Mini 1720 Number Mafia | Endgame snuggles

[Fro99er]

UNVOTE: to ask mod a question

[Fro99er]

@Mod in a world where a hypothetical town roleblocker blocks a scum making a kill and said scum making a kill targets said town roleblocker which action resolves first?

Roleblock resolves before kill. --P

[Fro99er]

I believe it has to be the roleblock given how jailkeepers work.

[Fro99er]

No need.

BBT is scum. I'll vote after mod answers and then BBT will self hammer if he knows what's good for his team

[Fro99er]

VOTE: BBT

[Fro99er]

Now we wait 72 hours for a hammer.

Sigh.

[Fro99er]

JarJar Frogger lalalalalalallllllallalalalalallaDucksGiraffeSheep and All Alone conftown wooyawoo!

[Fro99er]

Espe and DV likely town

MTD ?????

Bella and DRK the two I'm eyeing heavily

[Fro99er]

OH SHIT I JUST DID A READS LIST

I NEVER DO READS LISTS

[Fro99er]

DEAR TOWN

WHEN BBT FLIPS SCUM AND WHEN IM DEAD LYNCH DRK FIRST

RANDOM DECISION MAKING IS A SCUMTELL

ME AND BBT PLAYED IN A GAME WITH OUT MOD WHERE OUR MOD WAS SCUM AND OUR MODS SCUMBUDDY DICE TAG VOTED

DRK IS THE OTHER SCUM

BYE BYE

[Fro99er]

OMG

Espe is conftown

[Fro99er]

Nah you're good JarJar

Town paranoia moment by me

[Fro99er]

There it is...the delayed vote.

How scummy.

Lets not forget you arguing her in to a position of damned if you do, damned if you don't. Then not leaving any room for benefit if the doubt. bc that is a scum minded trap.

This is conftown when BBT flips scum

[Fro99er]

ISO dived MTD. I don't *think* scum, but not willing to townbloc MTD yet

[Fro99er]

Eughghghghfhvh Bella's ISO is awful

I firmly believe if BBT is scum if we just FlashLynch DRK Bella and DV we win

[Fro99er]

(Also, I feel more and more that DV is likely town but not totally sure)

[Fro99er]

VT

Got Neighborized by Bella last night

[Fro99er]

Bella how do you know you weren't blocked N2?

Who did you target with your roleblock?

[Fro99er]

wtf is that kill

vote: bella

It's somebody who thought they could kill both All Alone and DRK with one shot.

Or All Alone gambiting

Basically the choice is between Bella and All Alone

[Fro99er]

There's also a world where MTD or DV are scum, but IDK

[Fro99er]

Omg MTD could be scum.

[Fro99er]

Also, the self-meta is scummy tell works AGAIN

[Fro99er]

Oh, I might have been blocked n2, n1 I wasn't blocked because I copped you, frog.I targeted jar jar Because I thought he must have seen my crumb be because it was in response to him and decides to push my lynch anyway.

Which means Al alone is lieing g, because I didn't get blocked at any point. Notice he changed his claim.

VOTE: all alone unless I'm very much mistaken

So why are you voting all alone if you concede you might actually have been blocked?

[Fro99er]

Which also makes Bella unlikely to be scum. BBT would probably assume he'd be blocked again N2 so his buddy probably made the kill. Bella couldn't have killed Anti in that case.

MTD is probscum in that case

[Fro99er]

Hi

Why no claim?

[Fro99er]

JarJar shush.

They are a) very good friends and b) MTD is probscum

[Fro99er]

I think that's a bit of a leap (har har). If I were scum in that scenario I would advocate for a kill by the same person.

However, my previous scumread on Bella has been shaken somewhat.

I wouldn't have. It was the easiest way to confirm BBT scum was to have BBT kill again and AA block BBT again.

[Fro99er]

My head is spinning.

MTD Bella All Alone need to talk more.

[Fro99er]

I say we just flshlynch Bella and MYD in any order.

If we're wrong on both then we're in 4p mylo with two of JarJat/Myself/DV, then All Alone and Espe.

