Mini 1748: ClownTardis Mafia - GAME OVER!

[Plottin Kittehs]

Ugh.

I'm hating this Kuroi v Aero thing. I mean I kind of wish that Kurio CC'd Persi D1 because this would make things more simpler than they are. :\

Also I agree with BRO. I'm not going to vote Aero or Kurio based on the two roles in the same setup since Ffery did have two BG's in another game.

This game right now.

T_T

~M

[Aristophanes]

All I know is that you tried to do something N2 and we're blocked. All it confirms is that you had an action and that you aren't the one who make that kill.

For now, you're off the hook though.

I asked the person who I investigated and that he confirmed he blocked me. I don't know how that wouldn't be a confirmation that I had an action, when the person who blocked me admitted it - unless you're suggesting we're both scum covering each other.

I literally said it confirms you have a role, just not what it is. Nice reading though.

Oh shit VOTE: Ari

Thought you had crumbed something that was explicitly "not 8th doc" which would have basically made you scum.

Sorry, explain?
I forgot the 8th Doc was even a public thing until it was brought up and had to recheck what it was.
I don't believe I crumbed anything this game.

Why does not being the 8th make me scum anyway?

[Aristophanes]

I just realized more than half the players left have claimed. Should we finish off this as a mass claim?
It may help us sort out the finer details.

[Adaptive Heap]

To be quite honest probably the only thing saving us from guaranteed loss is hope or wifom of some kind of protect on our slot.
RIP Rob </3

I felt like we had to claim today so there wasn't risk of counterclaim (as in - if we're counterclaimed today that's a free scum lynch, so it doesn't happen) and also so that a protect if any *would* come our way.

That said I guess it's up to whoever the remaining PRs are.

---

Ugh.

I'm hating this Kuroi v Aero thing. I mean I kind of wish that Kurio CC'd Persi D1 because this would make things more simpler than they are. :\

Also I agree with BRO. I'm not going to vote Aero or Kurio based on the two roles in the same setup since Ffery did have two BG's in another game.

This game right now.

T_T

~M

Griping about the game isn't helping us win it.
I agree Aero/Kuroi *probably* get a pass for today but we have to decide who to lynch, and I think we really have to look at today as LYLO/MYLO.

Anyway I probably can't criticize lack of detailed re-reading but will get up to it.
(I've been mostly drunk for the last week - oops.)

What's your current read on BRO?

Two naked votes on NM out of the gates the last two days and then somehow manages to switch that back to a vote on us?
Gut is that's something I'm going to need to look back over.

-t

[Plottin Kittehs]

We knew the 8th doctor was either you or Aristo. When you said you had results, we thought that meant Aristo was the 8th doctor because the 8th doctor doesn't have night actions, but what you said makes sense now. Glad that's sorted.

Bro

is town. Mala and him have history together. Naked votes aren't scummy.

We think scum is

aristo

and one of [

notmaf

,

kuroi

], probably

notmaf

.

Kuroi

's been roleblocked and probablyjailkept so he couldn't have done the kill on night 2 or night 3 which buys him a free pass for today in spite of how little scumhunting he's been doing. I'm not happy with his contributions to the thread or lack thereof but unless he's also a strongman, he hasn't done the nightkill, and Davsto's role PM indicates a two man team.

Persivul

was terrible but I agree with Bro that

Aeronaut

not realising that Persi was one of his predecessors was probably a townslip.

It is still weird to me that

Notmaf/Kuroi

crumbed masons together. Like kuroi crumbed it and then not maf crumbed it and then kuroi confirm crumbed it and then notmaf confirmed crumbed it and then they both started shedding PR in distress tells when you asked them about the crumbs that read like "wtf stop quoting our crumbs we're not going to explain they're for later" and now they're not masons after all and in my last game I caught someone as scum because they crumbed and then didn't claim what they crumbed so I'm pretty sure there's scum in notmaf/kuroi.

It's still weird to me that you quoted their crumbs and asked them about them in the first place but I'm not counterclaiming you so you're town unless that happens and probably even then.

Aeronaut says that you and Ari aren't serial killers, and Kuroi says that Aeronaut isn't a serial killer. That means that the SK, if there is one, is in [bro, us, kuroi, not maf]. It's not us and it's probably not bro either, so [kuroi/notmaf]. We've thought for a while that the last scum was in [you, ari] and if it's not you then it's ari.

@Mod: The VC says Soren instead Kuroi

--P

[Adaptive Heap]

Bro

is town. Mala and him have history together. Naked votes aren't scummy.

