Newbie 1671 - Game Over (Scum win)

[tictac]

Nobody but Kuroi & pig should vote yet thou.

@camn & frank: Reads on Kuroi & pig?

@Kuroi & pig: reads on camn & frank?

@pig Your read on Kuroi?

[KuroiXHF]

..okay.
I am fine with this.
Really unlikely that I am wrong about both Kuroi & pig and this should simplify day3 significantly.

@Kuroi
What frank means is that if both you & pig are town, scum can quickly pile on 2 more votes and win. So you come off really certain doing this so soon.
On the plus side, if pig isn't hammered in 24 hours, everyone will know with 100% certainty that there is at least one scum in [pig, kuroi]

I wouldn't say 100%, but yeah. I see your point. UNVOTE: Pignash I'm actually in the middle of a meta on him. I've gone through three games and found similar behavior as well as the non-helpful scum hunt that corroborated his claim. The issue, however, is that he was town in all three of those games. I'm going to keep looking and hopefully find a game where he's scum so I can contrast how he acts differently.

Nobody but Kuroi & pig should vote yet thou.

Why? Because of activity? If that's the case, it's mostly you and I... and perhaps Camn too.[/quote]

@Kuroi & pig: reads on camn & frank?

I know you found my gut feeling of one passive and one active scum to be BS. I'm not holding out too much at that because the order of scum to town in my opinion right now is pignash, franksa, camn and then you. ...Unless you're asking about Franksa and Camn as a team, in which I haven't read anything on that, except for your blurb.

[tictac]

@Kuroi
Did your previous games somehow not have LYLO?
Cause I am really having trouble understanding this behaviour.

[tictac]

I wouldn't say 100%, but yeah. I see your point.

You didn't.

Nobody but Kuroi & pig should vote yet thou.

Why? Because of activity? If that's the case, it's mostly you and I... and perhaps Camn too.

I was fine with the vote because only way to insta-lose is if it's camn-frank and that is a low probability team. Risk was well worth narrowing the lynch pool to 2 candidates.(you & pig)
Kinda regretting giving the advice now.

Didn't want others to vote cause it isn't time to lynch yet.

@Kuroi & pig: reads on camn & frank?

I know you found my gut feeling of one passive and one active scum to be BS. I'm not holding out too much at that because the order of scum to town in my opinion right now is pignash, franksa, camn and then you. ...Unless you're asking about Franksa and Camn as a team, in which I haven't read anything on that, except for your blurb.

Fine. The reason for the question doesn't apply anymore.

[tictac]

I'm actually in the middle of a meta on him.

Why in the holy hell would you doing meta

after

you voted him on fucking LYLO??
I think that is just a reason you gave so you could back out of the vote semi-gracefully.

[KuroiXHF]

I didn't think the vote would pile on so quickly, to which you explained just today.

Can't tell if you're getting agitated because of today's situation or because you're trying to put me in a vulnerable position.

[Jackal711]

VOTE COUNT 3.1

camn (0) -
tictac (0) -
KuroiXHF (0) -
franksa (0) -
pignash (0) -

Not Voting: camn, franksa, pignash, KuroiXHF, tictac

With 5 alive, it's 3 to lynch.

Day 3 deadline is Friday, January 29th 2016 at 12:00 pm PST or in (expired on 2016-01-29 12:00:00)

[tictac]

@camn, franksa
I'm pretty sure at least one of you is town.

Can you see a possible town motivation for acting like Kuroi did? Cause I sure can't.
I could have bought him being sufficiently certain(at a strech), but he just demonstrated that he wasn't.

Am I assuming too much competence from Kuroi? I don't think I am. He does have more than a few games of exp.
Plot was townreading him for some weird reason so I may have a blindspot?

pedit:
@Kuroi I explained in

708

.
Please answer: Did your previous games have LYLO?

[tictac]

ugh 708

[KuroiXHF]

...all games have lylo. Mafia's intention is obviously to equal town's number.

[camn]

Hey. Just coming off a double.... Will read tomorrow. But briefly, tictac...I'm with you on Kuroi. I'm all for using your vote freely.....except in endgame. Only vote if you are sure. And then, why ever unvote? Unless you are gambiting somehow.

I'll read up tomorrow.

[franksa]

Can you see a possible town motivation for acting like Kuroi did? Cause I sure can't.

I can only see 2 possibilities.

1. Pignash was scummy hammering early yesterday. We dont need much push to vote him today, so if a scumKuroi votes him and the mafia doesnt jump on him too to win the game that would give us the little push we need to vote for Pignash today.

2. Kuroi is a lot less competent player than I thought, He actually doesnt understand LYLO (even I do, I have only read 1 game on this site before this game.) so he voted Pignash, the mafia didnt hammer, so... Pignash is one of them.

The 2. is what Kuroi trying to make us believe. The thing is, he has done it earlier in this game. Asking about RVS, not knowing how the matrix for the PRs work, mentioning the cop making us assume he is the cop (but then he didnt get killed for it!) and now not understanding LYLO. Based on his posts I would say Kuroi is a smart guy. I simply cant buy that with a couple of games experience he doesnt know all these things. I dont know... maybe he is trying to play the newbie card or the dumb card if there is such a thing. But overall, he is the first on my list. And if Kuroi is scum then Pignash is not scum, that would mean my other scumread is right too: camn. I support the Kuroi/camn scumteam.