[Fro99er]

VOTE: Bella

[Fro99er]

In the neighborhood PT she also said she'd sheep me D2. The only hint of that I see is her saying she's d vote ducky with me

[Fro99er]

I'd be happy to vote lala with you, Frog. Also, I'm done lurking

[Fro99er]

UNVOTE:

MTD needs to talk more

[Fro99er]

yes claim MTD

[Fro99er]

Everybody should unvote until the mass claim is over. I have reasons why.

[Fro99er]

Everybody should unvote until the mass claim is over. I have reasons why.

UNVOTE:

What's the deal frog? Are we gonna overthink this?

No. We're going to solve this damn game.

[Fro99er]

After Espe claims

[Fro99er]

True. But All Alone claimed several times. And changed it. Want Espe to officially claim.

[Fro99er]

I can confirm even absent Espe's claim that we're not lynching bella today.

[Fro99er]

Fuck off Jar Jar. We are not.

I have info you don't.

Stop being an ass to everyone in this game.

[Fro99er]

Bella can confirm town so piss off.

[Fro99er]

And based on balance, DV is most likely scum.

[Fro99er]

Reviewed for normalcy and balance by ether, mykonian, and quadz08! Thank you!

Given who it's been reviewed by, I can be fairly certain we are in one of two setups. It all depends on if Bella can conftown or not. The only choices are her or DV, and I'm pretty sure we go for DV given how well I know Bella.

[Fro99er]

PAGETOP

[Fro99er]

chill dude. It's not like I'm telling everyone "ignore frog, vote bella".

Was supposed to be a slight jab @ how often you've voted and unvoted this game.

I'll obviously listen to what u have to say.

I'm sick of your fucking jabs. You took a jab at Mollie. You took a jab at Bella. Now me. Two of my dear friends and me.

I'd fucking policy lynch you at this point if it weren't such an anti-town move to make.

Welcome to the WOTC list.

[Fro99er]

Was supposed to be a slight jab @ how often you've voted and unvoted this game.

You don't know me. I do that every game. Using that as a "jab" at me is laughable.

[Fro99er]

BBT –

Mafia Encryptor

Wanderer –

Mafia Goon

MTD –

Mafia Goon

Bella –

JOAT (1 shot cop, 1 shot RB, 1 shot neighborizer, 1 shot not saying)

All Alone –

Roleblocker

Lalaladucks –

Innocent Child

DV –

1-shot BP

VTs – Espe, Frogger, JarJar, Mollie, Anti, DRK


This is very town sided (I would know, I modded a 13-player mini normal game where the only scum was a mafia encryptor). Either Bella is fake claiming, or DV is scum. Given Bella can conftown, I'm willing to lynch DV first.

[Fro99er]

Jar Jar is town by play.
Espe is town by association.
I am town by association and play.
Ducky is conftown.
All Alone is almost surely town by play and associations.

The only questions are MTD, DV, and Bella (and a very longshot gambit by All Alone), and MTD doesn't make sense based off balance, so MTD is conftown.

This means it's between Bella and DV. That's it. And Bella can conftown tomorrow, and if she doesn't she's speedlynched.

[Fro99er]

We're lynching DV today.

VOTE: DV

[Fro99er]

This means it's between Bella and DV. That's it. And Bella can conftown tomorrow, and if she doesn't she's speedlynched.

And if somehow Bella and DV are both town, then All Alone has been gambiting.

There's no way we're in a setup where we have an IC, a 1-shot BP, a JOAT with 4 abilities, and a full roleblocker against just an encryptor and two goons. No. Way.

[Fro99er]

Bella's play makes a lot of sense from a town perspective too.

She wanted to conftown me because of my behavior around the mollie lynch, and because I'm a close friend she could work with. Neighborizing me makes sense as well. Her last ability makes sense and can conftown her, and she did well to save that one and not die yet.

[Fro99er]

Agree. If u tell me the reason not to vote bella then I think DV or All Alone are the next logical choices.

We're not lynching bella because she can conftown. Saying any more would be anti-town.

[Fro99er]

I have very specific plans that I will reveal at the right time. I'm 100% town and you need to trust me on this.

[Fro99er]

I've timed everything out as well. You will see.

[Fro99er]

I'm confirmed town BTW. Either bella is lying so she's last scum. Or she's telling the truth and copped me so I'm town via that.