You're correct that they aren't scummy in and of themselves but I really had the feeling he was softing cop and had an inno on us.
Considering that's not the case I have to reassess.

Also I think you'd have to present a pretty fantastical and credulous case to assume that we bussed Davsto given Davsto's role.
*shrug* but I guess that's just my opinion. Possibly gets Bro off the hook for scum faction as well.

(Non-game-related, a detailed version of this might be delayed for a few days yet but I'll see if I can get to it any quicker. We have plenty of time today though.)

We think scum is

aristo

and one of [

notmaf

,

kuroi

], probably

notmaf

.

The last thing that I noticed about Aristo was this:

Where are your reads at, Adaptive?
I know NM is up there, but who is scummy with him?

Followed by this:

What's wrong with you as a third?
I'm looking for scum with Dav, not scum with nob-flipped entities.

Which is a fairly glaring and direct contradiction if you're only looking for a single partner with Davsto.

So yeah you could be onto something there.

It is still weird to me that

Notmaf/Kuroi

crumbed masons together. Like kuroi crumbed it and then not maf crumbed it and then kuroi confirm crumbed it and then notmaf confirmed crumbed it and then they both started shedding PR in distress tells when you asked them about the crumbs that read like "wtf stop quoting our crumbs we're not going to explain they're for later" and now they're not masons after all and in my last game I caught someone as scum because they crumbed and then didn't claim what they crumbed so I'm pretty sure there's scum in notmaf/kuroi.

It's still weird to me that you quoted their crumbs and asked them about them in the first place but I'm not counterclaiming you so you're town unless that happens and probably even then.

I didn't pick up on any mason crumbs. Just thought their entry / association thing was weird and worth following up on (and promptly got called scum for it). I hadn't thought about masons up till someone brought it up recently and kind of wrote it off until now when you're bringing it up again!

So does a masons claim between the two do anything for us? I mean I don't get why there's scum in one of the two but not both or neither with that line of thinking.

Oh by the way...

Spoiler:

Talah, has mastina been around much? Tell her I said hi.

Not much in our QT but she's been popping in to make a comment and some brief analysis here and there. We were actually hoping to roll scum this game and I know she's been busy with other priorities so when it was town I sorta gave her a hug and told her not to sweat it.
However... she did respond to your "Hi" with something that I assume I'm not allowed to directly quote, so to paraphrase...

'Not particularly, vaguely checking in randomly like WoFish activity but hopefully a bit more than the end of Tarot Upick II'

Hopefully that makes some kind of sense to you - I guess they're games you've been in together.

-t

[Adaptive Heap]

I just had a thought.

I suppose a scum goon and a traitor could be given a neighbourhood. (ed: afterthought - or even scum goon and SK?)

Because that's another option but it'd be kind of weird given an FBI role existing in the first place unless it was a red-herring.
Can't really see a 9+2+1+1 setup being a thing given our role plus Davsto's.

Anywhose.

-t

[Aristophanes]

Plot, you gave, like, no reason for me to be scum in that post.
What is leading you to believe I am?

[Aristophanes]

I just had a thought.

I suppose a scum goon and a traitor could be given a neighbourhood. (ed: afterthought - or even scum goon and SK?)

Because that's another option but it'd be kind of weird given an FBI role existing in the first place unless it was a red-herring.
Can't really see a 9+2+1+1 setup being a thing given our role plus Davsto's.

Anywhose.

-t

I assume by this you are insinuating Not Maf and Kuroi because of the apparent mason crumbs (which I missed entirely)?

Possible.
I doubt the last mafia is a vanilla goon though, and am pretty sure this game is chalked full of red herrings.
Tempted to say there is a traitor, not an SK, now that you mention it.

[Plottin Kittehs]

Bro

is town. Mala and him have history together. Naked votes aren't scummy.

You're correct that they aren't scummy in and of themselves but I really had the feeling he was softing cop and had an inno on us.
Considering that's not the case I have to reassess.

Makes sense.

Also I think you'd have to present a pretty fantastical and credulous case to assume that we bussed Davsto given Davsto's role.
*shrug* but I guess that's just my opinion. Possibly gets Bro off the hook for scum faction as well.

Us too, for that matter. The three of us were all on Davsto pretty early. Not mafia ignored Davsto pretty much, Persivul townread Davsto, Kuroi did push on Davsto some.

Ari also had this thing where he pushed on Frozen for the "not a doctor" thing with the theory that frozen was a not-doctor with a doctor as a fakeclaim (70). This seems like the kind of thing a person on a two man scumteam would be looking for.

