Blitz 1: C9++ (GAME OVER!)

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I'm leaving the office now, children. Play nice.

[Painbringer]

There's nothing in his ISO to analyze. That's my point. Your response is nothing more than a ginormous handwave with a lot of words. Typing out a response isn't scumhunting.

I have made conclusions. Blocky has done nothing but lurk and avoid the thread. I went through his entire ISO showing the point. Blocky merely not being present isn't sufficient. His dodging of providing any substance.

I went through his entire ISO to prove the point. Why are you town reading him?

[Titus]

There's nothing in his ISO to analyze. That's my point. Your response is nothing more than a ginormous handwave with a lot of words. Typing out a response isn't scumhunting.

I have made conclusions. Blocky has done nothing but lurk and avoid the thread. I went through his entire ISO showing the point. Blocky merely not being present isn't sufficient. His dodging of providing any substance.

I went through his entire ISO to prove the point. Why are you town reading him?

Was me.

[Vedith]

We're not a hydra Vedith.

P.S. Blocky lurking has been noted.

[Persivul]

That's really really bad... why would you vote for a wagon you think is bad? I don't understand.

Because it's hilarious to watch you now say it's bad.

So, are you scum white knighting? Or do you agree that it makes sense for town to point out when they think an L-1 wagon is bad?

[Ranger]

ranger or whoever you are, I'm a bit flabberghasted by that. I don't understand how anyone could confbias off one greeting post and then consider any of Persivul's arguments to have "come out on top".

It will help you to know on my home site, RVS is a big deal. It lasts most of D1, and continues to be scrutinized--every single post of it--for the entire game. It's never rendered irrelevant. So, yes. One post of yours, I scumread. Your posting since then has not changed the read. I'd be lying if I said it really strengthened the scumread, but it certainly hasn't weakened.

As for Persivul: I feel your attacks are on shaky grounds at best, and he is defending himself adequately against them. He seems reasonable. You don't.

And why aren't you voting me then?

Only have one vote, silly. :P I have five suspects; I'm not a quintuple-voter.

[Titus]

That's really really bad... why would you vote for a wagon you think is bad? I don't understand.

Because it's hilarious to watch you now say it's bad.

So, are you scum white knighting? Or do you agree that it makes sense for town to point out when they think an L-1 wagon is bad?

Like this post by Persivul. Your window is closing ETL.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

That's really really bad... why would you vote for a wagon you think is bad? I don't understand.

Because it's hilarious to watch you now say it's bad.

So, are you scum white knighting? Or do you agree that it makes sense for town to point out when they think an L-1 wagon is bad?

How is it that you still don't get the difference between "I'm not voting that person because I don't think he's scum" and "I'm not voting that person because other people are voting that person"?

Like.. my entire disagreement with you is that your sole argument against people voting for Blocky is that there is a wagon on Blocky. Not because you think he's town, or because you have a really solid case on someone else - simply because there is a wagon on him.

Then you go and vote him and backpedal saying "Oh I just did that to show you that it is bad."

lol.... ok.

p-edit: Ok. Sure. I'm sure you will catch many scums that way.

p-edit: titus, what?

[Titus]

Your argument seems overly nitpicky. If you hate Persivul's (the people on the wagon are scummy) why not have him talk more? Sure I think Persivul is being an idiot ATM but not a scummy one.

His turn on you is good as well.

[Ranger]

Here, I'll make it easy for you:

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Blocky

Okay.

I see the Persivul suspicion

now

.
I think it's a bad-bus-vote, meant to get attention off of either himself or Blocky, but in either case, I still think we should lynch Blocky.

[Titus]

Still think we should vote Blocky and I like Persivul's vote. If we lynch Blocky, I will reflect on it though.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Your argument seems overly nitpicky. If you hate Persivul's (the people on the wagon are scummy) why not have him talk more? Sure I think Persivul is being an idiot ATM but not a scummy one.

His turn on you is good as well.

His "turn"? You've got to be kidding me Titus...

*sigh*

I feel like you aren't really reading the posts and just want to push your thing on Blocky. It's really stretching and I get that if you're town you want to push it through to see if you are right, but I don't see it and I explained why.

Persivul's posts are increasingly bad, and I'm quite disappointed with people's inability to even digest the argument.

I'm gonna give this game 24 hours but I'm starting to regret continuing with this playerlist against my better judgement.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Ranger, if Blocky is town, what does that make you think of Pers?
What if Blocky is scum?

[Titus]

ETL, This is pretty much what you said about TheAmateur right? In the Street Racers where we were both town?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I don't remember.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

What did I say about Amateur?

Also this argument is making me doubt my read on you.

[Ranger]

Ranger, if Blocky is town, what does that make you think of Pers?