[camn]

franska- I think you might be right about Kuroi playing a little dumb.
But I'm not totally convinced that kuroiscum means pignash town.
If Kuroi-scum knows that pignash is also scum, he knows that is was not risky AT ALL (from a mafia quickhammer perspective) to put a vote down so early... so he is a little quicker to do it. And if we had juped on it, and lynched pignash- it would grab him mad townpoints if pignash is scum. Of course, its a win for him if pignash is town.... so meh.

Either way, even now in the cold light of day- Kuroi voting early in LYLO has more scum motivation than town.

[KuroiXHF]

My motivation was pignash was playing such a bad move by stating that, "Oh. Disregard everything I ever said. I'm just bad at this game." I look to his signature and find "Oh wait - I just happened to have won seven games, but lost three of them."

Does that not ring a OMGYS bell in your head?

I already explained lylo.

[franksa]

@camn I actually like your reasoning here, you are right on this, Pignash can be town even if Kuroi is scum. Kuroi can be a sacrifice to win the game ultimately. Him and pignash was already a suspect so they had to do something to wash one of them clear. Is this called bussing? To help town kill his buddy to gain their trust? Anyway, its still clear that Kuroi is scum, we can think about the rest if we live until tomorrow...

@Kuroi I simply cant believe that you dont get what the problem is. I think you are playing.

I have an intent to vote on Kuroi

. We can talk about the 2nd scum a bit more, but I feel safe voting Kuroi now.

[camn]

Yep, that's bussing.

I agree with franska.

Tictac? Pignash?

[franksa]

Sorry, what I meant is: *Pignash can be scum even if Kuroi is scum too.

[tictac]

Yeah.
I've been thinking about this, and I still don't see how he could be town.

I think the partner is very probably pig.

@frank Do hold the vote for a few days. We aren't in a hurry.

[KuroiXHF]

@camn I actually like your reasoning here, you are right on this, Pignash can be town even if Kuroi is scum. Kuroi can be a sacrifice to win the game ultimately. Him and pignash was already a suspect so they had to do something to wash one of them clear. Is this called bussing? To help town kill his buddy to gain their trust? Anyway, its still clear that Kuroi is scum, we can think about the rest if we live until tomorrow...

@Kuroi I simply cant believe that you dont get what the problem is. I think you are playing.

I have an intent to vote on Kuroi

. We can talk about the 2nd scum a bit more, but I feel safe voting Kuroi now.

I actually like how you're using your brain, although it very well is a moment of opportunism. I saw what the problem was. I voted when two people could vote on. Although I feel my vote on pignash could be premature, I don't see the problem when I took it off...

Or would you rather me keep on a vote that everyone seems to be against?

[camn]

3 options, as I see it. Maybe 4.

1- townie makes premature vote despite knowing full well it is LYLO and knowing what that means.

2- scum voting his scumbuddy... Hoping townies pile on, yay scumlynch, easy mislynch tomorrow.

3- scum votes townie, hoping townies pile in, yay mislynch scum win.

Or I guess...
4- clueless scum plants random assed vote, realized the error, recants, and is now flailing.


Am I missing any options here?

[KuroiXHF]

flail
/fleɪl/
noun
1.
an implement used for threshing grain, consisting of a wooden handle with a free-swinging metal or wooden bar attached to it
2.
a weapon so shaped used in the Middle Ages
verb
3.
(transitive) to beat or thrash with or as if with a flail
4.
to move or be moved like a flail; thresh about: with arms flailing

Definition #4 I take it. I'm asking a question looking for an answer. It's quite a stretch to show my transparent thought process and look to it as flailing. I might put my vote back on, although I'm not done with his meta. I have found, however, that he is a bit more deep in thought and active as scum. In games where he's innocent, he is barely there. I'm trying to see, once I finish, how his activity matches up to the activity in this game.

[franksa]

Kuroi, you are not even trying to explain what you did. You are very ignorant and going on with your thought without expressing any worry about where the game is going. We are at LYLO, the last chance for the town. And yet, you seem perfectly calm. A townKuroi would be panicking and also he would try to defend himself with everything as he would KNOW, that a lynch on him loses the town the game. I cant get this feeling looking at your recent posts which empowers my idea that you are the sacrifice the mafia has agreed to take. You dont care if you are out today, you were prepared for that.

I would really like to hear Pignash's thoughts on this matter.

[KuroiXHF]

Kuroi, you are not even trying to explain what you did.

I did explain it. What is confusing to you? I have no problem clarifying anything.

You are very ignorant

Careful. I don't accept personal attacks.

We are at LYLO, the last chance for the town. And yet, you seem perfectly calm. A townKuroi would be panicking and also he would try to defend himself with everything as he would KNOW, that a lynch on him loses the town the game.

I understand the situation. This doesn't mean that I lose my cool. I actually would advocate the opposite. The mafia should be the ones to be desperate. They are so close to a victory, yet it's the time when the pressure would cause them to buckle. So again, how is me being calm a negative when it's a scum-trait to buckle under pressure (such as being intended to vote by the players at lylo?)

I cant get this feeling looking at your recent posts which empowers my idea that you are the sacrifice the mafia has agreed to take. You dont care if you are out today, you were prepared for that.

The probability is really in that favor, isn't it?

I would really like to hear Pignash's thoughts on this matter.

I voted him. How do you think he'll react?

[tictac]

bit more deep in thought and active as scum. In games where he's innocent, he is barely there. I'm trying to see, once I finish, how his activity matches up to the activity in this game.

You mean like in 1665 where he won as scum and made a total of 10 posts during days 2 & 3?

Please link an active non-blitz scum-game from him.

[franksa]

I am sorry, I didnt want to attack you personally, I just wanted to point to your behaviour under these circumstances.

How do you think he'll react?