It is still weird to me that

Notmaf/Kuroi

crumbed masons together. Like kuroi crumbed it and then not maf crumbed it and then kuroi confirm crumbed it and then notmaf confirmed crumbed it and then they both started shedding PR in distress tells when you asked them about the crumbs that read like "wtf stop quoting our crumbs we're not going to explain they're for later" and now they're not masons after all and in my last game I caught someone as scum because they crumbed and then didn't claim what they crumbed so I'm pretty sure there's scum in notmaf/kuroi.

It's still weird to me that you quoted their crumbs and asked them about them in the first place but I'm not counterclaiming you so you're town unless that happens and probably even then.

I didn't pick up on any mason crumbs. Just thought their entry / association thing was weird and worth following up on (and promptly got called scum for it). I hadn't thought about masons up till someone brought it up recently and kind of wrote it off until now when you're bringing it up again!

So does a masons claim between the two do anything for us? I mean I don't get why there's scum in one of the two but not both or neither with that line of thinking.

For a while, even after it looked like "the masons" were bussing, I would have still believed a mason claim from them, but notmafia claiming to roleblock kuroi removes that possibility. The kind of "call and response" thing that they did where not mafia entered the thread and kuroi immediately jokingly-but-maybe-not-jokingly claims to trust him and not mafia immediately acknowledges that kuroi knows what he's talking about is the kind of thing that if they were masons and one of them was killed, the other could point to it and say that it's proof that they were masons. I've seen players in previous games that I read crumb masons that way. I didn't immediately put them both into my INEXPLICABLE TOP TOWNREADS section of my readslist but continued asking questions and scumhunting them some, both to provide cover to make them less nightkillable if they were masons and because scum can crumb too.

Later on, things shifted, with kuroi growing suspicious of not mafia and pressuring him to do stuff, and notmaf growing suspicious of kuroi. That made them less likely to be masons; when I was a mason, I mostly matched my read on my mason partners to thread temperature, but I never let it fall below nulltown or lurksack. I'd readily agree that my mason partner should be doing more than he was but we all just "not feeling that wagon, sorry" whenever any of us got wagonned a little too hard. We tried to disguise our connections while still leaving a few things a surviving mason could point to, but kuroi and not maf went a step further with their reads on each other dropping below null and into scumread territory.

But if you're truly masons and you have a role PM related reason to know somebody is town then you don't roleblock them so they're not masons.

It can be useful to crumbhunt as town because it helps you avoid wagonning PRs, helps you catch scum if they don't claim the things they crumbed, and it's good practice for when you're scum too.

Oh by the way...

Spoiler:

Talah, has mastina been around much? Tell her I said hi.

Not much in our QT but she's been popping in to make a comment and some brief analysis here and there. We were actually hoping to roll scum this game and I know she's been busy with other priorities so when it was town I sorta gave her a hug and told her not to sweat it.
However... she did respond to your "Hi" with something that I assume I'm not allowed to directly quote, so to paraphrase...

'Not particularly, vaguely checking in randomly like WoFish activity but hopefully a bit more than the end of Tarot Upick II'

Hopefully that makes some kind of sense to you - I guess they're games you've been in together.

-t

Tarot was the last game that we played together, she was in the Wall of Fire hydra there. She was very inactive in that game but she was town. I don't want to pressure her to be more active because I don't think it'll help, but I do like playing with her. I feel like I can read her better than I can read you, but if you're not getting counterclaimed then that doesn't matter.

Mastina is one of only three players on this site to have scumread me for what I felt were the right reasons. In WiFoM city. I talked her down from it, and I was (genuinely) indignant at the time because it was a sore spot for me being approached from that angle, but a couple months later I finally realised she'd been right. I'm working pretty hard on the tell she picked up on because nobody (except mastina I guess) townreads me for the town response to that situation and I think I managed to keep the towntell out of the gamethread in the Odds and here as well but...she was right.


pedit: PoE, plus not being on Davsto early enough, and then later on (for example in 918) it looks like you're tying Frozen to him a bit. Lunch is almost ready, don't feel like making a big case when my main reason is PoE.

I'd still like to hear the results of your Dav research though when you have time. We don't need to rush this day phase.

--P

[Aristophanes]

I can deal with that. Dav analysis will be a bit still, so I'm glad we're not rushing like that last phase.

Time to start work myself. 11 hours of fun ahead...
Enjoy your lunch!