Won't change my opinion. My reads form independently from one another. (Bad stuff happens otherwise.) Interactions augmenting my observations are just a bonus. I think BlockyMan is scum.
I think Persivul's vote was bad, maybe scum-bad.
I still don't have a townread on you.

BlockyMan flipping town or flipping scum doesn't change my stance on either you or Persivul. Persivul's alignment wouldn't change my stance on you or BlockyMan. And yours doesn't change my opinion on them, either.

My BlockyMan scumread is stronger than any Persivul suspicion, though, and there's a strong wagon already present, so he is the player that I am pursuing.

[Marge]

Your argument seems overly nitpicky. If you hate Persivul's (the people on the wagon are scummy) why not have him talk more? Sure I think Persivul is being an idiot ATM but not a scummy one.

His turn on you is good as well.

His "turn"? You've got to be kidding me Titus...

*sigh*

I feel like you aren't really reading the posts and just want to push your thing on Blocky. It's really stretching and I get that if you're town you want to push it through to see if you are right, but I don't see it and I explained why.

Persivul's posts are increasingly bad, and I'm quite disappointed with people's inability to even digest the argument.

I'm gonna give this game 24 hours but I'm starting to regret continuing with this playerlist against my better judgement.

Banging you head against a wall does seem to have more appeal then this game.
I was slightly scum reading persivul mostly because his whole scum read is based on something he did as town.
That logic makes about as much sense as:

Spoiler:

Vote: persivul

[EspeciallyTheLies]

BlockyMan flipping town or flipping scum doesn't change my stance on either you or Persivul. Persivul's alignment wouldn't change my stance on you or BlockyMan. And yours doesn't change my opinion on them, either.

So you don't evaluate pushes after you get a flip based on the flip?

Ok.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I really am leaving now though, so goodnight.

[Persivul]

Ranger, if Blocky is town, what does that make you think of Pers?

Won't change my opinion. My reads form independently from one another. (Bad stuff happens otherwise.) Interactions augmenting my observations are just a bonus. I think BlockyMan is scum.
I think Persivul's vote was bad, maybe scum-bad.
I still don't have a townread on you.

BlockyMan flipping town or flipping scum doesn't change my stance on either you or Persivul. Persivul's alignment wouldn't change my stance on you or BlockyMan. And yours doesn't change my opinion on them, either.

My BlockyMan scumread is stronger than any Persivul suspicion, though, and there's a strong wagon already present, so he is the player that I am pursuing.

For the record, I voted Blocky for two reasons:

1. Show ETL's hypocrisy and the hollowness of his argument against me. I was confident he wouldn't vote Blocky.

2. If Blocky does get lynched, at this point I think we'll get decent information from the flip, and I'll likely be vindicated, except of course for wifom charges.

[Marge]

Spoiler: Blocky ISO

2nd blist post by a player. VOTE: Titus for stealing first.

I mean blitz lol

Hey. First blitz post totally appropriate for Titus.

VOTE: OceanWind

Hi noob.

WHY YOU NINJA ME
and first quote lol im awesome

Sorry, I was offline. I have read up.

Naw, I was watching football games. Anyway RVS has pretty much ended UNVOTE: Titus

Yeah, and two people already RVS'ed me.

GG NO RE

Am I allow to go offline to watch football games? VOTE: Titus Titus has gotten awfully scummy.

PEDIT: I dont think Titus is town.

Personally, I think ranger has been buddying a lot, and I do feel like Marge, Ranger, and Titus are likely scum. In the meantime I claim VT.

Marge, your acting a little weird there.

Marge still has an RVS vote on me.

PEDIT: I don't know, he has been buddying people, and I read buddying as scummy.

PEDIT 2: Pretty much the same reasons everyone else has.

Titus was saying I "lurked" And was voting me because I want offline for 3 hours to watch football games. He called me out for lurking after 15 minutes.
Also the massclaim seemed like scum trying to find power roles.

PEDIT FLUBBER: Im at L-1, and I would like someone else to vote Ranger before I vote him.

Cause I went offline to watch football and Titus started a bandwagon claiming i was lurking

You want hand holding. Ok?

5-7 RVS. Vanishes "to watch football" at the first sign of pressure.

titus... c'mon now. If this was a valid argument, why didn't ANYONE vote me the entire time I was gone?

57-59 he's read up and removes his RVS vote, implying he thinks I'm town. (If he thought otherwise, he'd defend his RVS vote).

Is this a point? I don't understand what this is doing here. It is IIoA.

62-66, Trolling and RVS. No real reads despite having read.

No I disagree. He was responding to people.

143, jumps me as his counter wagon and objects to my push.

So? What is scummy about that?

He says nothing about the massclaim or any substantive discussion (which is my true gripe he strawmans).

