not ALL of them are evil. Maybe two, but not all four.

As for the newspaper I willing to believe Riven has demonstrated he is behind writing it. It's the investigations he claims that I have trouble with for obvious reasons.

Fishbulb wrote: If gslamm is innocent, we'll lose another tonight, then tomorrow we will know the truth about Riven, FinalFear, and Night Stalker. And that is a worst case scenario. I think it will work.

I just realized I don't like my plan so much anymore either. I'm convinced Night Stalker can kill, and FinalFear's little rules breach makes me tend to believe him. So my plan sucks too in that IF FinalFear is pro-town and I know I am that would be two townies for Riven. Bad trade at this point.

How can I convince you Riven is not on our side?

Fishbulb · Post Post #271 (ISO) » Wed Sep 10, 2003 3:21 am

gslamm wrote:As for the newspaper I willing to believe Riven has demonstrated he is behind writing it. It's the investigations he claims that I have trouble with for obvious reasons.

I would agree with you here, except for the last two newspapers had nothing. Why would he bother fabricating that I did nothing Night 1, and JazzRed and Someone were seen doing nothing on Night 2? Just doesn't make sense if he was against all of us. He could've gotten all of us lynched by now if he wanted.

gslamm wrote:I just realized I don't like my plan so much anymore either. I'm convinced Night Stalker can kill, and FinalFear's little rules breach makes me tend to believe him. So my plan sucks too in that IF FinalFear is pro-town and I know I am that would be two townies for Riven. Bad trade at this point.

That is the dilemma. It is possible there is only one scum left, but it is also likely that there are two working together. The only ones who could conceivably be working together is Night Stalker and Riven. The rest of you are pointing blame back and forth, so I doubt you are in with any of them and same with FinalFear. The whole two vigilantes thing is screwy, too. If one of them is lying, then tonight could go all wrong. If it is just Riven who is lying, then it will be even worse. There's gotta be a plan that will work, just can't see it yet.

gslamm wrote:How can I convince you Riven is not on our side?

Good question. I just don't know. I trusted you early on, but everything's falling apart now.

gslamm · Post Post #272 (ISO) » Wed Sep 10, 2003 3:27 am

[quote=Fishbulb"] If it is just Riven who is lying, then it will be even worse. There's gotta be a plan that will work, just can't see it yet. [/quote]

This is what I'm afraid of! If I were anti-town I wouldn't have retracted my plan. Again I'll say it "two townies for a scum is a bad trade at this point."

FinalFear · Post Post #273 (ISO) » Wed Sep 10, 2003 10:26 am

so, the plan for tonight is? all this talk and less action won't get us nowhere. (well it might, so yeah.)

I say this:

vote: Riven

for some reason, i believe he's pro-killing-everyone-in-the-game.

don't ask me why.

gslamm · Post Post #274 (ISO) » Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:06 pm

Looking back again. Currently I have three votes on me. (Riven, JazzRed, Someone.) It's been that way for a while now. Night Stalker , Fishbulb or FinalFear could finish me off at any time and use Riven's "investigation" as an excuse. None of them has done that, so I've moved them up on my towness scale.

I really believe JazzRed and Someone are on the towns side too. It just doesn't make sense any other way. Maybe Riven is the last Scum ?!? If so I don't mind being lynched cause we will win this anyways.

If one of the unvoting players finishes me off he's been pretty coolheaded to just let my stew like this.

I've been biting my tongue for a while now about the dead PBug. He's made like five posts (in other threads) that refer to his role in this game as being mafia, anti-town, scum... So there's one down. Maybe Rite was scum (I don't know) Usually there is either three scum or two and a SK. I don't think we got a SK unless Night Stalker is lying. I tend to believe him for now since he didn't have to admit to the kills. That just leaves Riven! Does this make sense to anybody?