Mini 1760: A Midsummer Night's Dream (GAME OVER)

[goodmorning]

What are everyone's thoughts on an itlepip-FS loverize?

It's pretty OK unless we lynch FS today.

GM might be scum

I definitely could be. I certainly can't remember the last time I placed more than 2 votes D1 or the last time I was this disengaged with the gamestate this soon, so that's something.

He's been leashed and is being aimed by your co-equal scumreads, who are aiming him at FS. Is FS a bigger scumread for you than them?

Of course. FS have been much scummier, objectively speaking.

Grey and LLd have maybe been more subjectively scummy, but that was in another country.

I don't see why you seem to think Scum can't bus. LLd and Grey are more than capable of bussing a scummy partner.

Would that still give the incentive to not lynch scum as if he diverts a lynch away from someone who is clearly scum he can win the game?

How could Dwlee be capable of diverting a lynch all by his lonesome, especially when we know his wincon?

It's also scary that Goodmorning seems happy enough for her scumreads to take on that task. She's still scumreading them according to her most recent post but is now voting Seniors.

1. You are overestimating my inclination to take this seriously.
2. I literally have 2 Townreads right now. That's it. Everyone else is varying degrees of "well this could be Scum." If I limited myself to wagons I was pretty sure only Town were on, I wouldn't vote. To try and choose which 2 people are likeliest to be Scum, while wading through all the frankly poor posting in this game...

Yeah.

Readlist

I'd like for you to explain the basis for these reads,

especially your null pile

.

this is actually terrible

Vote: absinthe

I might move it back to FS later but this vote makes me feel so right.

[Aristophanes]

You are being a little bullheaded here.

I mean, if this were the route chosen, I also would gladly vie for the position, and I believe I am one of the most qualified in the game to do so.
In fact, I don't want anyone else to hold it. I

Will

take the position if we decide to go this route.

However I still dislike the plan and am not behind it.
Therefore I am still arguing.

[Dwlee99]

So what is the plan?

[Aristophanes]

So what is the plan?

We're fairly certain you're living.
We are still throwing shit at each other until someone gives in.

I say fairly certain because if we can't come to a conclusion, I think we should lynch you because this needs to be sorted out or eliminated.

So, what do you think we should do, Dwlee?

[Dwlee99]

Keep me alive. Allow me to make pairs without saying who they are or just leash me. And lynch someone that isnt me.

[Aristophanes]

Keep me alive. Allow me to make pairs without saying who they are or just leash me. And lynch someone that isnt me.

So helpful you are.

I should've known better than to ask.

[beeboy]

How could Dwlee be capable of diverting a lynch all by his lonesome, especially when we know his wincon?

Yes if puts up a convincing argument on another player, this also creates WIFOM bs that I don't want to be a part of.

[Dwlee99]

Then just ignore me, bb.

[absinthe]

Like, you fucking tell me.

If you want me to be the one who bets my life, I'll do it.

If you want someone else to bet their life, go ahead and make them do it.

I don;t care who it is, as long as one person unilaterally makes the choice and that their life is on the line if they fuck up.

Literally those are my stipulations, I refuse to allow this mechanic to be used beneficially for scum.

This sounds like trying to superimpose the kingmaker game mechanic on a normal mafia game, where the kingmaker themselves isn't a hidden role and isn't guaranteed by the mod to be town. The problem is that a scum-king can deliver one scum partner via the kills and then coast, or more likely turn the choice over to a townie.

It probably happens occasionally, but I've never seen that setup result in a town win. It's a data set of four or 5 games.

[absinthe]

Readlist

I'd like for you to explain the basis for these reads,

especially your null pile

.

this is actually terrible

Vote: absinthe

I might move it back to FS later but this vote makes me feel so right.

I want to know why he has Spiffeh and itlepip at the same level.

You are likely to be where I vote at the moment so go ahead and make your omgus accusation!

[absinthe]

How could Dwlee be capable of diverting a lynch all by his lonesome, especially when we know his wincon?

Yes if puts up a convincing argument on another player, this also creates WIFOM bs that I don't want to be a part of.