[KuroiXHF]

It is still weird to me that

Notmaf/Kuroi

crumbed masons together. Like kuroi crumbed it and then not maf crumbed it and then kuroi confirm crumbed it and then notmaf confirmed crumbed it and then they both started shedding PR in distress tells when you asked them about the crumbs that read like "wtf stop quoting our crumbs we're not going to explain they're for later" and now they're not masons after all and in my last game I caught someone as scum because they crumbed and then didn't claim what they crumbed so I'm pretty sure there's scum in notmaf/kuroi.

Why are you the only one insisting that there's crumbing going on? I'm saying there isn't and I want to guess Not_Mafia would do the same. I made a joke, and you're not the only one who took it more than what it was, but you did.

Here's the joke. (Paraphrasing)

Mod - We have a new player. Here's Not_Mafia!
Me - (Noticing the username) I have a feeling he's not mafia. I feel like I can trust him.

...Because I couldn't have chosen a different or more subtle/fitting way of crumbing my role if I were mason with him?

[Plottin Kittehs]

I am not the only person who saw it.

I still kind of want to do Davsto, but really anything outside of {Kittehs/Rob/Elsa/NotMaf/Kuroi} is cool with me.

Why none of this group?

Kittehs and Elsa are strong town, Rob is weak town, NotMaf and Kuroi because ~reasons~

~reasons~ means he saw it too.


I believe it is possible that it was just a joke. I have in the past struggled to find a way to communicate without accidentally crumbing things I didn't mean (vig/PGO when I just mean that i'm mad at someone, hider when I just mean someone's attacks are getting tedious, etc.)


The thing is that the joke you told together is subtle enough that several players didn't pick up on it (adaptive heap didn't for example), and it is a fitting way of crumbing the role. I've seen good players crumb in that manner in the past. It wouldn't be a misstep if you were masons for real.

--P

[BROseidon]

~reasons~ means he saw it too.

Confirming that this is the case.

[Rift Adrift]

VC 4.2

Aristophanes

(1): BROseidon

Not Voting

(6): Plottin Kittehs, Aristophanes, KuroiXHF, Adaptive Heap, Aeronaut, Not_Mafia

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Deadline: February 3, Noon US Eastern Time
Countdown: (expired on 2016-02-03 09:00:00)

Mod Notes:

[Plottin Kittehs]

Plot head is v/la until Sunday. Will still try to post. health stuff + family stuff + etc.

--P

[KuroiXHF]

Plot head is v/la until Sunday. Will still try to post. health stuff + family stuff + etc.

--P

I hope all is well with you and your family.

[Aristophanes]

Lol, I'm the only one with a vote on me and it's functionally unexplained.

We need to inject some life back into this game!

[Aristophanes]

Also, all the best, Plot!

And a Happy Birthday to Aero!!! =D

[BROseidon]

Ari pls claim. Now that the 8th doc has claimed, there's no reason not to mass-claim.

[Aristophanes]

Ari pls claim. Now that the 8th doc has claimed, there's no reason not to mass-claim.

Acknowledged and agreed.

After work today I shall (gimme like, 6 more hours...)

[Adaptive Heap]

Perhaps later, if necessary but I've been role blocked twice. The only role I know of not mafia is that he can role block. Has there been any word of his other roles or just that?

Can you please ask the mod if you'd be informed if you lost your investigative power?

So... by "Roleblocked" do you just mean that you got "no result"?
Or did you get an "action failed" or something similar to that.

Before you answer

you'll want to check with Rift if/how you're allowed to convey the result explicitly - we can't afford another modkill and I'm not 100% sure how it works.
This also applies to you NM as I have a similar question for you:

I'm JOAT, I have a cop shot, a roleblock and a watch shot.

N1 I copped Shiro
N2 I roleblocked Kuroi
N3 I watched Rob but my result said no one visited him

So the N3 result was a hard result? Or no result?

-t

[KuroiXHF]

The question has been asked. I'll answer as soon as an answer becomes available.

[KuroiXHF]

So I did get a result back, and I was told that I would be told if I no longer had my investigative powers. This leads me to believe that someone actively roleblocked me. There is the guess that Rob did use his power on me. The other option that I see is that Not_Mafia is a roleblocker - likely, a mafia roleblocker.

[Adaptive Heap]

Thanks for that clarification Kuroi.

I'm checking things out slowly. Have re-iso'd Bro and am about halfway through Aristo.
This might be a project that spans a couple of days but I'm posting my thoughts in our hydra thread and will consult with mastina prior to making any vote.

Interested to hear back from Aristo on his claim, and Not_Mafia on clarifying his own result.
(Also am assuming that Brosiedon and Kittehs will be claiming at some stage after this.)

-t