[Fro99er]

suffice to say, town has this in the bag and everyone should be sheeping me on this.

Bella - put your vote on DV.

lalaladucks. Sheep me. Espe. Sheep me.

[Fro99er]

All Alone. Sheep me. MTD. Sheep me.

[Fro99er]

MTD doesn't make sense based off balance

confused about this.

Go read post 1279. MTD cannot be scum if they are a mafia goon because it would be way too town sided. It's possible they are a mafia power role fake claiming VT, but that's a far fetched world I don't want us to explore right now.

Just wait and see my plans.

[Fro99er]

You took a jab at Bella.

?

My bad. Thought you were with the whole BBT will be mad at her for killing DRK thing. Defending my friends, that's all...was probably overly sensitive.

[Fro99er]

sometimes this game moves way too slow for my own sanity.

[Fro99er]

MTD doesn't make sense based off balance

confused about this.

Go read post 1279. MTD cannot be scum if they are a mafia goon because it would be way too town sided. It's possible they are a mafia power role fake claiming VT, but that's a far fetched world I don't want us to explore right now.

Well if MTD is scum PR then she probably has no choice but to claim VT cause otherwise it kinda confirms every VT claim in the game since we'd know that scum is in the PR group.

Exactly.

But I don't want to explore that now. ~reasons~

You will see.

[Fro99er]

PAGETOP

[Fro99er]

*\o/*

[Fro99er]

wooly sheep and pom poms for everyone who votes DV!

[Fro99er]

JarJar is town by play. You even said yourself he comes out looking better after the wanderer lynch.

Espe is town for recognizing BBT was trying to trap laladucks. There's no way scum says that to a scumbuddy. NONE. I'd be willing to stake the game on it.

[Fro99er]

There it is...the delayed vote.

How scummy.

Lets not forget you arguing her in to a position of damned if you do, damned if you don't. Then not leaving any room for benefit if the doubt. bc that is a scum minded trap.

This is not scum bussing scum.

[Fro99er]

I want a sheep.

Spoiler: animated gif

4. Animated GIFs - are of the devil, but they are permitted behind spoilers if clearly labelled as such.

Added a spoiler --P

[Fro99er]

God frog, I'm a bit annoyed at jj too at times in here but that's no reason to be so agressive...

I already said my bad, and but I'm always going to be extremely loyal to my friends.

[Fro99er]

this is dumb.

Bella is already confirmed not a mafia goon by the fact that she neighborized me (duh). Thus, there's ZERO chance bella is scum. Otherwise it's too scum sided of a setup. This would be the setup otherwise:

Scum

BBT – Mafia Encryptor
Wanderer – Mafia Goon
Bella – mafia 1-shot neighborizer at worst power, or mafia JOAT as claimed

Town

All Alone – Roleblocker
Lalaladucks – Innocent Child
DV – 1-shot BP
VTs – Espe, Frogger, JarJar, Mollie, Anti, DRK, MTD


Again - that's way too scum sided if Bella is scum, and this game was reviewed for balance by Ether and Quadz, who I have experience with reviewing/backup modding my mini normal. Bella is conftown in my mind.

[Fro99er]

For comparison, my setup was

scum

Goon
Goon
Encryptor

town

ascetic odd night cop
even night gunsmith
jailkeeper
backup rolecop
6 VTs

There's no way there's one less power role for town and one more power role for scum. Encryptor is very strong if used correctly.

If bella is scum then:
scum this game > scum my game
town this game < town my game

there's no way we made town weaker and scum stronger compared to my game and it be balanced. Especially with Ether and Quadz reviewing for balance. Ether reviewed mine, and quadz was my backup mod and defended the setup balance of my game.


Bella is conftown.

[Fro99er]

dude...read my next post.

setup in post 1312 is far more scum sided than setup in post 1313 if 1313 was balanced

[Fro99er]

If bella is scum here then:

scum this game > scum my game
town this game < town my game

that defies balance given my game was reviewed for balance. You cannot make a stronger scum than my game and a weaker town than my game and call it balanced.

[Fro99er]

I assume there's more frog? Something to do w/ Bella's final JOAT action and not purely based on side balance?

Why do you keep rolefishing?

