Mini 1714: Justified Season 2 Mafia (Endgame)

[Shinobi]

@LLD - no, I don't particularly think you have.
You point out little bits and pieces of what you don't like, sure, but there's no overarching idea of how/why Quilford is scum in what you've said.
If I've missed something, feel free to point it out to me and explain but I don't really see quilford!scum here.

So what you're saying is I don't have a giant post or "case" explaining everything I think in one place?

Is that what you're saying?

Yes and no.
A case would be super helpful but I don't think you're the type of person that would write one out. And that's fine.
What's

not

fine is the fact that I still don't understand why you think Quil is scum - even two or three sentences concisely describing what you think of him without taking potshots would be a step in the right direction.

[Shinobi]

This giant flashwagon cropped up on someone that I thought was being super helpful and whatnot and I literally don't understand why anyone wound up there.
I want to know why.

Even if you think I'm some [REMOVED] that can't read, explain it to me again so I can either back it or shut it down and we can move on.

Ill-judged term removed upon Shinobi's request. -Mod

[Quilford]

But as scum I just did lists where I'd just take everyone's name and make vague assessments based on how I thought they'd seem, because people don't read these things critically. I read his other games and as town he seems to actually legitimately try and I don't sense that here at all

catboi, he has made very similar reads lists in his other two games on site. I do think he appears to be trying harder in those games though. Bleeeeuuuurgh.

[Quilford]

And he was town in both

[Quilford]

Whatever the only thing he's posted that I've liked was #243 so I don't intend to fight this wagon at all

[chamber]

[Term since removed by mod]

Come on.

Edited as per redaction from original quote - Mod

[I_Am_Not_Varsoon]

But was there a contradiction in those? Like he said that he liked your logic and like Shin for town. He could not have like all your logic up to that point if he liked Shin as a town read.

[I_Am_Not_Varsoon]

That was at Quil.

[catboi]

But as scum I just did lists where I'd just take everyone's name and make vague assessments based on how I thought they'd seem, because people don't read these things critically. I read his other games and as town he seems to actually legitimately try and I don't sense that here at all

catboi, he has made very similar reads lists in his other two games on site. I do think he appears to be trying harder in those games though. Bleeeeuuuurgh.

I'm aware. If you can't discern the difference in level of analysis between those and this game you're hopeless.

[Quilford]

!Varsoon, Dwlee also told me he liked my logic but didn't agree with my conclusions, and I think Dwlee is probs town. So I do think it's plausible that Yimmy liked my logic but didn't agree with the conclusion I came to that Shin was scum. I think his paltry scumhunting is more convincing than this possible contradiction.

[Quilford]

But as scum I just did lists where I'd just take everyone's name and make vague assessments based on how I thought they'd seem, because people don't read these things critically. I read his other games and as town he seems to actually legitimately try and I don't sense that here at all

catboi, he has made very similar reads lists in his other two games on site. I do think he appears to be trying harder in those games though. Bleeeeuuuurgh.

I'm aware. If you can't discern the difference in level of analysis between those and this game you're hopeless.

nah mate I went past hopeless ages ago. i'm already at 'depressingly appalling'

[Shinobi]

[Removed]

Come on.

Frick, I'm sorry - that was just awful of me. I wasn't trying to say anything by it.
Please overlook, I'm not trying to be offensive to anyone. It was poor word choice on my part.

[Shinobi]

(I didn't think that word actually had anything behind it but apparently it does. :/ )

[Lady Lambdadelta]

@LLD - no, I don't particularly think you have.
You point out little bits and pieces of what you don't like, sure, but there's no overarching idea of how/why Quilford is scum in what you've said.
If I've missed something, feel free to point it out to me and explain but I don't really see quilford!scum here.

So what you're saying is I don't have a giant post or "case" explaining everything I think in one place?

Is that what you're saying?

Yes and no.
A case would be super helpful but I don't think you're the type of person that would write one out. And that's fine.
What's

not

fine is the fact that I still don't understand why you think Quil is scum - even two or three sentences concisely describing what you think of him without taking potshots would be a step in the right direction.

I'm not taking potshots, I'm explaining my point of view.

If you can't understand what I'm seeing, that's fine, but don't come to me and pretend that it doesn't exist. Either take my specific concerns and say "I don't understand this concern" and I'll elaborate, or accept that I have legitimate concerns.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

and Shinobi, honestly, if you are complaining about how you don't understand my reads on people, and then totally happy with Quilford's pressure on me basically coming from "I don't like your playstyle it doesn't explain itself enough" I am very confused.

[Shinobi]

and Shinobi, honestly, if you are complaining about how you don't understand my reads on people, and then totally happy with Quilford's pressure on me basically coming from "I don't like your playstyle it doesn't explain itself enough" I am very confused.

Explaining yourself is the crux of mafia, though.

[I_Am_Not_Varsoon]

Tell me is I am strawman-ing you, LLD:

Your argument is: "When you assume !Var is scum, suddenly all his posts look like they have a scummy intent behind them."

Tell me why I am wrong.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

and Shinobi, honestly, if you are complaining about how you don't understand my reads on people, and then totally happy with Quilford's pressure on me basically coming from "I don't like your playstyle it doesn't explain itself enough" I am very confused.

Explaining yourself is the crux of mafia, though.

Not really, no.

[Untrod Tripod]

and Shinobi, honestly, if you are complaining about how you don't understand my reads on people, and then totally happy with Quilford's pressure on me basically coming from "I don't like your playstyle it doesn't explain itself enough" I am very confused.

Explaining yourself is the crux of mafia, though.

getting people to do what you want is the crux of mafia

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Tell me is I am strawman-ing you, LLD:

Your argument is: "When you assume !Var is scum, suddenly all his posts look like they have a scummy intent behind them."

Tell me why I am wrong.

That's wrong.

My argument is, when you examine the intent behind !varsoon's posts, ie: the reasons why they would post the content as opposed to the content itself, you find that these posts are far more likely to have come from someone with a scum alignment than someone with a town alignment.

How is that hard to understand?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

and Shinobi, honestly, if you are complaining about how you don't understand my reads on people, and then totally happy with Quilford's pressure on me basically coming from "I don't like your playstyle it doesn't explain itself enough" I am very confused.

Explaining yourself is the crux of mafia, though.

getting people to do what you want is the crux of mafia

That's right, yes.

[Shinobi]

and Shinobi, honestly, if you are complaining about how you don't understand my reads on people, and then totally happy with Quilford's pressure on me basically coming from "I don't like your playstyle it doesn't explain itself enough" I am very confused.

Explaining yourself is the crux of mafia, though.

getting people to do what you want is the crux of mafia

Well.
Sure.

But I can't read people who don't explain stuff.

[Shinobi]

Meh, Lady might be town.
UNVOTE:

[Quilford]

Yeah getting people to do what you want involves persuading them which involves explaining yourself, unless you're playing against a herd of sheep or have the power of mind control.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Yeah getting people to do what you want involves persuading them which involves explaining yourself, unless you're playing against a herd of sheep or have the power of mind control.

It's like you're deliberately trying to be obtuse.

It's the same when you said that scum can't fake reads or manufacture reasons.

You either have a critical failure to understand how this game works, or you have a deliberate desire to be misinformed and make our conversations be about theory and use that to accuse me, instead of attempting to have real motives.

Which is it?