Again... so? What is scummy about that? This is missing conclusions. I didn't ask for hand holding, Titus. I asked you to state your case, which you are not doing here. I'm not particularly interested in Blocky because I don't feel strongly about him at all. You asked if I'd help you and honestly the answer is no at this point because I don't see the case.

194, Spurious empty "buddying" accusation against Ranger plus me and marge are his other scumreads. He never supports this or does anything to solve anyone's alignment.

Eh. Ok so he makes an accusation. That's good. Your issue is that he didn't follow up on it, is that correct?

196, Vague weird assertion.

200, Whines about Marge's vote. Doesn't explain his Ranger scumread. Agrees with everyone else.

He does explain his read, he said he feels that buddying is scummy. I could see a case for parroting reads as being scummy but not in the way it was delivered here.

209-212, Protect me from the big bad Titus.

Where does he say that? Someone asked why he didn't like you and he answered. In his ISO he was gone for 3 hours, and I agree, that was the only reasoning I could find at that time for that wagon, so he's not wrong. I don't see the case here.

There's zero scumhunting here. No questions. No attempts to persuade people. He's afraid to take any sort of risk on his scumreads. He's stalled any sort of engagement.

I don't really agree with this because he's made accusations and given his thoughts, and responded to questioning.

A lot of this is unnecessary PBPA and IIoA, Titus. I'm sure you know how I respond to that kind of stuff. I wanted a general overview of your case with key quotes and you gave me his entire damn ISO as if I haven't already read it and the context it came in. I appreciate your effort and thoughts on the posts but you have neglected to make any real conclusions, other than saying "Blocky did this in this post". Do you understand my issue with this "case"? It doesn't really exist beyond one or two points. I think it's a real stretch on your part.

I've had my fill for this game today.

[Flubbernugget]

Those of you who aren't voting Persivul need to explain to me why not in a way that doesn't involve "Blocky is better" because he's not. He's a meh lynch. His ISO isn't fantastic but it isn't super scummy either, like Persivul's is. I've pointed out several things wrong here. He hedged on Titus, which I could see as her way of gaining reactions, especially given her call for a wagon on herself off the jump. And understand that it wasn't the idea of mass claim that he hedged on - it was hedging on what he thought it meant about her alignment. "I'm not saying you are or aren't scummy for this... blah blah blah". It's literally disgusting.

Second, he claims that Marge is a better lynch but has literally done nothing at all to further or develop that read, or any other read whatsoever.

And when asked about his read on Blocky, his best answer is "the wagon is bad because votes and my read has dropped." Ok.. what?

When pushed he comes up with some ridiculous non-sequiter to run after in an effort to derail the questioning of him and shift the focus. It is literally nonsense to ask a player why he should vote someone the other person isn't scumreading or pushing.

Come on.

p-edit: posts that I will read.

I've already said that waffling on Titus d1 isn't a scum tell

And I'm not keen on sheeping someone that's questioning the massclaim while participating in it

[Flubbernugget]

Totally willing to theory chime.

I just wanted someone to go over the setup with me as I've never played it and the wiki entry is overwhelming.

Spoiler: Massive Theory

Well this will help me explain why massclaim is good so win win.

At the start of the game, the mod rolls 7 percentage dies. These correspond to the various PRs in the game and VTs.

1-50 = T (Townie)
51-65 = C (Cop)
66-75 = D (Doctor)
76-85 = V (Vigilante)
86-95 = M (Mason)
96-100 = B (Blocker)

The number of Ts directly influences how many scum are in the game. There is only one group scum and 50/50 odds of a serial killer.

Each role necessitates how many letters are in the setup. For instance, masons require at least 2 Ms. A full cop requires two Cs. We can eliminate any setup with one or thee Ms as the mod did not confirm an innocent child at the start of the day.

By structuring a mass claim day 1, we can either confirm all the PRs as town or force scum into some hard kill situations, particularly if we don't know about an SK. Neither do scum.

First PR or VT.
If we get a too many letters scenario (eight PRs), we know there must be scum in the PRs pool).
Then we go to number of letters. Full cops would claim dual letters, same with a one shot doctor (as a one shot doctor cannot exist without a full doctor).
Then, we claim the actual letters. Anyone dual letter claiming without a letter underneath is autoscum.

We also know the setup within a handful of possibilities, dependent on actual claims.

Okay first off why was this not the first post you made about massclaim

Second off I'm not lynching through the pr pool to get one fakeclaiming scum

[Ranger]

So you don't evaluate pushes after you get a flip based on the flip?

Not based off of the flip in of itself, no. A player flipping town or scum does not magically make this player that had an interaction with them town or scum.

Of course I will read the push. Of course I will re-evaluate my read given the information from the flip. But I do so by analyzing, not assuming.