[Fro99er]

Anyway. Bella and I have already determined scum cannot win. So that's good.

[Fro99er]

Conftowns:
lala
bella
frog
espe

probtowns:
jar jar
All Alone

unsure:
MTD
DV

[Fro99er]

look, even if bella's three other shots are fake, then scum of goon, 1 shot neighborizer, encryptor is more powerful than goon, goon, encryptor

and town here would be less powerful than town in my game.

And Ether reviewed both games and I know her thoughts on neighborizers.

[Fro99er]

I'm not willing to out bella's other power(s)

[Fro99er]

power, since i outed 3 other shots. but she said she had 1 shot left anyway.

[Fro99er]

VOTE: jarjar

Sorry, I retract that townread.
That's too blatant of rolefishing for my liking.

If you're town, we win anyway. Just sheep me on DV. I promise.

[Fro99er]

there is ZERO reason we shouldn't be lynching DV. All will be revealed tomorrow, because both bella and I cannot be dead by tomorrow.

[Fro99er]

A thumbs up from Frog would suffice for me.

I've already given my thumbs up.

[Fro99er]

if he's town then me tomorrow

I never said you tomorrow.

That's a blatant lie.

[Fro99er]

Also yes, I trust you that youre town. No, I am not sure I trust your gamesense.

Then you are being anti-town. Plain and simple.

It doesn't really matter in the end. Town is going to win.

[Fro99er]

Bella and I have very much been talking behind the scenes and we have this figured out. I promise. I'm conftown. I would not sabotage town.

[Fro99er]

that said, fine, I will trust you on that and blame you afterwards.

Blame me for what?

[Fro99er]

also youre pretty damn arrogant and I don't like that.

I'm arrogant because I have more information than anyone except Bella, but I'm controlling bella too because all will be revealed soon enough.

Bella did well to trust me.

[Fro99er]

Sure there is. It's my only way to convince you of my confidence in this plan.

[Fro99er]

Bella can conftown upon day start tomorrow (as soon as she gets a couple posts in, she will reveal all)

All Alone should roleblock me. All Alone – if you are town you MUST roleblock me. If you are scum you will roleblock someone else. If you don't roleblock at all, I will know that too. But not for the reasons it looks like.

I will likely be dead tomorrow, which is ok. If I'm alive tomorrow, even better.

If bella is not conftown tomorrow after she’s had several posts to explain, lynch her. However, I'm am 99% positive she will conftown tomorrow.

If she does conftown (it will become obvious after a few posts), she will leave instructions for the rest of the game tomorrow. Bella and I have night chat, so I will lay out detailed instructions for her. I trust her, I really do.

[Fro99er]

No, gods no, trying to convince me does not mean being an ass is ok and great...

Fine. I apologize.

[Fro99er]

Sorry DV if you are town. But this is all part of the plan:

[Fro99er]

Yes, I will be the NK. If not, this is very good for us because then I can explain everything in full tomorrow as conftown instead of Bella

[Fro99er]

Why not?

[Fro99er]

UNVOTE:

Sorry guys I have a better plan. It should include town

[Fro99er]

Bella has a vig shot left.

We were going to lynch DV and have Bella vig MTD. But I am afraid the VT claim is fake and there may be a hidden power that MTD has which would be the only thing that could foil the plan.

So either DV is scum or MTD/JarJar are fake claiming VT

[Fro99er]

In the neighborhood PT she also said she'd sheep me D2. The only hint of that I see is her saying she's d vote ducky with me

I thought she neighbourized you N3 though?

@dv: how do we know AA is town?

He's the main reason why BBT was lynched. Also really unnecessary early claim if he's scum. All the claim switching is also something that would only bring upon suspicion of him and scum won't like that, while it seemed to work pretty well for town. Only reservation is the DRK kill because I'm not sure if scum would have believed All Alone's new role claim.