His arguments are automatically suspect because his wincon shapes him in this game.

There was a reason why I called his vote on me scummy. There was no scumhunting in it, just convenience.

[itlepip]

Well your plan is so bad it seems to want to.

We use consensus for our lynches, we don't use consensus for our Leash.

It's much easier to put the burden onto someone, and learn from that. It's just BETTER too, because it means Dwlee can't be like "oh I trusted player X's opinion most so I went with his lol".

No, one person, one opinion. Stepping up to the plate, you're right you live, you're wrong on both, you die. Simple easy.

Not at all.
If we choose our towniest folk, he has bad reads, and we lynch our towniest folk because of it, that hurts the town.

If we all come to a consensus and make it obvious who we have agreed on, it eliminates that excuse from Dwlee.
It gets conversation to flow and makes people push their reads and take hard stances.


Also, to go back to your point on the possibility of scum killing the lovers if we don't (since I didn't respond at the time), I don't see why that is a problem.
No extra kill is gained in the process and we still are lynching who we think is scum, rather then settling for old reads that may have changed.

Right, so we should just let our "towniest folk" continue to mislynch people until we lose and suddenly we're "lol outplayed"

no fuck that We have the option here to cover our bases on all ends of the spectrum, by forcing people into situations where they get reads right or suffer the consequences.

I will happily volunteer for this procedure first, if you think I'm doing this just to control what happens and win. I will happily accept my death if I can't find a single scum in 3 reads (Lynch + 2 lovers).

Happily.

Holy Shit this is exactly my point. "OMG we can't trust town, just trust me and if I'm wrong then lynch me and then be in mylo (assuming the scum don't have a way to kill anyone ever this game, cause if they do then trusting LLD here just flat out loses the game for town)". Look LLD 3 lynches in a 13 player game is a ton. Burden of proficiency is 1 maybe 2 at the most. Town has 3 mislynches in a 13 player game, and 1 double lynch makes that mylo instead of lylo. You can't waste 3 lynches to then say "oops, I guess LLD was scum". Stop trying to manipulate town here.

I don't understand how this isn't the obvious lynch for today.

[beeboy]

Then just ignore me, bb.

Who me?

[SnarkySnowman]

Null is my not sure category. Either no read or not sure if town/scum. I feel like that was pretty self-evident, no?

[Dwlee99]

Ftr abs I actually did think you were scum there.

yes beeboy you are bb lol

[absinthe]

Null is my not sure category. Either no read or not sure if town/scum. I feel like that was pretty self-evident, no?

They've both put quite a lot of stance into the game. What is it that you need from them to get a better read? Why aren't you trying to get it from them?

[Aristophanes]

Then just ignore me, bb.

Who me?

Pretty sure that's me...but Lol

[beeboy]

bb = bee + boy Aristo plz.

Also what post was I supposed to respond to? The one where you said I was scum with a ^ attached to it?

[Aristophanes]

Well your plan is so bad it seems to want to.

We use consensus for our lynches, we don't use consensus for our Leash.

It's much easier to put the burden onto someone, and learn from that. It's just BETTER too, because it means Dwlee can't be like "oh I trusted player X's opinion most so I went with his lol".

No, one person, one opinion. Stepping up to the plate, you're right you live, you're wrong on both, you die. Simple easy.

Not at all.
If we choose our towniest folk, he has bad reads, and we lynch our towniest folk because of it, that hurts the town.

If we all come to a consensus and make it obvious who we have agreed on, it eliminates that excuse from Dwlee.
It gets conversation to flow and makes people push their reads and take hard stances.


Also, to go back to your point on the possibility of scum killing the lovers if we don't (since I didn't respond at the time), I don't see why that is a problem.
No extra kill is gained in the process and we still are lynching who we think is scum, rather then settling for old reads that may have changed.

Right, so we should just let our "towniest folk" continue to mislynch people until we lose and suddenly we're "lol outplayed"

no fuck that We have the option here to cover our bases on all ends of the spectrum, by forcing people into situations where they get reads right or suffer the consequences.