Yes, she neighbored me night three

[Fro99er]

There is nothing inconsistent I said there. Today, day three, she said she mentioned in the main thread on day two that she would sheep me

[Fro99er]

DV being a one-shot bulletproof also makes sense with a Bella vigilante shot left

[Fro99er]

The thing is, we cannot Lynch MTD and Visual anti-shoot TV because DV is bulletproof

[Fro99er]

So that is why we chose to go the other way around

[Fro99er]

Visual anti-equals vigilante on auto correct

[Fro99er]

Espe is not scum

[Fro99er]

We would've had you MTD all alone and JJ as the four kills the rest of us are conftown

[Fro99er]

VOTE: DV

[Fro99er]

UNVOTE:

yes?

You seem so excited to abort the plan

[Fro99er]

VOTE: MTD

[Fro99er]

Would much rather lynch DV and vig MTD.

But just afraid MTD has a power that would stop the vig.

This way Bella has to vig someone like JarJar or Espe if MTD flips town

[Fro99er]

VOTE: MTD

happy about this. much more likely to be scum than DV IMO

Funny because your order was DRK Bella DV yesterday

[Fro99er]

Jar Jar why are you still questioning Bella?

[Fro99er]

Cause I think she's scum. I've never stopped thinking she was scum. I only unvoted cause u said to trust u cause she could conftown.

Her vigging would conftown her.

[Fro99er]

You thinking she is scum is terrible. She's town by setup spec and by role.

[Fro99er]

how does Goon/JOAT/Encyrptor balance a bunch of VTs a 1-shot BP, a roleblocker, and an IC? That's far too scumsided. Unless you think bella is lying about her shots. But she obviously has a neighborizer, which is far too scumsided anyway. I know Ether's thoughts on a scum neighborizer because I tried to make one and she was like HECK NO.

[Fro99er]

like, there is no fucking way bella is scum. NONE

[Fro99er]

her actions were fine. They all make sense. Copping me made sense. Neighborizing me made sense. Saving her vig makes sense.

Setup spec confirms her as town.

[Fro99er]

Neighborizer is so powerful as scum because a neighborizer has NEVER been lynched in a mini or large normal game. NEVER. That's far too powerful to give to scum. Go see for yourself: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=29549

This is what Ether said to me about a neighborizer:
"I don't think the neighborizer is a good idea. Its role is confirmable and it might just be taken as town, and if so, the bloc it could potentially form with other power roles could get dangerous fast."

So Bella is not a neighborizer alone, that means she's a JOAT. And if she's a JOAT then that's far too powerful for scum (goon/JOAT/encryptor) to balance a 1 shot BP, a roleblocker, and an IC.

Bella is conftown. I'd be willing to bet the game on it.

[Fro99er]

god youre like a broken record

die scum

[Fro99er]

someone just hammer MTD please

[Fro99er]

Now, there is a chance DV is scum.

Goon/Encryptor/1-shot BP does balance roleblocker, IC, 4 shot JOAT with one of the shots being a vig. A vig and a scum BP make sense together. That's why I wanted to go DV first and vig MTD. If we go MTD and they magically somehow flip town, then we cannot vig DV because it won't go through.

[Fro99er]

Although it coudl be a touch scum sided, which is why I think it's possible MTD is just a goon and DV is town. It' could go either way there.

Based on play alone, I believe MTD is scum. I was just trying to set us up for a guaranteed win.

[Fro99er]

I should apologize though. I had the game worked out, but it's hard to see from everyone else's perspective sometimes when you have more information than them. It's not your guys fault you couldn't see what I was thinking, so I'm sorry for being bossy.

[Fro99er]

I was just trying to be a town leader, because too often I see town stumble without direction.

[Fro99er]

god youre like a broken record

die scum

<3 u 2

Care to scumhunt yet?

[Fro99er]

Like why would scum EVER truthfully claim BP?

I've seen it before. And scum won too.

[Fro99er]

outside chance is frogscum.

Sorry dude. I'm conftown.

Either bella is scum, or bella is town and she investigated me and got a "town" result.

It's like you aren't even trying.

[Fro99er]

pedit: see espe, nvm.

[Fro99er]

re bella: It doesn't matter.
As in, we shouldn't lynch her today and tomorrow if there was vig she's conftown, if not she gets lynched.

so you're saying she could be a scum neighborizer?

Wrong answer.

[Fro99er]

Gonna play some MC Hammer on the way home

"Hammer time!"

[Fro99er]

If bella is not conftown tomorrow after she’s had several posts to explain, lynch her. However, I'm am 99% positive she will conftown tomorrow.