I will happily volunteer for this procedure first, if you think I'm doing this just to control what happens and win. I will happily accept my death if I can't find a single scum in 3 reads (Lynch + 2 lovers).

Happily.

Holy Shit this is exactly my point. "OMG we can't trust town, just trust me and if I'm wrong then lynch me and then be in mylo (assuming the scum don't have a way to kill anyone ever this game, cause if they do then trusting LLD here just flat out loses the game for town)". Look LLD 3 lynches in a 13 player game is a ton. Burden of proficiency is 1 maybe 2 at the most. Town has 3 mislynches in a 13 player game, and 1 double lynch makes that mylo instead of lylo. You can't waste 3 lynches to then say "oops, I guess LLD was scum". Stop trying to manipulate town here.

I don't understand how this isn't the obvious lynch for today.

Ya know what, fuck it.

VOTE: Lady LamdbaDelta

[Friendless Seniors]

I've been traveling all day for a college interview
And I am tired and also feeling ill right now
Lots of pages to read. Will do that tomorrow.

-ep

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Well your plan is so bad it seems to want to.

We use consensus for our lynches, we don't use consensus for our Leash.

It's much easier to put the burden onto someone, and learn from that. It's just BETTER too, because it means Dwlee can't be like "oh I trusted player X's opinion most so I went with his lol".

No, one person, one opinion. Stepping up to the plate, you're right you live, you're wrong on both, you die. Simple easy.

Not at all.
If we choose our towniest folk, he has bad reads, and we lynch our towniest folk because of it, that hurts the town.

If we all come to a consensus and make it obvious who we have agreed on, it eliminates that excuse from Dwlee.
It gets conversation to flow and makes people push their reads and take hard stances.


Also, to go back to your point on the possibility of scum killing the lovers if we don't (since I didn't respond at the time), I don't see why that is a problem.
No extra kill is gained in the process and we still are lynching who we think is scum, rather then settling for old reads that may have changed.

Right, so we should just let our "towniest folk" continue to mislynch people until we lose and suddenly we're "lol outplayed"

no fuck that We have the option here to cover our bases on all ends of the spectrum, by forcing people into situations where they get reads right or suffer the consequences.

I will happily volunteer for this procedure first, if you think I'm doing this just to control what happens and win. I will happily accept my death if I can't find a single scum in 3 reads (Lynch + 2 lovers).

Happily.

Holy Shit this is exactly my point. "OMG we can't trust town, just trust me and if I'm wrong then lynch me and then be in mylo (assuming the scum don't have a way to kill anyone ever this game, cause if they do then trusting LLD here just flat out loses the game for town)". Look LLD 3 lynches in a 13 player game is a ton. Burden of proficiency is 1 maybe 2 at the most. Town has 3 mislynches in a 13 player game, and 1 double lynch makes that mylo instead of lylo. You can't waste 3 lynches to then say "oops, I guess LLD was scum". Stop trying to manipulate town here.

I don't understand how this isn't the obvious lynch for today.

I don't get to control the lynch today.

I only get to control the lover targets.

Like, you are misrepresenting this.

In addition, I already said be it me, be it not me IDC. As long as it's unilaterally one person.

[absinthe]

Ftr abs I actually did think you were scum there.

yes beeboy you are bb lol

You naked voted me and tried to get cozy with the players who were shaping up to be the game's leaders. That combination did NOT look town. If your behavior would have been the same if you actually were town then you probably need to think about how you play this game.

Also, I'm maintaining my smugpoints for being the first calling you out for it!

[beeboy]

I've been traveling all day for a college interview
And I am tired and also feeling ill right now
Lots of pages to read. Will do that tomorrow.

-ep

Educated scum are the scariest scum.

[Aristophanes]

bb = bee + boy Aristo plz.

Also what post was I supposed to respond to? The one where you said I was scum with a ^ attached to it?

I thought he was being endearing because I asked him a question and regretted the answer because it was exactly what I should have expected.

But I guess I like your theory better here.

</3

[Spiffeh]

We're not lynching LLD