If she does conftown (it will become obvious after a few posts), she will leave instructions for the rest of the game tomorrow. Bella and I have night chat, so I will lay out detailed instructions for her. I trust her, I really do.

What's your point?

I decided she's conftown since.

[Fro99er]

SOMEONE HAMMER THIS MTD PERSON

[Fro99er]

Wooly sheep as a reward

[Fro99er]

Do you like wooly sheep?

[Fro99er]

Yes now hammarrrrr

[Fro99er]

I owe you sheep

[Fro99er]

Stop light!

[Fro99er]

Go light

[Fro99er]

Ribbit

[Fro99er]

MTD you scum?

[Fro99er]

Flip

[Fro99er]

Flop

[Fro99er]

sweet potato

[Fro99er]

We'll see. I need to talk with Bella and take a step back if you flip town

[Fro99er]

I will read lots of ISOs

[Fro99er]

Sorry MTD if you are town

[Fro99er]

I'm impatient. I want flips

[Fro99er]

Yeah. I hope MTD is scum and this is over. I reeeeaaaalllllyyy don't think Espe is, but I'll reread that ISO again

[Fro99er]

Maybe. I didn't want to out her vig shot because now scum can no kill and frame her

[Fro99er]

That's why I had a grand plan that would have ensured town won. But everyone was making me feel guilty for not sharing

[Fro99er]

I didn't until she told me. Call me dumb if you will.

But that means she's town if we assume she has a vig.

[Fro99er]

I know.

[Fro99er]

I was hoping to catch Plotty Plot mod before bed.

[Fro99er]

MTD if we vig JarJar and he flips town, what next?

[Fro99er]

No, that doesn't buy us a free lynch

[Fro99er]

If she vigges and scum no kills, that's like a regular 1 kill night. No extra lynches

[Fro99er]

If Bella is scum I'm going to cry

[Fro99er]

lol

Lololoducks?

[Fro99er]

Oh thank god

[Fro99er]

Sorry BBT. <3

I knew you were scum from the way you reacted differently from frog mafia when the no kill happened. When you pushed me, I self-meta'd on purpose because it's like a 1-shot scumtell when someone calls me out for it. I'll never be able to use it on you again because it's 1-shot

Sorry town I was bossy at the end. I just had more information than anyone. The plan was lynch DV, Bella vig'd MTD, lynch all alone/JarJar the last two day phases. I'm picked up a super strong post-flip associative tell which cleared Espe so I only had 2 people to super worry about (DV and MTD) and two backups in case somehow it wasn't DV or MTD.

Bella played her role fantastically. It all made sense after she Neighborized me. Ducky played her role fantastically. DV played his role fantastically after reading the dead thread. And All Alone was brilliant. Jar Jar was really obvtown but I only included him in the most likely town but not conftown list in case something went really wrong.

Scum could have chosen NK's better but they tried really hard and fought hard the whole time.

Also - Mollie - <3 I'm sorry for mislynching you D1. I felt awful after you flipped. It was a very incorrect gut read of mine.

[Fro99er]

also for them plan to work I needed All Alone to not roleblock Bella so the second kill could go through so I wanted him to roleblock me.

[Fro99er]

And I was trying to draw the NK by saying if scum left me alive they'd be dead. We really did have an elaborate plan.

The only way it wasn't foolproof was if somehow MTD had a 1-shot BP or something which made me nervous.

[Fro99er]

Except you weren't because nobody (except MTD) would listen to me about you

[Fro99er]

Also. I thought the mod played well to. Especially that dead thread vig shot on me.

<3

Thanks for running the game Plotty Plot!

[Fro99er]

And the neighbor thread!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Fro99er]

WOOLY SHEEP FOR ALL

[Fro99er]

Like, I cannot state how well bella played her role.

She got an inno on me, intentionally had bad reads (which is why she was "worried" about me despite an inno on me) to stay alive so she could use her last two powers, Neighborized someone she knew could trust her, and saved her most powerful trait for the end

<3

[Fro99er]

I knew lala was town from bees

[Fro99er]

Yeah, I remembered you saying that and was going to quote it before I fell asleep.